hooper, you’re watching inflation affect state budgets. the dollar just doesn’t buy as many widgets these days. so while it looks like the state’s revenue is increasing, the fact is that our budget doesn’t go as far as it used to to provide the services necessary to keep the state from defaulting during a recession; especially when the cost of those services is growing while the value of the dollar isn’t.

cost-cutting helps, but new and stable revenue streams – like higher wages! – are the only effective way to combat inflation in the long term.

so, yeah, the same thing is happening to the state that is happening to your personal finances. but instead of comparing essential services to “luxury” items like new cars and asparagus, you should be comparing it to items like running water, shelter, and health insurance. the state doesn’t really buy “luxury” items.

if you want to cut true luxury items from your budget, though, you should cancel your internet subscription and cable teevee. :)

Hooper, you know if the state income tax had passed, you would have received a nice credit on your B&O tax, right? I would have come out way ahead. I think the B&O tax is nuts, but did you really cut employee hours over a .3 percent increase?

And while “core” inflation remains low, health care costs have skyrocketed, and energy is quite a bit higher as well. If you’ve bought gas lately, you’ve seen that yourself. So not all costs have been flat. Health care costs are a huge portion of any employer’s budget, as you must know, unless you don’t provide that benefit.

I think your view on health care is rather oversimplified. You keep comparing it to things that are discretionary and not essential. It’s a false equivalency. If you buy a cheaper car, or you buy the veggies on sale, that’s discretionary. There are levels of expenditure that you can choose to make. You can live without the best car or the tastiest asparagus. Your health isn’t discretionary. To me, health care is a basic right and basic service that should be guaranteed to all of us. There are lots of people who have to make a choice between the roof over their head or health insurance. It’s not a matter of personal responsibility. It’s a matter of a system that is geared to profit and will inevitably leave people behind. Single payer is what we should have. In fact,we do have it, and it’s efficient and effective. It’s called the V.A.

I’m down for adding a little extra to our state budget if we can create a class called, “How to play well with others”.

JanS,

In support of you, specifically the part where you don’t die, I present this video from the Vlogbrothers. The main point at the end is the argument of healthcare being a privilage or a right. I am on the side of it being a right.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Z_RVl-ph3s

I don’t have time to watch the vid right now, being on dial-up, and planning on heading to bed in a few.

But, the point of healthcare being a right vs. a privilege, brings up an interesting observation; hooper’s postings in this thread, would suggest he is in the “privilege” camp.

Yet, on another thread, he complains profusely about how his travels by car were impeded by other drivers that weren’t prepared for the snow. He was so upset about this, it’s almost as if he felt his “right” to operate a motor vehicle was totally stomped upon.

Mike

hooper1961..

Let me understand…

you think life should only be extended by medical means if the person has the resources to do so?

that puts you in the company of your insurance company who makes all of your medical decisions…

until they decide you don’t need the treatment that will save your life.

and in company with the idiots who pay for critical care at any cost but will not pay for medication or procedures that would avoid critical care altogether.

If we could donate the difference between medical costs in other countries and what is paid in our system… every man woman and child in the United States could have the best medical care available.

Why condemn individuals to death when you could simply change the system?

If Washington opened it’s health care plan up to individuals.. the cost of the entire program could be covered by the premiums of the new members… and everyone would have cheaper more effective medical care.

imagine that.

Hooper, what I have to say to you in this moment would get me banned.

However, let’s just leave it at this: may you NEVER have a loved one who is ill. I don’t mean with a cold. I mean a REAL, life-threatening illness. You talk about your son. What happens if he gets a rarer form of cancer that’s only beatable by way of expensive treatment? What if your insurance company said “screw you, your son only has a 30% chance anyway of beating it, we’re just going to let him die.” Would you accept that? I pray you wouldn’t. If you would, you’ve got WAY bigger issues than we can discuss here.

And just to show you I’m not just grasping at straws – my father (WHO IS NOT OLD) was diagnosed 18 months ago with a form of cancer that’s 99% deadly. Fortunately, he’s got insurance through my mother, and he opted to fight. He saw the very best specialist in this type of cancer – who happens to work in Seattle – and went through 12 months of grueling treatment, nearly dying multiple times in the process. But he didn’t die. He no longer shows any evidence of the cancer. He is one of the 1% of people who survive it. Is his life not worth it? If you still think not, apply this situation to your son. Is his life not worth it?

Think carefully before you speak.

Oh, and you want to harp on fat people? What about those of us who are fat because we have a medical condition that prevents exercise. I eat 1200 calories a day – mostly fruits, vegs and lean protein – and walk as much as I can. Do I not deserve health care? I’m healthier (despite my health issues) than some skinny kid who lives on beer and mac n cheese and video games. My blood pressure is regularly 80/60, heart rate around 70, my cholesterols are perfect and all of my other standard bloodwork is absolutely ideal. Are you saying that I, who take care of myself better than some skinny college kid, do not deserve health care that treats my inherited medical condition? Because that treatment allows me to be a VERY productive member of society, in a very well-paying job with a family. We contribute to the solution by helping others wherever we can. What do you do besides bitch on a forum?

1. Aim–well stated

2. Hooper, sorry to hear your wife died suddenly

3. Most folks that are uninsured cannot afford coverage (often hundreds of dollars a month)

4. Medicare, as a Public Option, where everyone can buy in (sliding scale if needed), would provide risk sharing across all.

5. I think it is an ‘obligation’ of an industrialized, civilized society to provide health care.

6. Costa Rica, which is considered a third world nation, provides health care to all. Perhaps we could learn from them?

Hooper, I am very interested in your direct answer to Aim’s question:

What happens if your son gets a rarer form of cancer that’s only beatable by way of expensive treatment? What if your insurance company said “screw you, your son only has a 30% chance anyway of beating it, we’re just going to let him die.”

For chrissake hooper, what if your magic, probably very expensive, insurance doesn’t cover your son’s possible illness, and you even with all of your apparent wealth, don’t have enough money to cover treatment?!?

(Also, a tangential question; when all of us poor folk die off, who will be around to serve you as you shop at Safeway, Wal-Mart, and all of those other bargain stores?)

Mike

hooper1961

risk based behavior?

what happened to genetics here?

so.. you were fat and you were able to do something about it so everyone else regardless of their medical condition and genetics should be able to do the same thing you did because after all if you could do it they could…

that concept boggles the mind.

but lets say that you are right.

do you really think that losing weight is some magic panacea for whatever genetic or environmental load is hanging over your head?

sorry.. it doesn’t work that way.

you had best hope that if your body does break it does so it a simple medically acceptable way with a long successful history of treatment.

if not.. you’re out of here.

your insurance company has no vested interest in saving your life… no matter how much money you have given them.

Flagged to this thread.

It’s an interesting discussion and I don’t want to close it.

But for those who don’t know our longstanding rules:

This is one of the few places online where it’s not OK to fat-bash.

That includes claiming that obesity is a “choice.”

I have been big my whole life. Trust me, it ain’t a choice. Will stack my consumption up against 50 slender people any day.

And frankly, I’d probably be smaller today if not for the fact that every time, goaded by a world that ridiculed me for being big, I tried dramatically reducing consumption/overexercising, I’d lose 10 pounds … and when attempting to no longer starve myself to the point I couldn’t work or study, returned at some point to something resembling a more normal intake, the 10 would come back with 10 friends.

Finally I gave up trying to “lose” weight more than a decade ago, and funny, my size has been stable ever since.

And I continue to be healthy as hell. Thank God.

And pissed off that the government is allowed to propagandize that fat is bad, ergo I’m bad, and every big person you see walking down the street.

Size in terms of weight is no more a choice than:

size in terms of height

size in terms of bones, feet, whatever

gender

race

skin color

natural hair color

sexual orientation

And that is where WSB rules stand.

Again, because this hasn’t veered into the usual variety of fat-bashing – ridiculing people for their size – I’m not currently planning to delete anything. But I’m putting up the big red flag.

Smoking, you can quit. I smoked for six years long ago and quit – tough as it was – a human being can live without ever smoking a cigarette.

Drinking and drugging, you can quit. Wish my dad, dead of a shredded liver at 44, had. Wish my mom, dead of a cancerous pancreas at 62 (thanks to smoking and drinking), had. A human being can live just fine without taking a sip of alcohol, a toke of a joint etc. etc.

If you have found a documented case of anyone who can live without ever putting another bite of food into their mouth, I’ll be fascinated to hear it. Meantime, I eat when I absolutely have to because I am starving and have been working for 12 hours without leaving the keyboard, or the field … and yet even if I only find time for one small meal a day, my body has decided it’s big and that’s that. I made peace with it long ago and wish that everyone else with a large body would be able to do the same. (And whatever body size you have, I wish you the same peace.)

Body size is not a choice. And not up for debate. There are a million other websites in the world that will let you declare obesity to be bad, wrong, unhealthy, a choice because somebody eats too much. Not this one. Whatever size you are, you can be healthy and I hope you are. I sure am.

Back to the discussion. Minus obesity, please.

well, here ya go…here’s the next idea

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101128/ap_on_bi_ge/us_employer_health_plans

do we really believe that employers will actually increase salaries to make up for this? Really? I have an island…cheap…

Here’s what I say. Every congressman/woman takes a 25% salary cut…and they have to pay for their health insurance out of their own pocket. Then maybe we can start talking. If they can’t do that, then we should all have the health insurance that they have, at the cost that they have. Fair is fair!

The people making these decisions are so out of touch with regular Americans that they don’t have a clue what it’s like out here for all of us. Amazing, simply amazing!