Home › Forums › Open Discussion › politics of LGBT/straight exclusion
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June 19, 2008 at 7:39 pm #627103
JoBParticipantkayleigh…
good conversation happens when everyone listens… and thinks.
and yes.. i agree..
NewResident has been make a real effort to hear and think..
as has shibaguyz…
and this has been mostly good converstion… discounting a little pot stirring:)
June 19, 2008 at 7:39 pm #627104
charlabobParticipantWhat KL said!
I didn’t even mind the academese — it brought me out out of my plebian shell and made me think.
NR is especially impressive (except when she persists in think she and House are a “we”…that I will never comprehend!) But that’s definitely a beer discussion, not an online one :-)
June 19, 2008 at 8:40 pm #627105
JenVMember“And further, when we have met in person, you show absolutely no interest in speaking with me. I have specifically gone out of my way to speak with you and have consistently been met with distance and hostility.”
NR, on Saturday you came over to my table while I was in the middle of a conversation with someone AND while I was sick. I said Hi to you. If you view that as distance and “hostility” then so be it. Gee, I am really sorry that I didn’t give you my undivided attention, since that seems to be what you crave. I didn’t want to be rude, but now here I am being rude to you…giving as well as I have got.
June 19, 2008 at 10:20 pm #627106
JenVMemberyou know, the more I dwell on this, the more unhappy I get with this whole latest edition of this thread. NR, now you’re coming on all “poor me! jenv was mean to me!” which is not even the case. I met you once at the Handbag event. Briefly. Less than 5 minutes. Then you came over and said hi last Saturday. I fail to see how that equals me being distant and hostile. Not everyone is as gregarious as you. I might not bubble all over when I meet someone- does that make my feelings less valid? I am not going to get into name calling with you, or explain myself further. As a wise man once said: “If you have to ask, you’ll never know.”
June 19, 2008 at 10:42 pm #627107
feydrasMemberThanks for the welcome NR and JT. And in your own way, JenV. I kinda feel like part of the gang since you yelled at, er.. commented to me.
JenV – you are completely right that it was arrogant of me to pop off a post judging people. My personal impressions of people have nothing to do with the topics being discussed and served to make my points unhearable as evidenced by JoB’s comment that i was only name calling and assassinating character instead of joining the conversation. I’m sorry, especially to Shibaguyz who i was just plain mean to and who took it with grace. I would edit that particular comment out of my post but it would make the thread less sensible.
I should have cut my post off about midway, right after my comments about NR which i think are still relevant.
June 19, 2008 at 11:28 pm #627108
beachdrivegirlParticipantFeydas, welcome! It is always good to have additional posts and people on the blog!
June 20, 2008 at 12:50 am #627109
JoBParticipantJune 20, 2008 at 1:02 am #627110
AnonymousInactiveFeydras – I just want you to know that you made extremely valid, intelligent points and your post was not at all mean-spirited.
I just don’t want you to think that EVERYONE will treat you this poorly for stating your views and opinions on this forum.
I hope that you stick around and continue to share your thoughts as it is obvious, to me anyways, just how perceptive you are.
June 20, 2008 at 1:06 am #627111
charlabobParticipantLet me add to the welcome, Feydras. A new articulate voice is always refreshing! Your response was very gracious — I’m almost disappointed; I was kinda’ hoping to have someone new at whom to yell. :-)LOLhehehehehe
Seriously, hope we get to meet you in person too! In most cases, our barks are much worse than our bites (see any dog thread for evidence.) In my case, I’m working with my dentist on an enhanced bite.
the c half
July 8, 2008 at 9:50 pm #627112
shed22ParticipantWow, that was exhausting!
I am a long time (strangely obsessed) reader of the blog. This is my first time reading through the string of posts on the forum and while I can appreciate all the points of views expressed, it’s wearing me out.
So a big thanks to you all for keeping things lively and standing up for what you believe/percieve to be right while I idly lay down for a quick nap.
I am a proud member of this community and I hope we get to meet at some all-inclusive, non-exclusive gathering to equally celebrate our corner of the world and the diversity of people who inhabit it!
July 8, 2008 at 10:11 pm #627113
soclwrkrinmotnMemberJuly 8, 2008 at 11:02 pm #627114
BayouMemberShed, I have to agree with the WOW/exhausting comment…
I’m kinda glad that I missed this thread to begin with. Personally, I find it enlightening to gather with like minded people- whether that be gardeners, dog park enthusiasts or other members of the LGBT community. I’m quite baffled that a simple meetup thread would escalate into accusations of exclusion. I don’t think that dog lovers gathering for coffee is particularly harmful to the cat people of the world.
July 8, 2008 at 11:10 pm #627115
ZenguyParticipantI think they were simply using the meeting as an excuse to attack people they clearly do not understand. I think everyone wants to make friends with people with like intersts, whether that be hiking, cards, being black or being gay. I have many interest and many different friends to go with those intersts, some gay some not.
July 8, 2008 at 11:15 pm #627116
soclwrkrinmotnMemberI am still not quite clear why this got contentious. I think you (Zenguy and Bayou) both summed it up, though.
And Shed, you do need to meet us blog folk. Even the fiery ones (like me) are pretty nice. :) The White Center event (and where I and a few others live) was quite fun.
July 8, 2008 at 11:22 pm #627117
AnonymousInactiveBayou, to use your analogy, the question becomes do you have to actually own a dog, or can you just love dogs? And I also wonder, how can one become enlightened by surrounding themselves with like minded people?
And I don’t agree at all that the meet-up was being used as an excuse to attack. It bothers me that that is still the assumption. I know 3 of the straight people desiring to talk about this, and attacking is the furthest thing from their minds.
July 8, 2008 at 11:38 pm #627118
BayouMemberJT, Actually I have a dog AND a cat but it was just an analogy.
What I said was that I find it enlightening to “gather” with like minded people- meaning those who share the same ideals or vision on a number of varying topics of interest. Particularly those that are engaging with positive ideas for a progressive society.
I didn’t, however, say that I “surrounded” myself with only like minded people, which would be far from reality. I’m not going to get into a list of my diverse group of friends but I will suffice it to say that they vary in every range of color and creed.
I think I understand where you are coming from with your original posting on the subject but I respectfully disagree that a meetup is a means of exclusion. As so many people have noted in the threads, it IS important for *some* people in our community to have safe space. Perhaps they aren’t out, perhaps transitioning or a number of other possible scenarios.
Growing up in the deep south, it look me a long time to become comfortable in my own skin. I know there are others that have had similar experiences and look to others in the community for support in that matter. And although you personally may not have experienced discrimination here, in Seattle in 2008- many people continue to.
I believe that you were trying to make the point that diversity is enlightening and perhaps some members of the community just need a latte, a conversation and a chance to embrace that diversity.
July 9, 2008 at 12:07 am #627119
AnonymousInactiveSeeing as I am (somewhat, I guess) being accused of wanting to “attack” and this was the place to do it, I think I will speak up.
The point being made here was not about one group of people “attacking” another group of people. The point was, why have an exclusive meet-up when you wouldn’t appreciate an exclusive meet-up that you were banned from? Why do to others what you would not want done to you, or your group of people?
It was a very simple question. There were several examples given to support the necessity of an exclusive get-together that I, personally, empathized with.
I just wanted to make sure that it was understood, at least for this straight person, what the issue was about (and NOT about). I learned a lot. I think we have all moved on.
July 9, 2008 at 12:44 am #627120
AnonymousInactiveI don’t know that I necessarily believe the meet-up in and of itself was exclusionary. And I understand and appreciate the different needs involved. Been there and done that, for sure.
In the original thread, I was bothered that some members of the LBGT community immediately assumed the straight participants where antagonistic and out to harass.
I only wished to share another view point, and be willing to at least listen to others. The anger and defensiveness coming from some, did not represent me. I certainly don’t have all the answers or pretend to speak for anyone but myself.
I do know, that I try really hard to treat others how I want to be treated. And I truly believe some in the community could not see how their words sounded no different than what is often used against us.
July 9, 2008 at 12:50 am #627121
JoBParticipantI read the same announcement everyone else did at the beginning of this event and as a friend of some of the LGBT community, i know that i have been invited.
However, as a friend of the LGBT community, I also know that it would be considerate of me to let them meet together and get comfortable with one another before walking in that door..
LOL.. just to be self serving… it will help prevent misunderstandings from those who might find me too attractive to resist if they didn’t know my straight little arse is coming ahead of time:)
(OK.. maybe a cheesy joke… but, i couldn’t resist… it has been years since a stranger found my grandma vibe overcoming their libido… i just had to fantasize ;) )
the point is.. no-one who had a reason to want to join that particular group of people has been banned…
and i intend to wait for that group to join the rest of us in a forum-wide event when they find themselves comfortable enough to do so.
in the meantime.. i am percolating an event that will be open only to women and male crossdressers ;=0
oh no…….
now.. won’t that be fun….
July 9, 2008 at 12:52 am #627122
soclwrkrinmotnMemberThat’s where I got confused too, JT. No one said that it was meant to be exclusive. :) I do think safe spaces are needed, but at the same time, I think this group was for those of us residing in WS/WC and are members of the LGBTQ to have coffee and just meet. La familia, verdad?
July 9, 2008 at 12:55 am #627123
soclwrkrinmotnMemberJoB, you almost always make me laugh, and think. :)
July 9, 2008 at 1:08 am #627124
JoBParticipanti thought i posted… but must be getting heat stroke:)
JoB curtseys in soclwrkrinmotn’s general direction and winks…
but will still ban him from any event involving cross dressers ;~>
July 9, 2008 at 1:40 am #627125
soclwrkrinmotnMember*falls out of chair laughing*
July 9, 2008 at 2:24 am #627126
BayouMemberNewRes, I wasn’t trying to beat a dead subject, I just missed the original thread until it was “bumped” up earlier today. That sent me back to the corresponding threads and I was a bit shell shocked after reading them all.
JT, I appreciate those of you that are willing to have an honest dialect and I recognize that each of us can only speak of our experiences/opinions. I’m not one of those people who like to be pigeon holed or labeled either. I don’t do the rallies and I don’t have rainbow stickers plastered all over my car. Like you (I assume from your posting), I don’t want to be defined by the fact that I’m gay. It’s only a small piece of the puzzle. I just found it appealing to have the opportunity to meet some other “family” in the neighborhood. Of course, there is no guarantee that we will bond but you really never know where friendships may take root. And I’m all for attending other forum member events too, not just the queer ones.
(Making a mental note to hit on JoB whenever we meet, lol.)
July 9, 2008 at 2:40 am #627127
AnonymousInactiveBayou – I didn’t mean to imply that you were “beating a dead horse”, only wanted to clarify my position in the aftermath.
I did learn a lot and, if anything, hope that other people thought about some things as well.
I love how you speak of never knowing “where friendships may take root”. I am new to town and, regardless of if I was welcome to this particular gathering or not, I did meet a true friend out of the whole ordeal.
You know who you are and I’m lucky to have you in my life!
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