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May 24, 2012 at 6:14 am #755361
JanSParticipantwhat the AFL-CIO did in SC was infantile, and not a way that I would expect grown adults leaders to act. But…as you and I well know, humans are imperfect..and boy, were those guys imperfect that day. While it might have helped them to vent just a little, what the hell were they thinking?
and just so everyone is clear…Nikki Haley, gov. of SC was born in SC, of Indian Sikh descent…and that is why Kootch called her (or her effigy), “woman of color”…
May 24, 2012 at 2:53 pm #755362
JoBParticipantkootch..
the supreme court found it discriminatory to invade the privacy of women…
an astounding decision at a time in our country’s history when many state laws considered women little more than the property of their husbands or nearest male relatives.
Regardless of how you choose to view that decision, it is the law of this land
and it’s the DOJs job to uphold the law.
even when politics is used as the excuse to break it.
May 24, 2012 at 2:56 pm #755363
JoBParticipantKootch..
i agree with Redblack that beating anyone in effigy in public is one of those What were they thinking moments…
but i wish i felt that you were more upset by the fact that this governor was a woman or a woman of color
than the fact that this governor was a Republican.
May 24, 2012 at 9:07 pm #755364
kootchmanMemberI did clearly indicate she was a woman, and a woman of color. in fact JoB i CAPITALIZED “woman”. However, in the simulated assault, the perpetrator of the deed, felt compelled to also include she was a Republican Governor. It was an element of the act. This goes to the heart of “special protections” for “special people”. In leftist theory land, an assault on a woman, a person of color, or LGBT, is a more serious assault than an assault on any other person. It’s an assault. Politically adjusted and weighted laws and beliefs are either hypocritical or just plan pandering … and those that are not “favorably” weighted are denied equal protections.
well JoB get out as outraged when a Democratic DoJ costs us millions of dollars, no, HUNDREDs of millions to prosecute states implementing settled, laws of the land, to suck up to voting constituents. The Supreme court ruled states can require photo ID’s.. The left doesn’t though… the prism they look through is their catichism de jour’. Now, imagine, a KKK garbed person(s) standing outside a polling station, making overt gestures of hostility and intimidation. I would expect and demand a federal prosecution… would you? But Holder, declines to prosecute a New Black Party Panther attired in his war colors doing the same… now… justice is credible only when applied uniformly. Other than that..justice looks like a clown suit, not better or deserving of more attention than any other political instrument at the disposal of the “party” that happens to be in power. You are an apologist for corrupted governance because there is a thin filament of agreement. You are willing to ignore not one single DoJ investigation into the meltdown.. not one. The only convictions of massive financial frauds, the previous administration. Surely there is some consensus… tell Obama his bought and paid for Wall Street attorney, Eric Holder is naked…we know why he was appointed.. campaign donations. I haven’t seen DoJ as patently corrupt since John Mitchell… as incompetent? yes. Slitherling as corrupt? no.
May 24, 2012 at 9:40 pm #755365
kootchmanMemberOur Senate at work… what would you do with 4 billion? Illegal aliens are claiming and getting $1,000 additional tax refunds for children. Here’s the rub… they can declare children residing in Mexico, who have never set foot in the USA… not even a SS number is required. Funny, I was rankled that my daughter was enrolled in SS in the hospital of her birth, and has been on every tax form files since. So, the Senate has a Republican proposal, not to eliminate the tax credit… just that any dependents claimed have a SS number… you and I have to do it. Harry Reid won’t consider the bill…. it is dead on the table. That’s 4 BILLION of your tax dollars going to children not even US citizens. Incredibly one, 32 year old illegal worker claimed 20 dependent children and got 20K of your tax dollars… oh, yea.. he included all his nieces and nephews in Calixico, Mexico. 4 Billion. The Senate that hasn’t passed a budget in over 1100 days. Thanks for your active participation Democrats, in rooting out WFA for maybe a couple hundred votes. Do us a favor, just hand out $500 in cash to every illegal and buy the votes outright… it’s cheaper.
May 24, 2012 at 10:35 pm #755366
DBPMemberkootch, do you have sources for any of these claims?
If an illegal immigrant claimed 20 kids in Mexico as dependents, presumably that means he was caught and prosecuted, right? Otherwise, what evidence are you working from here?
To even file a tax return, the filer, at least, has to have a SS#, right? And if you use a bogus one, it constitutes ID theft, which I believe is a federal-level felony. (In fact, many illegals HAVE been prosecuted and have served jail time for this very crime.)
Moreover, if you claim 20 kids as dependents, and get a $20,000 refund, that is sure to raise lots of eyebrows at the IRS. You are practically begging for an audit if you do that.
So I’m not sure I see the problem here.
When it comes to taxes, I expect the real problem with illegals is that they typically work off the books, meaning that STATE governments lose out on some payroll tax revenue that they’d otherwise be getting.
Correct me if I’m wrong.
And please . . . sources!
May 24, 2012 at 10:55 pm #755367
JanSParticipantoh, my, David…isn’t it enough that the man gave you the information? Why need sources…lol…may even tell you to look it up yourself…
May 24, 2012 at 11:41 pm #755368
waterworldParticipantThe original source is a 2011 audit performed by the Treasury Inspector General for Tax Administration (TIGTA). Here’s a link:
http://www.treasury.gov/tigta/auditreports/2011reports/201141061fr.pdf
It’s true that Treasury estimates $4 billion in refundable child credits is being paid out to people who are not authorized to work in the U.S. At the end of the Bush Administration, that number was under a billion. Various changes to the credit program have made it possible for people to get much more in refundable credits.
It’s not clear how much of it is fraudulent. The tax filers are people who file using Individual Tax Identification Numbers, which are issued by the IRS to people who are not eligible for Social Security Numbers. (The IRS does not care if you are legally entitled to work in the U.S. or how you made your money, they just want you to file tax returns and pay the taxes owed. The ITIN makes that possible, and because of it, many undocumented immigrants are able to file returns and pay their taxes.) Whether or not the children that serve as the basis for the tax credits are citizens is less clear. It appears that some are in fact citizens even though one or both of their parents are not. Others are not citizens but are entitled to the credit because they meet the residency requirements.
Of course there’s political maneuvering going on around whether or how to address the issue. If you look at the long list of other reports issued by TIGTA related to the Recovery Act, you’ll find many others that address questionable payouts of millions or billions of dollars, or practices that result in failure to collect millions or billions in taxes. One example is a report about over $3 billion being paid out to U.S. taxpayers who make fraudulent claims for education tax credits. I haven’t heard anyone in Congress howling about the injustice of those payments.
While I would probably support legislation that does more to prevent child tax credit refunds being paid to people who do not both live and work here, changing the tax laws in ways that increase the burdens on poor immigrant families is much lower on my list of priorities than, say, changing tax laws or enforcement provisions that unfairly benefit the wealthiest Americans.
May 25, 2012 at 2:35 am #755369
kootchmanMemberGood idea… do look it up yourself. The IRS did random samples of the filers. No, you do not need a SS to file.
Do you know that the harsh, terrible remedy the republicans proposed waterworld? Any refund for a minor child is… that minor child has a SS numbe That does not harm or injure immigrants… they are required to have one… just like you are. Simple solution… the IRS cannot issue a refund for a child tax credit unless that child has a SS number. what hardship is that?
we are treated like morons because we are. we are so disassociated from numbers like “trillion” or “billion” … doesn’t ruffle a feather. “Oh well, just our well intentioned government(s) who already take a good third, more likely half of our incomes letting a few slip through the cracks”… Yet. incredibly, astonishingly, “you” want them to get bigger still…taking even more in to waste”. The government needs to have cultural shift… it’s our money.. and it was taken from hard work, ingenuity, risk.
The “war on woman”.. is no less than a claim on other peoples money. I say the government has so much, is so big, it has no control of what it confiscates now. So on a small scale.. just this one little slip …. what would you do with 4 billion? The average cost of one year of a public college is now..12,681. I say the war on women include making them come out of colleges 50K in debt with economically irrelevant degrees. Since there are more women in college than men… about 58% (yet still are classified as protected…huh?) How many tuition payments are there in 4 billion? JoB ? How many birth control doses in 4 billion? waterworld… even Pelosi has weighed in..NOW.. she says no more tax increases for under a million in income..oops must have heard from that SF base of hers. Obama is gunning for 250K increases. If you got your wish list in taxes.. and you won’t. It’s another pipe dream. I won’t even cover the deficit… at best under todays rate of borrowing, it would cut the deficit by an estimated 30-40 per cent. we will borrow 20-25% of every dollar we spend instead of 40 cents per dollar. There is that word “unfairly” again.. so say you. I think you are entitled to keep as much as you can keep. Let’s go for a flat tax.. that will eliminate capital gains advantages.. and make YOU pay for the entitlements you want so badly..in direct proportion. Then we will see how careful a taxpayer and citizen you are. Funny how eager people are to spend other peoples money… the government has found the sweet spot. Half a population who doesn’t pay income tax, with a burning sense of fairness and injustice as watchdogs? Put a half starved dog in the butcher shop as a watch dog. Money issues hit women the hardest. Thats an economic reality. They constitute the hardest hit of strugglers.. single parents, most of who are women.
One more time.. there isn’t enough money to solve the deficits in the coffers of the 10% who pay 78% of federal income taxes… it’a just a myth. Conservatives, Independents, Libertarians, are giving now new powers, no new programs, no new entitlements until the ship of state plugs the holes and gets righted again. why liberals prefer life jackets is beyond my understanding.
North Korea has the worlds “fairest” income distribution. But I am betting Bangladesh, Somalia, and most of sub-Sahara Africa are very close.
May 25, 2012 at 1:44 pm #755370
redblackParticipant“Oh well, just our well intentioned government(s) who already take a good third, more likely half of our incomes letting a few slip through the cracks”
i’m calling [expletive deleted] on that.
show us the tax returns, kootch. i wanna see how the government takes half of your or anyone else’s income.
One more time.. there isn’t enough money to solve the deficits in the coffers of the 10% who pay 78% of federal income taxes… it’a just a myth.
i see you’re still having trouble understanding that that’s because the top 10% has 80% of the nation’s income. therefore, they pay 80% of the nation’s income taxes.
but that’s only income tax. the top 10% pay almost all of the capital gains taxes and taxes on investment income.
why? because the bottom 90% has virtually no investment income.
and you can’t cut spending enough to pay down the debt, either.
we have to do both.
May 25, 2012 at 3:52 pm #755371
kootchmanMemberYou can call ***** all you want. But if you read the post carefully…. I said “governments”, and yes, it takes no small math wizard mind to throw a few rough numbers.. 14% goes right off the top to SS, add medicare, state, local, sales, and then income taxes;… the cost to carry government is hugh and getting larger… then there is property taxes, user fees, ;….
Here.. should help
Tax Freedom Day® 2012 arrives on April 17 this year, four days later than last year due to higher federal income and corporate tax collections. That means Americans will work 107 days into the year, from January 1 to April 17, to earn enough money to pay this year’s combined 29.2% federal, state, and local tax bill.
Self employed of course pay more… much more.
May 25, 2012 at 4:04 pm #755372
JoBParticipantkootch..
so you rail on and on about big government
and the increasing tax deficit
and then you support a political party that increases the size and tax bill for big government every time they take the big seat in the White House
Lucy .. i think you have some splaining to do
May 26, 2012 at 1:59 am #755373
kootchmanMemberNothing like this one! This administration is the whopper of whoppers! The burn rate has been unprecedented. Not to excuse the bloat and burn of the previous administration, but we elected a Democrat for hope and change. We didn’t get that. We got more of the same with a unique twist.. while the left was so fond of screaming “Haliburton” at the least, most republicans were in disgust. This administration parades crony capitalism like a badge of honor. There is no WFA that is over the top for Buddies of Barak is there? Are you better off today, then you were four years ago? If you are, you were a campaign bundler for Hussein Obama, the sycophant for more of the same. JoB we did our “splaining” Lucy, we didn’t rally behind the nominee, McCain. we voted for Hope and Change, the president who would unite us… who would have thunk it would have devolved to this?
May 26, 2012 at 2:25 am #755374
kootchmanMemberYou do make a good point redblack… when this recession hit, the vulnerability of a middle class that had the lowest savings rate in the industrialized world, and the most indebtedness, as a percentage of gross income was indeed shocking. Incredibly, but true, we are being exorted by programs like “cash for clunkers” to do more of the same. You think, maybe a nation whose average household credit card debt that exceeds its average savings, was a bit on the vulnerable side? 56% of undergraduate college students have credit cards, and 73 per cent of those make interest only payments. who pulled out a credit card in college back in they day? No redblack, you won’t have any savings if you live off credit and defer impulse to a time when you can afford the trinkets a consumer market offers. But we lead the world in cars per household, jet skis. snowmobiles, Bermuda for some reason has more televisons per capita.. but in the industrialized world, we do. Getting the picture here? How many families when the good times were rolling along..kept the proverbial 6 months of income in ready reserve? Y’know I watched a TV show of a distressed MI family…the archetype family of four… two snowmobiles, three vehicles, a sport fishing boat, and during the “interview”… two computers, three television sets, and an above ground pool in the backyard… but no savings when the layoffs hit. Amazing. Maybe, like the Great Depression generation, this generation will have an appreciation for being liquid and solvent. Now, if we can just keep more of what we earn… but I fear not. It’s hard when the average family works 1/3 of a work life to pay for government. It’s by far the biggest overhead for working families… and amazingly you still persist in thinking more from the small percentage of wage earners in the top ten per cent have the capacity to “solve” the problem. Your president knows they don’t, the congressional budget office knows they don’t…..and I suspect liberals might know they don’t… kick the can and hope for something to happen is about the best we are getting from a government that has learned, promises mean votes. we can’t afford all we expect from government and what they insist we need…
Now, I happen to agree we need to do both. On a scale neither side wants to admit. The Democrats won’t cut enough to do the deed, republicans won’t raise taxes enough to do the deed. But. given a choice between the two… the bargaining chip is… revenue. You won’t get more until ya cut more. Meaningful, substantive cuts. Entitlements, defense, are no longer sacred cows. Obama doesn’t have the chops to stand in front of the cameras and lead. He blew his mandate the first year of his presidency.. when we farted around with Obamacare.. when the economy and jobs were the national crisis. The Democrats abused an absolute majority. Every fringe group got a voice..and the ones of reason? Like Simpson and Bowles? Dead on arrival.
May 26, 2012 at 3:34 am #755375
JoBParticipantKootch…
psst.. it’s a holiday weekend
go out there and make your holiday
nobody else is going to do it for you
PS.. i think it would be ok with him if you called him Barry
May 26, 2012 at 4:53 pm #755376
waynsterParticipantkootch you still underestimate the power of women voters and so does the grand old party……. the thing that both party’s are missing is when you increases jobs you increases tax revenue simple math in good times you have good things in bad times the good things get cut first….for the GOP they want domestic spending to go first for the democrats they want defenses spending cut first then both think raise taxes either on the rich or the middle class…. and nether side takes in account inflation or price hikes on goods and services….. you do and I do….to say that the President doesn’t stand up and lead…. well neither does the GOP…and yes both sides forgot during the healthcare debate more pressing needs were not being addressed in a manner that should of been….to say the Democrats were abused their power… no more then the GOP did when they had control of it……
May 26, 2012 at 5:46 pm #755377
JoBParticipantkootch…
republicans are patting themselves on the back for getting the party’s faithful women back … maybe
but Obama did it won’t mean much to that huge block of suddenly motivated female non-voters who are listening carefully …
After all.. it’s their future those anti-preventative healthcare and anti-wage equity and anti-pill bills the republicans are promoting across the United States will impact.
Add to that the arrogant disrespect that Republican members of the house and senate have shown their fellow female colleagues when it came to testimony on issues that impact women’s lives…
Obama did it isn’t going to mean much to them when it is so clear that in this case, Obama didn’t.
Is he the lesser of two evils when it comes to women’s issues in this election?
yes.
but if enough women turn out,
the next democratic candidate is likely to pay a whole lot more attention.
May 26, 2012 at 11:41 pm #755378
kootchmanMemberExactly. He is s president who cannot muster a national consensus. All he can do is try a drive wedges. You are demographically correct. There are actually more voters in the millenium generation that the boomers. The went for Obama by about 67 per cent. Since 08, they have added 10 million potential voters. Instead of offering opportunity, growth, jobs… the best he’s got for the 48% that are unemployed? More tuition debt and after 20 years, forgiveness. This is not going to be a gender determined election. Ms. Fluke was paraded at the last minute to crash a 1st Amendment hearing. It was not a birth control, or a womans right meeting. She had as much business at that meeting as a hearing on salmon fishing quotas with the Fisheries sub-committee. It got liberal press buzz… but it was “outed” for what it was. See, this is the deal… no matter what Obama does, or will do til the election the street cred is gone. He is looked as as nothing but a street level huckster with a buncha jive talk that he can’t deliver. Who is he pimping off is the first question. The military is livid…his administration has given the movie industry inside information on Seal Team Six so they could polish his star. Way to reward the dedication of the most secret and deadly special forces we have. He “outed” a special air unit used in covert ops that the public and our enemies had no idea existed… only the Select Committee on Military oversight knew of their existence. Some issues transcend gender privilege. National security being one of them. Tell ya what JoB.. tell those young women… here.. the Romney option is a 75K starting salary job and you pay the $9 per month for birth control or take your pick of employers and accept a job with the best benefits package …. or…. the Obama option the rest of the country will pay it and you.. you can wipe tables at Micky D’s or join the 22 million looking for a job for another four years and pay off a national debt that is going to top 75K for each one of you long after he is gone. That’s the lesser of two evils? I am betting the shine is off the star struck young adults who were woed the first go round. BTW… the Blackstone private equity dinner/fundraiser for the Prez by those who find capital for private equity… $38K per plate. I am thinking Wealth Creator is going to be preferred to Wealth Waster. Particularly for a generation that has lived with the duality of liberalism and consumption… one was theoretical talk, the other was their reality. Actually Obama is losing Reagan Democrats at a faster rate. The ones who decided Ohio and PA.
May 27, 2012 at 12:00 am #755379
kootchmanMemberwaynster…. congress makes appeals to constituents. The President is the titular head of government. He has the bully pulpit. He’s the one that can call press briefings. For a man who won such a sweeping electoral victory… he is in sad shape. Even Democrats in their deepest hearts are despairing of him. It’s sort like they are stuck with him. You and I both know if Hilary was drafted on the convention floor… if NY stood up and nominated “favorite daughter”… on the first ballot. The convention would turn on him like a rabid dog. He would carry the black vote, but that’s all.
May 27, 2012 at 12:17 am #755380
dobroParticipant“…the Romney option is a 75K starting salary job and you pay the $9 per month for birth control or take your pick of employers…”
Nobody is stupid enough to think Romney will be handing out 75K jobs. Except…
May 27, 2012 at 3:57 am #755381
kootchmanMemberHe won’t be handing them out. but he won’t be obstructing those who create those jobs. The stupidity would be after four years and 22 million unemployed, this prez can.
May 27, 2012 at 6:23 am #755382
JanSParticipantsomething magical is gonna happen the day after he’s elected? If he’s elected? Corporations are gonna magically create a ton of jobs? Yeah, right…
May 27, 2012 at 3:13 pm #755383
JoBParticipantKootch..
i said he was the lesser of two evils on women’s issue
not that he is the president who can’t build a consensus
i really resent you distorting what i said and then building a case on your distortion.
lies, lies and more lies do not equal truth
they don’t even equal an interesting argument
May 27, 2012 at 3:13 pm #755384
JoBParticipantMay 27, 2012 at 4:26 pm #755385
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