Too close for comfort? Liquor store location raises concern

Amber October 16, 2009 (9:23 am)

Oh, come off it! The last place in the world an underage drinker could get boozed up is a state-run liquor store. Their employees are seriously on top of things. There’s a QFC mere feet from the proposed liquor store with self-check stations – how many kids could get beer there? Geesh.

TP October 16, 2009 (9:26 am)

I personally don’t see having the liquor store as a necessity in Westwood Village. I don’t see it as something that will benefit the community.

rob October 16, 2009 (9:33 am)

I am 34 and I look it, and they card me every time I go into one of those places, so I am not worried about HS kids buying from one. As for it being a drag on the neighborhood, I just don’t see it. They are clean well kept stores, and they don’t seem to attract the thuggy element to hang around like some of our many bars and convenience stores in WS do.

Andrew October 16, 2009 (9:34 am)

It will benefit the people who likes to drink that live in that area. It will save on gas and is better for the environment than having those residents drive all the way to the junction. No problem there. I agree with Amber 100%.

homesweethome October 16, 2009 (9:36 am)

ditch it, no purpose to having a liquor store so close to school grounds

and Amber – there are plenty of over aged folks that are more than willing to buy for the under age folks, it has nothing to do with how on top of things the staff of any store is

villagegreen October 16, 2009 (9:50 am)

Alcohol benefits anyone who drinks it. Haven’t you heard? Lower cholesterol, reduced risk of heart disease, etc. The key is moderation. You could say Westwood Village itself isn’t a necessity. But that would be stupid.

Mac J October 16, 2009 (9:55 am)

So, if kids can get booze from QFC or “helpful” 21+ folks anyway, what difference does it make where the liquor store is? I fail to see any connection of proximity of alcohol sales to schools and underage drinking. The kids who want to drink will find a way, whether the liquor store is across the street or in the next county. The “moral” impact of the store is entirely negligible.

onceachef October 16, 2009 (10:02 am)

I am sometimes amazed at the rationalizations people can make to support, or in this case not support any “new” venture coming into a given neighborhood…the “what ifs” are sometimes…ridiculous. If the state decides and okays the store to be in the Westwood Shopping Center then it should go there…the “possibility” of an adult buying liquor for a minor exists at any store, regardless of location, that offers liquor (groceries included)…that’s up to the store, the management and the police to monitor and control. Hopefully there are enough responsible adults as well who will say NO to any minor asking to buy liquor for them…if it happens to me I’ll report the kid to the management and let them deal with it from there. It’s not fair to assume that if a liquor store opens in Westwood there will be increase in criminal activity or over-indulgence.

JW October 16, 2009 (10:11 am)

Hiding a perfectly legal activity from children always guarantees that they’ll grow up with healthy attitudes toward it, right?

Bill October 16, 2009 (10:15 am)

I don’t understand the argument of shielding our kids from the sight of a liquor store. It’s not like they will be the one’s purchasing the alcohol. Many adults like to have a cocktail every now and then. An adult having a drink is not a bad thing in itself.

That kind of overprotection seems to be counterproductive and not realistic.

MargL October 16, 2009 (10:36 am)

https://westseattleblog.com/blog/?p=20964

It doesn’t matter where the store is. Kids will get alcohol as long as the 21+ crowd is stupid enough to sell it to them or buy it for them.

How many kids sneak off to the trees or behind a building to light up a smoke? Where are they getting the smokes? Stealing them from parents? Bumming them from older friends?

It’s not location, it’s education and responsibility.

Celeste17 October 16, 2009 (10:38 am)

I don’t understand the protest of having a liquor store in Westwood Village (WV). I feel having it at WV would be a good idea. It would serve the community and I do not feel that they would contribute to a minor drinking. I feel that grocery stores and gas stations that sell beer are more then likely to have people buying alcohol for minors. I feel that this addition to WV would be fine. The teens are not going to be bothered by this store. Build it.

MJ October 16, 2009 (10:41 am)

This is ridiculous. Another waste of time and resources. Who cares if they see the BACK of a liquor store?? Most likely most of them see a liquor cabinet in their own home of sorts every day. And the idea of protecting them from it like it doesn’t exist only creates a mystery around it.

Parents, schools and communities need to talk about handling situations – not just shielding people from them.

Buddsmom October 16, 2009 (10:59 am)

Get a life ladies! Kids who want to drink will find away no matter where the liquor store is. Beer and wine are much more accessible to teens than trying to get a bottle from a WSLCB run outlet. By the way, there are 4 schools within a couple blocks of the Junction store. Closing that one down now too?

mark October 16, 2009 (11:17 am)

Funny. Check out the “litter” left behind at most underage drinking spots (school yards, woods, playgrounds, parks) and you find way more beer bottles and Mike’s Hard than booze bottles about 25-1, if not higher. The bigger threat, if there even is one would be at QFC. I blame the Coinstar machine, it seems to always been in the middle of this kind of stuff.

Mike in the Junction October 16, 2009 (11:18 am)

I read the Seattle Times this morning that they are adding liquor stores in some area malls this holiday season. I thought it was a great idea. You can get wine at target- beer and wine at the QFC- Some people have too much time. C’mon!

WSB October 16, 2009 (11:37 am)

Being from a family affected by alcoholism in earlier generations, I have a challenge for you all, if you have a minute to spare.
.
So let’s say you don’t think this is the way to go about tackling youth drinking. What is? What would you suggest needs to be done? Is there a role for a group like the Southwest Healthy Youth Partnership, which involves community volunteers who care deeply as well as one dedicated staffer who’s interested in saving lives. Thoughts about what they most need to focus on, to really help?
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Or, maybe to go a bit further, would you contend it’s not a problem and doesn’t need to be addressed? Really curious! – TR

M October 16, 2009 (11:40 am)

And make sure it is open Sundays so I can have my Sunday afternoon G & T!

And mark please expalin what the coinstar machine has to do with under age drinking? This I gotta hear..

MargL October 16, 2009 (12:08 pm)

I think the education and community involvement part of it is great! We do need more of that – but not to the extent of organizations dictating that liquor stores shouldn’t be in certain areas. If there are large populations of people that believe that, they should do the Tim Eyman thing and get an initiative petition going.
However, I think the effort would be better spent giving families tools and information about how to work with and communicate with -their- kids about how these activities (drinking, smoking, drugs) are bad and providing them with other things to do – healthy hobbies and after school/summer programs.
That being said, the parents of these children do need to take some of the responsibility and shouldn’t -expect- the community to do all the work to keep their kids on the ‘straight and narrow’.

Jason October 16, 2009 (12:19 pm)

I would appreciate having the liquor store near Westwood. Going to the one in White Center can be… “exciting” at times. And not in a good way.

dawsonct October 16, 2009 (12:20 pm)

Maybe if we stop treating alcohol as some great taboo, the only purpose of which is to inebriate the imbiber, then the child may not be so intrigued. When you cloak anything in mistery, or simply withold education, the curious young mind will naturally seek enlightenment, but usually receive information from their peers, who are just as clueless as they are.
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Humans have sought to alter their state-of-mind throughout history, better for the child and society to learn to treat it as natural and understand how to control it, through education and regulation of the various substances.
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It always comes back to education.

KBear October 16, 2009 (12:24 pm)

M, I think the point mark was trying to make was that the Coinstar machine at QFC was responsible for burglaries in the neighborhood in the same way that the state liquor store would be responsible for underage drinking.

(Here a reference the Coinstar machine’s involvement in a burglary. BAD Coinstar machine!!)
https://westseattleblog.com/blog/?p=20706

onceachef October 16, 2009 (12:30 pm)

Thanks for asking that question M…I also had a “huh?” moment when I read that :) Like I mentioned…rationalizations!

dawsonct October 16, 2009 (12:33 pm)

When I was in HS (not long ago, in a geological sense), it was easier to find pot, and you could still function stoned, marginaly. I suspect that still holds true.

meeps October 16, 2009 (12:35 pm)

I don’t think the presence of a liquor store makes kids want to drink. I also don’t think that pre-21 drinking automatically turns one into an alcoholic. I disagree with MargL assessment that drinking is “bad.” In fact, I think that’s half the problem. Drinking isn’t bad, if done in moderation at the proper age. I think parents who are responsible drinkers set a better example than parents who say, “Drinking is bad, just don’t do it.”

Isn’t it about time we retired that “Just say no” crap? It’s a joke, it doesn’t work. I had my first drink well before I turned 21. I don’t know what my parents could have possibly done to stop me from doing it.

I truly truly believe the most important conversation a parent can have after the “you shouldn’t drink and here’s why” is the one that explains if you do drink, call me and I’ll pick you up. It’s not enabling. I don’t know how many times I’ve seen drunk girls at parties crying because they had too much to drink, and now they are relying on their drunk friends for advice and guidance because they are AFRAID to call their parents. The “you’ll never leave the house again” conversation can wait til morning.

K October 16, 2009 (12:36 pm)

I live in very close proximity to westwood village and we already have a problem with car thefts, car accidents, and crime in general. Yes, I was once one of those maladjsuted teens who skipped school and shoulder tapped adults to buy alcohol. Yes, it was easy. Yes, some of them understood we were young and less than wise, and tried to take advantage of us while “helping” us. Yes, I committed acts of graffitti and peed in people’s yards. I don’t want a liquor store across from my house or across the street from my kid’s school. Yes, there is beer at QFC. But so what? I don’t think this is necessary, or a good idea.

WSB October 16, 2009 (12:37 pm)

LOL on the geological sense. I have taken to saying “back when I was (whatever) and dinosaurs walked the earth …” And thanks for sincere replies to my question. I am not taking a stand on this store’s location, good/bad/indifferent, just sincerely curious what people’s thoughts are, if you have a moment to spare ’em. Meantime, we’re off to check out rain trouble – TR

dawsonct October 16, 2009 (12:48 pm)

Has there been a Jim Foreman sighting?

rob October 16, 2009 (12:50 pm)

I grew up in a town of 300 people about 25 miles from the nearest liquor store. There were only two places in our town to buy alcohol (tavern and grocery store) and the people who ran those places knew everyone in town, and no kid could ever get away with buying from them. What’s more, most every kid blows town when they turn 18, so 21+s to buy for kids were pretty much non-existant. Despite all of this, kids who wanted to drink didn’t have a hard enough time getting their hands alcohol to stop them from drinking.

The answer to kids drinking isn’t to simply try to make the supply as hard as possible to tap into. They will always find a way.

The problem as I see it is that there are too many kids who don’t learn responsibility, respect, common sense, etc when they are growing up. I am sure everyone will have a different opinion about why this is and what to do about it, but my experience has been that its usually a problem of absent or ineffective parenting. If you have kids, its up to you to give them the tools to deal with life, and not just let them run crazy and do whatever the hell they like. If a kid doesn’t have parents, or has parents that aren’t doing their job, we as a community should fill the gap.

I know that is all easier said than done, but just because it is hard doesn’t mean we should fool ourselves into thinking its better to focus on things that really won’t make any difference.

Amber October 16, 2009 (12:57 pm)

Teach kids responsibility and that personal choices have consequences, trust them to make and overcome a few mistakes, and you get a fine functioning adult. There is absolutely a role for a group like the Southwest Healthy Youth Partnership! Give parents and kids a toolkit to deal with these issues, talk about drinking/smoking/drugs openly and honestly, and instead of promoting NIMBY-istic prohibition, allow that responsible adults can make responsible decisions. AND MODEL THAT BEHAVIOR FOR THE KIDS.

Sam October 16, 2009 (1:19 pm)

Seriously, the last place I was ever able to get alcohol underage was a liquor store. Now Albertsons – they always came through!

Kat October 16, 2009 (1:42 pm)

I personally am getting a little tired of the world revolving around the needs and wants of minors. Yes, the children are our future, but I pay taxes and want a Margarita!!

JanS October 16, 2009 (1:46 pm)

good grief..so many things in our community that need our concerns. I doubt that this location will change a thing.

Donn October 16, 2009 (1:55 pm)

There currently is a state law of not having a liquor store closer than 500 feet to the front door of a school. This liquor store is less than 75 feet to the play fields of the high school and middle school and I don’t really see a difference whether you are measuring to the front door or the school property where kids will be playing. That is the primary issue. Secondary is that there is a liquor store already existing less than a mile away in White Center 8-10 blocks away. So it appears that we are quite well served in the south end of West Seattle.

If there is a need to replace the liquor store closed in Morgan Junction, why not the Alki area which is not well served at all? There is the old Pegasus Pizza place that is not being used.

Really, does it bother anyone to drive that extra mile to get their tequila or vodka? It isn’t like, oh gee, now that I can’t walk to the liquor store, I might as well get beer or wine.

You may also wish to look at today’s story in the Seattle Times about how grocery store business is hurt by having a liquor store in the immediate vicinity. See http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2009361804_apwaboozingthedeficit1stldwritethru.html

MargL October 16, 2009 (2:03 pm)

meeps – I totally agree with you. I should have clarified, as you did – Drinking isn’t bad, if done in moderation at the proper age.
The problem is some people are unable to drink in moderation, or wait until the proper age.
My father is an alcoholic as is my brother and I’m almost 100% certain that my parents never once sat him down and said, “Son, your father has a problem with alcohol, as did his father and probably your great grandfather. Addictive personalities run in the family and we want to help you avoid potential problems in the long run and if you ever feel you have a problem please come talk to us!” as a start… those conversations never happened. And we never had a good example of ‘how not to be addicted to alcohol’ at our house.
Now – why did my brother end up having problems and I didn’t? Nature vs. nurture?
I don’t know if my daughter has inherited this ‘addiction’ tendency that comes from both sides of her family (she’s only 3) and we don’t drink at home so model behavior hasn’t been a issue.
But, I do plan on having frequent heart-to-hearts with her about it as she grows and will gladly take advantage of and contribute to any community resources that are available to help her avoid finding ‘happiness’ at the bottom of a bottle.

old timer October 16, 2009 (2:15 pm)

My concerns are about vehicle access and traffic flow.
How much traffic will be added to the already heavy at times post office flow?
Also, there is that very odd crosswalk on Trenton at the access
driveway to Westwood, which the kids walking down from the playfield above do use.
Traffic, already annoying may become dangerous as well.
I wish they would put it somewhere over by the Target, but if wishes were in play, I’d probably opt for something else entirely.

KateMcA October 16, 2009 (3:07 pm)

I’m of age and sound mind and body, and I would like to have a liquor store closer than the Junction. I am certain that if alcoholism and underage drinking are the issues here, then having a liquor store in Westwood Village will neither make nor break the situation. Alcoholics will go elsewhere. Underage drinkers will get booze elsewhere.

furor scribendi October 16, 2009 (3:23 pm)

If the traffic patterns of the White Center and Junction liquor stores are any indication, the volume of really bad drivers and those that are co-dependent for them will greatly increase. Add that to the Post Office traffic and the general large volume of Westwood traffic, plus kids etc coming across Trenton (I know, Sealth is now on Delridge but will return soon) and you have a really heavy traffic situation. I live on Trenton – – traffic is bad enough already. Just say no to expanding the liquor store to Westwood!

AJ October 16, 2009 (3:51 pm)

It sounds like people want convince and safety. The drive to the junction is far but they drive there because the experience at the white center store was a little shaky.
The location of the new store is one issue but from the comments posted, driving the extra mile to white center is not an option because of the rift raft. That’s brought up another issue.
I shop at the white center store and would change to the Westwood location if it happens, just to feel a little safer.

Gina October 16, 2009 (4:33 pm)

Sure, ban the liquor store and all alcohol and all home produced wines. Call it Prohibition, get some run runners. That will stop minors from getting any spirits. Worked so well in the past, didn’t it.

Seriously, a State run liquor store causing worry? I have never seen anyone passed out with bottle of Kaluha in a paper bag.

Krystal October 16, 2009 (4:51 pm)

Here’s a solution. Sell liquor in the grocery stores.

Cheryl October 16, 2009 (4:59 pm)

Living much closer to Westwood Village than the Alaska Junction, I say BUILD IT… b/c I will definitely go there rather than drive all the way to Burien or the Junction store.

Lest you think I’m some kind of drunkard who can’t wait to booze it up closer to home, I’ll mention that I too am the daughter of an alcoholic father, with myriad other family members who suffer from the alcohol addictions. It profoundly affected my life from childhood to today, though luckily I’ve escaped the addiction aspect of this family disease. But then, I’m a big proponent of Alateen and Al-Anon meetings for people who have a problem w/ someone else’s drinking.

I also have a 3 year old, so as a PARENT myself, of *course* I’m concerned about underage drinking, but a State Liquor store is the least of my concerns in terms of where kids can obtain hard liquor (if that’s all they’re even trying to obtain, which they usually aren’t).

If teenagers want to get booze, they will find a way. Banning liquor stores won’t stop that. Beer and wine is everywhere. So are drugs. Parents who kid themselves re: those facts are setting themselves (and their kids) up for utter disaster.

Parents who are really open & talk to their kids about liquor, drugs, etc. will help those kids make healthy & smart choices. Or at least they’ll know they can still go to their parents for help, guidance, love, etc. if they made stupid choices.

Expecting the state & Federal government, businesses, teachers, etc. to impose morality is foolish, irresponsible, and not very cost effective either.

I say, bring the *ADULTS* their booze!

Rick October 16, 2009 (4:59 pm)

I can’t really imagine access and traffic flow being that much more of a problem in a city that has encouraged increased density and shoehorning for maximum units/sq. footage. 4-plexes in backyards,60 or more units in what used to be a few houses, or try getting into the new QFC. I do imagine the protest is more about product rather than logistics. If we were talking about a specialty shop of some type with similar traffic impact there wouldn’t be a peep.

MargL October 16, 2009 (5:05 pm)

Here’s an interesting tidbit I saw in the latest email from the Westwood Neighborhood News I received this week. Note the last line re: the White Center store.

“Liquor Store
Further discussions are taking place currently with the Washington State Liquor Control Board, Renae Gaines of Madison Middle School who leads up the City’s underage drinking committee, Seattle City Council Richard Conlin’s office, and State Representative Eileen Cody’s office on the locating of the Liquor Store across from Denny and Sealth School’s playfields in Westwood Village. Per discussion with Washington State Liquor Control Board this morning, it is their intention to remove the liquor store from White Center which is less than 1 mile away from the new store. “

WSB October 16, 2009 (5:22 pm)

That wasn’t in the notice I got last nite from Donn @ Westwood Neighborhood Council, from which this item sprang (following up on a phone conversation earlier in the week). I have just left phone messages for both media liaisons at the LCB in Olympia, but given the fact it’s Friday night, they are probably gone and I may not hear from them until Monday. Nothing on their website, but on the other hand, they didn’t make an official announcement of the Westwood store until after we had called about it and published our story – TR

bridge to somewhere October 16, 2009 (5:43 pm)

I was all for the WV store, til that post about the WC store . . . That would mean some serious traffic . . . Uh-oh

MargL October 16, 2009 (5:43 pm)

I wondered about that – I’m subscribed to the westwood-neighbors listserve on scn.org
http://www.scn.org/westwood/listserv.html
Donn sent the email to that list.

Kathleen October 16, 2009 (7:52 pm)

Ridiculous. Alcohol is legal for adults to consume. Therefore it makes sense that you would place the store front in a shopping mall. It’s not legal for kids to smoke. Following the logic displayed above, that means no cigarettes should be sold at any grocery or convenience store in proximity to children. Do they limit cigarette sales by the same rules? That would be ridiculous, too, but just want to know if they’re following any sort of logic. I am not advocating alcohol or cigarette consumption by minors, I’m advocating that existing laws be enforced and common sense applied.

Bonnie October 16, 2009 (7:58 pm)

Ridiculous.

stango October 16, 2009 (8:06 pm)

I come from 2 alcoholic parents and learned the dangers of drinking by 6th grade. Their problem drinking taught me to respect alcohol, and I never developed a problem. In fact, I’m known among my friends as a “lightweight” and I think that education is the key to developing a healthy respect for the dangers of alcohol abuse.

I work in a public library, and have seen/caught teens drinking on site many, many times. Every time, it was malt liquor and/or that awful energy drink/malt liquor combo. Never mind whether or not teens can get liquor at a liquor store. They are going to your local bodega/convenience mart to get it, if not the grocery store.

It’s true that when I was a teen, we regularly had keggers out in the woods behind our high school, but we didn’t get those kegs anywhere near the school. We knew the places that would sell to minors, and went there, even when it meant driving across town. We drank near our school because that’s were the woods were. If the woods were 3 mi from the school, that’s where the party would have been.

Of all the times that I drank in high school, or was at a party where there was drinking, I’d say that liquor was involved less than 5% of the time.

The kids will drink, and will go to where they need to in order to get it. Without guidance/education, they could develop a problem. Unfortunately, I received education by (bad) example, but I learned nonetheless. The location of the liquor store is irrelevant, unless that store develops a reputation for selling to minors, in which case kids will come from all around the city to buy there, whether it’s close to a school or not.

d October 16, 2009 (8:49 pm)

If it is confirmed that the WC store will be closed? And we assume all of their traffic coming in? Might not be so good to have around, as old timer pointed out, that crosswalk which kids will be pouring out of.
I don’t live around there and I don’t buy alcohol at the liquor store, but I have noticed that lame crosswalk. Take a look at it next time. There is something very weird and unsafe about it.

I have never been to the WC store. I don’t even know where it is. Is it a super high volume store or something? Or are people passed out on the sidewalk? What is the deal?

Is there information available about the volume of sales and traffic in the different stores? Is there any correlation with alcohol-related crime via # of police calls to the immediate vicinity of liquor stores? They (SPD), tracks that for certain small grocery stores, if I’m recalling Lt. Paulsen of SW Precinct correctly. All of this is so speculative, of course, until that closure is confirmed.

But if nothing else, again, folks should look at that crosswalk old timer mentioned behind the sports field. I think he’s right – it’s odd. Maybe not safe???

rob October 16, 2009 (9:28 pm)

I’m not sure I understand the traffic concern. I can’t imagine a liquor store is going to draw more traffic than any of the other businesses in the shopping center, and they are bound to add more businesses whether a liquor store goes in there or not. So to me, the traffic concerns really ought to be about the shopping center as a whole, not any one business in it unless its something huge like adding a movie theater.

DBurns October 16, 2009 (9:53 pm)

FWIW my understanding is that Westwood Village has requested 2 security guards at the new store, which would be in addition to the one employed by Westwood Village 7 days a week.

onceachef October 16, 2009 (10:13 pm)

You can’t treat alcoholism or underage drinking by controlling the location of an outlet…it’s just ridiculous to believe this…it’s irrational to think that the outcome of opening a (state operated) store in Westwood will create some sort of maelstrom of alcoholic minors regardless of the proximity to a school…I dare a minor to ask me to buy them liquor (at any location for that matter)…they’ll be disappointed with my answer!

bluebird October 17, 2009 (12:48 am)

re: traffic. I shop at both the Junction and the WC store. During school hours, I have never seen more than one or two other people. It just isn’t an issue. Friday and Saturday night, or near a holiday, I’ve seen at most, ten people in line. Granted, I don’t go in very often, but that has consistently been my experience for years. All these fears are way overblown.

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TR, in response to an earlier question on what to do with kids and drinking. Start telling them the truth. The good and the bad. With many things, as parents, we default to warnings about all the dangers in life. Curiosity and experimentation produces different results. Sometimes drinking is just plain fun, and doesn’t result in all the catastrophic outcomes. Teens then decide we’re lying and throw out all the genuine concerns, such as binging, driving, etc.

.

I’m a big advocate of knowledge. Growing up, the biggest partiers, that got in the most trouble, were all of us naive church kids. We had no idea what we were doing, and didn’t care. The kids who had parents who talked to them and were open, had much more respect for themselves and the choices they made.

Meghan October 17, 2009 (6:21 am)

How absurd. The last place any underage person can get booze is at a state liquor store! Maybe we should also close the Starbucks (caffeine addiction), Eats (obesity-causing ice cream sandwiches), Jamba Juice (empty calories), Barnes and Noble (dirty magazines), and Target & Pier One (goods made by Chinese labor!). So stupid. Open the store for the convenience of all the local residents, not over a fear that teenagers might try to get liquor. God, I hate that way of thinking.

rob October 17, 2009 (7:46 am)

What is wrong with a liquor store at a mall that happens to be by a playfield? I don’t think too many playfield children are going to buy liquor. This is too stupid to even discuss. I say open one on every block. Every minimart sells tobacco and beer and many are located near schools, churches, parks and playfields.

K October 17, 2009 (8:01 am)

So if the argument FOR the liquor store is that alcohol is already bountiful and readily accessible, that it is a parent’s responsibility to teach safe drinking or non-drinking practices, and that the assumption is that there will be no increase in crime, traffic, or public intoxication, then should we also open a gun store and a strip bar there too? Maybe a casino? After all, guns are legal and readily available, so why not make it easier to buy a gun because it is a parent’s responsibility to teach safe shooting practices? Maybe we can have an adult novelty shop too, and teach the kids how to discern their porn choices? And the kids who do not have responsible or involved parents should be free to run the streets getting high, drunk, and prostituting themselves to pay for their habits? Do we as a society have no responsibility to ensure that the world is a safer or more just place as opposed to less so? Perhaps involved and loving parents choose to protest liquor stores across the street from schools because we feel that it is not best practice in urban development. Just because a bunch of twenty and thirty something people without kids (at this time) want to buy a fifth of Absolut without wandering over to crime ridden White Center, does that mean that homeowners with kids who live directly adjacent to the property should just shut up and have no say? I don’t think so.

Z October 17, 2009 (8:15 am)

I attend the middle school across the street from the soon-to-be liquor store, and I happen to know firsthand that parents teaching their kids isn’t going to stop them from using substances such as alcohol. I have heard people at my school talking about “the great party last weekend where we were all drunk and high”. And I’m sure that some of these people do have parents that aren’t very attentive in their children but I’m sure that some of them have parents who teach them about these things. People may think that if the parents pay close enough attention things like that won’t happen, but kids can always manage to find a way. Its as simple as telling your parents, “Oh, yeah, I’m going to a sleepover with my friend”, or, “I’m going to a party but my friend’s mom is going to be there.” I even had an experience just the other day where one of my classmates was talking about the party she had, and how she was asking for more beer and she was so drunk, because her parents were out of town. I also live near the school and the idea of people coming to Westwood and getting drunk and hanging around my home makes me uncomfortable and afraid. Kids at my school visit Westwood all the time, and I know that it wouldn’t take long for them to find a way to obtain alcohol. In my opinion, adding a liquor store across the street from a school won’t have any good effect on the neighborhood.

miws October 17, 2009 (8:24 am)

“I dare a minor to ask me to buy them liquor (at any location for that matter)…they’ll be disappointed with my answer!”

“…..you’ve got to ask yourself one question: Do I feel lucky? Well, do ya, punk?“(?) :P

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Regarding the closeness to the WC store, FWIW, the Morgan Junction store was just a tad more than a mile away from the Junction store. Morgan’s previous location was across the street, on the Thriftway lot for many years prior to the new TW being built. And, previous to that it was about a block or so north, in what is now the back section of the building O’Neill Plumbing is in. That would have made it closer to being exactly, or possibly even a bit less than a mile from the Junction store.

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Mike

Friend O'Dingus October 17, 2009 (10:12 am)

Silly people, don’t you know that kids today get their kicks from the medicine cabinet anyways? Not that it’s right mind you, but I must remind everyone that the road to hell is paved by good intentions. Hoopla around the proposed store only adds to the mystique.
Some folks think the existance of any liquor store is a bad thing, some folks think if your old enough to put your money on the bar then your old enough to drink. Me? Well, I’m somewhere between the two.
In general, I think we coddle our kids today way too much (18 and out is what I say), and that do-gooders are at epidemic proportions (see the aforementioned ‘weird’ intersection on Trenton as an example. That’s recent you see…added as a ‘traffic calming’ element because of the athletic fields).
A liquor store in Westwood Village is as fine with me as another freekin coffee/juice/bubble tea place would be; in fact, preferable, as it won’t attract as many vacuous, self-absored, phoney, materialistic, and vain yuppie types.
I think we should be happy that the convenience of a legally run liquor store may be added to the colorful mosaic that is Westwood. Lord only knows what would be said if the idea of a desperately need tavern within walking distance was ever proposed.
Oh, and to Kat above, I want to try one of those Margaritas of yours gurl!

Arborheights Pal October 17, 2009 (11:03 am)

I’ve read the comments about the new liquor store and I am surprised at the number of people whose parenting skills are so poor that they admit they cannot trust their children. I DO applaud their honesty in this regard. This is an “in-home” issue, not an issue about the installation of a Liquor Store. So lets talk about the Washington Liquor CONTROL Board!!! We are among the few states in the US who does have a Liquor CONTROL Board that takes its job seriously. Liquor is sold in centralized stores run by the state. Security is on premises. ID’s are checked. Measures are in place to make it nearly impossible to steal liquor. Further, Westwood Village, which is private property, has an on site security force who can and who do remove people who are purposelessly loitering on the site….that would include underage persons who are attempting to have a legal age person purchase alcohol for them. This practice, indeed, is far more prevalent in front of convenience stores and grocey stores (note that QFC, which is footsteps away from the new Liqor Store sells wine, beer, etc. Why is this any different?)More traffic for Westwood is a good thing for our neck of the woods. It translates to more business to ALL the stores in the Village, which translates to increased revenue and more jobs.

Cleveland Ken October 17, 2009 (2:54 pm)

WOW it only takes one IDIOT to stop clean legal adult fun. I’m glad I don’t have my head buried deep in my ass. Pull your heads out people and get a life and stop trying to control everyone’s lives. Build the damn thing and see what happens, I bet you will see no more drunk kids than there already are around there.

gretchen October 17, 2009 (9:21 pm)

Arborheights Pal,
you’ve got it exactly right!
I live in the westwood hood and want a liquor store here. The more diverse the business in Westwood Village the better. And we are NOT worried about any increase of crime or traffic in our neighborhood due to a new liquor store. The crazy driving comes from the other state run office across the street the DOL. But you don’t hear us trying to run them out of the neighborhood. We live in the city people get over yourselves!

TheHouse October 18, 2009 (7:41 pm)

My concern isn’t with kids drinking and it would be great if I could simply walk over and buy my Jack Daniels. But, my concern is with the vagrant clientele that typically flocks to liquor stores. You see lots of it at the White Center location and also see it in the rear of The Junction location.

No, I don’t want alcoholic homeless people staggering to and from Westwood Village and walking through the surrounding streets.

If this store is successful in opening (I hope that it isn’t), then I would expect WV to beef up their security in the complex and place cameras around the complex (especially by the cut through to Henderson).

JanS October 18, 2009 (11:03 pm)

Where have I been all this time? There’s a big bunch of vagrants hanging out in the parking lot behind the junction parking lot? More than hang out on the Key Bank corner or the Easy Street corner? Maybe I just didn’t have my glasses on, but I’ve not seen it. I use that lot for more than one business, and haven’t ever seen a bunch of vagrants there. Oh…maybe you meant me ;-)

WSB October 20, 2009 (10:09 am)

To get a clarification on record for future searches: Ann in communications (media liaison) at the Liquor Control Board tells us there is NO PLAN to close/move the White Center liquor store – TR