39 Replies to "TRAFFIC/TRANSIT: Friday watch, fourth week of West Seattle Bridge closure"

• Jort April 17, 2020 (7:54 am)

  I had the chance to see some of the coronavirus-suppressed driving decisions of my fellow West Seattleites last night. The amount of vehicles on Highland Park Way, Holden, etc. was astonishing, and it was off-peak and a Thursday. Cars were backed up for blocks and blocks, and clearly the hair-trigger road rage was setting in for a few folks. I truly don’t think folks here have any concept of how fundamentally different everybody’s lives in West Seattle are, starting right now. I think people are under the assumption that there’s some kind of magic lane re-striping or a magic signal re-timing that’s going to come in and, while not make things perfect, at least make things bearable. I’m going to tell you right now that is not happening no matter how much you might wish it, and there is literally only one way out of this: reducing the amount of driving and providing meaningful alternatives. Every minute spent getting angry about this is time of your short life on this earth being wasted, because no amount of anger on the planet is going to change the fact that every single West Seattle resident’s reliance on the automobile is now completely altered, and, again, there is nothing anybody can do about it. People who used to drive and swore they’d never do anything else undeniably will be riding bikes and buses, and that is just a 100 percent flat fact. 

  • Honestly? April 17, 2020 (4:03 pm)

    Do you honestly believe this stuff? Do you think that the entire concept of public transit hasn’t been fundamentally changed as well? You think that people are going to crowd into a tiny space and risk getting sick? It rains 300 days a year here. Bikes are a pleasant idea, but not viable. People will continue to work from home as much as possible and a lot more people from West Seattle will be on the water heading to work until the light rail is ready. All of this is nothing but speculation as we all could be home for a lot longer and neither you nor the alleged “cyclists” have any more answers than the rest of us. 

    • Patrick angry now April 17, 2020 (8:04 pm)

      Never mind that Jort guy; and I do believe he actually believes this stuff. This is his dream come true. It’s like that old saying, if your only tool is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail. Jort is what we call round these parts; a bike nazi. definition of bike nazi. Jort doesn’t understand that there are people who have situations that differ from his, such as: living with physical disability, working somewhere that is not down town, having children, having disabled children, requiring a car for work, having a job that requires you to be at a physical location to do things such as: making bicycle components, airplane parts, or perform building repair and maintenance, repairing ships that deliver affordable Asian bicycles and laptops. Jort has a very narrow world view. I, like “Honestly?”, want to see people proposing solutions and delivering constructive arguments as opposed to the pessimism that only bicycles can cure.  If bicycles are truly the answer…… then as soon as we are allowed to get back to work; I need a lumber package delivered to north 35Ave SW, 2 kids dropped off and picked up daily from before and after school daycare, a 5 ton punch press delivered from West Seattle to East marginal way, my neighbors kid needs medical treatment in capital hill 3 times a week, another neighbor needs dialysis fairly frequently and will also need  a bike ride to work on Michigan. Can you carry a new water heater on your bike for me tomorrow? Bicycles are a very small part of the solution, and if it makes Jort feel any better, I just tuned up my bike to get to work via the lower bridge. I will however be keeping an eye out for smug looking middle aged men in spandex crossing the lower bridge and will be asking; “are you Jort?”   (sorry, just my assumption concerning who Jort may be).     We need our community leaders to step up. Our community needs to put pressure on local, state and federal representatives to fast track temporary, and permanent solutions. This is going to take a lot of work. Just like it took a lot of work to get the bridge that is failing us now.       For anyone interested in the history of our  “Jeanette Williams Memorial Bridge” and what it took to get it built, here is a wonderful video featuring the incredible woman who made it possible.   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pQ7LcpMrf8&feature=emb_rel_end. We have not been this cut off from mainland Seattle for over 100 years. This is not sustainable for our community and will have repercussions throughout the region.  

      • smug older than middle aged guy April 17, 2020 (9:41 pm)

        We are up against an unyielding physical constraint: The roads are only so big and they can’t be enlarged in any meaningful way. The only way that folks can get dependable daily deliveries of 5-ton punch presses is if as many people as possible are enticed out of their single-occupancy cars. Bikes and better bike facilities are the cheapest and quickest way to accomplish that. Those of us who can cycle should do so and free up road space for people who absolutely need to drive. I’m doing my part, will you?As for spandex, it’s not really practical in this climate. Merino wool is much better.

        • Patrick angry now April 18, 2020 (10:54 am)

          Ha! Thanks for the Merino Wool tip “smug older than middle aged guy”.    Stating that we are up against an “unyielding physical constraint” is selling us short. For better or worse, we have physically shaped this city to meet our needs. We regraded half of Seattle. The other half sits on what were once mud flats. The Duwamish was dredged, widened, and straightened to serve as a more navigable waterway for trade and commerce. in 1918, we had 3 temporary swing bridges crossing the Duwamish, one of which (Oxbow bridge) was even moved to a new location as the Duwamish was straightened further. Another had trolley tracks and pipes to supply West Seattle with fresh water. The pipes had to be uncoupled every time a vessel needed pass. There is not much we North-westerners can’t do. We do need to replace the bridge ASAP. I will ride my bike when possible, but that may not be all that often. Kids and work responsibilities don’t allow for the use of a bike as transportation and a work vehicle. As mentioned above, many people are logistically or physically prohibited from biking.    Looking at the Spokane bike counter, we are at 1,847,983 trips since Nov 2013, which is great. That averages to roughly 790 trips per day. Compared to 108,000 trips per day in vehicles over the Duwamish, many of which are car pools and buses. We do not have an accurate way co count people, just vehicles, so a head count will be higher than 108,000. Let’s call it 115,000 people who used to cross the Duwamish in vehicles.   Say optimistically, 25% of people will be working from home after we get back to work, say another 5% will have lost employment and will not reenter the work force or retire. Let’s say another 5% move away from West Seattle due to inconvenience. That leaves us with approximately 75,000 commuting trips across the Duwamish.  Do you think we can get 5,000 trips per day across the lower bridge on bike? That leaves 70,000 trips per day on the already crowded arteries of commerce that make up this region. This will create unknown amounts of additional pollution due to idling cars in traffic and million upon millions of lost revenue spent on wasted fuel and lost productivity. We need the political will to fast track a bridge replacement and temporary infrastructure for the sake of the entire region, not just West Seattle. So, yeah, I’m going to ride a bike when I can, It won’t likely be often enough to develop a smug sense of superiority. Bikes are, at the most, 5% of the solution. Now I’m thinking about that Portlandia skit about the bicycle moving company.  Maybe I can get a 75 gallon water heater delivered by bike…….

• Grant April 17, 2020 (8:24 am)

  Considering SDOT is not even marginally qualified to remediate pot holes much less mitigate and project manage a major infrastructure structure failure (and ALL their fault) with the single arterial gateway to West Seattle serving 130k residents now land fill rubble; get used to these images of empty a empty bridge while West Seattle economically and socially slowly and painfully chokes to death to the whispered sighs and “oh well” from all City government and our so called representatives.  As per usual. Just make sure your useless car tabs are paid up and current!

  • tsurly April 17, 2020 (9:48 am)

    yawn

  • MArk47n April 17, 2020 (11:46 am)

    That’s pretty hyperbolic. There is more than one arterial into W. Seattle, the bridge just happened to be the most convenient for most. The failure of the bridge likely is NOT the fault of SDOT, especially if there was an underlying fault in the design or materials used in the construction. Who knows, perhaps the bridge would’ve been closed earlier.My chief concern is that it’s not a given that the bridge will be repaired at all let alone replaced.

  • WR April 17, 2020 (1:41 pm)

    Agree with Grant. 

  • dsa April 17, 2020 (1:46 pm)

    Not addressing the failure earlier *is* the fault of SDOT.  That alone may have caused what now appears to be complete failure.  Back in 2014 had a report suggesting remedial actions including additional post tensioning that had been provided for in the original build, but acknowledged as the most expensive.  However now just the shoring to tear it down probably costs more than that remedial action.  And not replacing the high level is not an option.  Our access with the east and north is all but lost despite having some squek by alternatives.

• West Seattle Lurker April 17, 2020 (10:53 am)

  It’s unfortunate this happened, but it’s just a bridge. 

• Tim McGuire April 17, 2020 (12:35 pm)

  If you’d like to contact your city representatives and let them know how you feel about all this here are all of their email addresses.  Teresa.Mosqueda@seattle.gov, Lorena.Gonzalez@seattle.gov, Lisa.Herbold@seattle.gov, jenny.durkan@seattle.govI sent my thoughts. I think everyone in west seattle should so this gets the attention and priority is deserves, that we deserve.Tim

  • China Cat April 17, 2020 (7:23 pm)

    Thanks, I sent an email, discussing prohibiting large vessels and sailboats above the lower bridge. Time to shut it down. We no longer need a high span bridge.

    • Tsurly April 17, 2020 (8:09 pm)

      Then you should have emailed the Coast Guard. They control the maritime traffic, not the City, which has been stated on here sooooooooo man times before.

      • WSB April 17, 2020 (8:31 pm)

        Getting the river suddenly changed to “non-navigable” would certainly be a tall task.
        https://www.nap.usace.army.mil/Portals/39/docs/regulatory/regs/33cfr329.pdf

• dsa April 17, 2020 (12:39 pm)

  We still have three lanes. One is on the low bridge. One is at 1st Ave bridge and the other is at 16th bridge.  That is the bright side.

• Jim April 17, 2020 (1:08 pm)

  “We” don’t have use of the low bridge.

  • dsa April 17, 2020 (2:57 pm)

    Yes, the low bridge sucks up those nasty buses and trucks, so yes the low bridge definitely does count.  What does make this quite different than last time we lost a Spokane street bridge besides more population is our access to the 1st So Ave bridge.  As I remember, prior to rebuilding the 1st Ave bridge West Seattle comprised something like 25% of the traffic over it.  We had very simple on and off ramps back then.  But the rebuild created these twisty lengthy loop de loops and extra stops that make it quite cumbersome to access that bridge now.

• Rick April 17, 2020 (1:38 pm)

  If you take the ferry (reduced sailings/service) to Vashon and depart at the south end (Talequah) you can then connect to I5 and drive around. Just takes a little thinking outside of the box. What used to be 12-15  minutes is now only a couple of hours. But it’s OK, as the jobs are gone and don’t need to go to work anyway. And I left the farm in Kansas for this?

• Seaview April 17, 2020 (2:55 pm)

  I was trying to not get worked up about this, but as I just sat in traffic from i5 to my house on a Friday at 2pm, taking nearly 50 min….feeling upset. This is going to change west seattle dramatically. 

• Mj April 17, 2020 (3:18 pm)

  The City needs to provide alternatives that are viable, aka more transit and water taxi service, increase the capacity of alternative routes (restripe 35th to 5 lanes, Roxbury to 4, restrict left turns at key intersections) and get the bridge Fixed or Replaced yesterday.   The City needs to get these plans in place quickly so when people venture back to work they have way to get there in a reasonable amount of time

  • KM April 17, 2020 (3:50 pm)

    MJ, much like your former suggestion(s) to allow highly-college-educated people on the Spokane St Bridge, suggesting 5 lanes of cars on 35th Ave SW is not going to catch on no matter how often you mention it, nor is it going to help move people over the Duwamish. 

    • dsa April 17, 2020 (5:34 pm)

      Adding a lane back to 35th just while it is necessary, and should be implemented just as quickly as the “Stay Healthy Streets”.

      • AMD April 17, 2020 (6:27 pm)

        What?  How is making 35th wider going to add capacity to the 1st Avenue Bridge?  You’re going to take away everyone’s car storage (which I am okay with, to be honest, but that’s beside the point) just so they can get to the traffic jam faster and still get downtown/the east side in the same amount of time.  How on earth does that become “necessary” in someone’s mind?  

  • WSJ April 17, 2020 (4:51 pm)

    “Widen 35th to 5 lanes” is now the front-runner for most ignorant suggestion, beating out “build a temporary bridge in pontoons”

    • dsa April 17, 2020 (10:02 pm)

      I wrote restrict Burien, yes they might find some work arounds, or get to share in the metering like the rest of us.  And how to get to Roxbury if not by 35th?  You must live on 35th, I’m sorry, arterials suck.

  • dsa April 17, 2020 (9:05 pm)

    AMD, The city and state can add capacity to 1st ave so bridge by dedicating a lane or two to West Seattle.  Essentially restricting the flow from points south, Burien.  35th ave bottlenecks is just one of the detour issues they need to correct.  Most or all have already been spoken about on this newsite.  But what is SDOT doing?  All the mayor says is all options are on the table.  sure,  Now is the time to fix up these detour routes.

    • AMD April 17, 2020 (9:45 pm)

      That doesn’t add capacity, it just prioritizes the traffic differently.  Having been over the 1st Avenue Bridge scores of times, I have absolutely no idea how they would “dedicate a lane or two to West Seattle”.  That doesn’t make ANY sense.  In this idea you have, are you including the Myers Way on/off ramps as West Seattle Traffic?  If you are, good, Roxbury is a recommended detour to the bridge, but how are you going to stop people from Burien from turning onto Roxbury?   Or in your idea is the Highland Park Way exit/entrance the only one considered West Seattle?  If that’s what you’re thinking, you still don’t need to widen 35th.  It’s already 4 lanes wide north of Morgan, and Morgan is where you cut over to Highland Park Way.  Adding lanes of traffic to the south end of 35th will make ZERO difference in commute times.  Paving will help.  That is the fixing up the routes need, not rechannelization.

• AlexC April 17, 2020 (3:41 pm)

  My bus driver said they got an email today suggesting they were going to start enforcing masks on buses. Have you heard anything about this @WSB?

  • WSB April 17, 2020 (4:02 pm)

    Checking.

    • WSB April 17, 2020 (4:49 pm)

      From Metro spokesperson Jeff Switzer: “We’re not requiring, but are strongly encouraging that riders wear face coverings on public transportation at this time.”

  • flimflam April 17, 2020 (4:36 pm)

    even for “non destination riders”? i highly doubt it and don’t see how it would be enforced.

• TJ April 17, 2020 (3:41 pm)

  How do you think it’s not a given that it will be repaired or replaced? This needs to be the biggest priority in the history of the city to get ALL lanes back fast. The “Seattle process” of studying, debating, doing moronic environmental studies, to take 6 years to build is not an option. Fix it. Fast. It can be done. Get the top engineers on it. This is way out of Seattle’s league. And this is on sdot and our politicians. Infrastructure is a key job of the city yet they spend all their time on social projects and progressive ideas. Shuffle money around, and beg the feds who they constantly nag, but no new taxes or a toll on whatever they do. I’m 48 and have lived here my whole life and remember the first go around with a damaged bridge and ridiculous leadership 

• Mj April 17, 2020 (5:13 pm)

  KM – the City has a number of 5 – lane streets where the curb lane is used for parking off peak, 35th is Principal Arterial and is needed more than ever to handle more traffic especially during peak times when people start to go back to work.  And regarding the low level bridge I suggested highly educated Health Care workers, doctors, RN’s, phamicists be allowed to use low level bridge, your reference to my comment neglected this very important point!  I do not qualify, but allowing health care professionals access better utilizes the capacity of the low level bridge and reduces traffic on the alternative routes that I and others will be resigned to use.

• 22blades April 17, 2020 (5:40 pm)

  I have a question that I couldn’t find the answer to; Does the High Span fail/fix involve only the center span or does it involve the approaching spans as well? Apologies if it was written elsewhere.

  • WSJ April 17, 2020 (6:36 pm)

    Good question, I haven’t seen this answered, but I think the reality is that until they know what’s wrong and what the potential fix(es) is(are), it’s too early to tell. 

  • dsa April 17, 2020 (6:46 pm)

    You could call it “just” the center section.  But that actually appears to be the two halves of  the cantilevered ends from each side of the river that protrude over the water.

• Aaron April 17, 2020 (6:30 pm)

  No SPD in sight during my bicycle commute into town this afternoon, but tons of single occupant cars… they really should have enforcement continuously if they are going to do it at all.

• Mj April 17, 2020 (10:32 pm)

  KM – I suggested highly educated doctors, RN’s and phamicists should be allowed to use the low level bridge.  I am not included in this group, but understand that allowing better utilization of the low level bridge helps everyone.

  Regarding 5 laning 35th the Mayor says all options are on the table.  The City could simply restrict curb lane parking during peak times and extra capacity is provided.  All it costs is some signs and paint.

Sorry, comment time is over.