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May 3, 2012 at 6:49 pm #603118
LPMMMemberThis is going to be yet another mess that we have to deal with. The tunnel is already constraining as it is, but 1st and 4th Ave will be total gridlock trying to get home with more stadium traffic.
I thought we passed a referendum that said that the city would not subsidize a sports stadium? It doesn’t matter if people think it “pencils out”, they always say that. Why is no one talking about this?
My neighbor works at the Port and he says that all the traffic will drive jobs out.
May 3, 2012 at 8:58 pm #757319
casabobaMemberI’m awaiting results of traffic impact study.
May 3, 2012 at 9:07 pm #757320
SmittyParticipantGames tip-off at 7:30, early arrivers about an hour prior, most about 7:00.
How does this mess up the commute?
May 3, 2012 at 9:55 pm #757321
LPMMMemberWell, re-read the post. 4 additional events during the week. Add that onto existing traffic. Add on the trucks, metro, etc. People tend to arrive 2-3 hours before the games to find parking, go to Pioneer Square/downtown, etc. That’s in the middle of commute time.
But still. Public money for a stadium? We already have three. What about the jobs issue? There has been no alternate locations looked at. We’re supposed to jump in because one guy wants to make money? Sounds fishy is all.
May 3, 2012 at 10:06 pm #757322
WSratsinacageMemberTraffic is already a mess on I 5, I 90, 405 and surface streets by 4 PM for 7:10 PM Mariners games. Another sports venue is just going to make it even worse in the SODO area. The M’s are correct in coming out for a basketball team with an arena elsewhere.
May 4, 2012 at 1:18 am #757323
Genesee HillParticipantWSratsinacage:
Yes, you are right. A 5,000 person maximum capacity arena would outdraw the mighty Mariners at Safeco. Look out for traffic…you might find two more cars on 1st, and four more people on each and every bus. Hehe
May 4, 2012 at 2:45 am #757324
LPMMMemberI’m pretty sure the plan for for 18,000 seats, not 5000.
I bet it would be a good idea for fans to look at other locations. Bellevue has tons of space, and it would suck if we couldn’t get our team back because we bet everything on the wrong horse.
May 4, 2012 at 2:55 am #757325
casabobaMemberRe.: Point #7. Just curious, Wonder what does the traffic impact study will state? In a few more days we shall know…
May 4, 2012 at 2:58 am #757326
LPMMMemberApparently it not a real study:
http://www.nwcn.com/home/?fId=150105395&fPath=%2Fnews%2Flocal&fDomain=10212
Read the letter.
May 4, 2012 at 5:23 am #757327
casabobaMemberRe: Post # 9:
Seems like a legitimate study. Perhaps however not to every vested-constituent.
As a long-time West Seattle Blog Forum Commenter what do you suggest are the best “next-steps” for our overall community?
May 4, 2012 at 6:22 am #757328
HMC RichParticipantWell, Sound Transit runs trains right by there. And Light Rail is only two blocks away as well.
Take the Water Taxi, ride a bike, ride a bus with your bike.
Move. Change Jobs. Work at the Arena.
But what is the real reason why you are complaining about the traffic? It already stinks.
I daresay, I wouldn’t mind a stadium/arena corridor. But I am extremely biased. If they add the arena, get in a hockey team and a basketball team (not counting NCAA Tournaments, etc), I personally could make around an extra $30,000 per year.
It will increase jobs in the area, spur more business growth in SODO and it might help spur the county and city to expand public transportation.
May 4, 2012 at 1:56 pm #757329
JiggersMemberAnyone seen what the former Sonics team Thunder have been doing as of late? I forgot 98% of posters here aren’t sports fans. They are on their way to winning the 2012 NBA title. On to your daily gardening routine, stitching or whatever it is you do now…
May 4, 2012 at 3:15 pm #757330
OrobMemberWhile I still am not setting my hopes too high, I really do miss having a basketball team to root for. It’s interesting how passionate people are in voicing their disinterest.
I grew up with the Sonics. Watching them got me outside, pretending to be Payton, Kemp, or Detlef with time running out on the shot clock. This turned into years of playing my favorite sport, and in turn keeping me outside and healthy. Having the team provided an uncle with a job. My best friend got his first job selling tickets in the tiny office on Western. I won a free tshirt playing horse with Derrick Mckey at a GI Joes. Going to games gave my family and friends memories we cherish.
I will not tell you that you are wrong for having concerns about traffic or port issues. The funding on this arena is a good deal, but I understand concerns there as well. Just thought I’d share some of the reasons some of us are hopeful.
May 4, 2012 at 3:54 pm #757331
WSratsinacageMemberGenesee Hill – There is no way they would build only a 5000 seat arena. It would be much bigger. One of the reasons given for not wanting to use the Key Arena (which can hold about 19,000) is that it is too small so there is no way they would build a small 5000 seat arena near Safeco.
May 4, 2012 at 5:04 pm #757332
LPMMMemberMultiple entities are concerned about traffic, jobs, and the public financing that is probably illegal. Yet, we aren’t supposed to be concerned about something as small as getting home from work, or anything as large as those other things. It would be easier to build the stadium in Bellevue then it would be to muck up more traffic and demand that other people and businesses relocate? People don’t want to drive out of town or switch jobs just to have an NBA team. WE could have it all it seems, but the narrow focus on that one location seem counterproductive, and probably means we won’t get our team back if we aren’t exploring alternatives.
BTW, I have lived in WS since 1996.
May 4, 2012 at 5:38 pm #757333
OrobMemberThere are groups actively exploring Bellevue as an option. I wouldn’t call that narrow, and the fact that a business man has stepped forward and taken action in SODO just happens to be the way things have gone. If something serious shows up in Bellevue, as in a private party to do major financing, I do not think it will be ignored.
May 4, 2012 at 6:09 pm #757334
casabobaMemberGiven the recently announced decision by a consortium of three shipping lines to move from Seattle to Tacoma (See Story Below) wouldn’t Seattle port traffic/road container traffic go down? Wouldn’t this lessen SODO area traffic? Shouldn’t we try and replace these lost jobs?
“Seattle’s port losing big customer to Tacoma.”
—March 11, 2012 SEATTLE TIMES News Story—
A consortium of three shipping lines that accounts for about 20 percent of the Port of Seattle’s container traffic is moving to Tacoma — the latest shift in the long-running rivalry between the two seaports.
The “Grand Alliance” consortium of Germany’s Hapag-Lloyd, Japan’s NYK Line and OOCL of Hong Kong, which now operates at Terminal 18 on Harbor Island, will relocate in July to Tacoma’s Washington United Terminal, the Port of Tacoma said in a statement.
The Port of Seattle said in a statement the relocation could mean job losses in Seattle, and called for greater cooperation between the two ports.
May 4, 2012 at 8:50 pm #757335
LPMMMember@17 So you are saying that we should add insult to injury and drive even more jobs away? That’s pretty dumb. Why not build the stadium in Bellevue, then we can have the jobs AND the team? WIN WIN.
May 5, 2012 at 12:41 am #757336
Genesee HillParticipantWSratsinacage:
You are correct. I was being my normal, pathetic, sarcastic self in implying that a 5,000 person arena would outdraw the mighty Mariners. Sorry. I think the Ms attendance will soon be 5,000, or less, a game, the way they have been playing…That is all I meant.
I do not think that an arena with 20,000 fans max will be a huge hindrance on SODO. Another Qwest (Clink), yes. Another Safeco with a .500 ball club, yes. But not a 20,000 capacity arena, with most events in the evening.
Bottom line: I guess I really do not care if the arena gets built, or not. I do not think it will do horrible damage to the traffic in that area, however.
May 5, 2012 at 3:10 am #757337
JayDeeParticipantFrom what I understand, 1/2 of the freight mobility improvements promised for Qwest/Safeco (overpass at Lander, and more) were never implemented. Now we are asking for more sponsored sport-stadia crap for a town that doesn’t want the neo-Sonics, not with a public-private pocket picking attached.
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We need to keep the industrial/port business intact or we risk Seattle becoming Mayor McSchwinn’s Disneylandia where all the citizens ride bikes (regardless of aptitude, weather, ability or age) from West Seattle. No one will actually engage in non-tourist related commerce, but it will be pretty. Send the NBA to Bellevue; they want it, and they can afford it.
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The Thunder are dead to me.
May 5, 2012 at 6:13 am #757338
casabobaMemberRe.: Post # 18: I do not understand your reply. Can you please clarify? Specifically in response to post # 17:
“A consortium of three shipping lines that accounts for about 20 percent of the Port of Seattle’s container traffic is moving to Tacoma,” in July.
Thank you.
May 7, 2012 at 10:56 pm #757339
WSratsinacageMemberThanks Genesee. Peace.
May 7, 2012 at 11:12 pm #757340
skeeterParticipant#17 response
We need to replace the port jobs with port jobs. We already have the facilities and equipment in place.
May 8, 2012 at 12:07 am #757341
casabobaMemberQUESTION: Will the estimated 20% of container traffic lost by the port of Seattle to Tacoma result in 20% fewer port jobs? Will it result in 20% fewer Transit Jobs (rail/truck)? I have NO idea. I sincerely hope not.
QUESTION: Why is Seattle losing port jobs to Tacoma? Seems cannibalistic. Why are we not attracting MORE cargo to BOTH ports? Again, I have NO idea.
I’ve read that the recent estimated annual loss of cargo containers from Seattle to Tacoma is approx. 400,00 containers. This is approximately 20% of the annual volume of the Seattle port capacity (2.1 million),
I have also read that the Port of Seattle was designed with a potential capacity to operate at 3 million containers. I agree with “skeeter” in post # 23. (We need to Grow/Replace jobs.)
However, another question is, why do we have roads in place today that struggle with handling 2.1 million containers when we have designed a port with a capacity of approximately 3.0 million containers? Sadly, again I do not know.
QUESTION: What is the economic loss to the port of Seattle in terms of payroll wages by losing approx. 400,000 containers / year to the port of Tacoma? I have no idea? Again, I hope that it is not a lot.
For perspective, the Highest NBA Team Payroll is approx. $87.5 million (Boston Celtics). The lowest $46.5 million (Sacramento Kings).
The highest NHL Team Payroll is approx. $71 million (Philadelphia Flyer’s). The lowest $29.6 million (N.Y. Islanders).
QUESTION: Shouldn’t we be working to attract to Seattle high paying recession-resistant jobs across a broad-scale of diversified business enterprises?
QUESTION: Shouldn’t we demand of our governments in partnership with business to insure that the proper infrastructure is in place? I think yes.
The enemy is not in my opinion the ports of Tacoma or Seattle. The enemy is not entrepreneurial sports owners. The enemy is not the citizens of Seattle reluctant to support a self-liquidating bond issue.
The enemy is a lack of far-sighted trusted-leadership. The enemy is not “them,” it IS “us.”
There is no limiting reason which cannot be overcome why Seattle can’t have effective transportation that supports its citizens, and their civic, business, and entertainment interests.
July 18, 2012 at 11:16 pm #757342
AwesomeSauceParticipantDidn’t want to start a whole new thread for this…
DreamGirls putting up a fight in the NBA arena concept, LOL
http://publicola.com/2012/07/18/strip-club-refuses-to-sell-property-to-arena-backer/
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