FOLLOWUP: Six days after ring removal, illegal beach fires persist at Alki

heartless July 29, 2020 (1:55 pm)

Couldn’t we just get a fireboat to head out there each night to hose down the fires? I’d chip in for beers for the firefighters afterwards…

I’m pretty serious about this proposal, but to be even serious-er: if they can’t prevent the fires now, how will closing the beach work? Wouldn’t that need enforcement as well? Why not just enforce the no fire rule in the first place?

Shaun July 29, 2020 (4:02 pm)

I love it that’s a great idea reward our firefighter’s for their continued hard work. I am down to chip in on that lets make it happen!
KM July 29, 2020 (4:02 pm)

Do we know if they are at least extinguishing fires when they ticket? Can they ticket, extinguish fire and dampen any wood brought for fuel?
- Wsguy123 July 29, 2020 (4:30 pm)
  
  Did I miss a report of people being ticketed? I hope they are but I kinda doubt it. Seattle Fire probably cannot issue a ticket. It would have to be Seattle Police. I hope SFD is wetting down the fire because people have commented witnessing beach goers just relighting the fire once SFD leaves.We really need to treat these with a heavy hand if we want results. We’ve had years of the Seattle way to prove people will do what they want. Stiff fines, arrests, etc are needed to get the point across. Putting up signs and taking away fire rings is not working. People who live close to the beach have been reporting on wsb that they see fires all over the beach at night.
  - KM July 29, 2020 (10:49 pm)
    
    I probably just assumed on the ticketing. It’s Seattle, I should know better!
- AlkiBeachResident July 29, 2020 (7:01 pm)
  
  They don’t ticket, they just ask people to put out the fires. I watched 3 SFD walk the beach requesting fires be extinguished (not sure if the time… 9:15?) and watched a group relight their fire w/ SFD a block and a half away asking for other fires to be extinguished. By 11:30 there were 15 fires that I could see. It’s a non-stop cycle.
Alki resident July 29, 2020 (4:47 pm)

I tried reporting an extremely big fire with fireworks being shot over the apartments. They said they would “note” it.
Just wondering July 29, 2020 (6:34 pm)

How about selling raffle tickets to be the one who aims the fire boat hose? I’d but a look of tickets!
WTF July 29, 2020 (8:13 pm)

I’ll bring the IPA!

Duffy July 29, 2020 (1:59 pm)

Your “in case you forgot how dumb people are” briefing for the day.

Yma July 29, 2020 (2:05 pm)

Argh – there’s got to be some responsible middle ground. Put out the fire rings, have them be reserved. Those folks ignoring fire bans are going to continue to do that- so cite them & get them off.

ITotallyAgreeWithYou July 29, 2020 (2:28 pm)

So irresponsible people who set illegal fires anywhere they choose and force SFD call outs will become suddenly responsible if we provide reservations? “They’re going to do it anyway” is a poor argument for deferring to irresponsible, dangerous, and illegal behavior.
- Dunno July 30, 2020 (6:33 am)
  
  Like to trailers, courthouses, buildings, police stations where the enforcers that you want come from? I agree with you all, but wanting the police to enforce laws, yet take them down by 50% seems ironic.
Anonymous Coward July 29, 2020 (2:36 pm)

Cite them? Like have the police out there punishing folks for a non-violent offense? What police? Besides, I thought we decided to stop prosecuting folks for non-violent offenses.
- Al July 29, 2020 (6:06 pm)
  
  Perspective. It’s like how everyone hates congress, but likes their congressperson. We all agree that nonviolent offenses don’t warrant harsh police action—except those offenses that effect us directly. Those ones need to be punished with an iron fist!
- heartless July 30, 2020 (3:18 pm)
  
  Okay, so I have you down as saying we should never cite people for non-violent offenses. Good to know where you stand.
  
  “What police?”
  
  Can you read? Haven’t you read about the police down at Alki? I think there are even pictures of them down there–in this very comment section! So, um, those police. Those police that are already there.
  
  Any more questions?
Anne July 29, 2020 (3:14 pm)

Why? Why should there have to be some “middle ground” Folks were asked-then when that didn’t work -told-but they just couldn’t follow rules. SFD had to continually go down to put out fires. So rings had to go-but still making fires. So because a handful of folks who could give a darn about anyone or anything may cause beach to be shut down. So what – you want SFD/SPD/ Parks Dept. to sit down at Alki all night to cite these jerks? Do you think they’d care? Do you really think they’d pay the fine anyway? How must it be to live such an utterly selfish life- all about me,me,me-with not a care about how their actions impact others.

Luke July 29, 2020 (2:15 pm)

I’d be ok with closing the beaches. The social distancing on Alki is a joke.

mrsB July 29, 2020 (5:58 pm)

Agreed!!!
tonenotvolume July 29, 2020 (7:34 pm)

Absolutely correct. My wife and I walk it every other day and on the best days it’s about 25-40%. But hey, what’s a little corona shared with friends.
- rme July 30, 2020 (12:11 pm)
  
  So if you’re walking Alki that consistently and noticing a social distancing issue, wouldn’t continuing to return mean you’re adding to the problem? I don’t understand this. If a place is crowded, don’t go.
Bradley July 29, 2020 (10:05 pm)

Close the beach? What makes you think anyone will enforce it if they won’t even enforce illegal fires?
J-9 July 30, 2020 (2:27 am)

I completely, 100% agree! Alki and the sidewalks, up and down, along the water are so busy but especially the beach! We took a drive by Alki Beach Tuesday evening, close to 10 p.m. and there were several beach fires with groups of people, the motorcycle groups, people hanging out in groups on the sidewalk. No one seems to be monitoring any of this or enforcing any guidelines or laws. There’s no social distancing! No masks! On another day, we drove by in the afternoon on a Saturday. Beach was packed! Restaurants and bars had lots of people inside and out. Some, clearly not following the guidelines. How does anyone expect to get through this if we’re not all doing our part? I want to get out and about as much as the next person but enough is enough!

clean beach fan July 29, 2020 (2:25 pm)

I’m interested to see that Seattle Parks has this machine- I had assumed they didn’t have one since the beach is so seldomly cleaned, and often relies on volunteers to pick up litter. Do they just leave it sitting in storage 99% of the time? I will be emailing the Council asking for more frequent cleanings moving forward, seems like it should be at least a weekly thing. Not that this solves the fire/bad behavior problem, just an interesting side note

Alkilocal July 29, 2020 (4:05 pm)

You can see it parked on the other side of Alki Elementary community center near the entrance to the park. I’ve often wanted to ask to see if a group of Alki volunteers could help clean with more frequency.
Alki Res July 30, 2020 (9:55 am)

I just posted something on nextdoor about cleaning the beach more regularly. I had no idea this thing was sitting here idling. I wish they would hand over the keys to a group of volunteers, the beach in terrible shape more often than not. I’m also curious if the community could section off a part of the beach for a “neighborhood club” like laurelhurst?

Tru July 29, 2020 (2:38 pm)

I realize these days it’s low priority but a little enforcement would help. Didn’t see one officer the several hours there on Monday. Though there were several dogs running on and off leash.
My thought tho is if people think and do get away with little things it could be a slippery slope.

WS2000 July 29, 2020 (7:52 pm)

Police generally don’t ticket off-leash dogs: that’s an animal control job. Which suggests that there might be a way for SFD to cite people for illegal fires, but you’d have to check what the city code says.

Lola July 29, 2020 (2:40 pm)

Yes if they ticket the Continuing Fire Makers maybe it will stop? Nobody seems to care about rules anymore. They have gone out the window. I hope because a few people can’t control themselves not to make fires it does not hurt the rest of us who want to enjoy the beauty of the water and the sandy beaches.

C July 29, 2020 (2:50 pm)

My observation is that there is a total lack of management prowess re: getting the public on board with what is desired here. There is a desire to keep group size down and a specific focus on outdoor parks. When the public ignores that, officials repeatedly “take the toys away” as punishment. Earlier examples are no parking at parks, closed parks, reduced hours at parks, boards nailed on park benches, huge expensive unsightly signs warning people out of parks, removing fire rings at parks, etc, etc. So effectively bullying the public into what is desired. That rarely works and clearly is not working in this case. In fact the latest fire ring fiasco does nothing to get groups off the beach and does everything to destroy the environment of the beach. I’d think a major job of the parks dept. would be to preserve that environment. Removing the fire rings is a major fail in that respect. The next step described of closing the parks will be ignored I would predict as well. There is a saying re: the definition of insanity being to do the same thing over and over and expect a different outcome. This “taking away the toys” fits that bill. Try another approach. I agree with YMA above. This is not a perfect science. Find some responsible middle ground that accomplishes a more favorable outcome. To simply think you are in charge and tighten the screws until compliance is accomplished is a pipe dream.

AlkiBeachResident July 29, 2020 (9:59 pm)

Other parks, including golden gardens and this week various Lake WA parks and docks have had their parking locked off, they can’t do that at alki, so we get everyone, even with the bridge being closed. And fireworks every night, in fact, fireworks right now.

Peter S. July 29, 2020 (2:57 pm)

Honestly – will anyone really be surprised if/when the scoff-laws continue to be scoff-laws, even if the beaches are closed? Like it or not, enforcing laws is currently out of favor, so what’s to stop them from having their fun?

westseaguy July 29, 2020 (3:18 pm)

Heavy fines are the only thing that will work. People wont be happy but we have to start taking action to get this under control.

Alkilocal July 29, 2020 (3:43 pm)

I’m in agreement with you. The lack of respect towards our community, intelligent thinking, adherence to rules, and allowance of visitors to blithely go about to have fires up and down the beach, let dogs run off leash on the beach, litter, street race, vandalize, you name it without any semblance of corrective measures, imposed fines or citations has led to an unstated and mutual relationship of enabled and entitled behaviors. I don’t have confidence these behaviors can be stopped. Side note: I’m so happy to see the beach cleaner back from a quarter’s retirement!

Duh. July 29, 2020 (3:24 pm)

Enforce laws by punishing offenders. Fines, fines, and more fines. The intellectually challenged will eventually get the message. Seems pretty simple to me. Then again, it is Seattle…

Duh. July 29, 2020 (3:25 pm)

Enforce laws by punishing offenders. Fines, fines, and more fines. The intellectually challenged will eventually get the message. Seems pretty simple to me. Rules are meaningless unless they are enforced. Then again, it is Seattle…

Lisa July 29, 2020 (3:40 pm)

Why fine for making a fire but NOT for gathering? Allow fires. Fine the gatherers if they are not social distancing. This would free up the SFD to put out fires not in a (safe) fire pit. Talk about dispatching our civil servants for the wrong reasons…

Alkilocal July 29, 2020 (4:10 pm)

One reason that beach fires are bad is due to the litter and hazardous materials left behind. Go down early morning after a nice night and see the litany of broken glass, liter, plastic bags, fireworks all along and near the previous beach fire spots. The social appeal of the beach and beach fires (and lack of any rules) encourages the destruction of the beach.
- Lisa July 29, 2020 (5:52 pm)
  
  @AlkiLocal – But that’s not the reason they’re using to remove them. This issue is about gatherings.
  
  BTW – I am down at Alki just about every weekend morning and have spent time cleaning up the sidewalk so I know garbage is an issue. But I don’t believe the only reason for garbage is because of firepits.

22blades July 29, 2020 (3:44 pm)

I think it’s a good time for some Seattle Fire Department drills. Dispatch a ladder truck when there’s a beach fire call!

Bubbasaurus July 29, 2020 (3:53 pm)

How is anyone surprised by this. Are there any laws that are enforced in Seattle? How about the laws that are ignored by dog owners at every athletic field and beach in Seattle?

Alkilocal July 29, 2020 (4:11 pm)

Omg! This-Yes. Thank you.
Wsguy123 July 29, 2020 (4:41 pm)

I’ve been working with officials about dogs illegally in many areas for a decade or more. Too many offenders, too many areas people have the opportunity to bring dogs, and not enough Animal Control Officers. When you call Animal Control or fill out a form online, your info is subject to public disclosure laws so dog owners could in theory get your info and retaliate. Animal control won’t take an anonymous complaint. A lot of wiggle room snd loopholes for dog owners. It sucks, people have complained about bad owners here for years. There have been some bad bites over the years and dogs have harassed or killed other animals like swans that used to live at Lincoln Park and I remember a seal pup a few years ago that died by suspected dog bites.
- Brady July 29, 2020 (7:58 pm)
  
  If you really want to make this conversation about dogs …The # of dogs you see off-leash is directly related to what a TERRIBLE jobs Seattle does of providing places for dogs to play with each other safely. West Seattle is particularly bad. There are many places in WS where parks could designate a portion for dogs, or even certain hours of the day for dogs. The vast majority of responsible dog owners would gladly use them. But in the absence of any alternative, even the responsible owners resort to using other public spaces. [The trend of citizens making their own solutions to failures of public planning is not new or limited to dog-owners.] Scofflaws will be scofflaws, but as someone said above, there are middle ground solutions that would make both dog-owners and the dog-averse happy.
  - RationalizationNation July 30, 2020 (3:52 am)
    
    I’ve lived in West Seattle for 20 years, always with at least one dog in my household. All my dogs have lived long and happy lives and have never been off leash where it isn’t legally permitted. You’re making excuses along the lines of “my teenagers wouldn’t have to drink illegally if they’d just lower the drinking age to 13”.
Jon Wright July 29, 2020 (8:53 pm)

No, no laws are enforced. Speeding, smoking, littering, left turns, dogs on leashes, yielding, keeping sidewalks clear, stopping for pedestrians, carpool lanes, etc., etc., etc. But you can count on plenty of new laws being enacted with no plans how to enforce them!

Drake Stern July 29, 2020 (3:53 pm)

Where is the room here for individual judgement and accountability? I mean, we are in a fact-vacuum with this virus thing and people are behaving as if things are known that are manifestly not known. Is mere obedience the point?What are we going to think of ourselves when we discover that everything we have been doing is not only erroneous but backwards?https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/07/scourge-hygiene-theater/614599/I remember September 12th 2001 when they put soldiers with machine guns into the airports. The thing was, had they been there on September 11th they would have still allowed those hijackers onto the airplanes. They were authorized travelers. So the soldiers did nothing and in fact were soon removed and the phrase “Security Theater” was coined. People are demanding for their neighbors to be fined and policed and imprisoned and no one knows what the heck is even going on with this virus.

bill July 30, 2020 (12:20 am)

My goodness, who let a sane person into this conversation?
heartless July 30, 2020 (8:19 am)

I let myself in, Bill.

But original poster:
What on earth does the lack of surface to person transmission of the virus have to do with fire rings at Alki? Have people been disinfecting the logs before burning them? Are people bleaching the sand? Are the putting out the fires with hand sanitizer? I just don’t see where you’re going with this.

“I mean, we are in a fact-vacuum with this virus thing and people are behaving as if things are known that are manifestly not known.”

What examples are you thinking of?

“Is mere obedience the point?”

Where rules are concerned–like the no illegal fires at Alki rule–then yes, obedience is exactly the point. Obedience to speed limits is also called for. Do you disagree with those?

“People are demanding for their neighbors to be fined and policed and imprisoned and no one knows what the heck is even going on with this virus.”

I think it’s reasonable fires on Alki are currently illegal. I further think it is reasonable to enforce that law and cite people who flout it. You disagree?

As for the virus–we know lots about the virus, and if you have any questions I suggest asking your doctor or Googling reputable sources for information. Is there something about the virus that you find particularly confusing?

Alki Eric July 29, 2020 (3:58 pm)

Last night I saw about 6 SFD and 2 SPD ask about 12 groups with fires to put them out, all partially put out the fires and in an hour at least 5 groups were back at the fire. 4 of the other fires were not put out and continued to smoke all night. I had to flip one driftwood log that weighed at least 80 pounds and would still be burning right now if nothing was done. Citations would help. Also, there were 6 cars blocking the fire/police lanes so not even the cops or SFD could park there. Instead of citing them first and then making them put out the fires, they were told to put out the fires and then a parking officer came to write tickets but all but 1 car was cleared by that point. My neighbors and I would all be for closing the beach but how would that be enforced? Something has got to give.

Alkilocal July 29, 2020 (4:15 pm)

Downtown pre covid, tow trucks and parking enforcement came early and waited for the 3pm time slot to expire to ticket and tow all cars parked on 1st, 2nd, and 3rd ave. That seemed to work really well. Let’s run a study on cause, effect, and outcomes with those parameters.

uncle loco July 29, 2020 (4:07 pm)

Maybe we can form an angry mob to deal with this. That seems to be the only way to get results around here these days.

Duh. July 29, 2020 (4:14 pm)

Angry mobs? All that does is make matters worse. Watch the news lately?
Brenda July 29, 2020 (4:25 pm)

Omg that’s funny. But sadly, kinda true.
helpermonkey July 29, 2020 (4:26 pm)

an angry mob of 5 or fewer people. no torches. sanitize your pitchforks.
Anonymous Coward July 29, 2020 (4:52 pm)

Yeah, but we can’t just be an angry mob. We’d have to set stuff on fire. Like, I dunno, maybe a big pile of driftwood down at Alki…
- Duh. July 29, 2020 (7:57 pm)
  
  How ironic…an angry mob starts fires on the beach to protest no fires on the beach. It’s like a coffee table book about coffee tables!!!

Um, No! July 29, 2020 (4:15 pm)

In this city, you might as well get use to the fires. Maybe a social worker can step in?

heartless July 29, 2020 (7:56 pm)

I mean, the cops sure aren’t doing anything–even when they are there! Read the comments, or go visit the beach. Cops show up, tell people to leave, people leave and come right back. SPD or the fire department (if they can–many fire departments can issue tickets or fines) need to start citing people.

Guy July 29, 2020 (4:36 pm)

Wsguy123 July 29, 2020 (4:52 pm)

All I can say is I have been waiting a long time to see comments that share the same concerns as mine. Hopefully the tide is turning from C’est la vie to following the law / being an unselfish citizen.

flimflam July 29, 2020 (4:58 pm)

yup, beyond time to start issuing fines…it will pay for itself in the long run both financially and for the greater good. its really amazing/funny (in a way) that people really think breaking laws/rules shouldn’t have consequences. fine each person at the fire area, active participant or not – standing there, feeding the fire, whatever. its lovely that some feel that “punishment” for misdeeds is somehow wrong or mean or something but sorry, people do what they can get away with.

heartless July 29, 2020 (7:58 pm)

agreed
~Hockeywitch~ July 29, 2020 (9:18 pm)

agreed

Yma July 29, 2020 (5:42 pm)

A fire on the beach is a beautiful thing. It can be a celebratory thing. Bring back the rings, put in more rings. The detritus, that’s a whole different discussion- pick up & pack up your stuff.

AlkiBeachResident July 29, 2020 (10:48 pm)

the rings were set closer to businesses and away from the apt/condo only section of the strip. There are signs up all along the beach that fires outside the rings are illegal and subject to fines, which they never hand out. The garbage every morning is gross, the cinders on the beach are crappy, and tbh I’m over my apt either being a sweat box because I have to close my windows, or having the whole place smell like campfire every night and morning. Wanna campfire go camping and burn one where it’s legal.
AlkiBeachResident July 29, 2020 (10:57 pm)

and the regular use of the permanent driftwood for bonfires is seriously inconsiderate and selfish. Fire may be pretty but it’s incredibly inconsiderate to burn in an area where it’s marked illegal and where it infringes on the ability to breath easily for those of us who live here.

No Longer Surprised July 29, 2020 (6:16 pm)

“How is anyone surprised by this. Are there any laws that are enforced in Seattle? How about the laws that are ignored by dog owners at every athletic field and beach in Seattle? ” I recently moved to Highland Park and the attitude here is surprising. At first we thought it was a community of conscious people who cared about one another. Living here is different. People (the same people) run their dogs off leash at Riverview Park EVERY DAY. They watch their dogs poop on the playfield while others on the parking strip openly deal drugs, live on the street freely, litter at will. These are all people choosing to break the law. I’ve seen gatherings at the park consistently since March. Some are distancing, some definitely not. Heck, there’s even a house on 12th that seems to be hosting regular live bands in their backyard with a full audience of people watching. ??? It is astounding that people are so selfish and just don’t believe the science of this pandemic. I agree with those saying fine the people gathering & setting fires on the beach but what about the dogs, the litter, the drugs, the loitering, the illegal concerts? Shouldn’t they be ‘punished’ too? Or maybe people can just stop and look at themselves and put this selfish, immature, unkind behavior on pause. So yes, I am surprised, (was surprised), but not any longer surprised; but incredibly disappointed, embarrassed and sad for my new neighborhood.

Junction Lady July 29, 2020 (6:31 pm)

When I went to the beach on a hot sunny weekday I was so impressed how individuals or small groups parked their beach blankets within 8 feet or more from mine. From the street it can look like a mob of people when in fact the beach-goers I saw were very respectful about social distancing. If they weren’t respectful I would have left.Shine some huge bright lights on the beach and inform (via megaphone) the fire attendees to line up for citations and let them know repeat offenders fees will be double! People live across the street and need to sleep without rowdy fire party madness, and IT’S ILLEGAL! You could even call it OPERATION ALKI BEACH!

Douse the flames July 29, 2020 (6:58 pm)

Add community service sentences and litter pickup gigs to the citations and fines. Time to eliminate fire rings, fire pits, and allowing fires on the beaches in this city. They pollute the air, scar the beach and leave toxic debris. Seattle’s one of few urban areas that continues to allow beach fires, supposedly because they are a “tradition”. It was a tradition to burn witches at the stake too. Some traditions are better left behind.

Duh. July 29, 2020 (7:53 pm)

If Seattle refuses to enforce laws, why, oh why, do they insist on creating laws. If the laws are not enforced, just stop making laws. Impossible to have one without the other. ENFORCE THE LAWS!

tonenotvolume July 29, 2020 (8:02 pm)

Speaking of enforcement, what about “vehicles with boat trailers only” parking lot. I think those are McLarens. Yes, West Seattle enforcement is a joke. Try doing 25mph per new speed limit especially on 35th.

Alki res July 29, 2020 (8:40 pm)

Police are never out there. Neither is SFD. So how will they enforce closing the beach?

heartless July 30, 2020 (8:24 am)

Various people, and the WSB itself, have confirmed that both police and the fire department are often at Alki.

I agree that closing it seems to just be punting the problem down the road–that if they are not enforcing the fire bans currently, why would they enforce the beach being closed. But the police and fire are indeed present.

AMD July 29, 2020 (8:58 pm)

Omg, how hard is it to just NOT light fires???? It’s a million degrees out anyway, not great for the environment, and not at all necessary to enjoy the beach. There shouldn’t need to be enforcement because it is SO much easier to just NOT light fires than it is to light one. I will never understand the entitlement of some people.

jim July 29, 2020 (9:02 pm)

Parks has maintenace staff with 4×4 cart and buckets that could be used to douse fires and fire pits/logs to deter fires as reactive or proactive measure near end of their shift. Contact new Parks Director Joey.Furuto@seattle.gov. He is super at getting things done without delay.

Civics101 July 29, 2020 (9:13 pm)

So frustrating – election coming, please use our collective voices to put in candidates that don’t cater to every dog off leash, Beach Fire burning, I’m special so can do what I want groups.

~Hockeywitch~ July 29, 2020 (9:14 pm)

SFD should just walk up to the burning beach fire and spray it out… No asking to put it out, just an quick, Sorry no fires on the beach, and put it out… soak it good. Obviously ASKING the people to do it isn’t working.. tough love.

Seabruce July 29, 2020 (10:30 pm)

I agree with you seems it world be easy if SFD put out these illegal fires by drenching then so the wood can’t be relighted

Elfhaime July 29, 2020 (10:04 pm)

Should this restriction of 5 or less poepl include the organised volleyball that happens every day in Alki beach? There are always crowds around them.

Mj July 29, 2020 (10:37 pm)

Really all the screaming for enforcement of no fires on the beach and people screaming to defund the Police. What do you want, you can’t have both! If it’s enforcement, it needs to treat everyone the same, nothing I hate more is a double standard.

heartless July 30, 2020 (8:32 am)

I see police at Alki failing to fine people for illegal fires. What, you’re worried if there are fewer police there will be less police to NOT fine people? You’re not thinking this through buddy.
Wes C. Addle July 30, 2020 (8:33 am)

You can have both since “Defund the Police” is not “get rid of the police”.
Um, No! July 30, 2020 (8:50 am)

This^
poultine July 30, 2020 (2:40 pm)

First, as others have said, defund is not eliminate.

Second, no one said the same people complaining about the fires are those that support defunding the police.

Third, by getting other workers to do some of the other work currently given to the police, they could have more energy to enforce the law. Or, alternately, maybe writing tickets for fine-able offenses doesn’t really need to be a police responsibility. Kinda seems like asking someone with law enforcement training to nicely ask people to put out a fire and then do nothing else is a waste of everyone’s time and money.

SEAlife July 29, 2020 (10:50 pm)

If only we cleaned up our parks and streets of trash and needles as quickly as we clean up a beach.

anonyme July 30, 2020 (7:13 am)

All of this non-enforcement by SPD and SFD, as well as the cleanups and the initial fire circle removal, is paid for with tax dollars. Wasted tax dollars, as there is no enforcement. A large fine should be issued as a first offense (first time caught, that is) with an arrest for the second infraction. So sick and bloody tired of living in a city where lawbreakers get to destroy public property and disturb the peace while the rest of us have no choice but to sit back and PAY for their shenanigans. Why should the beaches be closed to respectful citizens due to the actions of a few idiots, who suffer no consequences at all? Fires on the beach should be banned permanently.

Steeeeeve July 30, 2020 (9:03 am)

Scoundrels… Throw the book at them.

Cami July 30, 2020 (10:11 am)

Parks needs to return the rings and unlock them. Anyone that is a long time Alki local knows that there will more illegal beach fires without the rings. Bring back the fire monitors that we had years ago.

rme July 30, 2020 (12:19 pm)

If I’d known how obsessed West Seattleites are with ticketing, fining and even arresting , I never would have moved here. It feels like the suburbs in this comment section, and that is not a compliment.

poultine July 30, 2020 (2:50 pm)

So… you’re surprised that people want to ticket/fine/arrest people who break laws? I’m not sure what other model you’re expecting people to live with. Do you live in Alki? People who do have to deal with the fires, litter, cruising, and occasional shootings. They might have a bit more of a stake in the conversation, and justified frustration, than those who live at arm’s length (like myself). Or were you under the impression that choosing the live near the beach means that you’re 100% OK with everything that happens there, illegal or not?
Heartless? July 30, 2020 (4:58 pm)

RME – Thank You. Well said!

C July 30, 2020 (2:06 pm)

So we see police consciously not enforcing an assortment of “rules”. Police are “Law Enforcement”. I wonder if there are actually “laws” to enforce here? In many cases I am betting not or possibly even that in some cases like the decision to remove the fire rings, existing laws / ordinances are clouded. Just because some official makes a rule does not mean Law Enforcement can / will enforce it.

heartless July 30, 2020 (3:12 pm)

It’s not complicated. Fires outside of designated fire rings are illegal, always have been.

Illegal meaning against the law.

Illegal meaning if you do it you are breaking the law.

There is nothing at all cloudy about this. Law enforcement absolutely can enforce this, it’s kinda in the name “LAW ENFORCEMENT.”

https://library.municode.com/wa/seattle/codes/municipal_code?nodeId=TIT18PARE_CH18.12PACO_SUBCHAPTER_VIIUSRE_18.12.270FI&showChanges=true

Tom Lenard July 30, 2020 (4:11 pm)

It’s time the mayors office closes alki until Covid has been eradicated. It’s that simple. Remove any and all public parking in the area. Close the beach and have police officers enforcing the law from Durkins office. A $1500 fine and or 5 days in county jail should be enough to deal with the violators.

Alki Boom July 30, 2020 (11:01 pm)

Stopping the illegal fires would put a stop to the fireworks that are still terrorizing our neighborhood. Who isn’t fed up with the random explosions every night?

Upper Alki Boom July 31, 2020 (8:52 am)

We feel your pain. We live near Schmitz Park Elementary and the noise from the beach comes right up through the beautiful preserve, to our house. From the beach, the Alki play field is a large open space with nothing to block the sound. We hear the fireworks and in years past, the music festivals, the pirates landing and most sound that travels up to us, through S.P. If we are tired of the fireworks, you must feel under seige. S.P. Elementary is a school with a parking lot and a playground. It is closed.People have been riding motorized dirt bikes at the front, lighting fireworks, crawling on the top of the school roof, and even skateboarding on it. Lots of law breaking activity. It is like a war zone around the 4th of July in our neighborhood. Please stop lighting fireworks. It now happens all year round for no reason. Think about those of us with anxiety around fireworks(Veterans and many others).

Rob August 1, 2020 (11:58 pm)

Yeah, there’s gotta be 20 beach fires out there tonight and of course fireworks. Smoke galore. Engines revving. It’s not hot out but we have to close our windows and turn on our portable ac because of the smoke. Climate change anyone? Is this what we want for Seattle? Chaos? Total disregard for the law? Unhealthy air? I’d say vote the council out but that takes too long and we don’t have that much time! We are in the midst of collapse. And no, the police will not respond to the problem.

alkiobserver August 3, 2020 (7:47 am)

This is too easy. Just call it a protest. Protests are not only virtuous, but totally safe and exempt from covid concerns. Police and firefighters stay away. Sing, dance, all hours of the day… whatever it takes. Protesters can have fires wherever and whenever and you can really pack the crowds together. Hold a protest on Alki against whatever moves you. Gluten and guilt-free fun!

Rob August 3, 2020 (11:59 am)

We have become a society of extreme takers. The message is that if we ourselves do not ‘take’ then we will be left with nothing. Selfish and greedy we have become. We do need the police as well as justice. BLM is very legitimate. We are presented with a false choice between police and justice. We can form a just police institution with the many good cops out there. What’s the alternative? It takes work. It takes real work. The city council is not up to the job.