Small business/personal health insurance

[JoB]

hoop..

if the only thing you hear is what you think you already know

then you are unlikely to ever discover what is and isn’t true.

i think

therefore it is

is not a valid argument

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[JoB]

hoop..

so back to health insurance..

you think that everyone should have health insurance

and you cite your ability to procure high deductible health insurance as evidence that everyone can afford insurance.

how high a deductible do you think an individual with a pre-existing condition would have to have to obtain any kind of health insurance at your rates?

because you do know that health insurers can still deny insurance due to a pre-existing condition .. don’t you?

and pre-existing conditions are apparently of the well it could happen to you variety since health insurers are now denying healthy live organ donors because if they got sick it would be more difficult for them to recover.

too bad so sad for them?

they should never have been stupid enough to allow themselves to get sick?

or stupid enough to donate even part of an organ to someone else so they could live…

i sincerely hope that works out for you hoop..

but odds are it won’t.

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[hooper1961]

JoB – all I know is that Obamacare is going to significantly increase cost of insurance for millions of low risk insured people. As high risk folks get insurance in 2014 at the same rates as low risk people. Insurance cost for low risk people will increase dramatically. This is blatantly unjust.

From what I understand smoking is the only risk factor and some age factoring in the insurance pricing. This leaves out a huge controllable factor (that cannot be stated) that is one of the largest contributors to health care cost. This unnamed factor must be included in the risk costing, without it’s inclusion unjust cost burden is added to low risk people.

ps: many many people live their entire lives without any major illness especially people who get recommended sleep, eat well balance diets, maintain appropriate weight and exercise.

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[kgdlg]

I have this image of Hoop hanging over his desktop, chain smoking cigarettes, with one hand in a fast food bag, drinking a high fructose corn syrup soft drink. We hate in others what we see in ourselves. Best piece of advice a college friend ever gave me. Always gives me pause before criticizIng the behaviors of others…

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[hooper1961]

i do not smoke cigarettes, i do not drink pop, i eat my veggies, i avoid high fructose corn syrup and salt and i exercise and eat a well balance diet kgdlg.

yes in my late 20’s and through my 30’s i was overweight by more than 70 lbs. in my late 30’s i made a commitment to lose the extra weight that required that i stop drinking beer, no sweets, more weight lifting, and watch what i eat. losing the weight took perseverance and dedication.

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[JoB]

hoop…

would it surprise you to learn that i don’t smoke any substance and never have..

or that i don’t drink

and haven’t had a single drink of alcohol for over 20 years..

or that i get my 8 hours of sleep every night

i rise with the morning and am seldom up past 9PM

i don’t do drugs.. not even the legally prescribed kind if I can do without them

i eat a balanced diet and watch my calories like a hawk..

i read the ingredients list on every single food item i purchase…

with one notable prescribed exception,

if it has high fructose corn syrup or artificial sweeteners or chemical additives, i don’t consume it.

for the first half of my life i was a dancer, hiker, runner, biker and rugby player…

now i exercise as much as my body will tolerate..

Yet.. stuff happens and there you go.

Stuff happens hoop..

no matter how well you take care of yourself.

but you keep whistling in the dark

and blaming others for their misfortune.

it won’t save you

but you keep whistling anyway

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[hooper1961]

job – many people smoke, do not exercise, eat crap, and then get diabetes or some other ailment. why should people who exercise, sleep 8 hours, don’t smoke pay more for health insurance to compensate for the latter folks?

yes i know shit happens some smokers live to be a hundred and an exercise health nut can fall over dead. but the law of averages dictates that these are the outliers. and insurance premiums needs to be based on sound principals. people who do not take care of themselves need to pay more for insurance than those that do; it is only fair. insurance cost needs to be based on risk

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[hooper1961]

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[JoB]

hoop,

take a look at the bottom line for the health care industry..look at the total industry… including actual medical delivery and administration … what the CEOs make, what the profits are..

then take a look at the GMO industry

and the high fructose corn syrup industry

and the chemical additives for your food industry

and the rollback of pollution standards set in the 60s

and then tell me again that people making poor choices

is what drives your health care costs up

bullies pick on the little guy hoop

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[hooper1961]

JoB – once again there are a number of contributing factors involved including people with bad health habits. And I have already acknowledged problems with delivery and CEO costing and unhealthy food choices.

Why don’t you acknowledge that people who make bad health choices ought to pay more than those that do? Think of it as a stick to foist better choices that would result in lower use costs on the system and thus reduced insurance cost for everyone.

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[JoB]

hoop

I am all for sin taxes..

but, i don’t believe it’s my place to decide who does and doesn’t make bad health choices…

I use cocacola.. one of those foods you claim are bad… to help control my energy levels throughout the day.

I gave it up because i don’t like drinking high fructose corn syrup but i had real problems controlling my energy…

my doctor told me to go back to drinking cocacola so i could stay out of bed.

I eat potato chips to control medication induced nausea … another “bad” food.

If you saw me buying either would you assume that i didn’t care about my health?

someone else i know has to consume fat to keep her phosphorus levels down.

if you saw her choosing the full fat alternative would you assume that she didn’t care about her health?

the assumption part of the equation is what makes a fool out of people who think they know better than you about your choices every time

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[hooper1961]

JoB – I never said it was my decision. All I said is that those people who make bad choices should be required to pay more for their health insurance. people that get speeding tickets pay more for car insurance; but using your logic they ought to pay the same premium as someone who doesn’t have tickets.

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[hooper1961]

JoB – I never said it was my decision. All I said is that those people who make bad choices should be required to pay more for their health insurance. people that get speeding tickets pay more for car insurance; but using your logic they ought to pay the same premium as someone who doesn’t have tickets.

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[JoB]

hoop..

the biggest problem comes when you define “bad choices”

what is a bad choice for your health might well be a good choice for mine..

there are a good many lifestyle choices you might make because you perceive them as healthy that i would avoid because of the possible risk of injury…

should you pay more if you engage in sports?

what if you run where it is not well lit?

or ride a bicycle or motorcycle?

and what about the increased risks of water sports?

how about a health insurance bump for the safety rating of the car you drive?

or if you own or live in a home with more than one story?

and what about genetic predispositions hoop?

should an individual have to pay more because they might become ill with a genetic disorder?

the beauty of universal insurance is that all of those risks are spread over a much larger population and therefore cost individuals less..

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[service dog academy]

JoB, you are arguing with a person who will never understand illness/injury/disability until it happens to him.

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[JoB]

hoop..

i am pretty sure screw you is one of the things you aren’t allowed to say to anyone here…

you can say screw your ideas

or you can counter my argument

but hurling personal insults is a no no

and referring to weight by calling it “the other major factor, cannot be identified but is under a persons control (been there myself)”, isn’t just bending the rules but crosses the line.

i am pretty sure you haven’t been where i am hoop or you wouldn’t make blanket statements that assume you know everyone else’s reality.

your assumptions are getting in the way of your intellect hoop…

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[miws]

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[hooper1961]

JoB – i believe that people have some personal responsibility for their own health (controllable items) and those that do not take care of themselves ought to pay more for insurance than those that do take care of themselves. The fact is obesity is a huge problem in this country and is very costly to the health care system. i was obese and made the choice to lose the weight and have successfully kept it off via denying myself sweets, beer and other high caloric foods and exercise.

and why is frank discussion on a major health issue not open for debate? and for you Job to continue to deny this fact is not being reasonable.

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[WSB]

I didn’t get flagged but just happened onto the rulebreaking post.

Repeated rulebreaking means a member has no interest in being able to continue participating in the community.

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[hammerhead]

Well I called Ashely above and he was very helpful.

I will actually be switching insurance companies and saving $150.00 per month

HH

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[JoB]

hoop..

and i pointed out that there are lot of behaviors that increase your risk of needing health insurance that are socially acceptable

if we are going to play that game, lets go for the real risks..

a recent study showed that women who were obese by current medical standards were healthier than women who were underweight..

the trouble with assumptions is that they are not always based on facts.

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[dobro]

“…if we are going to play that game, lets go for the real risks…”

I think the real risk is being stupid enough to keep pi**ing on the floor of the host after you’ve been repeatedly warned.

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[JoB]

well there is that :)

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[jissy]

bumping for Sonoma

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[Kevin]

I posted the following link in the thread that Somoma started.

https://westseattleblog.com/forum/topic/health-insurance-for-freelancers?replies=4#post-398547

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[Author]

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