HARBOR RVs: City plans ‘geoclean’

Harbor Avenue SW has seen a fluctuating number of RVs in recent years, from a few to more than a dozen. Lately, it’s been the latter; the lineup grew about the same time as the Andover/26th sweep (we noted 9 on Harbor before that and counted a dozen RVs/trailers yesterday between the 3000 block and the Bronson street-end). The area drew another round of complaints when one RV burned last weekend, and questions about whether Harbor too would be swept. After several reader emails, we asked the city this week about plans for the area and just received this response from Seattle Public Utilities spokesperson Sabrina Register:

With a focus on addressing public health and safety, Seattle Public Utilities (SPU) performs multiple RV Remediations monthly in different areas of the City. We do site assessments where there are five or more RVs in one location. The assessments help the City determine which areas should be prioritized for cleanup.

At least three days prior to the remediation, temporary “no parking” signs are placed at the location, letting the public know about parking restrictions for a particular time period. Staff follow up with direct outreach to RV occupants starting 72 hours prior to a remediation.

Harbor Avenue SW is scheduled for an intense, one-day clean (called geographic or geoclean) next week.

Whether that means the RVs will have to be moved remains to be seen – we’re checking with SDOT about the parking-enforcement aspect of this. Past “geocleans” at various West Seattle sites have just been cleanups. We asked about the burned-out RV shell remaining from last Sunday’s fire (which SFD said did not result in any injuries); Register said it was being prepped to be “safely towed” (if that hasn’t happened already).

We also asked about the 16th/Graham vicinity, which has seen more than five RVs recently; Register said, “SPU’s upcoming site assessments will include 16th SW near SW Graham to determine if it meets the criteria for an upcoming RV Remediation.”

Chris July 8, 2022 (11:34 am)

The recent increase in RVs must be from Andover and its so irresponsible of the city to allow them to just move to a much more public space that is dangerous for the RVs and anyone driving by there. Plus these RVs are not hesitating to take over the space and spread their stuff out to the green spaces and the bike/walking trail. They take over an area and the city let’s them do it. Now more people are camping in the green space above Harbor Ave. There is a very large camp growing at the bottom of Fairmount in front of Saltys. I’ve seen cars dropping off lumber and metal for construction. It’s just ridiculous how quickly people know where to go for parking and camping. The Rvs and camps grow bigger in months, then it takes the city years to do anything about it. It’s all so unnecessary if the city would just enforce rules and laws that they do on the rest of us. It ruins the neighborhood for everyone.

Eric1 July 8, 2022 (12:53 pm)

Chris. It is Friday for Pete’s sake! Can you please stop making sense? My brain hurts when people use logic regarding the City government. Can you please use feelings and emotions so my brain goes into a stupor and everything is butterflies and unicorns for the weekend. Thank you.
- Does Science matter anymore? July 8, 2022 (4:48 pm)
  
  It actually isn’t necessarily logical to expect the exact same thing from two different things/people in different conditions/circumstances, just because we want this. Faulty logic makes my head hurt. Math teacher, you out there?
Derek July 8, 2022 (1:44 pm)

Stop criminalizing RVs and give them a place to park for free. Stop criminalizing being poor. You shouldn’t have to have money to exist in the world.
- Rhonda July 8, 2022 (3:34 pm)
  
  Stop excusing illegal behavior and law-breaking. Everyone in every modern society needs money to exist in this world. Some of those illegal RV dwellers have nicer cars than many West Seattle home owners.
- Question Authority July 8, 2022 (3:37 pm)
  
  That’s referred to as a RV park where there are utilities and a way to dump your waste, the money spent on bad habits can be spent paying to live there instead so you get ahead in life.
- momosmom July 8, 2022 (3:48 pm)
  
  Well Derek I don’t know what world you’re talking about but this big blue ball needs money to make the world go round and round!
  - Does Science matter anymore? July 8, 2022 (4:46 pm)
    
    The earth does not actually require money to rotate on it’s axis. Astronomy teacher, you out there?
    - Jethro Marx July 8, 2022 (7:22 pm)
      
      I’m not an astronomer, but all scientists, engineers, and particularists about language share your pain in this bizarrely human-centric claim. Science rules the motion of the earth but cannot speak tikTok.
- lucy July 8, 2022 (3:55 pm)
  
  Stop believing that it’s progressive and compassionate to allow people to live in filth and squalor on the streets.
- Frustrated July 8, 2022 (4:24 pm)
  
  You can keep your little corner of the world clean and drug-free without having money. You can choose to not scream at random passers-by without having money. Stop excusing bad behavior on a lack of money.
- Thomas Wood July 8, 2022 (4:32 pm)
  
  Derek all you ever say is that the poor are being picked on .Do you have any evidence to support your position?
  - CAM July 8, 2022 (7:10 pm)
    
    Are the comments on this blog referring to them with adjectives that would suggest they are not human beings not sufficient evidence of that?
- Clark July 8, 2022 (9:04 pm)
  
  Acts against the law and criminals are what is criminal. This is the phrase always used to justify not holding the people taking over streets, sidewalks and neighborhoods to the detriment of people who are living there trying to have a safe clean environment for their families and neighbors. The phrase used to get rid of any accountability for the people taking over the streets or the city government (don’t blame the Police). Let’s see how you feel when there is human feces in front of your house.
- Robert July 9, 2022 (12:49 pm)
  
  I have an Idea. Everyone just drive down to Baja California. Lotsbof sunshine and sandy beaches. Good fishing. Don’t need much money to live.

Craig July 8, 2022 (12:10 pm)

Good to hear there’s action happening. As a daily walker and bike to work commuter on that stretch, it’s hard not to notice the trash piles and junk stacks growing from the RVs and creeping across the public right of way and to the bike/walk path each day a little more. It’s full on trash and waste, not spill over of someone’s household goods.

Rose July 8, 2022 (12:32 pm)

This is always so heartbreaking and frustrating. I care deeply about the safety net, I want people to be safe, healthy and happy. I believe we have a responsibility to take care of those less fortunate.Yet the encampments make me feel unsafe. If this was a refugee camp in Africa we would not stand for it. Yet here we are okay with it.It makes me sad that I feel this way about these encampments and I do want people to live with dignity. I don’t believe these RV encampments provide any dignity.

CAM July 8, 2022 (7:29 pm)

I don’t think that anyone is okay with it but I do think that people aren’t ready to deal with it in a way that actually resolved the problem. On one side people want to 1) make the problem go somewhere else, 2) make the problem illegal and put people in jail, 3) take away people’s civil liberties to solve the problem.

None of those things are actually viable solutions for a long term resolution to the problem. 1) Where will people go? The next place they go will simply tell them to move on as well. 2) There are simply not enough jail or prison beds in the entire world to imprison the entire homeless community out of being homeless. Then you have to release them at some point and guess what? They don’t have homes to go to and are again going to be forming camps and living in vehicles on the streets. 3) You can’t force someone into a camp against their will or into housing against their will unless you can prove that they are legally incompetent to make those decisions as a result of mental illness or cognitive disability. Neither homelessness nor drug use on their own results in either of those kinds of incapacity.

The other side (ostensibly the side people would call the bleeding hearts) want to 1) prevent the above types of actions from happening because they see them as detrimental to the individual, 2) provide housing, 3) provide social services, etc. Unfortunately, nobody among the “bleeding hearts” (not my favorite term) that has any kind of power over the system is willing to provide a true picture or analysis of what it will actually take to make those things happen.

The things preventing those things from happening? 1) Bandaid programs that run on temporary funding that show short term gains but then don’t get their funding renewed, 2) Gaps in the service network that allow for individuals to fall through the cracks in one area which leads to problems in other areas that eventually snowball and lead to a crisis level situation, 3) Barriers to receiving services that make it difficult to access or maintain services despite what we know about the recovery model for substance disorders and mental illness and the reality that people will have relapses and require continued support, 4) Frequent changes in government structure or control that lead to changes in theory and emphasis and understanding of the issue, 5) Inability to tell people that the beginning is going to look worse than the end. So there’s my thesis statement on why this problem will continue no matter how much people yell or vote for different people or how many sweeps are done or how many people are arrested, etc. Because nobody wants to do what needs to be done and the system is built to punish people that are honest about it.
- Alki guy July 10, 2022 (12:49 pm)
  
  Thanks for the thoughtful response. I appreciate how you lay out both sides.I personally want these folks to find a means of living within a range I personally find tolerable: a permanent home off of public lands for those able and willing. One potential option:Those who are unable (mental illness) either find their family and put them in their care or, if no family, gov’t fiscally responsible supported care. Fiscally responsible meaning not a gov’t purchased hotel in Seattle-area… send them to lower cost of living area. Without mental awareness, family I see no reason this impacts that individual materially.For those who are able but unwilling to work, put them in forced savings program in which gov’t saves wages on their behalf while they are forced to maintain jobs. Their wages will first go to to pay for their own costs of gov’t support (housing, food), the remainder is saved on their behalf. Once they save enough for private housing they can leave. Any illegal activity (drugs, theft) and they are jailed and are forced to do same work, but no wages or accrued saving.

K July 8, 2022 (12:55 pm)

What a joke. How much money are we spending shuffling RVs all over the city that could be spent on increasing housing? The city can brand their actions any way they want, but at the end of the day it’s not solving anything but wasting taxpayer money.

paul July 8, 2022 (1:00 pm)

Its highly frustrating what the city government has allowed to happen to the city. They claim they are “working” on it, but we as citizens do not see much action. Meanwhile camps build quickly overnight, causing harm to the ecology, neighborhood, and general feeling of safety by businesses or homeowners.

Fred July 8, 2022 (3:39 pm)

Remember, we voted these people in.. We are partly responsible for the situation. We need to figure out how to take action as citizens and not just complain on a blog.

don July 8, 2022 (1:01 pm)

Did anyone see the fire there this morning at about 5 or 515? i saw the fire engine driving to it as i rode my bicycle to work. This is a safety hazard. the stuff they have there and the risk for fire or injury seems just too great.

WSB July 8, 2022 (3:03 pm)

Whatever it was, it wasn’t much of a fire, as the incident log shows one engine was on scene for 9 minutes total.
- 935 July 8, 2022 (7:48 pm)
  
  Oh. Only 9 minutes? Then it’s ok. whew.
  
  /s

anonyme July 8, 2022 (1:14 pm)

What happened to the 72-hour parking rule that supposedly was going to be ENFORCED? Instead, the problem is allowed to grow and fester, causing widespread damage that then involves very costly remediation. How much does the ‘geoclean’ cost?

Derek July 8, 2022 (7:36 pm)

When the punishment for something is a fine, then it’s only a punishment for the lower class. Crime is not punished equally. Or Trump and Bezos and more rich people would be in jail.
- Question Authority July 8, 2022 (8:09 pm)
  
  Here’s a thought, don’t violate parking rules and you won’t be burdened by a monetary citation. There has to be accountability for one’s personal choices or the scales of justice don’t balance out.
  - Harbor Res July 11, 2022 (1:22 pm)
    
    Do you make sure they ticket every single car that is parked and hasn’t moved in 72 hours? There are cars on my block that haven’t moved in the whole time I’ve lived here and they don’t get tickets. It sounds more like people only want the 72 hour rule enforced when it would punish a houseless person. They don’t enforce it for many parked cars and no one is raging about that.
- anonyme July 9, 2022 (6:17 am)
  
  Yes Derek, but what does that have to do with my comment? Fines are an unjust punishment unless based on income. That doesn’t mean that RV’s should not be towed if they break the law.
- Pessoa July 9, 2022 (12:52 pm)
  
  Of course that would have to include the middle-class enablers of Bezo’s whose portfolio’s might contain Amazon stock. Amazon and other large corporations are publically owned and that indignant progressive waxing indignant about “rich” people is as likely to own Amazon, or other corporate stock, as a conservative. When it comes to the rubber hitting the road – in other words, money – there isn’t much difference between a conservative or progressive sitting across the table of a financial planner, not in any substantive way.

Auntie July 8, 2022 (1:14 pm)

Even after a fatal shooting and a fire, the city has still not cleared out the encampment at 26th & Juneau. And I’m sure if the neighbors close by tried to do it, they would be told they could not. Taxpayers have fewer rights than squatters now. We’re all pretty much sick of it.

Alki Jack July 8, 2022 (1:18 pm)

This is the entrance that most people coming to West Seattle and Alki Beach see. Plus many citizens love this area to bike, run, walk, hike, push their children in strollers etc. They are spreading their stuff everywhere. Wood Pallets, stolen bicycles, garbage, debris, huge event tents, old couches and chairs, generators etc all sorts of junk. This area is normally a beautiful recreational area. They just moved from the somewhat industrial area near the steel mill to the entrance to Alki. The area now looks just disgusting!

shed22 July 8, 2022 (1:23 pm)

Why don’t they make harbor avenue restricted (permit only) parking overnight?

Audifans July 8, 2022 (1:33 pm)

How do you say ‘shell game’. Musical chairs. I get a ticket for parking, and they get ‘look the other way’

StupidinSeattle July 8, 2022 (1:42 pm)

Agree with Chris. This is a broken windows issue. The city has to continuously pursue and motivate RV owners to move and not tolerate parking or camping in public spaces in violation of city ordinances. The encampments are clearly safety and sanitation issues that cannot be allowed to exist and grow larger.

skeeter July 8, 2022 (1:46 pm)

Even if we ignore the human misery, all these sweeps and cleanups are costly. Wouldn’t it be a more efficient use of tax dollars to establish a big huge safe parking site somewhere that people can just live in their RVs for months or years at a time? Have any other West Coast cities tried some kind of approach like this?

My two cents July 8, 2022 (5:36 pm)

You still need people to go there on their own and that has been a challenge.
WS Guy July 8, 2022 (8:56 pm)

They did just vote to fund an RV lot for 50 vehicles at $1.9 million. It includes security, sanitation, and recovery services. The math works out to about $40,000 per parking space. I’m not sure how much you earn, but that is as if all of my annual pay went to handle ONE RV. Of course I take care of myself and don’t make a mess so I have to pay my own way. The “compassionate housing” crowd has very expensive tastes. I don’t see how this is supposed to scale up to anyone who pulls into town with an RV.

I’m not sure how much of that LIHI is taking for itself, but its senior employees pay has been increasing annually according to their 990 filings so good for them.

bill July 8, 2022 (2:03 pm)

I went past this group of RVs today. One of them has surrounded a plot on the parking strip with chain link fence and erected a pavilion tent!

Alki Jack July 8, 2022 (3:51 pm)

Yes I saw the chainlink fence, if that isn’t a in your face to the City of Seattle what is. Better yet what’s next!
Does Science matter? July 8, 2022 (4:56 pm)

Your comment made me laugh… ‘erected a pavillion tent!’

That is odd.

Is it possible the city has set this up for upcoming remediation? Maybe it looks obviously homemade, haven’t seen it myself, and just wondering.
- bill July 8, 2022 (9:17 pm)
  
  Science — The tent is clearly associated with the private fenced parking strip.
  - Science July 9, 2022 (7:01 am)
    
    Interesting, thanks. Wonder what the intent is. Trying to increase safety/protection? To create a temporary sense of place, of ‘home?’ Wanting to stay somewhere for awhile, tired of being uprooted? Or? Not that it’s okay or should remain there, but wondering.
    - Harbor July 11, 2022 (11:33 am)
      
      I have seen the one they are referring to. I think it’s just to have more personal, enclosed space. It leads directly into their RV. There is a chainlink fence that I saw was to contain a dog. These seem new to the regulars I have seen there for a while. One person I know trims the grass and rakes the leaves in their immediate area. I suspect the intent is like you say, a sense of place.

Mr J July 8, 2022 (2:28 pm)

I love the enforce rules comments. Are people really living in a vacuum? Just say you don’t care and you don’t want to see it. Be honest. Let’s also be honest on how we got here as a Country, State, County and City – we prioritize property over people and fail to build enough housing and we prioritize our own wealth (I.E. taxes) regardless of the cost on the community. We’ve been electing politicians to cut our taxes to save us dimes while the rich and corporation rack in billions. Do you actually want change? Write your elected leaders. Tell them you want progressive taxes in this state so we can pay for more affordable housing, health services, child care, infrastructure etc etc. Or you can run for office. If you want things to stay the same keep voting for the Bruce Harrell’s and Sara Nelson’s of the world and we’ll stay right where we’re at – they’ll just sweep people more often so maybe we won’t notice encampments as much.

Um, No! July 8, 2022 (3:33 pm)

@ Mr J – LOL, so let’s keep doing what we’ve been doing for the last decade or more because it’s been soooooo successful. Who do you think got is in this situation to begin with? It sure as hell wasn’t Sarah Nelson. I’ll be happy to pay more taxes if those taxes are “guaranteed” to go to health and mental services, child care, employment services and the like instead of funds being diverted to other projects and causes. But you know and I know, that will never happen. And why is that? And who has been in charge of that money over the last decade? Hmmmmm? What’s the definition of Insanity?
- Mr J July 8, 2022 (5:22 pm)
  
  LOL!!! You’re hilarious. I’m guessing you’re referring “democrats” when you say people in charge. I specifically didn’t mention political parties because both the big ones are guilty of perpetuating this. When people comment “enforce the law” it’s ridiculous and if people can’t see that criminalizing poverty and sweeping our houseless community is not only inhumane but a waste of resources than I think we’ll be stuck right where we’ve been forever.If you’re willing to pay a little more than we can agree that this problem needs more money and it also needs more community involvement. I’m sure you an I agree on a lot.
Genessee5Points July 8, 2022 (4:11 pm)

Mr. J, I’m honest, I don’t care AND I don’t want to see it. I would like laws enforced, more police and more sweeps until all the camps are gone.
- Mr J July 8, 2022 (5:22 pm)
  
  BRAVE! The Oscar should go to you.
- Derek July 8, 2022 (11:03 pm)
  
  The worst form of NIMBY: the ones who want all the poor locked up. Little do they know, the middle class now become the targets and the new lower class. Never ending cycle due to this economic system.
My two cents July 8, 2022 (5:41 pm)

Mr. J – where to start? First off, please tell me the last time the Council and Mayor cut taxes in this city? Not a rant against the concept of taxes and such, just pointing out that more dollars are being paid by the community over time. No one is advocating a paupers prison, but people and the community want to feel safe, want to feel as if elected officials are acting on issues.
- Mr J July 8, 2022 (6:20 pm)
  
  The revenue problem begins at the State. We need less regressive taxes (sales tax and property) and more progressive tax structures like an income tax, corporate taxes and no more handouts to big businesses. Right now the city leaders cannot do that because it’s illegal in the State so they’re forced to get creative with revenue solutions. I want people to feel safe. But I also want people to realize our leaders have been letting us down for decades and we shouldn’t be taking out our frustrations on our houseless neighbors.
  - Wseattleite July 8, 2022 (11:10 pm)
    
    You have got to be kidding me. Seattle and the State of Washington DO NOT have a revenue problem. They have a spending problem, and can’t seem to manage anything effectively.
- Science July 9, 2022 (7:11 am)
  
  ‘No one is advocating a paupers prison’
  
  Actually, there have been comments in recent threads suggesting essentially forcing houseless folks into places like prisons and camps and hospitals and requiring compliance with whatever is forced upon them. So…
Jeff C. July 8, 2022 (6:35 pm)

You’re the one living in a vacuum. Your elected officials are the exact reason this happened. Ed Murray? Jenny Durkan? Jay Inslee? More progressive tax? What… like the soda tax? Jfc… Get real. Seattle and WA have some of the Nation’s most progressive taxes. It’s not a matter of taxing people more, it’s about the piss poor allocating of funds. It’s about the unbelievably stupid zoning laws. It’s about woke nonsense like defunding the police that has allowed lawlessness to run rampant in Seattle and surrounding areas.Btw… No one is electing liberal democrats to lower taxes! lol “Write your elected leaders!” Why? To remind them to do what we elected them to do?! Why is it that all the progressive cities are turning into absolute sh-t holes? Seattle is easily one of the top 5 most progressive cities in the country, yet looks like a third-world country in certain areas… yet instead of building affordable/ public housing… they continue to construct luxury high-rise condos that only someone with a six-figure salary can afford. Who is allowing this to happen? Umm… maybe the people everyone in Seattle continues to elect? The same people who defunded the police! The same people that allowed CHOP to happen.The homeless issue is a f–king crisis and should be treated as such. These people are basically refugees because they have been priced out of any sort of affordable housing and overlooked in society. The overwhelming majority have severe mental health/ addiction issues. They need to start building designated parking areas for RV’s. Tiny homes for those without RV’s. All with toilets, showers, clean running water, weekly trash disposal, and access to all social services. Continue building affordable housing units and public housing/shelters tenfold. The goal should be transitioning people into real housing by getting them clean and back to work and contributing as functioning members of society.We need to focus on rehabilitation. It isn’t mercy or compassion allowing people to live in their own filth. It’s enabling. Anyone with severe addiction is suffering worse than you could ever imagine and basically has a death wish with how potent fentanyl is. Sprinkle in some meth and they become completely deranged and detached from reality. At least Bruce Harrell is trying to fix things, and clean up the sh-t storm that pedophile Ed Murray and imbecile Jenny Durken left for him. You’re really going to blame Bruce for this? I’m sorry but sweeps are a necessary evil, the moratorium was lifted a long time ago. At least it gives the city a chance to go and sanitize the area. Dispose of the trash. Reduce the ecological impact from the runoff of feces/ urine. Durkan was sweeping even during the height of the pandemic… which I agree was f–ked. Most politicians are wolves in sheep’s clothing. Durkan was ruthless when prosecuting people during the MayDay riots in 2012, or what about her legislation regarding medical marijuana in 2011? Yet CHOP was just a summer another of Love. Gtfoh…
- Um, No! July 8, 2022 (9:07 pm)
  
  @ Jeff C – Everything you said is dead on 100% accurate! Nicely and bluntly said. People need to keep hearing this.
- bill July 8, 2022 (9:35 pm)
  
  Jeff C. — “Defund the police” is a really bad slogan but in fact the police in Seattle have _not_ been defunded. Police behavior brought calumny down on them and many who could not handle it have left. I think getting rid of officers who think a badge is a license for thuggery is a good thing. The city has money available for hiring. Funding is not the problem.
- Mr J July 8, 2022 (10:02 pm)
  
  That’s not really at all what I’m saying, it seems like you’re having a moment though. Are you ok?
- 1994 July 8, 2022 (11:10 pm)
  
  “The overwhelming majority have severe mental health/ addiction issues. They need to start building designated parking areas for RV’s. Tiny homes for those without RV’s. All with toilets, showers, clean running water, weekly trash disposal, and access to all social services. “We had that years ago – called congregate care for those unable to care for themselves. But the federal gov stopped funding this and left it up to each state to fund….that is when the congregate care went away and civil liberties took over. A person’s civil liberties, their ability to make choices, became more important than actually taking care of the person.
- Scubafrog July 8, 2022 (11:12 pm)
  
  What’s Harrell doing? The SPD has no new officers, and he’s shuffling the homeless around like a card hustle. The only thing this mayor’s done is ‘clean up’ City Hall, so that his feet don’t get dirty on the way to work. Sawant politically-survived recall, Mosqueda was reelected, and Herbold has a great chance, too. Seattle chose this by proxy of their far left politicians. Mayor Harrell’s earning his place next to Murray and Durkan. As the SPD struggles to stay afloat, and the city wallows in high crime, graffiti, violence and shootings, many ask “where is Mayor Harrell, what happened to his no-crime promise, and promises to restore the SPD?”…. He appears to only have 1 cheerleader left. Maybe 2.
  - anonyme July 9, 2022 (6:23 am)
    
    I’m not sure what can be done when the only candidates running are ALL poor choices. This goes for judges as well, who usually run unopposed.
935 July 8, 2022 (8:04 pm)

Follow the money. a billion dollars (+) over 10 (+) years….

Like the medical industry – no one gets rich off of “cures”.

Perpetuate the problem – cash the checks, raise the taxes. Apathetic Seattle Voter will continue to fill the trough – because “poor downtrodden neighbors“. At some point, enough is enough. But maybe not for you Mr J (and Derek) keep uploading your tax dollars to a wood chipper.
- Mr J July 8, 2022 (10:08 pm)
  
  Yikes. Ok. You’re arguing some of my own points back – I agree that we’re wasting money. But we’ve also (as a city/state/nation) cut funding to vital lifelines for people and sending them into the situations we see around the city (not all though). Can you at least see that?
  - 935 July 9, 2022 (3:22 am)
    
    So, you agree with me that we’ve overfunded (irresponsibly) the homeless “cure”. But you then say we have “cut funding to vital lifelines”
    
    So we have (by your logic) Overfunded by….cutting funds? Those are pretty spectacular gymnastics.
    
    Do people sometimes need a hand out? yup. Look at all the social programs available Welfare, unemployment, EBT and WIC. You can see examples everywhere. But grift in the homeless “problem” is disgusting both by the user and the used.
    
    Taxpayers need to start to recognize- the govt needs a wedge to separate you from your money. In Seattle-they have a BIG one vis a vis “homeless problem”
    
    Follow the money. Bureaucrats are getting rich off of our hard earned money.

Lance July 8, 2022 (2:34 pm)

Well I’ll be, it’s almost like the Andover sweep just… pushed them somewhere else! How ’bout that.

snowskier July 8, 2022 (2:46 pm)

Come on city. You need to get on this right away. 72 hours then tow or go. As for construction in the park off of Fairmount, no time should be needed to clean people out of a greenbelt. Bring the garbage truck and start disassembling right away. It’s time for stern enforcement of the rules, this is a place for all of us to enjoy, not for squatters to defame. Sooner or later, these folks will get the clue that taking over the parks isn’t allowed. Let’s help them rise up the learning curve.

Genessee5Points July 8, 2022 (4:12 pm)

Mr. J …. Another honest person ^^^
- Mr J July 8, 2022 (6:28 pm)
  
  The bravery! Medals all around for outspoken hero’s against poors!
  - snowskier July 9, 2022 (9:23 am)
    
    I watched a video I took 5 years ago of my son learning to ride his bike at this exact spot on Alki. There were 3 RVs in it but you know what wasn’t, piles or garbage, trash and criminal waste. Those folks knew how to exist without ruining an area while they figured out their lives. As for the current situation, it’s criminal and disgusting. Things have changed. I’m not against the poor, I’m against the criminals and anarchists that just ruin everything around them and won’t accept and help to change or live in a civil manner.

T Rex July 8, 2022 (3:42 pm)

Anyone want to guess how many meetings and studies it took to name this procedure? Good Lord. GEOCLEAN, like they are actually doing something good for the environment that was legit besides moving homeless people from where they are not SUPPOSED TO BE. Gotta love Seattle, so politically flipping correct.

RW July 8, 2022 (3:54 pm)

If these people can’t afford to rent in Seattle, live somewhere you can afford to rent a place.These RV’s should be towed and destroyed so they can’t be used again for this madness.

Mr J July 8, 2022 (6:30 pm)

You should really say this comment to at least 10 people you know. If they all agree you’re in a cult. The hatred of poverty on this thread is sad. Ya’ll need therapy.

Mj July 8, 2022 (4:25 pm)

Strictly enforce the parking rules. Enough already, as a bike rider RV’s encroaching into shared bike/street lane is a significant safety issue especially in sections with a raised median island.

C July 8, 2022 (4:57 pm)

Campers have been relocating or establishing near SSC along 16th Ave SW as well.

WSB July 8, 2022 (5:51 pm)

As acknowledged toward the end of the story above. (16th/Graham)

wetone July 8, 2022 (5:01 pm)

I was thinking of going camping this weekend but no sites available with good views and near water. Maybe I’ll just drive RV down to Alki and park south side of point as it’s a nice view by the water and save me money on gas……Oh don’t worry I’ll even leave area like I found it;)

Chris Duncan July 8, 2022 (8:16 pm)

Great idea! Park over at the Safe Street by Alki Lighthouse where there is plenty of room and great views. For some reason that area is being protected from RVs because it’s a Safe Street, but they let the actual trail and green space intended for safe outdoor activity be taken over by RVs and camps.
Neighbor July 9, 2022 (7:01 am)

Just scoop your poop, unfortunately pee is harder to contain
Science July 9, 2022 (7:20 am)

Go ahead, and while parked there, maybe imagine if you didn’t have a home to return to, or anywhere else to go, after the weekend…
Harbor Res July 11, 2022 (1:06 pm)

@Wetone, people literally already do that and camp on fire roads. That’s not some wild idea.

Wes Sea July 8, 2022 (6:29 pm)

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/14/headway/houston-homeless-people.html
Some large cities have had success.

Unpopular Truth July 8, 2022 (6:30 pm)

“If you build it they will come.” In droves. And RVs. As a longtime volunteer assisting homeless folks and animals, I am battling extreme compassion fatigue, and I am not alone in grieving that Seattle has become a garbage dump.

Reasonable Person July 8, 2022 (7:05 pm)

Anyone who wants a job in this economy can get a job. Just look around there is help wanted signs everywhere. If a person need some help, need some clothes, need some guidance, to help them interview and get the job, all of those resources are available. From what I have observed, most people who are chronically homeless are not seeking employment. They have drug, alcohol, or mental health, or all of the above problems. It is not compassionate to let them live the way they’re living. It’s time for tough love. Enforce the laws, offer help, but no more excuses and let’s reclaim our city back that’s turned into a dumpster fire. If they’re not willing to try to get their life together despite repeated outreaches and offers of help, that doesn’t mean we should let them live on the streets turning every public space into a garbage dump.

K July 8, 2022 (9:32 pm)

Most of the homeless have jobs. What they need is housing. HOUSING. The thing we really do not have anywhere near enough of and everyone whines and moans when we try to build more. The jobs aren’t the problem, it’s the housing.
- Auntie July 8, 2022 (9:48 pm)
  
  And am I the only one who has noticed that developers NEVER choose to include affordable housing in their developments – they choose to pay a fee for the affordable housing to be “somewhere else?” How about if every developer had to include affordable housing and did not have the option to buy their way out of that? Oh, horrors! The landlords would have to rent to middle-to-low income people, instead of upper income, raking in the dough.
  - anonyme July 9, 2022 (6:30 am)
    
    Auntie, you’re right. I’ve also never seen an accounting of exactly where those fees end up. The income from fees should be strictly controlled and directed, although I doubt that happens. But I like your idea of making inclusion mandatory in every development, as that would mean that housing would not be completely income exclusionary.
- sna July 9, 2022 (3:37 pm)
  
  Most homeless do not have jobs. Each year the point in time count asks about employment status and it’s fairly consistent that about 80% are unemployed with only 6% employed full time. ;
  - trauma awareness July 11, 2022 (9:28 pm)
    
    People in poverty and especially those experiencing homelessness are experiencing a high level of difficulty, discomfort, and stress in their daily circumstances, as well as instability of place in the world and inadequate resources to care for themselves in the same way as those with better circumstances can.
    
    Though there are some who manage to maintain work while homeless, it can be very difficult to work under this level of life difficulty, or even immediately after some improved circumstances, due to trauma.
    
    People who can appear able physically, might be suffering from trauma. Trauma is not the same as mental illness or incapacity. It is a human condition which can result from difficult and harmful experiences and circumstances in life, and can be challenging, but can be healed with things like compassion and care and improved circumstances.
    
    Many people will experience some trauma in life, we all have experienced some in the past couple of years, and some will experience more trauma in life than others.
    
    The world is in great need of trauma education and healing, along with more affordable housing, and improved systems to help people in need.

MM July 8, 2022 (7:26 pm)

Remove all these RV encampments! Get rid of this toxic situation so we can get our nice Emerald City back and fully enjoy it like we once used to.

Jim P. July 8, 2022 (7:46 pm)

If these groups made even basic efforts to live like good neighbors and keep their area clean, not accumulate garbage and debris like an episode of “hoarders” and in general act like they wish to be part of society, the issue would be far less of a problem and they would be a lot more welcome.

They are here and they remain because this is where the free stuff is. If you have mo job, no prospects of one because you are not even looking and little to no family, why live in such an outrageously expensive town?

Mr J July 8, 2022 (10:13 pm)

These groups? You mean our under-housed neighbors? Why “other” them? Human beings is what they are. Do the work Jim P, a lot of “these groups” work and pay taxes. Why should they move? That sentiment is entitled. Be better.
- New Salt July 9, 2022 (1:08 am)
  
  There is nothing more entitled than attempting to occupy public spaces to the detriment of everyone else without any legal right or permission of the preexisting communities. They are “other” because they have chosen to occupy space in these areas illegally. It doesn’t matter if they pay taxes or not. Laws are the heart of our social contract. There are thousands of places you could park an RV in this country for months without anybody hardly even noticing. There are thousands of places you could find a job with a lower cost of living than Seattle. Squatting in one of the most expensive cities in the country is 100% a choice. And I’d be delusional if I believed more than half of the “campers”, RV or otherwise, in this city were capable of consistently making sober work/life choices that were in their best interest. The answer to inadequate services should never be tolerance of illegal and antisocial activity. It should be making illegal options more difficult, and legal options easier and more appealing. Do you think parking RVs on public streets in front of people’s houses and businesses for months or years at a time should be legal? Good luck convincing the rest of your neighbors.

JayPeterman July 8, 2022 (8:57 pm)

I’m just here for the comments

Science July 9, 2022 (8:22 am)

Here’s a vision. Maybe fill your cup of coffee first. What about something like this. Imagine, multiple apartment communities/facilities built in all the neighborhoods around Seattle. A team of people who do outreach for those living without housing. There is an assessment of level of need and complexity of issues. These folks are then offered to be housed at one of these communities, that best fits their need at the time. That way folks who are dealing with similar issues, have a sense of community, and can have the best supports too. Some communities could have increased security for domestic or gang violence or other safety concerns. Others could be for those with drug addictions needing treatment. Others for those needing more mental illness help or other health care. And others for folks more simply needing housing and help reintegrating into work. There could be an initial period of focus on helping the person recover and increase wellness and resources. Then a focus on helping them secure employment or identifying other resources such as disability, if needed. There could even be an integrated optional employment program that does work for the city or government, such as trash clean up, food service for this program, supply manufacturing for the military, etc. Some trade education options, bike or auto mechanic internships, for example. Of course people could pursue outside employment too. After maintaining housing, and work for a period, then a focus on helping them move back into their own independent housing. Initially there may be a wait list, but with a goal of working towards enough housing and resources that eventually there would not be a wait list, we could approach people immediately with, ‘we’ve got a place for you.’ Native people, local citizens, minorities, folks with children, etc, could be prioritized. A key aspect to this would be a compassionate, voluntary, helping people approach. Not about punishing or forcing. Dignified, respectful, help. Because, that is the right way to care for people, and also strategically, logically a good approach for long term success.

Cozy July 9, 2022 (10:05 am)

The homeless are some of the most broken hearted among us.

Please be kind, and stop hurting people who are already hurting and grieving.

James July 9, 2022 (9:10 pm)

I agree and I’m ashamed of my neighbors and the hatred spewed here

Chris July 9, 2022 (10:21 am)

The total silence of our representative, Lisa Herbold, is striking. She always seems to take the side of letting this stuff go unchecked as long as possible. I have no idea why she cares so little how this impacts all of us. Defund and do nothing but allow our great neighborhood to be taken over by people disobeying rules and laws that create a civil society. Our streets and parks are waiting rooms for something that may never be available, and city leaders appear to be proud of that fact.

Niko July 9, 2022 (3:39 pm)

Yet she made an appearance at the Highland Park Improvement Club fundraiser

Runner July 9, 2022 (2:15 pm)

Here is the simple answer. Enforce no RV parking on Seattle streets, period. Provide one or more large lots with sanitation facilities and counseling services. It’s not voluntary, you drive your RV there and accept city help, or you leave the Seattle streets. End of RV camping on Seattle streets!

Pessoa July 12, 2022 (8:58 am)

From the minute a homeless individual – or one with a tenuous housing situation – wakes up, it is a struggle. They face the world, often aging with a chronic health condition, without the support and resources that many of you take for granted. Before giving in to your primitive brain stem, engage your frontex cortex, that evolutionary latecomer to the game where I’m told a little noblesse oblige is supposed to reside.

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