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June 20, 2011 at 5:29 am #599414
hooper1961Memberi see in today’s times that metro is about $60,000,000 short of funding and a proposal is to raise car tab fee by $20. metro serves 350,000 customers a day, raising the fair by 50 cents for all users roughly would raise $45 to 50,000,000. thus why is a fair increase not being brought to the table?
June 20, 2011 at 6:30 am #727120
JanSParticipanthoop,, do you take the bus on a regular basis? Do you have any idea what the fares are now? Just curious (no fair looking it up before answering)
June 20, 2011 at 7:35 am #727121
metrognomeParticipantI think we should terminate all Metro services (bus, carpool, vanpool) for, oh, say a month, and see how many more cars are on the road. And how many people have to quit their jobs.
Here is an article from today’s Seattle Times featuring a WSite vanpooling to Bothell that included these stats on why public transportation is important (to be fair, I should note that vanpool fares pay the entire operating cost; bus fares pay about 25% of that service’s operating cost):
In 2010, King County’s vanpool program had a large environmental impact:
Reduction in vehicle miles traveled – 46,056,054
Gallons of gas saved – 2,769,785
Metric tons of greenhouse gas reduced – 494,484
Metric tons of carbon dioxide reduced -483,111
http://blog.nwjobs.com/careercenter/easy_riders_vanpooling_can _save_time_money_and_the_planet.html (sorry, had to split the url cuz I’m too lazy to have it shortened.)
June 20, 2011 at 1:32 pm #727122
redblackParticipantand you all know that mayor mcginn wants to add $20 to seattle citizens’ car tabs to fund in-city light rail on our own – without waiting another 15 years for sound transit to do it, right?
i agree wholeheartedly. i say make it $50. let’s fund both metro and in-city light rail. maybe even a chunk of that dumbassed tunnel.
mcginn can take a suitcase full of cash to olympia, empty it out on gregoire’s desk, and say, “here. will you talk to me now?”
it would be a fitting symbol.
June 20, 2011 at 1:50 pm #727123
Genesee HillParticipantHeck, you could add a 200 dollar additional tax to my car tab(s) for light rail to/from West Seattle and I would gladly vote/pay for it. To paraphrase J D Wentworth: I want light rail to West Seattle and I WANT IT NOW!
June 20, 2011 at 3:19 pm #727124
DPMemberHeck, you could add a 200 dollar additional tax to my car tab(s) for light rail to/from West Seattle and I would gladly vote/pay for it.
Genesee Hill: I don’t share your confidence in the ability of Seattle to finish transportation projects it dreams up and taxes people for. I recall trading a dollar amount similar to the one you mention in exchange for a promise that soon I’d be riding a shiny new monorail in the sky.
Well, I never did get to ride that monorail. And needless to say, I never saw my 200 bucks again, either.
 Â
As we know, it’s hard to make predictions. Especially about the future.
June 20, 2011 at 3:24 pm #727125
hooper1961Memberjans i do take the bus regularly to seattle. it’s $2.25 that is far cheaper than driving and parking downtown!
June 20, 2011 at 4:11 pm #727126
Genesee HillParticipantDP;
I agree. I voted for the goofy monorail as well. But, I don’t let one mistake keep me down for the rest of my life! I could not even venture a guess on how much I have spent on useless wars in my life time! But, I am sure there will be another one just around the corner….
June 20, 2011 at 6:02 pm #727127
metrognomeParticipantGenHill — not sure how old you are, but I am confident in saying that you will never see light rail or even streetcar service from the mainland to WS in your lifetime and probably your children and grandchildren. Simply put — not enough population density added to the challenge of getting across the Duwamish and dealing with our hills. I’ll be happy to buy a case of Mexican Coca-Cola and leave it somewhere for your descendents, just in case.
(notice I said ‘from the mainland’; I think it is also highly unlikely streetcar service will ever be built on the peninsula …)
June 20, 2011 at 6:13 pm #727128
metrognomeParticipanthoop — to attempt to answer your question, there is something called ‘fare elasticity’ which means that when you raise fares, you lose a certain amount of ridership. Plus with so many passes, even if the same amount of rides are taken, you don’t get an extra 25 cents from every rider.
If you want some background on the current financial situation, check here:
http://metro.kingcounty.gov/am/future/
If you want general background on the benefits of public transportation, go to
http://www.apta.com/RESOURCES/Pages/Default.aspx, select ‘Advocacy and Education’ from the left nav bar and look for anything by Paul Weyrich, a noted conservative, who researched and wrote on this topic.
June 20, 2011 at 6:26 pm #727129
hooper1961Membermetrognome i understand basic economics and the value of transportation. a 25 to 50 cent fare increase across the board is very reasonable. presuming a 50 cent fare increase means the 56 would cost $2.75 (off-peak) to get to downtown seattle that is still way cheaper than driving and paying for parking!
June 20, 2011 at 6:43 pm #727130
Genesee HillParticipantmetrognome,
Yes, you are no doubt correct, it is very doubtful I will see it. The cost alone will almost ensure that. I feel we have the density for light rail though. The hills weren’t a hindrance in the 1920s when we had streetcars to West Seattle. They crossed the Duwamish and went up Avalon to the Junction. Another branch went to Alki and to 61st. On my walks, I can still see where the tracks were on 61st!
I asked one of my elderly neighbors if he remembers the streetcars in West Seattle. He replied: “Hell, I used to ride ’em”! Another elderly friend used to ride them to Lincoln Park. He said his sister was afraid to look down when they crossed the old wooden viaduct across the Duwamish!
June 20, 2011 at 6:53 pm #727131
ElizagraceParticipantForget the flat rate car tab, what ever happened to the value of the car to determine the car tab fee…
June 20, 2011 at 6:54 pm #727132
anonymeParticipantThe fares for elderly and disabled passengers were recently tripled in just over 12 months. With food and utility prices skyrocketing and Social Security frozen for the past two years now, this demographic simply cannot take another fare increase.
June 20, 2011 at 6:58 pm #727133
365StairsParticipantTim Eye Man is lurking somewhere…I can smell him…
June 20, 2011 at 6:58 pm #727134
hooper1961Memberelizagrace – people voted to ax the car tab due to unrealistic valuations that they used when it was in use.
anonyme – social security was never intended to be a sole source retirement. the bus fares for elderly are dirt cheap as it is and raising them is not unreasonable.
June 20, 2011 at 7:00 pm #727135
Genesee HillParticipantThe value based car tab fee was an Eyeman measure that passed in an election.
June 20, 2011 at 7:03 pm #727136
Genesee HillParticipantYeah, people thought it was unfair that the owner of a Ferarri 330GTB 2+2 paid more for his/her tabs than an owner of a 1962 Renault Dauphine!
June 20, 2011 at 7:25 pm #727137
hooper1961Memberno they thought it was unfair the State valued their 10 year old ford focus at $5,000 instead of at the Kelley Blue Book value of $1,000. The values are illustrative only. this measure may not have passed if the legislature/governor had stepped to the plate and FIXED this issue that annoyed a lot of people that could very well have been the difference.
it’s like the legislature if they had limited the soda tax to soda the initiative likely would have not passed.
June 20, 2011 at 7:40 pm #727138
miwsParticipantHoop, it’s nice that the $2.25 bus fare is such a bargain for you, but there are many people that are on limited incomes, or are not getting regular raises at work, or are unemployed, and every $0.25 increase, (and there have been several over the last few short years) add up to quite a bit, when multiplied by daily, or otherwise frequent bus riding.
Mike
June 20, 2011 at 7:57 pm #727139
hooper1961Memberit’s a bargain for everyone
June 20, 2011 at 8:07 pm #727140
dobroParticipant“it’s a bargain for everyone”
unproveable assertion based on your own prejudiced ideas.Even when contradicted by people with factual information (redblack, JoB) and anecdotal evidence drawn from their own circumstances (Mike), nothing gets thru. This is why I see no reason to engage in conversation with a person like yourself. I’m out.
June 20, 2011 at 9:43 pm #727141
SueParticipantBTW, the peak fare for Metro (one zone) is actually $2.50 now, not $2.25 (which is the off-peak fare).
June 20, 2011 at 11:06 pm #727142
maplesyrupParticipantCar tab fees should be raised to cover transportation projects. The problem is that you can’t trust the legislature to use the funds raised strictly for those purposes.
Anyway, roughly 25% of Seattle proper lives in West Seattle. Seems like enough to justify a rail project to me.
June 21, 2011 at 5:18 am #727143
hooper1961Memberi said off-peak
$4.50 for a round trip to and from seattle downtown versus driving and paying for parking ~$15.00. this is a flat out bargain
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