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April 8, 2009 at 4:30 am #590430
TheHouseMemberI received a message today from a long time poster that many of us are familar with stating that they along with another long time poster are no longer able to post on the WSB. There is a possibility that this is a technical glitch, but from their feedback it seems that their accounts have been suspended so that they no longer can post.
I have had postings deleted on multiple occasions as well (as early as yesterday) even though I take the time to abide by the rules of the site and reread my postings multiple times to make sure that I don’t target anyone personally. I have also cited on multiple occasions how I have been accused of personal attacks while others personally attack me. I have proven in past posts that there are double standards occasionally.
I understand that WSB is a private entity and they have the ability to make the rules and run the website as they see fit. I also understand that I have the ability to not visit their site if I do not like their rules. The fact of the matter, many people have sent me e-mails, PMs, etc stating that they enjoy my comments and quite frankly, I enjoy WSB. I have even gone out of my way to introduce myself to the owners of WSB while in public in hopes of putting a face to the name and letting them know that I’m not a “troublemaker”.
If WSB acts as if they are a news organization (and in my opinion they do), aren’t forums similar to editorials where people can voice their opinions without the fear of being censored? If you truly value a diverse community, then you should allow differing opinions. Personal threats of course should not be allowed, but if someone doesn’t agree with your worldview and voices theirs it should not be grounds for deleting posts. That is known as censoring.
For the most part, we are adults on this site and I would say that the target audience is adults (I recognize that some kids visit), but if someone is offended by a comment or word they should speak their mind and let the forum members police themselves. If there is habitual abuse then I could understand the Admins getting involved.
Just my 2 cents.
April 8, 2009 at 4:40 am #663806
WSBKeymasterparagraph 3 yes
paragraph 4 no
I have spoken on all this on this site until I am blue in the face and gotten little but grief for it. So we have ceased explanations and taken action as needed. Some of the action taken has been long overdue and my mistake has been in not acting sooner.
No one has any idea what we have endured and been subjected to offsite. We no longer answer some people’s offsite e-mail to us because we have been abused and insulted one too many times – and threatened. Because we choose to run a website, does not mean it’s OK to have open season on us. However, I also choose not to discuss publicly who has said what to us when and why.
This is NOT intended to be an anything-goes forum. It can be freewheeling to a point. Not to the point where it is a laughingstock. Not to the point where it is profane. Not to the point where it is a sewer of discord.
You can choose to be disappointed if you want. You don’t have the full picture. And that is all I will say. Thanks.
April 8, 2009 at 4:48 am #663807
TraciMemberSo NR is banned? I will genuinely miss her voice on the forums. TR, I respect your judgement but I will miss one of our most active members.
April 8, 2009 at 5:36 am #663808
KeithMemberIt’s plain to anyone with two eyes that WSB does indeed “truly value a diverse community” through tireless coverage of so many people, places, programs, and viewpoints in our neck of the woods.
It’s also obvious that differing opinions are indeed allowed here, as they are exchanged constantly on the forums and given voice through many news stories.
Let the 99.9% of other online forums have the rude, obnoxious, baiting, combative, insulting, and generally annoying posters. I think it’s great there is one site near and dear to my heart that expects adults to behave themselves. It’s really not too much to ask of anyone, regardless of their opinions.
Think and say what you want, but be considerate and civil. That’s not censorship – that’s common decency.
April 8, 2009 at 5:46 am #663809
hopeyParticipantThink and say what you want, but be considerate and civil. That’s not censorship – that’s common decency.
Spot on. Thanks for saying it.
April 8, 2009 at 5:50 am #663810
JiggersMemberImagine what the Seattle Times has to endure everyday with their “comments” section. Anyways, I’m drunk half the time I visit this site.:)
April 8, 2009 at 5:53 am #663811
GenHillOneParticipantIn two very different ways, nicely said, Keith and Jiggers.
April 8, 2009 at 6:15 am #663812
livingonthebeachMemberAmen all. Some of the best persuaders have been those who have done it with kindness. I would much rather spar with someone who challenges my opinion intellectually and with respect. In return I would respect their opinion (and often agree afterwards).
Thanks WSB for all you put up with and provide.
April 8, 2009 at 6:39 am #663813
JiggersMemberOne thing I can’t stand is a sugarcoater or someone who thinks that everything is all rosey.
April 8, 2009 at 12:35 pm #663814
beachdrivegirlParticipantThe House I share in your disappoint of this double standard. I do agree that the blog should be a place where people are kind to one another I do not agree that those with differing opinions should just be blocked. A simple reply to NR email, PM or both over the past few weeks was all that was needed. If you put your contact information out there the least you can do is respond. Even a simple I received your email & will look into your concerns would have been nice. Isn’t that what we all expect when ranting/raving to other local business owners? The blog just became a little less diverse in my opinion which is disappointing.
April 8, 2009 at 2:06 pm #663815
AnonymousInactiveJiggers@#9 = the crux of the matter.
April 8, 2009 at 2:42 pm #663816
B-squaredParticipantThank you, TR, for enduring with this blog – and specifically, the forum. i value your efforts and i can only imagine what you have to put up with! it’s unfortunate that there seem to be a few that find “button pushing” a sport and/or chose to post without civility or common courtesy. perhaps courtesy isn’t so common anymore.
April 8, 2009 at 3:42 pm #663817
WSMomParticipantThanks TR, what B-squared said…
April 8, 2009 at 4:14 pm #663818
CallMeAlMemberAs I am relatively new…it seems to me from my brief observations that those who follow the “West Seattle Kumbaya, peace/love, recycled zen harmony” way of thinking have their voices heard. Those whose beliefs or sense of humor varies get the ax. Am I correct?
April 8, 2009 at 4:24 pm #663819
AnonymousInactiveLet’s put it this way, Al – if you don’t come to the table in a diplomatic manner or share the same opinion / perception / perspective, the likelihood of being banned is exponentially greater.
Civility here means agreement and consensus. If you anger the Forumblog Elders, you will be reprimanded and punished.
April 8, 2009 at 4:24 pm #663820
WSMomParticipantAl, I don’t believe you’re correct. TR says there is more to the story than we know. For my part, having been a forum reader/sometimes poster for over a year, TR has been very fair and allows all voices to be heard…as long as the comments follow the general forum rules (rules that I think are worthwhile).
April 8, 2009 at 4:29 pm #663821
IrukandjiParticipantIn their 24/7 work or providing news and info relevant to WS, the blog maintains a forum for people to connect with each other for varying purposes.
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If the forum is not fun or helpful, people will go elsewhere. If the forum is a constant barrage of BS postings, people will go elsewhere. Or they’ll just constantly complain and harass others to make themselves feel ‘heard’.
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Finding the balance has fallen to the minute staff maintaining WSB. Perhaps someone else could establish a West Seattle Chat Room, unmoderated, and take all the BS, sniping, posturing, etc. there and have at it in real time. In the meantime, why not employ the delete, ban and filter as desired.
April 8, 2009 at 4:34 pm #663822
JoBParticipantCallmeAl…
i don’t think so.
you don’t have to be nasty or make fun of someone to be humorous…
and you don’t have to be “West Seattle Kumbaya, peace/love, recycled zen harmony” to be civil.
I can think of one poster in particular who has a wicked sense of humor and could never be labeled Kumbaya but still manages to be civil while he eviscerates your argument… and yes, that keen knife has been turned on me more than once.
He is proof that you can disagree vehemently and still be civil… i don’t think he has ever had a single post deleted…
something i can’t say.
i couldn’t disagree with liuigilinguini’s recent tombstones more… labeling alone doesn’t make it so..
April 8, 2009 at 4:39 pm #663823
herongrrrlParticipantIf you have never experienced the joy (sarcasm) of moderating an online forum, please don’t jump to judgmental conclusions about why people are being excluded. Having done some time moderating myself, I have no doubt that there is a lot to the story we don’t know. Personally, from some things I have seen here, I am surprised WSB continues to have this forum at all. I am grateful that they do!
April 8, 2009 at 4:42 pm #663824
EmmyJaneParticipantI’m supporting TR and the blog on this one. Last time TR tried to set out some rules/give some guidance about what this blog was for, he got mocked and argued with. It should have served as a warning but people kept pushing. Its their blog, they can do what they want with it and if we choose to participate within their boundries we should be thankful for the site they provide. If we don’t like their boundries we can go elsewhere.
We also have to remember they’re running a business here. They have sponsors and those sponsors don’t want to be a part of something nasty.
April 8, 2009 at 4:43 pm #663825
SarahScootParticipantI would tend to agree with those saying that TR and Patrick have been fair, but I have witnessed some questionable deletions and bannings. A few weeks back there was the rental house debacle, where anyone who dared to make even a good-natured joke was deleted from the thread. That led to people getting (rightfully) annoyed that their innocent comments were deleted, then Patrick coming in and threatening to pull accounts from anyone who strayed off-topic in the thread again. Then he actually swore at the forum members, then the thread was closed and deleted.
I’m not here anywhere near most of the time, but I would assume that wasn’t the first incident of its kind, which does make me question how and why people are banned and comments deleted.
April 8, 2009 at 4:51 pm #663826
CallMeAlMembermay I ask who/what is TR?
April 8, 2009 at 4:53 pm #663827
JoBParticipanti suspect even partick has bad days… at least he had the sense to pull his own offending posts.
it is far too easy for all of us to pick apart the details.. but in the end i think we need to focus on the intent… and the intent is to give us all a safe place to post comments and generate community.
The world isn’t divided into do-gooders and do-badders as those who are complaining would have us believe… I don’t think anything is that black and white…
April 8, 2009 at 4:53 pm #663828
JoBParticipantApril 8, 2009 at 5:00 pm #663829
JiggersMemberHehehe.. I remember that rental house joke Sarah..I was just being real sarcastic when I posted my thoughts to only be deleted. But in honesty, I couldn’t care less that it was deleted. I have other things to do than fill my hours in the day here, like look for a better job to upgrade to full time. But that’s like going to a bank today and getting a loan. It’s almost impossible.
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