FOLLOWUP: What SDOT says about crash-plagued West Seattle Bridge spot

(Reader photo from crash and fire January 3)

After multiple crashes (including this one and this one) weekend before last toward the southwest end of the West Seattle Bridge – near the pullout by the “Welcome to West Seattle” sign and remaining “Walking on Logs” sculptures – we asked SDOT if they’re looking into that particular spot.

(January 5 photo from commenter SeaKev)

Though neither crash resulted in serious injuries, among other things, they had other effects – such as, both led to callouts for SDOT responders to come reset the jersey barriers that the crashes had knocked out of place, which required blocking traffic for a time. Meantime, here’s what SDOT spokesperson Ethan Bergerson told WSB:

Thank you for bringing this pattern to our attention … we’re still working on this question for you. Our pavement engineers and Vision Zero team are looking into this location to better understand the history and current conditions and consider potential next steps.

Some commenters have wondered whether a change in pavement types at that spot is a factor in these crashes – or whether it’s just a speed problem – or maybe a risk faced by certain types of vehicles. Even a quick search of our archives shows crashes at that spot for years. (Side notes – the number of crashes in our archives outstrips what’s shown on the SDOT collision data map, if you’re looking for hard data. And the bridge has had at least one other focused trouble spot before.) We’ll continue checking back to see what SDOT eventually deduces.

56 Replies to "FOLLOWUP: What SDOT says about crash-plagued West Seattle Bridge spot"

  • Al King January 14, 2025 (1:17 pm)

    “Thank you for bringing this to our attention” WOW just WOW.  This takes “we know there’s a problem we should have fixed long ago but we’ll pretend it’s shocking news to us” to a whole new level. WSB. Please keep shining a light on this please!

  • Seth January 14, 2025 (1:31 pm)

    Maybe if people drove the posted speedlimit or close to and wernt weaving in and out of traffic they wouldnt have crashed. -Sincerely someone who has driven this corner without issue for years.

    • No more Subarus in the passing lane January 14, 2025 (7:42 pm)

      It’s not a speed issue. This turn can be taken safely at 50-60 mph in dry conditions with a car equipped with proper tires (Michelin’s, Continental’s, Bridgestone’s, etc. and not the boof y’all buy at Les Schwab). I have lost traction here in the WET going 15 mph off throttle in a car equipped with KO2 all terrains. Carrying speed down the back of the bridge and up the hill is the most fuel efficient way to drive, and the bridge is built like a freeway. The bridge is not built like a road that commands a 45 mph speed limit, but more like one that should be 60 mph. I’ve driven in 31 states, and Seattle’s drivers are top 3 worst in the country because nobody tries to understand the fundamentals of driving and roads besides letting people merge. I will gladly pay more into RTA every year to get more people off roadways because it will have a dramatic effect on those of us who like to drive. Please anyone reading this just put some effort in to how you drive or don’t drive at all if you can. 

      • Gatewood resident January 14, 2025 (8:56 pm)

        Wow this is next level incoherent. Incredible stuff 

      • WSzombie January 14, 2025 (9:55 pm)

        This is my 4th or 5th time repeating this post. I’m in 100% agreement here. It’s not a speed issue, it’s an issue of vehicle type, road quality, and weather conditions. I have a basic Toyota Tacoma with rear wheel drive and excellent tires. (Cooper Discoverer AT3) When going up that hill, especially in the left lane, there is a set of 3 rolling hills right near the curve. Those rollers take weight off the back end of rear wheel drive vehicles. When accelerating to make it up the hill, having no weight in the rear causes the back wheels to lose traction. Since it’s on the curve, the spinouts should be expected, not a surprise. And if SDOT is really just learning about this now, they’ve been sleeping on the job. That section was redone after the bridge was fixed. I’d find it hard to believe they haven’t done some sort of traffic or accident monitoring on a NEWLY REPAIRED BRIDGE. 

      • West Seattle Lite January 15, 2025 (12:22 am)

        There is absolutely nothing wrong with Les Schwab Tires. I’ve used them on my 4Runner for decades without issue – snow, sun, sleet, mud, sand, and rain. 

    • D-Mom January 15, 2025 (8:27 am)

      Definitely not a speed issue (though I’m sure some crashes are). And it is not just affecting rear wheel drive vehicles. I have AWD CRV with snow tires and felt my tires disengage in that exact spot and start to slide when I was going 40 or less in the rain. This was about 20–30 minutes after an accident was just cleared in the exact same spot. I look on the blog and see about 10 commenters skidded in the same spot. It is right where the new pavement is on the inside lane (next to the jersey barrier as you are going around the turn.  It’s so bad that I now avoid the bridge completely in the rain. It was like hitting a patch of ice. 

      • Jenn January 15, 2025 (11:53 am)

        I have a Ford  F150 truck I  Wrecked on that corner I was not speeding is my  I was going under the speed limit. My back end just went right out from underneath me and wam. They just need to do something about the pavement that’s all there is to it. When I wrecked there was a sheriff behind me 2 cars back and he absolutely told me there was nothing else I could have done that I didn’t do anything wrong. Thank goodness I didn’t hit anybody else just the barrier and I was okay.

    • Sedan driver January 18, 2025 (7:30 am)

      I don’t know how fast the crashers were going but I have consistently taken this turn at 50 – 55 mph in my Honda Accord in dry conditions, on the concrete section. Then the road surface changes and I’m always careful here, slowing down. 

  • Also John January 14, 2025 (1:39 pm)

    It’s a speed problem.   If you go the posted speed limit you will have no problems with the change in surface finish. If you go over the posted speed you’ll find your vehicle lose traction where the surface finish changes on the corner.

    • WSzombie January 14, 2025 (9:56 pm)

      @Also John, I’m curious as to what cars you’ve driven in that stretch of road. I highly doubt any of them are heavy and/or rear wheel drive. I’m guessing a Prius or Mini Cooper. But my imagination will have to suffice as I doubt you will reply. 

      • Sunrise Heights January 15, 2025 (6:21 am)

        Are you suggesting we all should be driving heavy, oversized vehicles at high speed and that the roads should be designed for those who do? Research shows that oversized trucks and SUV’s pose a hazard to pedestrians and other cars and are more likely to cause accident fatalities. I would agree that SDOT has to design for and respond to the reality that too many people are driving that kind of vehicle unnecessarily (I.e., they have no functional need for it). However, I don’t understand the implied judgment of people who drive smaller, fuel-efficient cars at safe speeds. It sounds like you’re suggesting there’s something wrong with that. Are you?

        • k January 15, 2025 (8:57 am)

          I didn’t get that at all from their post, just guessing that the poster’s experience involved a vehicle with good stability and maneuverability in a wider range of conditions than a work pickup (for example).  

          • WSzombie January 15, 2025 (7:39 pm)

            @K, you are correct. I was making the point that @Also_John probably drives an front wheel drive car that is likely very light and has a small engine. @Sunrise_Heights: Can you provide a data source for your statement regarding safety and vehicle hazards? I won’t debate that trucks kill more pedestrians that cars, but from my research, I have data to prove it’s due to trucks far exceeding car sales. As a ratio for vehicles sold:pedestrian deaths, the top two killers per vehicle on the road are both sedans. 

    • D-Mom January 15, 2025 (8:29 am)

      Untrue. See my comment above. 

  • The Good Driver January 14, 2025 (1:52 pm)

    There might be a problem with the pavement, I don’t know. 

    But what I do know is that people drive way too fast to get up & around that curve.  We’ve all seen it, they’re not driving 50-60, they’re not driving 65 … many are driving 70+. 

    Having said that, people drive way too fast EVERYWHERE … on California, on 35th, on side streets. 

    And worse, most aren’t young drivers … most are in their 40-50s … parents who know better.  Parents who would be BS if you drove THAT fast past THEIR house.  Accidents aren’t planned. 

    Do stupid things & you get stupid results.

  • Look Both Ways January 14, 2025 (2:34 pm)

    If it was just a speed issue, there’d be crashes daily; in fact, multiple per day. Clearly that’s not the case, and clearly some crashes weren’t due to speed. The pavement or curve needs further analysis and correction.

    • H2OK9 January 14, 2025 (3:29 pm)

      Exactly!But they’ll take the SDOT shortcut and just reduce speeds.

    • AJ January 14, 2025 (7:24 pm)

      “clearly some crashes weren’t due to speed.”      You know this how?    Is there a study?

      • Look Both Ways January 14, 2025 (10:53 pm)

        Multiple witness accounts cite factors other than speed in past comments.

  • KT January 14, 2025 (2:48 pm)

    Such a Seattle answer ….. Thank you for bringing this pattern to our attention … we’re still working on this question for you. Our pavement engineers and Vision Zero team are looking into this location.

    • WS Res January 14, 2025 (6:16 pm)

      What did you want them to say? “We don’t want your input”? “Oh we know all about that problem, we just choose not to do anything”? “When I write government entities, hearing “we’ll look into it and tell you what we find” sounds like an OK start at least.

    • Christopher B. January 15, 2025 (12:19 pm)

      “Vision Zero” sounds like another way of saying “blind.”

  • Tanej January 14, 2025 (3:14 pm)

    Definitely a speed problem!  Drivers are still doing 50+mph when they get to the Fauntleroy/Oregon stoplight.  I see it not just often, frequently, but regularly!  It’s impossible to pull onto Fauntleroy from the side streets unless a red light stops them (and don’t count on that either!)

  • Gay January 14, 2025 (3:36 pm)

    Tail gaters……STOP IT NOW!   You’ll get there.

  • Julia January 14, 2025 (3:55 pm)

    I was there recently on wet pavement. Driving cautiously, but still felt the rear tires lose traction briefly. Weird.

  • WSDUDEMAN January 14, 2025 (4:05 pm)

    Speed, moisture and vehicle (weight/tires) seems to all play into this corner being a bit tricky. I’ve had no trouble in my car, but my truck has slid there, even with new tires. Any bit of moisture on the pavement seems to exacerbate the issue. To a comment above, yes, people are usually absolutely flying up the bridge and into that turn. Will be interesting to hear what info the DOT comes back with in 3 years.

    • Little One January 15, 2025 (6:51 am)

      YES! Multiple factors at play here, it’s not one thing or the other only.I think if this curve was better designed, there could be less accidents and less “slippage” felt by people that have not crashed. But, add rain and less skilled driving (including speeds) for the car type and conditions, and this problem area becomes a hot spot for accidents.Overall, I see people braking before and then accelerating too late on hills in Western Washington all the time. This area is tricky because if you haven’t maintained momentum while taking into account the road conditions, you can accelerate or be going too fast at an adverse point in the road.

  • Adam January 14, 2025 (4:05 pm)

    If there’s an uncontrolled 4-way intersection in town that has lots of issues, usually the result is a 4-way controlled intersection with stop signs. The city doesn’t go out and just point fingers at ppl for making mistakes on how they handle it. That’s left to the trolls on the internet. Instead, they just make an unsafe street safer, regardless of how you feel about it.  And Seth, how many accidents HAVE you been in? If the answer is zero, does that mean every accident that occurs on streets you’ve traveled for years cannot be addressed with mitigation efforts that might include changes to the roadway/signage/surface/speed limit, etc, because Seth has never crashed? Is that how it works? I’ve also lived here for years and taken that road thousands of times (not an embellishment). I’ve never crashed there, and I know of the issue. And yet there have been times where I swear I felt tires lose traction slightly. I drive a safe speed limit and sometimes that’s even slower than the posted limit. So do we not make changes for those of us attempting to drive safely that may find themselves accidentally in what might be some trouble?

    • Olive January 14, 2025 (6:08 pm)

      Wordy.

    • WS Res January 14, 2025 (6:18 pm)

      Yeah, when drivers hit pedestrians or cyclists, the idea of a “road diet” seems of interest to commenters here. So why not the same for this dangerous spot of road, even if it only involves vehicles?

  • M January 14, 2025 (4:06 pm)

    If it were just the pavement, wouldn’t there also be daily crashes too? I’m guessing it’s speeding + bad tires + conditions + pavement. And SDOT is only responsible for 1/4 of that equation. 

    • Jimbo January 14, 2025 (8:30 pm)

      Amen.

    • Sunrise Heights January 15, 2025 (6:32 am)

      Thanks, M, for cutting through the reductionist debate. I would add that while I wish people would slow down to mitigate the factor they have the power to control, I do also hope SDOT addresses the problem.

    • Lynda B January 15, 2025 (9:10 am)

      I agree with this.  There are lots of variables and contributing factors including driver competency.I just renewed my tabs.  DOL’s website will be down for an update and my suggestion to them was to add a driver refresher component before you complete before renewing.  The issues I see speeding, zipper merging and no lights when there is low visibility.Some folks are in a hurry and “me” focused that they forget they’re getting on the road with a lethal weapon (i.e. their car) if they don’t use it properly.  Take a moment and think we’re all trying to get home to our loved ones safely.

  • Kbota January 14, 2025 (4:14 pm)

    It’s not just a speed issue.  If it were, there would be a lot more accidents.  I was doing the speed limit, in a truck with great tires and did a sway and swing at that spot.  Never had it happen before.  I would have hit a car if anyone had been near in the other lane.  It’s a pavement problem and there is enough data to show they need to fix it.  

  • WS Taxpayer January 14, 2025 (4:28 pm)

    Tire wear, weather, incline, banked turn, road conditions and driver competence are all factors that are  magnified by speed.    There is no silver bullet.

  • Vincent January 14, 2025 (5:11 pm)

    It’s speeding.  There’s little chance there will be a police monitoring speeds anymore, so people feel emboldened to speed.  I see it going up Admiral as well.  If I go 10 over up Admiral, I still get passed by.  People fly up the hill even faster at the west end of the the WSF/way.  It’s a long sweeping corner like a racetrack.  

  • Juanito January 14, 2025 (5:12 pm)

    Speed is a problem at that curve.The transition from the new pavement on the bridge to the older pavement on Fauntleroy by the sculptures is an additional problem.Just after the bridge reopened as I came around the curve in my ancient Toyota Tacoma truck the vehicle fish tailed and started to slide toward the kids on the logs. I let off on the throttle and steered in the direction of the slide (snow driving 101). The truck stopped sliding and I putt putted on up the hill. The pavement on Fauntleroy in both directions from 35th to the bridge needs to be improved. On rainy days the surface is slick and the traction is reduced.Fauntleroy from 35th to Admiral needs to be completely rebuilt.I’m just an old guy who drives an old truck and I’m not a civil engineer working for the City so I don’t think I need to take a deeper look at the situation.

    • SL January 15, 2025 (7:28 am)

      I agree with this. I think people pick up speed coming around the turn on the new grooved pavement, then when they hit the old pavement they lose traction and start to skid. Especially if their tires are compromised. It’s ridiculous that SDOT is out here resetting the barriers regularly, but haven’t put any real thought into a solution.

  • Jethro Marx January 14, 2025 (5:26 pm)

    A skill issue? The simplest possibility is often the answer, even if we’d like to pretend it’s something else. Ask any proctologist.

    “I tell you, it was a million-to-one shot, doc, million-to-one!”

    • Friend O'Dinghus January 14, 2025 (6:57 pm)

      Well I was going to have fusilli for dinner, but not now…

  • Rumbles January 14, 2025 (5:53 pm)

    To those complaining about speeders, while that may be true — it may also be true that people are not speeding.  I have gone around that corner at 30 mph when wet and if you step on the gas with too much pressure to compensate for the growing hill it is not hard to get a tail slide.  If you aren’t expecting that and overreact to it it isn’t hard to lose control.  

  • Suzanne January 14, 2025 (6:49 pm)

    It feels like we’re talking among ourselves here, unless  Ethan Bergerson of SDOT is monitoring our comments to evaluate the situation, which seems unlikely.  He’s a media contact, according to SDOT’s website. What would be a more effective approach? A petition directed to SDOT Director Greg Spotts (his email is not posted)?  Writing about our first-hand experiences including close calls to Mr. Spotts or the person responsible for West Seattle? Suggestions… ??  Tracy links to SDOT’s Transportation page in her article. Here’s another link to it — https://seattle.gov/transportation

    • WSB January 14, 2025 (6:51 pm)

      They’re not considered official public comment, but in my experience many public agencies are well aware of our comments. (See the slide in the Healthy Street story, for example.) Sometimes they actually yield information, not just opinions.

  • mnw January 14, 2025 (7:17 pm)

    “Thanks for bringing this pattern to our attention.” This sounds as if they had no idea prior to WSB reaching out that there have been multiple accidents at the same location. Does someone have to lose their life to “get their attention”?

    I am a cautious driver but get a lot of anxiety driving that curve in the rain now. Please, just fix the pavement to improve the traction in that spot. Sure, speed contributes but it’s obviously more than that.

  • Keep it real January 14, 2025 (8:14 pm)

    Lived in W Sea since 1995.  Never had many issues until lately.  Combo speed and driver addiction “aka phones.”  Most drivers can’t so basic driving tasks, like spacing for merge. 

  • Ltmmgm January 14, 2025 (8:21 pm)

    Driving too fast, driving too slow, driving when it is wet, driving when it is dry…remember you may have new tires but when the weather changes from hot to cold so does your air pressure in your tires, so make sure to check their pressure periodically

  • Marcus January 15, 2025 (5:19 am)

    Drove it last week. It does transition from a traction positive road surface to that ground down rock aggregate smooth surface. Seems like the SDOT would have diamond wheel scored the transition for about 50 feet. Yet there are many road surface transitions all over the city and drivers need to just keep eyes on the road and drive appropriately.

  • Driving Joe January 15, 2025 (6:43 am)

    It’s speed. All the physics majors here trying to solve the equations of friction of tires on the road and the coefficient of the water can put their chalks down because the primary factor is speed. I’ve witnessed almost half the people taking the bridge going over the posted speed limit.

    • enginerd January 15, 2025 (11:15 am)

      Is there the same frequency of accidents on the eastbound side of this curve? I certainly do not hear about them. If it was speed and speed alone, why wouldn’t the opposite direction of the same curve be just as dangerous?
      If it’s physics… then maybe there is something “physically” different about the westbound lanes… like for instance an abrupt change to an inferior surface condition midway through the curve.

    • Al King January 15, 2025 (5:01 pm)

      You haven’t noticed? ALL these spinouts occurred when it was raining or was still wet from raining.  Tell us why you believe speed is the only reason and wet smooth pavement isn’t the cause.

  • Andrew January 15, 2025 (6:55 am)

    “Slippery When Wet” signs may at least alert drivers not familiar with this corner. I have fishtailed twice this year in this spot in my rear wheel drive SUV in the rain. New Michelin’s in July 2024.Not a speed issue, but if I drove slower it may have helped. I agree with the comments about the ‘bounce’ in the road and losing traction.

  • enginerd January 15, 2025 (8:15 am)

    Possible causes given for the frequent accidents at this
    location:

    • 1. It is 100% caused by excessive speed.
    • 2. It’s a combination of factors, perhaps including
      excessive speed, but most certainly also exacerbated by surface conditions
      and/or other road surface factors.
    • 3. It is 100% caused by surface conditions and/or other road
      surface factors, but not excessive speed.

    SDOT should already be aware that there is an abnormal and
    unacceptable number of incidents at this very specific location. It is disappointing
    that they have not done anything to address or even identify the leading cause. 

  • KA January 15, 2025 (3:15 pm)

    Could it also be exacerbated by last-second lane changes to either go left on 35th or straight on Fauntleroy? Maybe earlier signage could help?

  • Burgerman January 18, 2025 (1:41 pm)

    It’s very simple. The change from anti-slide grooved new concrete to the ancient, large rock-aggregate concrete that has been worn smooth by decades of traffic, combined with uneven subgrade causing older panels to tilt, creates a situation where some types of vehicles with a certain weight distribution and differing drive wheel arrangement and torque distribution lose traction when it is raining. The OBVIOUS solution is to repair/replace/modify/level the older panels until out of the curve. Nothing more is required than road repair/surface modification. Don’t let anyone else tell you otherwise.

Sorry, comment time is over.