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March 21, 2010 at 7:14 am #594253
JanSParticipantI have no use for people like this. If you’ve considered yourself part of this movement, are you really that sure you want to be associated with this?
March 21, 2010 at 1:53 pm #690730
miwsParticipantOh, but doncha dare call them “teabaggers”, because it has a vulgar, sexual connotation to it, and is very hurtful and hateful, when directed at them.
(Incidentally, I didn’t even know of the sexual connotation of the term, until Dori Monson kindly pointed it out on his blog, after a State Rep or some such used the term publicly, [Can’t stand to listen to his show anymore, but he probably made a huge stink of it there as well.])
Mike
March 21, 2010 at 4:14 pm #690731
francis57MemberMarch 21, 2010 at 4:34 pm #690732
brewParticipantJeez…How I hate it when people take the actions of a few and use it to label an entire group, and those who use it to promote their own agenda. I cannot count the times that small groups of Dems, repubs, and libs have used just as vulgar AND WORSE behavior. (And no, I am not affiliated with the “tea bagger” movement).
Unfortunately, by the time people realize that it’s BOTH the Democratic AND Republican party that is ruining this country, it’s going to be too late.
March 21, 2010 at 5:06 pm #690733
SmittyParticipantThat’s ridiculous.
First off BOTH sides have idiots. Remember WTO? Remember pies thrown into the faces of conservatives? I don’t discount the views of the Left because of a few idiots(I just discount them because they are usually wrong).
Second, if I was a political operative – the first thing I would do is plant someone into a movement you didn’t agree with and have them yell something racial. You guarantee that KO, Rachel, the now defunct Air America and yes, the liberal MSM will run with it.
March 21, 2010 at 5:09 pm #690734
clark5080ParticipantIt is always the actions of a few that get all the attention. That does not reflect the vast majority of people who who oppose this healthcare bill.
Jim
March 21, 2010 at 5:16 pm #690735
JoBParticipantSmitty
i remember a similar argument when someone shot and killed an abortion doctor recently… and it didn’t play well then either…
There may only be a few individuals caught on film or by reporters yelling the n word at those of color but Sarah Palin came dangerously close to exactly that while representing her party running for Vice President.
Racism isn’t the issue.. hate is… and while you might find a great deal of anger and frustration demonstration of democrats … you don’t find the kind of hate that negates the humanity of others simply because of their sex or race or sexual orientation or …
and if you do.. it is condemned loudly and publicly.. period.
democrats.. for the most part… think someone actually has to do something vile to you to personally before expressing that kind of hate.
I am aware that i am speaking generally… but the real tragedy is that republicans as a group have condoned hate generating language and behavior as part of their political process…
That saddens me more than sickens me…
but it is a lot like the 60s all over again.
March 21, 2010 at 5:23 pm #690736
elikapekaParticipantYes, both sides have idiots. That’s always the argument. But I, and I think most people, condemn this type of behavior no matter where it comes from. I mean, really, Smitty, do you know anybody who supported the WTO anarchists? I don’t.
But I found this especially offensive. This was a mob scene. I know I’m sounding like my mother here, but the Capitol is a place deserving of better behavior. Respect is due to the place and the office, even if you do not respect the particular individuals in the office at the time. I was very saddened to see people showing up wearing ratty tank tops and shorts in the people’s house, spitting on and yelling obscenities at elected representatives.
I’m not particularly in favor of this bill either, because I think it doesn’t go far enough. But I really wish we could find some way to discuss the true merits of these things without having these emotional triggers constantly being pulled to get people so worked up we never get to the real issues.
Oh, and Mike, I’m with you on Dori Monson. I don’t know what’s happened to him over the years, but he’s totally unlistenable now (if that’s a word). :-)
Liz
March 21, 2010 at 5:23 pm #690737
JoBParticipantyou know Smitty… i just caught your last sentence as i hit enter…
do you really think that person was planted by someone in the other party to make conservatives look bad?
get real. All you have to do is watch an evening of Fox news to know better. That kind of rhetoric and hate can be found on a television near you any night of the week…
you may have become so accustomed to it that you think that kind of rhetoric is normal behavior…
I agree that yelling the n word in public is mostly an exaggeration of what is broadcast nightly…
but it is only a small leap from the private thoughts generated by all that hatred to thinking it is ok to voice that hatred publicly.
acknowledging that is part of that personal responsibility thing that has lost all meaning in the language of the conservatives.
personal responsibility includes owning up and condemning that kind of behavior…
not condoning or excusing it or blaming someone else.
March 21, 2010 at 5:33 pm #690738
SmittyParticipantWho’s condoning it? It’s awful – but it doesn’t negate the entire movement.
And yes, JoB while not nearly as wide-spread as the 60’s when Dixiecrats had power (that’s short for Dixie DEMOCRATS, btw) it is equally as appalling.
Those darn Lincoln-Republicans!
March 21, 2010 at 6:21 pm #690739
JanSParticipantI guess I find it very sad that arguments like Smitty’s happen. Blame the Dems, it was someone planted, never take personal responsibility, and heaven forbid that a conservative Republican condemn this type of behavior and shut it down. Do you honestly think that all those slurs, all those signs that show up at all the teabag rallies are plants? I don’t. And I think we are being naive if we think that the “tea bagging” is about civil discourse that is meant to take our country in another direction. There’s nothing civil about it. And be careful what you wish for, as what we become may not be all that palatable.
Oh, and , wow, the Dems/libs/progressives are to blame for all the things that got our country where it is. What short memories we have. I am soooooo tired of these arguments about “you did it”, “no, you did it”. We are fast become a very divided country, where “no one” is to blame. And too many people are becoming haters because of it. I think it’s very sad.
March 21, 2010 at 6:39 pm #690740
SmittyParticipantHow many times do I have to condemn it, JanS? Four, five?
Smitty Condems It. Good?
Now, that doesn’t mean you condemn the ENTIRE MOVEMENT.
A few bad apples………
I don’t condemn your stupid movements because of a few bad apples, I condemn them because they are stupid.
Clear?
BTW – what is a “teabagger”, anyway?
March 21, 2010 at 7:11 pm #690741
JanSParticipantSmitty…the “official” wikipedia definition:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_protests
another take:
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/04/freedomworks-long-history-of-teabagging.php?ref=fp1
and the take that really gets some people, and makes one wonder about the lack of thought when naming your movement:
March 21, 2010 at 7:18 pm #690742
dawsonctParticipantI don’t condemn these dupes for the fairly large number of backwards, racist types in their “movement”, I condemn them for the ignorant, fearful, and selfish agenda they support, at the bidding of their corporate bosses.
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Anarchism AND Libertarianism are BOTH idiotic movements. Humans haven’t evolved far enough to be able to live under only the dictates of fairness and morality, nor are we capable of achieving equatability in all of our interactions, so personal resentment is inescapable.
Maybe in a few hundred millennia.
March 21, 2010 at 7:21 pm #690743
miwsParticipant“BTW – what is a “teabagger”, anyway?”
Smitty, the definition that upset Dori so much is NSFW.
I’m sure Urban Dictionary lists that def.
Mike
March 21, 2010 at 7:57 pm #690744
SmittyParticipantSo, if I understand it correctly, using the word “teabagger” when speaking of the tea partier” is kind of, sort of, maybe kind of bigoted?
I can only imagine the outrage had conservatives used this term to disparage a movement on the Left.
March 21, 2010 at 8:23 pm #690745
JanSParticipantSmitty…this is what they call themselvesa…don’t accuse people of being bigoted when there is nothing there. They chose the term.
March 21, 2010 at 8:25 pm #690746
elikapekaParticipantActually, Smitty, the people in the group used the term to describe themselves, not realizing the connotation. I agree that it’s in poor taste to continue to use it once you know the “urban” meaning, but they sort of did it to themselves.
March 21, 2010 at 9:11 pm #690747
SmittyParticipantWha?
I only hear Rachel, Keith and their minions using that term.
Tea Partier = Tea Bagger
They know EXACTLY what they are doing when they use the term, so there are no excuses for “who started it”.
March 21, 2010 at 9:12 pm #690748
metrognomeParticipantwow, there is a lot of revisionist history being made out here, usually by leaving out a few inconvenient truths … let’s see … where to start?
– if the Tea Party was ever a ‘grass roots movement’ it has long since been coopted by Republican leaders (like Dick Armey) who are making a fortune in ‘consulting fees’ and hoping that the public will be on their side for the next election cycle
– the original ‘tea revolt’ had to do with ‘taxation without representation’; this one is based on ‘we were soundly whipped in an election where we were able to vote and so now we are behaving like a two-year-old throwing a screaming tantrum on the supermarket floor.’ Exactly what tax increases had this administration actually put in place before the TP was formed?
– when the John Birch Society started acting the same way in the 60’s and 70’s, conservative leaders like Barry Goldwater had the stones to tell them to behave or get out of the Republican Party. They didn’t listen and were expelled. Who has heard of the JBS now, except in history class?
– it’s pretty disengenuous to blame liberals for the riots at the Seattle WTO when the main organizers of the violence were anarchists and libertarians from outside the US (note that the violence has continued at WTO meetings in Europe.) Sure, liberals were involved in the protests — mostly the non-violent ones. Anarchists believe in little or no government, a concept closely allied with the conservatives’ alleged desire for small government.
– the Dixiecrats pretty much all became southern Republicans … Why? Because LBJ signed the Civil Rights Act giving blacks the right to vote. Doesn’t that seem racist at its core? Doesn’t having the motto “I want my country back” seem racist at its core when it is directed at the first president who is not lily white?
– doesn’t it seem odd that the very people who supported a president and a Congress that ran this country’s economy into the ground and lied us into a war that has killed over 4,000 US soldiers and maimed 10’s of thousands more are mad at a liberal president because he hasn’t fixed their catastrophic mistakes in only a year. Keep in mind that the Republican congress repealed the regulatory laws that were in place since the Depression, allowing Wall Street, the banks, the insurance giants, etc. to run amok for the sake of greed — and most of those firms are run by Republicans …
tafn. discuss among yourselves … politely, please.
March 21, 2010 at 9:18 pm #690749
JanSParticipantSmitty…your argument doesn’t hold water..they called themselves that…quit this always blaming the other side thing. I hate both terms.
March 22, 2010 at 12:55 am #690750
dawsonctParticipantThanks for the point-for-point refutations Metro, I didn’t have the energy.
—
I don’t know what Georges Santayana would say about consciously revising history, but I bet the results of historical revisionism is more or less the same as forgetting ones history.
March 22, 2010 at 4:47 am #690751
JoBParticipantSmitty..
have you actually listened to any of the teabaggers? most of them are not articulate enough to make their point… they sure can chant slogans though.. including.. we don’t want single payer.. leave your hands off my medicare…
LOL… if stupidity is your bottom line you may have to rethink support on this one…
metrognome..
i can’t thank you enough… i really didn’t have the energy for this one today. welcome to the arena.
March 22, 2010 at 5:47 am #690752
jamminjMembermy favorite is:
I don’t want govmnt run health care…
and they better not cut anything from my medicare!!!
It’s ironic how 8 years ago, America knew best on how to run another country and tell them how when and where… but when it comes to running this country… then all of a sudden the govment don’t know squat.
And this ‘so called’ pro-life argument: so its ok to protect life (until birth), then if an insurance company wants to deny life saving measures to a live person…. oops, it was pre-existing!!! sorry.
I would have no problem with the arguments against in itself… but bringing monkeys to a ralley, holding up nazi signs, calling politicians ni55er and fa55ot, bringing guns to rallies, the death threats….and THEN the complicit nature of the crowd that allows that behavior. And somehow we are to take the rest of your arguments seriously???
March 22, 2010 at 6:45 am #690753
HMC RichParticipantJoB, please source Sarah’s racist statement. Also, the term “teabagger” is not nice. It should not be used along with the word “ni…..” and the “h…” word. You should live up to the values you espouse. I suggest you read Michelle Malkin’s “Unhinged”. Tell me what you think about those idiots.
JanS, do you truly believe that most people of the tea party movement are racist? Come on. You are not ignorant. You know better. You know those people screaming racist/homophobic comments are the ignorant ones. The majority are not that way. You know that. You are just stirring the pot. One reason Beck started the 9/12 project was because of the 9 principles and 12 values. That helps keep the fringe elements in check. He warned the Tea Party people the other day too.
You know that both sides usually act with a modicum of respect but there always seem to be a few on the fringe.
Smitty, I get what you are saying.
Hey Metrognome, are the Anachists from Portland outside the United States? Why do those idiots have to ruin so many things? Pittsburgh last year wasn’t too happy with certain behaviors during the G7 or G8 (whatever that meeting is called). I didn’t hear of too many altercations from the right wing extremists last year when the town meetings were happening. I did see some SEIU people trying to stop others from exercising their right to speak out.
Yes, the Republicans behavior paved the way for the Democrats to control the legislative and executive branch. No, it is not racist to say “I want my country back”. Limited Government vs Statism. This President at best is a big goverment guy who stated that he doesn’t care for the limits of the constitution. At worst he is a Progressive Socialist who is going to try to get the Federal Government to grow exponentially and change this country that will make some European countries more capitalist than us. Correct me if I am wrong but I think you can get jail time for not buying health insurance when implemented. If that is true, then we have truly lost more freedom.
Metro, you forget that Mr. Obama promised that his programs would keep unemployment at or under 8%. He bitches about the previous administrations debt but has already doubled that. This new entitlement will cost more than estimated. Even Dick Durbin said that. You guys need to also take ownership of what he (Obama and the Democratic Congress) hath wrought.
Anyway, I truly wish the racists and homophobes would go away. For a while yet we still have some form of freedom. Many disagree and have the right however ugly or repugnant we (yes I said we) find it. But, are you saying that people cannot speak their minds (however ignorant or vile?) Are you going to be like Woodrow Wilson and throw people in jail for speaking their opinion?
Racism is bad for all of us. And historically it was the Democratic party and their policies that kept minorities down. LBJ knew that and pushed for the Civil Rights act anyway. Someday I hope all people are treated equally (and this is only for JoB (except women …you know I tease). There is still a ways to go.
Anyway, I agree the Republican party got what it deserved, and Obama ran a centrist campaign but left hints that he was really more left wing. It was a means to an end (Hi Saul). The American people elect our officials. We have the final say. There are going to be a lot less democrats around Washington after November.
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