WEST SEATTLE LIGHT RAIL: Sound Transit board chair optimistic; opponents not giving up

Two notes about West Seattle light rail tonight:

(Image from Final Environmental Impact Statement for West Seattle Link Extension, page 176 of appendix N.2)

BOARD CHAIR’S OPTIMISM: When King County Executive Dow Constantine spoke to the Rotary Club of West Seattle today, light rail was one of the topics. He noted first that the next step is the Federal Transit Authority’s “Record of Decision,” formalizing what the Sound Transit Board – which he chairs – approved in October. That’s expected in February, he said (a few months later than planned, as a Sound Transit spokesperson had told us last month). But he believes “we are in a strong position to deliver what voters approved” in 2016. A short time later, in response to a meeting attendee’s question about timeline (officially still projected to open in 2032), Constantine said, “the scope is really the question – such as, do you build the Avalon station or not? – there are 100 questions like that, that the board’s going to have to answer.” He won’t be there for all the answers, as he’s not running for re-election (which he had more to say about, as we’ll report in a separate story tomorrow).

OPPONENTS NOT GIVING UP: The Rethink the Link group, which wants to see West Seattle light rail canceled, is planning a community forum on January 25, its first event since a walking tour last June. One organizer says, “Yes, it is the eleventh hour, but that is often when people wake up.” We asked about the point of the forum, since the board has chosen the “project to be built” – this is most of their reply:

Broadly speaking, our mission is to inform the West Seattle community of the scope and impacts of Sound Transit’s light rail project. The information given to folks at various “outreach” events- and found in both the 2022 Draft EIS and in Sound Transit’s Final EIS (released September 20, 2024) is often incomplete, inaccurate, vague, or non-existent.

The West Seattle Community Transit/ Light Rail Forum will include

(1) a complete and detailed map of the entire route! (All segments will have the same scale and north orientation!)

(2) a list of all residences and businesses that have been notified of potential eminent domain.

(3) a map of the Delridge, Avalon, and Alaska Junction stations WITH list of businesses and residences that will be demolished

(4) a street map of traffic detours during construction, e.g., the closure of Alaska forcing all traffic to be moved to Oregon and Edmunds

(5) a map of our current bus routes, and routes that Metro has cut (Our experts can talk about how easily and inexpensively we can give ALL of West Seattle better transit without light rail.)

(6) a list of the 13 food sources that will be eliminated (causing a ‘food desert” from Delridge to WS Junction

They also believe that some ST Board members “realize dropping WS light rail could be a win/win/win!” and observe that “The new US Department of Transportation might also help us out by cutting the funding.” Their forum is set for 10 am Saturday, January 25, at the Center for Active Living (4217 SW Oregon).

123 Replies to "WEST SEATTLE LIGHT RAIL: Sound Transit board chair optimistic; opponents not giving up"

  • Griff January 7, 2025 (6:22 pm)

    “The new US Department of Transportation might also help us out by cutting the funding.”The mask is off.

    • Liz S January 8, 2025 (7:11 am)

      Seriously. It’s only a matter of time before they start talking about all the nebulous crime (by which they mean poor people) that light rail will bring to the neighborhood. Commenters below are already doing it.

      • LoveWS January 9, 2025 (6:56 am)

        Look at the news this morning: 

        Seattle congestion increased 9% in 2024 as workers returned to office
        We need light rail to the peninsula to save so much time. Wherever light rail goes in, the park and ride lots fill up and traffic goes down like magic.
        Light rail is electric drive, so transportation pollution goes down too, and we act on climate.
        We voted for it. Let’s make sure it’s gets built.
        • Nunya January 9, 2025 (8:24 pm)

          This project will absolutely destroy West Seattle. 

          • Z January 13, 2025 (12:07 pm)

            Oh clairvoyant one, prey tell how this ruin will become of the link in West Seattle. Otherwise I shan’t believe you are not “full of it” 

        • Jim January 13, 2025 (5:39 pm)

          No thanks. Crime follows the light rail everywhere they go. Paying that money to destroy west Seattle doesn’t seem like a good idea. 

      • The Dude January 9, 2025 (11:45 am)

        And the obvious “light rail kills children”.

    • Lauren January 8, 2025 (8:49 am)

      💯

  • hmmm January 7, 2025 (6:43 pm)

    “The new US Department of Transportation might also help us out by cutting the funding.”

    Ya know, when you need to hope for support from Trump, you just might be in the wrong…

  • Oh Seattle… January 7, 2025 (7:01 pm)

    It is amazing how we keep spending billions on projects and then don’t build them. It’s been studied and studied and studied and it’s time to move forward. I hate the word NIMBY but the resistance is for and by the people that don’t want West Seattle to change… an entire generation is being left without any real opportunity to own a home. This is the first and most important step toward equity and progress and growth and prosperity. Buses are not a solution. Grade separated transportation is the only real solution to start to give the city back to everyone. I don’t love this routing or plan in general, but this is what we got and it’s better than the alternative: status quo/nothing. 

    • EVGuy January 7, 2025 (8:09 pm)

      How, exactly, does removing real estate from use to devote it to a light rail for a location 20 minutes away make housing cheaper? Why are buses not a solution? You could have bus routes every 5 minutes for the cost of the light rail over the water.     Spending billions on already-over-budget boondoggles is why we don’t have nice things, not the other way around. 

      • Go Rail January 7, 2025 (9:00 pm)

        @EVGuy & @Gay as noted above “Grade separated transportation” is the key. We cannot simply add more buses because increase in cars on the road and lack of space for more buses on the road will create more congestion. We have to separate mass transportation options from cars and trucks to have a reliable, streamlined and durable people moving solution. Hopefully, light rail will continue to be built through West Seattle into White center and Burien in the future.

      • Oh Seattle January 7, 2025 (9:22 pm)

        Grade separated transit (even buses on their own dedicated roads and bridges but not on our current road network) is the most scalable and sustainable transportation solution for growth. Mobility is by far the most critical component for equity. If people can move more freely without the burden of cars (cost, fuel, maintenance, insurance and parking) then people have more options for places to live. The growth stimulated by housing that isn’t car dependent, again more scalable and inherently denser. These types of urban centers help grow retail cores and the smaller scale and potential rapid expansion of housing options creates affordability. This plan could grow West Seattle massively, especially close the route. And no, the way we currently do buses does not scale. And a 20 minute bus ride would be 3-5 minutes on a train. 

        • WS Guy January 8, 2025 (4:21 am)

          Bus Rapid Transit (BRT) is a great answer.  Instead of building a dedicated rail bridge, build a dedicated bus bridge with feeder lanes.  Cheaper – plus an advantage is that it will be forward-compatible with driverless vehicle transport, which is more convenient for point-to-point transit and will be really popular in the coming years.  (Try Waymo – it’s in SF now and could be running driverless bus/van service with dynamic routing within 5 years.)

        • WS Guy January 8, 2025 (4:27 am)

          A 3-5 minute train ride… what is that one stop?  More like 12 minutes after taking a 15 minute bus ride to the train station and a 3 minutes escalator to the platform.  And then a transfer at SODO (until 2035), an escalator to the street, and a 15 minute walk from one of the handful of stations on the fixed rail line.I’m not against trains per se but don’t BS me.

          • Go Rail January 8, 2025 (4:21 pm)

            @WS Guy you may not be wrong, but that will still be quicker, cheaper, less impactful on the environment and more scalable for future needs than what we have now – driving a car with a single passenger. We have to start making the investment now for long term solutions that are more accessible to many more people. 

          • Jim January 13, 2025 (5:44 pm)

            You keep mentioning scalable, how so. Explain it in simple terms. It costs a ton of money for another rail line. Transition to White Center? No thanks, there is nowhere near the room for that. Buses can be added and routes changed rapidly as needs change. Paying millions for a mile of track isn’t equity. 

        • natinstl January 8, 2025 (5:46 pm)

          Some of my co workers live in the Snohomish area. They took away buses to push them to light rail. They now have to drive to a park and ride, catch a bus to the light rail and then come downtown. it’s added so much travel time and inconvenience that now they drive downtown. 

      • Jon Wright January 7, 2025 (11:17 pm)

        Yes, an infinitesimal amount of West Seattle real estate will be needed for the construction of light rail. However, once it is built, Sound Transit’s redevelopment of that property will probably return the number of affected housing units tenfold.

  • Gay January 7, 2025 (7:12 pm)

    More buses…many more, please!  It would work. We do not need the light rail. Not here.  Bring back all the bus routes and keep them running up into the neighborhoods.

    • KBear January 7, 2025 (7:40 pm)

      Buses get stuck in traffic. How would you change that? The only way is to give buses a separate road that cars are not allowed on. Might as well build light rail. 

      • EVGuy January 7, 2025 (9:02 pm)

        You mean a bus lane? Like the ones all over town, that already exist? 

        • KM January 7, 2025 (10:07 pm)

          Oh the ones used by entitled drivers and delivery drivers? The ones that disappear, merging with general traffic onto major highways? The ones earmarked for “all modes” at certain times? The ones with limited enforcement and no self-enforcing design? The current design is not working, bro. If it did, grade separated ground transport wouldn’t be necessary. 

        • Derek January 7, 2025 (11:00 pm)

          You mean the bus lane currently sharing lanes with cars on the ramp that got backed up three miles this morning? That one?

          • Kyle January 8, 2025 (12:29 pm)

            I mean, if that’s your argument let’s just build a new on-ramp with a bus only lane too. Should cost like 100x less.

        • CAM January 7, 2025 (11:48 pm)

          That cars drive in with no consequences ever? Unless you’re voting for bus lanes with concrete barriers separating them from all traffic buses are not rapid transit. 

    • Arbor Heights Resident January 7, 2025 (7:55 pm)

      I have good news for you: the WSLE project will be great for our bus system, because Link trains have a far higher capacity than the buses they replace. Here’s the breakdown:

      Each Siemens Series 2 Link car has a maximum capacity of 194 passengers, and they are operated in trains of 3 or 4 cars. In comparison, each New Flyer DE60LFR Metro bus on the C line has a maximum capacity of 58 passengers. This means that one light rail operator can transport as many passengers as 10 to 13 Metro bus operators. Those 9 to 12 bus drivers can be reassigned to increase bus service on other routes!

      So if you want a better bus system, you should support the West Seattle Link Extension!

      • Martin January 7, 2025 (8:21 pm)

        For years to come the WSLE will only run to SODO and therefore most people will have to transfer twice (WS and SODO). That will take much longer than staying on the bus to downtown. Metro is already saying they will continue the buses to downtown meaning no savings of bus drivers or reassignment of bus service to other routes. Those big trains will mostly be empty. Sound Transit only expects 5400 riders a day, less than most bus routes. So why are we spending $7b on this and not just increase bus service NOW?

        • WSR January 7, 2025 (10:03 pm)

          That is incorrect. Taking the bus and making connections downtown is infinitely longer than taking light rail. I have taken a bus and transferred to light rail riding as far as Northgate and it is significantly faster than taking the bus the entire way (this is prior to the extension of the served areas up north). I have even taken the bus as far as Redmond with transfer to ST Express buses and I bet once they connect the lines it will still be faster on light rail. I doubt the ST estimates are correct with the amount of people moving into the area and the number of packed buses during prime commuting hours and even off hours. I’m not sure where all the ridership resides but there are many people who transfer at downtown light rail stations to continue further north. 

        • Jon Wright January 7, 2025 (11:04 pm)

          “For years to come” is 7 years (2032 to 2039). Not ideal but hardly the indefinite amount of time your disingenuous wording implies.

        • CAM January 7, 2025 (11:50 pm)

          Martin – some of us already transfer to get to where we’re going. The idea that someone riding public transit expects to get from beginning to end without ever transferring means that person doesn’t use public transit often. 

        • Jay January 9, 2025 (4:21 pm)

          Just a note to anyone that doesn’t know, Martin is the guy behind the gondola campaign. He’s our on local Tim Eyman. And it’s very frustrating how he and the small group of retirees backing him get boosted so much by the media that it seems like a 50/50 split on the transit issue.

          • WSB January 9, 2025 (4:46 pm)

            Reporting is not “boosting.” (At least relating to our publication, as we do not take positions, nor publish editorials.) And if you look at our archive on this topic
            https://westseattleblog.com/category/sound-transit/
            you have to go back six months for the last story related to this group, nowhere near a 50-50 split (more like 5-95). – TR

      • Chemist January 7, 2025 (8:28 pm)

        For what it’s worth, the series 2 cars have a seated capacity of 70 and, iirc, that 194 is called a “crush capacity” of standing folks.  The metro bus you mention has a 58 seated capacity and much more at standing.  Light rail can carry more people but your math is a bit slanted if you compare a standing/crush capacity to a bus seated capacity.

      • WS resident January 7, 2025 (10:41 pm)

        The light rail is going to be even further away from me than the C Line, which is already a 25 min walk. Many times in order to utilize the C Line, I’ve driven and parked in the junction. I support the light rail, but a lot of West Seattle would directly benefit from more bus coverage. If adding last mile options to get to the light rail isn’t in the plans, it will greatly hinder it’s effectiveness.

        • Foop January 8, 2025 (12:17 am)

          I believe the plan is to have the buses that go downtown today to feed the light rail once Ballard is done.

        • WSR January 8, 2025 (1:33 am)

          Fully agree the light rail should serve more beyond the Junction. It is really unfortunate this extension doesn’t go further to White Center and Burien since it could help a significant number of people at lower incomes. However if you already park at Junction to take the C, how is light rail even further for you if the planned terminus is in the Junction (42 & Alaska)? 

          • Arbor Heights Resident January 8, 2025 (6:14 pm)

            WSR- That extension to White Center and Burien is proposed in both the ST and SDOT long-range plans. If WSLE is built out, it’s quite likely ST4 will include what you describe. Time will tell.

    • K January 7, 2025 (8:01 pm)

      Still a bus driver shortage.  A shortage that’s still expected to persist for many years to come.  Buses don’t drive themselves.  Light rail carries far more passengers per operator, so it makes more sense given ongoing staffing issues.

      • Martin January 7, 2025 (8:13 pm)

        Light rail will only serve 3 stations, we still need buses to cover all of West Seattle. Pay and train drivers properly and we can eliminate the driver shortage.

        • k January 8, 2025 (7:59 am)

          Alleviating need on major routes via light rail service and we will alleviate the shortage, allowing more routes going further into neighborhoods.

        • Chris January 8, 2025 (9:49 am)

          Martin–we already pay and train drivers well at Metro. The driver shortage is mostly over, but there aren’t an infinite number of people who want that tough job. Everytime ST extends light rail, Metro restructures service. We will take the money saved by not running 600 buses a day downtown and redirect that service to improve coverage and frequency of buses within West Seattle just like we have done elsewhere. 

      • Facts January 9, 2025 (9:04 pm)

        A shortage on bus drivers!!! Know your facts before speaking out the side of your neck. There was a brief opening for applicants late summer which all positions were filled. Next round of new hires shouldn’t even open up for another 3 months…. Outside of maybe the one unfortunate driver recently murdered. King County Metro driver positions are far from any shortfalls….The moment positions become available they become overwhelmed with applicants. We’re talking about bus drivers not police officers….

    • Neighbor January 8, 2025 (12:40 pm)

      Light rail will free up bus coaches and drivers to serve local routes.  We don’t need to waste bus drivers on the Rapid Ride when we have light rail.

  • Alki resident January 7, 2025 (7:26 pm)

    Adding this overpriced artwork will destroy the dynamic of West Seattle. So many businesses will be destroyed and forced out of the area. All for what? Go 15 down to SODO and catch another train? Makes zero sense. Not to mention the drug smoke and violence that comes with these trains. Add more buses, there’s plenty of time frames to work them in. 

    • geoff January 7, 2025 (8:39 pm)

      Christ. Could you be any more racist? 

      • Alki resident January 8, 2025 (7:39 am)

        Where do you read racism in my comment? Give it a rest dude. 

        • Burgerman January 8, 2025 (8:05 pm)

          Alki resident – you’re an admitted Trump supporter. Racism is inherent in your belief system, stop gaslighting.

    • WS Resident January 7, 2025 (8:46 pm)

      I actually can’t find a straight answer to the question, does the West Seattle route continue to the Ballard link extension once that’s completed?

    • East Coast Cynic January 7, 2025 (8:51 pm)

      Yes, take light rail to SODO and catch another train – for many West Seattlites that work at the UW, in North Seattle, and on the Eastside, this would be a tremendous transit sea change for the better.  Not every person who lives in West Seattle works downtown.

    • WSR January 7, 2025 (9:05 pm)

      What nonsense! You haven’t encountered smoke, violence and the mentally unstable on buses at all? I have seen it all and then some. Full transparency, I’ve also seen it on the light rail and yet I still take these modes of transportation because I don’t own a car for economic reasons.Question is do you even take public transportation? I’d like to say no since it’s never been a 15 minute bus ride down to SODO at any hour, maybe in the past and in your ideal conditions. And now with Amazon employees going back to work downtown both roads and buses are going to be crowded even if a bus lane exists on the bridge. Sometimes it would take me well over an hour to get home during rush hour from Colman Dock/Alaskan Way be it traffic, weather or no more space on the bus.  Light rail is far from overpriced art. So many of the anti-Link group refuse to change and want to see meaningful growth in this area because it doesn’t serve you. Plain and simple. 

    • Go Rail January 7, 2025 (9:06 pm)

      @Alki Resident while having any business taken out is heartbreaking, building light rail has shown time and again that it helps spur growth and increase business opportunities. Portland saw the growth when they built their light rail on the 90s and 2000s. Seattle area light race station neighborhoods have see development increase. It is good for the community in the long run and gives us more transportation options. We have to think long term investment here. 

    • Peter January 8, 2025 (8:32 am)

      Ah the good old transit causes crime LIE. It was only a matter of time before some LIAR trotted that out. 

    • Neighbor January 8, 2025 (12:49 pm)

      You’re just so completely wrong about all of this.  You didn’t even get close enough to be corrected.  You’re not just wrong.  You’re Not Even Wrong.

  • Arbor Heights Resident January 7, 2025 (7:36 pm)

    Good grief, a food desert? In the junction? I don’t know how anyone takes these anti-transit people seriously. And very telling that they think the new anti-transit administration will help their cause…

    • Scarlett January 7, 2025 (10:39 pm)

      Don’t conflate anti-light rail with being anti-public transportation.   I take bus transit to every corner of King County and my opposition to light rail is based on its vastly oversold claims and obscene cost.  I’ll go to the library if I want to pick up some romantic fiction.  

      • K January 8, 2025 (2:33 am)

        You don’t need to go to the library.  Just visit the Rethink the Link site if you want some fiction, lol

      • walkerws January 8, 2025 (8:31 am)

        The “anti-light rail but pro-bus” is a smokescreen. These people are anti-public transportation but don’t want to say it because they know it’s a bad position.

      • Arbor Heights Resident January 8, 2025 (11:26 am)

        You’re not fooling anyone with that line. The anti-Link people are anti-transit and the fact that they think Project 2025 will help them is just more proof of that.

  • Derek January 7, 2025 (8:18 pm)

    We need to speed up lightrail. We already lost a year.

  • Bus Rider January 7, 2025 (8:55 pm)

    We advocate for better transportation to and from WS (bus) and better bus service within our community.    Sound Transit rail will take us only to SODO in 10 years – but most West Seattleites will not be able to use it easily because there will be NO parking at the stations – and limited bus service to the stations- and after getting there we will have to go down 90’ on an escalator or 80’ in an elevator to ride the 4 miles to SODO where everyone will have to transfer whether to bus or light rail.

    • Derek January 7, 2025 (10:55 pm)

      Can we stop the disingenuous “only take us to SoDo” lie

    • CAM January 7, 2025 (11:53 pm)

      Well zero percent of that is based on facts. 

    • Another One January 8, 2025 (9:34 am)

      I wonder how the enormous and efficient subway systems of other large cities got started? Did they all just suddenly appear one day? 

  • West Seattle Mad Sci Guy January 7, 2025 (10:45 pm)

    Am…am I in a parks and recreation episode?

  • matt January 7, 2025 (10:54 pm)

    I want light rail ASAP.  Can’t wait!

  • Johnny Stulic January 8, 2025 (12:02 am)

    Why are the people who are against the Seattle light rail aiming so low? You should should shoot for the stars, go global: branch into other large world metropolises like Tokyo, London, NYC, Shanghai, and convince them they’re stupid for running their subway systems and they should immediately dismantle them and switch to buses instead. If they won’t listen, pretend they’re Greenland or Panama and threaten them with TFG.

  • Dara January 8, 2025 (2:35 am)

    Just here to add another perspective. I was brought back to my job after a layoff only because of work created by the ST light rail project. I came back to Seattle for this work, giving this place a last chance I didn’t think I’d be able to afford. I can think of dozens of others whose livelihood now depends on this project and can only imagine how many more jobs this project will create as it fully unfolds, if it’s allowed to unfold. In addition, I’ve seen firsthand the POSITIVE impact of emminent domain on property owners. For too long this action has been equated as unfair seizure. Owners are fairly compensated and many only lose access to small portions of land, otherwise unused at present.

  • Niko January 8, 2025 (4:40 am)

    Defund sound Transit 

  • Salal January 8, 2025 (6:36 am)

    Lighty rail is a reallllllly bad plan for west seattle

  • bill January 8, 2025 (8:31 am)

    The Link Rethinkers claim ‘The information given to folks at various “outreach” events- and found in both the 2022 Draft EIS and in Sound Transit’s Final EIS (released September 20, 2024) is often incomplete, inaccurate, vague, or non-existent.’ I will grant the EIS is not 4th-grade level reading. It is a serious document, compiled by serious people, with the information available. But the Rethinkers somehow have better information than the staff working on the project? I am particularly amused by the claim the Rethinkers are going to present “a list of all residences and businesses that have been notified of potential eminent domain.” That already exists in Appendix L of the EIS. But the Rethinkers have a better list? How did they divine corrections to the official list? By the way, the Appendix is a searchable PDF so it’s not all that hard to look up a property.

  • Shawn January 8, 2025 (8:37 am)

    These anti transit people need to stop. It’s so infuriating. This has already taken far too long. How can a person in a city justify being anti transit?  We desperately need this train immediately. We needed it a decade ago.

  • LetItGo January 8, 2025 (8:42 am)

    I am wildly entertained by the folks dying on the mountain of “you will have to transfer to go anywhere”–Have you been to any other major metropolitan city in the US or around the world with a high-functioning train system? They all require transfers at some point. Stop trying to cut off access to WS, buses will not cut it, it’s clear from our current situation that buses are not magically efficient with having to sit in the same traffic as the rest of us. I love this community so much but I’m SO tired of all of the himming and hawwing over nonsense; it’s truly a reason I’ve considered selling my house and moving to another neighborhood but I won’t let the louder voices win, I’ll just keep sharing my opposing opinions to make others uncomfortable. 

    • Another One January 8, 2025 (9:36 am)

      It’s very obvious they haven’t spent time using an effecient light rail system for daily life, or even have the capacity to imagine it. 

      • Scarlett January 8, 2025 (2:42 pm)

        I’ve ridden light rail here but it hasn’t changed my life.  Every destination could have be easily reached by bus transit (and closer to my destination), whether by Metro or Sound Transit.  More buses means more cars off the road, and buses far more effectively canvass neighborhoods, sans finding a parking spot or relying on someone to drop you off at a station.   Btw, I’ve ridden trains from London to most recently, Tokyo and Osaka, but its an apples and oranges argument.  

        • walkerws January 8, 2025 (3:40 pm)

          Buses require drivers, of whom there are fewer and fewer. They also share roads with traffic and get stuck in said traffic. They *do not* mean more cars off the road, because induced demand means there will still be just as many cars. Buses are a key part of our transportation network, but they do not serve the same purpose as light rail. London, Tokyo, and Osaka also have bus networks that integrate with their extensive light rail networks, as we are endeavoring to do here in Seattle. It is not an apples and oranges argument, but an apples and apples argument.

        • East Coast Cynic January 8, 2025 (6:39 pm)

          Buses also get stuck in snow.  I remember a major snow storm a bunch of years ago where it took me about 6-7 hours to get home from downtown – buses jacknifed on the WSB causing my bus and many others to crawl at a snails pace on the 1st ave s bridge:/ – because we were reliant solely on buses while many light rail riders got home much earlier.  West Seattlites deserve such an advantage.

    • Scarlett January 8, 2025 (2:37 pm)

      Speak for yourself, LetItGo, you’re not making me uncomfortable – that would require coming up with an argument for light rail based on realistic projections, and predicated on how light rail has been transformative here or in other cities – which is hasn’t. 

      • LetItGo January 9, 2025 (7:40 am)

        You should get out more then Scarlett. Ride the subway in NYC, The BART in SF, the L in Chicago…to name a few. Realistic projections, I don’t have those because I don’t show up to these “forums” and “meetings” where voices in favor of progress and innovation are drowned out by citizens afraid of change and only want to stall projects and create more “committee oversight” of the simplest things (See: NIMBYS) which gives way to complicating bigger projects. Like I said, I won’t be selling and moving just yet but I also won’t be getting a on a bus anytime soon either because that isn’t getting me anywhere fast when I can pass them in traffic and get to where I need to go in a timely fashion. I’ll hold out for the train, it’s coming whether anyone likes it or not ;)

  • Peter January 8, 2025 (8:48 am)

    What the people saying they want more busses instead of light rail are refusing to understand is that not building light rail will not result in any additional bus service. Metro and Sound Transit are completely separate agencies with separate funding, operations, staff, equipment, and legal authorizations. Not building light rail will only result in WS residents paying ST taxes for no additional transit service. I can’t help noticing those crying that we need more buses instead of light rail are not proposing any plan to fund and build out bus service that would have the equivalent speed and capacity of light rail. Even if there were a real proposal to implement such bus service, I would literally bet my house that the same people opposing light rail would oppose the enforced 24/7 bus lanes, real signal priority, and massive increase in the number of buses running that would be required to do it.

  • Aaron G January 8, 2025 (8:51 am)

    Very much looking forward to light rail coming to West Seattle.

    • LoveWS January 9, 2025 (7:04 am)

      Me too.  I took it to a Husky game at the University of Washington recently and it was so fast! I barely had time to scan the front page of the newspaper on the way.It saves so much time it would enable UW students to live in WS.

  • CarDriver January 8, 2025 (8:55 am)

    Will be interesting to read comments in the blog from those advocating for it when the bills for it come in and they realize what it’s costing them.  Do we need mass transit? YES. Will it be worth the blank check we’ve all signed and handed over? Will be interesting to see the final results (if I live long enough).

  • Crowski January 8, 2025 (8:57 am)

    In 2016, voters approved Sound Transit 3’s proposal to provide mass transit services to areas like West Seattle, Burien, and Ballard. The vision, which also included establishing rapid bus transit services, extending the Sounder South line, and adding more bike lanes and pedestrian trails, was firmed up before going on the ballot in November. Just because people voted for better mass transit does not mean they voted for light rail. WSLE is too ambitious, outrageously expensive, and will not benefit many of us who must pay.”

  • Marfaun January 8, 2025 (9:31 am)

    Let’s be clear about the 2-part WS light rail project (WS-SODO ($7 billion) + SODO-CID tunnel ($2-$5 billion).  Sound Transit’s 2000 pages of Draft and Final Environmental Impact Statements (EIS) say that light rail — when it gets built (2042?): >will carry no more passengers than buses do today (26,000-28,000)> will add transfers and wait times to what is now a direct bus ride between WS & downtown, > will not reduce traffic congestion (OK, FEIS says 0.002 reduction in car & light truck traffic, zero reduction in bus, freight & emergency traffic)> will not mitigate its 614,000 ton carbon footprint until 2105 (80 years from now).  Seattle & King County set 2050 as their goal for carbon neutrality, Sound Transit (S.T.), which generates about 400,000 tons of carbon a year, is helping prevent them from reaching their goals.> will do irreparable environmental damage —  erase 3-4 acres of Pigeon Pt. forest and green space, harm habitats, make heat island effects worse.   S. Transit has already cut 140 acres of trees for its north-south-east lines, helping prevent Seattle from reaching its 2037 tree canopy coverage goal.  Its Ballard-SLU plan will cut another 4 acres of forest.> will displace or close 70-100 businesses, lose up to 1000 jobsSpending $9-$14 billion on WS-SODO-CID will also dry up funds S.T.’s $12 billion Ballard-SLU rail proposal.  This isn’t play money.  These are our tax dollars that S.T. is using to fund worse transit.  As S.T. continues spending itself into debt, where does anything think it will get federal bailouts from a Trump administration that hates public transit? So the question has zero to do with NIMBY, and everything to do with improving transit, which isn’t happening — even though we voted for that in 2016 in ST3.  But in the eight years since, S.T. has spent our ST3 money paying off ST2 projects & debt service, generating DEIS & FEIS documents and masses of literature, staging presentations, and giving a pittance to Metro Transit for West Seattle Rapid Ride C & H lines — which Metro had already funded.   Let’s not fixate on the shiny rail object.  Let’s focus on improving transit.

  • Chris January 8, 2025 (9:53 am)

    This meeting is hardly a “forum”.  That implies real debate. This is a meeting of a small group of people who oppose light rail to West Seattle. If it is really a forum, then I am sure they will give those of us who support light rail equal time to present and make our case.  I don’t think that will happen at this meeting. 

    • BlairJ January 8, 2025 (1:05 pm)

      I plan on attending to find out how open a forum this is, and to show my support for light rail to West Seattle.

  • Scarlett January 8, 2025 (12:55 pm)

    Light rail is not going to have a significant impact on traffic congestion and it won’t be a transformative public transportation option.  It will be exactly what it is now, a nice adjunct for some people – even indispensable – but a very, very expensive piece of infrastructure that hasn’t – and won’t – go far in the grand scheme in solving the pains that come with increasing density here or any other neighborhood.  Frankly, if light rail disappeared tomorrow, no one would notice it, certainly no one would lose access to public transportation.  So, all of you can trot out the strawman arguments, borne out of frustration and irritation because you voted for something and it is being delayed, okay, but it won’t change the eventual outcome.  The only real solution to increasing density  are living wage jobs in West Seattle so people don’t need to leave the peninsula. 

  • CorvidFan January 8, 2025 (1:29 pm)

    I’ve lived in a neighborhood which had Light Rail before (Capitol Hill) , and it was so convenient.   Took me four minutes to get downtown to work!  Before the Capitol Hill Light Rail station was completed it took a minimum of 30 minutes on the bus to get to work.   The Light Rail is FAST, plus it loads more quickly than the bus and typically has trains coming every 10 minutes.  It’s great for getting to Seatac and has plenty of room for luggage. Also, it can accommodate more than two bike riders at a time.  Is the construction phase going to be inconvenient?  Sure, what construction project isn’t.  But in the long run the Light Rail will benefit West Seattle.  

    • Scarlett January 8, 2025 (3:10 pm)

      Great, but you are not everyone else.  Do we spend billions on light rail that will benefit a small percentage of the population, including apparently, you?  This is the whole crux of the argument.  Everything has some assumed benefit for someone but the question is whether that benefit outweighs the cost, whether there is enough benefit for enough people, to use the utilitarian argument.  Is it worth spending billions to shave a few minutes off your commute – and should someone else pay for that? 

  • Maggie Fimia, Co-Chair SmarterTransit.org January 8, 2025 (3:01 pm)

    Transit planning is a science. If increasing transit ridership and reaching more transit dependent folks for the least cost is the goal, continuing to build out light rail (ST3) fails miserably. Questioning spending $1 billion/mile is NOT being anti transit it’s actually pro transit. But don’t take our word for it.According to the Puget Sound Regional Council’s 2050 Transportation Plan*, even with full build out of ST3 (Lynnwood to Tacoma; Federal Way to Tacoma; Bellevue to Issaquah; Ballard to Downtown and West Seattle to SOHO) by 2050 and for $150 BILLION and counting, we will see:1.     Virtually no decrease of Co2 emissions2.     A 54% increase in congestion3.     Only 3% of all trips will be on ST trains4.     Destruction of sensitive areas; neighborhoods, businesses and loss of thousands of treesSound Transit should finish ST2 and improve what has already been built. But currently ST3 is NOT a voter approved project. It is $100 Billion over what voters approved, will not increase ridership or decrease congestion as voters were lead to believe. Where did we get these numbers and why is the agency able to go unchecked? How to we get our elected officials to hold it accountable?Please see smartertransit.org to sign our Petition to the Legislature; see “Promises vs. Reality” to see our data and specific sources from PSRC; and under Learn More see our Contracts Report for why this agency is allowed to take so much money from the region and offer so little in return. Hundreds of companies, corporations, organizations, jurisdictions, construction firms, real estate, developers and PR firms are making millions/billions from these capital intensive projects. smartertransit.org is an all volunteer, mostly transit and transportation professionals, non partisan, pro transit non-profit. Thank you to the West Seattle Blog and the Rethink the Link folks for trying to hold this agency accountable.*PSRC is the federally mandated planning agency for King, Kitsap, Snohomish and Pierce Counties

    • walkerws January 8, 2025 (3:39 pm)

      Maggie, as much as I would like to chuckle at the name of your organization and move on with  my day, I will engage you here with a level of good faith that I do not believe you yourself are bringing. Light rail is not supposed to decrease congestion. It is supposed to provide an alternative to congestion. 

      • Maggie Fimia, Co-Chair SmarterTransit.org January 8, 2025 (4:46 pm)

        Relieving congestion was how ST first sold it to voters. Their graphics from subsequent campaigns did the same.* From their 1996 Sound Move Plan (The Ten Year Regional Transit System Plan): “The problem is traffic congestion…No one likes traffic. It takes a frustrating toll on our time and nerves. But much more sobering and far reaching is the impact congestion has on our jobs, economy and environment. Congestion reduces productivity …” That was 30 years ago. Public policies should always begin by getting agreement on “What is the problem we are trying to solve?” Followed by “Who needs to be at the Table?” “What are the viable alternatives to solving it?” and “How do we measure success?” So now we are told light rail is supposed to provide an alternative to congestion. Where is is the objective analysis to look at all the other ways that could be done? You can’t pack the trains and then just have the buses with no standing passengers and call it even. We would very much like to see it. BRT, enhanced and accessible bus access to all neighborhoods, vanpool, shared ride and all sorts of other potential alternatives. have not been analyzed or considered. They would cost a fraction of ST3 and be in place much sooner. The numbers absolutely do not justify continuing to spend a hundred BILLION dollars and rising, on expanding light rail beyond ST2. *major 2016 campaign piece showed the I-90 bridge with sleek light rail cars running closing together with very few cars on the same bridge. Meanwhile ST spent $40 million on marketing and public relations between 2007 and 2015 leading up to the vote – buying ads in virtually every news outlet.

        • Neighbor January 9, 2025 (1:29 am)

          You’re hurting us Maggie.  Please stop hurting us.

        • walkerws January 9, 2025 (8:15 am)

          Research and understanding of traffic engineering has evolved since 1996. Read a more modern book or something if you’re going to be inserting yourself into a conversation you are not qualified to be part of.

  • Scarlett January 8, 2025 (3:01 pm)

    Lets be honest here, where there is smoke there is usually fire.  Yes, some here are probably NIMBY’s for whom light rail, along with more density, is another incursion into the WS they want to preserve in formaldehyde.  By the same token, there are some here who have been captured by the idea of a train coming to West Seattle, and their rationale isn’t much deeper than that.  I am fond of trains, but when I look around the country, and even here, the promise of light rail hasn’t panned out and it hasn’t been that transformative mode of public transportation.  A segment of the population will use it, sure, but then that begs the question:  Why not simply expand bus transit and accomplish the same thing for a fraction of the cost and displacement?  Show me in the United States  where light rail has been superimposed on any major city and become that transformative mode of transportation, substantially alleviating traffic and pulling substantial numbers numbers of people from their cars?   

    • walkerws January 8, 2025 (3:36 pm)

      Because, as countless users have told you repeatedly on this post and on many previous posts, bus transit does not “accomplish the same thing.” Your argument about whether or not light rail will “alleviate traffic” is also a straw man argument (a type of logical fallacy). Light rail provides an alternative to traffic, not a way to alleviate it. It has been previously suggested that you look up “induced demand.” I will suggest it once more.

      • Scarlett January 9, 2025 (7:34 am)

        No,  I have perfectly clear.  I have said that light rail is an option, but not one that is worth $7 billion for providing little in the way of traffic congestion relief, certainly not anymore than what bus transit can provide.  I think you are more interesting in playing logic l fallacy games than achieving clarity.

        • walkerws January 9, 2025 (10:28 am)

          I think *you* are more interesting in playing logic l fallacy games than achieving clarity.

  • WSBreader January 8, 2025 (4:56 pm)

    I’m excited for light rail! Bring it on!

  • Fitness Dude January 8, 2025 (5:11 pm)

    I’m SO GLAD that we have a new President in two weeks who will cut funding for these government mass transit scams.

    • LoveWS January 9, 2025 (7:00 am)

      We voted for light rail, and we insist that it be built. 

    • Steve January 9, 2025 (8:05 am)

      Washington will be insulated from Trump, fortunately. 

  • Peter January 9, 2025 (9:48 am)

    I want to hear all the people calling for more bus service instead of light rail to stand up and awoke that you support fully grade separated, completely car free, 24/7/365 bus lanes for all bus routes, and the drivers, mechanics, and staff, and the huge number of new buses that would be needed to provide the same speed and capacity as light rail! Let’s hear from you! Comment below with your real name swearing your support for these!

  • Scarlett January 9, 2025 (11:57 am)

    Since light rail will almost be certainly coming to West Seattle, short of a seismic change in opinion, the big mystery is how people can arrive at such vastly different conclusions given the same data. 

    My conclusions are based on what light rail has been able to achieve, and more importantly, what is can’t and won’t be able to in the future.  Certainly the lack of light rail has not impeded development coming to West Seattle currently, and it seems unlikely to do in the future.  Light rail will not significantly reduce the traffic bottleneck on the bridge; it will be a nice transportation option for some clustered around stations, but then we don’t design a transportation, at a $7 billion cost, to benefit a small subset of people.  Jeremy Bentham would be turning over in his grave. 

    I understand the attraction of the light rail concept, but its not tranlating into a real, workable I reality for vast numbers of people.  The idea of multi-sgement trips – bus to the light rail station, another light rail transfer, then perhaps another bus to the doorstep of your destination –  is magical thinking.    (No, your personal anecdote about how light rail has changed your entire life doesn’t constitute a reality for others.) Buses?  They actually canvas a neighborhood more effectively, often with with point to point service, and routes and frequency are easily changed to accomodate demographics, And yes, buses take private vehicles off the road, reducing congestion.  

    Of course, if voters feel its still worth it, including the human cost to others, so be it.  But in the end it will be a very costly option with limited impact.  If and when it is completed, lets pray and hope that every single train is packed with riders, given the cost, though I’m not holding my breath.  

    • CARGUY January 9, 2025 (12:58 pm)

      I’m excited! With all of the development continuing to happen, having this infrastructure will be great benefit for the future of our neighborhood.

  • Bus Rider January 9, 2025 (12:09 pm)

    The statement … “the  Rethink the Link group, which wants to see West Seattle light rail canceled” is not really  accurate.  Rethink the Link is pro transit, and our members use light rail.  Light rail might not be the best solution for West Seattle, however.  The forum on the 25th is to discuss “ridership facts, impacts and acutual costs”.  

    • walkerws January 10, 2025 (9:02 am)

      This is disingenuous. Rethink the Link is an anti-transit group full stop.

  • Roxi January 9, 2025 (1:25 pm)

    I have lived in Seattle my whole life. We don’t need or want light rail coming to our town. It has bus routes that take you everywhere you need to go. The cost of this is unbelievable . People are going to lose their business and homes.  For a train we don’t need. If you could have built it when it was approved , but the cost is not worth it. Where is the common sense. You can’t keep taxes the people. You will end up with more people in trouble. 

  • Jay January 9, 2025 (1:56 pm)

    The fundamental issue here is that a small minority of West Seattle residents don’t respect democracy or the rights of others and want to impose their personal ideology on the rest of us through force and manipulation.

    • Scarlett January 12, 2025 (6:41 pm)

      I abide by the majority’s decision but a “do-over” is a part of democracy, too.  It’s the reason we have courts, referendums, and even  impeachment to remove presidents.   Because something is arrived at by democratic process is in itself meaningless    

      • k January 12, 2025 (8:02 pm)

        Courts are there to adjudicate whether the law has been followed, not to just overturn things for funsies.  Referendums and Impeachment still require legal grounds and processes to initiate a vote, because reversing the will of the people is not done lightly.  These anti-light rail groups haven’t accomplished anything within the existing legal framework to get a “do-over” because they have no legal grounds, only opinions and a fancy website with exaggerated (if not outright made-up) “facts”.  The democratic process if far from meaningless.  On the other hand, a challenge to a democratic vote without legal grounds is exactly that.

  • Ryan January 12, 2025 (5:33 pm)

    I have lived in West Seattle my whole life. We want and need light rail coming into town! Bring us the light rail we have asked for, and quickly please! 

    • Thomas January 14, 2025 (11:23 am)

      why do we have to spend billions of dollars on light rail when we can have electric buses doing the same job cost highly anything compared what the mass destruction of light rail does.. number one it does not get into neighborhoods stays on main roads you still need buses to get to the light rail question why spend billions of dollars in misplaced so many businesses in houses for a few people

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