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September 1, 2015 at 6:10 am #818336
JKBParticipantI’ve posted several times to a thread on the WSB home page. They disappear within the hour. Others have successfully posted.
Thread in question relates to somebody skywriting “Black Lives Matter”. My initial posts offered that all lives matter. Subsequent posts were about why my posts kept vanishing.
So I’ll ask again here in the forum – are we looking at editorial censorship, or repeated technical failure?
September 1, 2015 at 6:32 am #827421
DianeParticipantJKB; I went through about a year of my posts disappearing; it was so frustrating; wsblog did not know why; sometimes my comments were found in wsblog spam folder, but that meant having to contact every time; even worse, I could see my posts/comments, so assumed they were up on the site for everyone else to see; turns out only I could see my own posts; for months I just stopped trying to post anything; eventually, my last try, changing my password worked
September 1, 2015 at 9:55 am #827422
JanSParticipantJKB…the editors of the WSB don’t censor unless someone is being extremely offensive.
September 1, 2015 at 2:59 pm #827423
JoBParticipantJKB.. i checked. i can’t see any posts by you either. i do’t know what’s happening.
i do know they are working through some glitches in the software
on the subject of black lives matter…
i will agree that all lives matter but would point out that some are at far more risk than others
September 1, 2015 at 3:44 pm #827424
BonnieParticipantI have had that happen too and it seems to happen quite a bit to me. I’ll post and then go back to read more comments but my comment isn’t there. I think it’s some glitch in the system.
September 1, 2015 at 4:31 pm #827425
KBearParticipantSaying “All lives matter” in response to “Black lives matter” is insensitive at best. It’s like saying “I don’t care about racism, because I’m not a racist.” Or questioning the need for Black History Month.
September 1, 2015 at 4:52 pm #827426
SueParticipantThere are often a lot of glitches that happen, that supposedly won’t happen when the forum gets upgraded. For quite some time the software decided that my old email address (which was also the name of my business) was spam, and everything I posted would end up in the spam filter. Sometimes I would see it anyway (where no one else could), or sometimes I didn’t see it but others did, but mostly it just disappeared into the ether until TR could fish it out of spam. I had to change the email address I used just to avoid it. Still happens occasionally, but for some reason it just *hated* that email address. :)
September 1, 2015 at 5:44 pm #827427
goebbelsMemberSo only posts that are offensive are censored? Based on what I have seen that is blatantly untrue, unless disagreementdislike are considered subsets of “offensive”.
What a way to operate a community forum. Thumbs down.
September 1, 2015 at 6:22 pm #827428
JanSParticipantgoebbels..I see you just joined us 46 minutes ago or so….you are an adult…you have choices…here it’s the choice of using the forum or not using the forum. Also, by “offensive” I mean blatantly , disgustingly offensive, against a civil community standard. Take that however you will…I’m just curious why you bother to come here and comment if it’s thumbs down for you…unless you’re trolling. Those of us who come here enjoy discussing things with other members of this forum…and we do try to remain civil. Take that for whatever it’s worth…
maybe you can cite an example of something being removed that was not “offensive”…always nice to be able to back up what you claim, isn’t it?
September 1, 2015 at 7:09 pm #827429
JTBParticipantKBear—yes.
September 1, 2015 at 8:41 pm #827430
JKBParticipantJan, there have been cases of posts being taken down without offensive content. Others have complained about this, and I had it happen myself. You were even on that thread (the one about evangelical churches), which actually saw some other posters come to my defense. Thanks, Diane, others. So I can’t be certain that’s what happened here, which is why I invited the editors to clarify whether the disappearance was editorial or technical in nature.
KBear (and apparently also JTB in sympathy), your ‘insensitive at best’ is…confrontational, at least. Sounds like you meant to say something even stronger, but decided to just imply it instead of being upfront. Compare with JanS’ comment which makes a reasonable counterpoint that allows dialog.
So there are several things about the BLM slogan and its advocates that I don’t care for. Pushback against ‘All Lives Matter’ suggests that you think black lives matter more, for instance.
Some people agree with me, some others don’t. But for this to be a forum suggests that opinions are welcome and open to discussion.
September 1, 2015 at 8:58 pm #827431
KBearParticipantYou’re right, JKB. You said something mildly racist and I confronted it. No one is saying “Black Lives Matter more” than other peoples’ lives. But when you try to correct the slogan to “All lives matter”, you are basically denying the fact that conditions are different for African Americans and other people of color than they are for white people. Denying white privilege is racist.
September 1, 2015 at 9:42 pm #827432
JTBParticipantJKB, I think confronting insensitivity, tolerance, indifference, etc. to systemic racism in this country is long overdue.
I don’t believe KBear’s first comment was particularly harsh or even very confrontational for that matter. He framed it in a general way so it would be construed to apply to anyone taking the stance you presented.
I’d been thinking about this issue, how white people choose to relate to BLM as a movement. It’s not easy, because there is a deliberate intent to make white folks uncomfortable with the status quo.
I strongly disagree with many of the positions advanced by Outside Agitators 206 who slipped in under the banner of BLM and disrupted Bernie Sanders speech a few weeks ago. But they aren’t representative of what I’ve seen put forward by the BLM Network.
September 1, 2015 at 11:47 pm #827433
JKBParticipantNot sure what you two think racism is, but apparently it includes legitimate difference of opinion, all the way down to choice of rhetoric. Turns out some people think differently.
As a thought exercise, imagine someone saying QueerLivesMatter, JewishLivesMatter, or ImmigrantLivesMatter. Got a problem with that?
Please don’t even start the white-privilege thing. To start with, whites are no more all alike than blacks. Sweeping statements about the whole group are by definition stereotypes.
September 2, 2015 at 12:08 am #827434
JKBParticipantAnd what’s with being all over me for saying all lives matter, and not asking goebbels about…Goebbels? Now there’s a symbol most of us wouldn’t mind censoring.
September 2, 2015 at 12:31 am #827435
JoBParticipanti see you chose to ignore my comment
that all lives aren’t at equal risk
which is why the black lives matter movement is necessary
September 2, 2015 at 1:28 am #827436
JKBParticipantSorry about that. Didn’t ignore at all – even gave credit, but got the name wrong: “Compare with JanS’ comment which makes a reasonable counterpoint that allows dialog.”
JoB and JanS are probably not the same person; my mistake in getting the name wrong.
September 2, 2015 at 3:01 am #827437
KBearParticipantWhite privilege does not mean all whites are alike. It just means that white people benefit from judgements other people make based on the color of their skin, whether they choose to or not. Again, if you can’t admit that’s true, you are part of the problem.
Goebbels? Don’t feed the trolls.
September 2, 2015 at 3:20 am #827438
KBearParticipantNice straw men, by the way.
September 2, 2015 at 3:33 am #827439
JKBParticipantYeah, probably right about the trolls.
The ‘white privilege’ argument is horrifying and offensive. Show me something I have because of privilege, that I shouldn’t have had. You can’t. First because you don’t know me – all you can do is stereotype. And second because you probably have a really screwy idea of privilege.
Let me clarify that last. Every single exposition of the ‘privilege’ argument I’ve ever heard has supported itself with examples of how black people have been denied rights or otherwise trodden upon. That’s not privilege. I don’t apologize for my unquestioned right to vote. If you want me to help correct the wrongs done to others, we can have that conversation. But I won’t apologize for what really was my right, nor for what I earned on my own.
Perhaps you had something else in mind. Explain if so; I’ll listen.
And I am granting you a lot of unwarranted latitude here – when you go off with ‘part of the problem’ rhetoric, you are not helping your cause. Word of advice: learn to deal with people who do not think exactly the same as you do.
September 2, 2015 at 4:07 am #827440
JTBParticipantI’m less interested in white privilege than complacency on the part of white people in the face of systemic racial discrimination.
That said, your characterization of white privilege is not in line with what I’ve seen discussed. No, actual privilege based on being white, or not being black, is what that’s about as you indicate.
I believe that racial discrimination actually works to the disadvantage of white working people. Bernie Sanders nails it pretty well even though he’s gotten flack for not speaking more directly to racism beyond its economic underpinnings. So whatever privilege accrues to whites is largely illusory—-for them, a suckers’ reward. African Americans still pay a greater price.
I don’t profess to have a solution to put forward in response to the challenge from Black Lives Matter. Of course, getting rid of racist practices in police departments is an obvious and important start, but that’s easy compared to the broader challenge. What I do believe is necessary is for the nation to acknowledge the problem we all share and resolve to try and develop some solutions for it. That’s why diverting attention from the challenge is problematic.
I think it’s good that a segment of the African American community is no longer willing to play along with the system and instead is challenging it.
September 2, 2015 at 5:11 am #827441
KBearParticipantJKB, I suspect you also consider yourself “color-blind” and think that “reverse racism” is a thing. As far as not helping my cause, I think you’ve pretty much exposed your own ignorance.
September 2, 2015 at 5:19 am #827442
JKBParticipantWSB, I’ve tried to report Kbear once already and am doing it again. Abusive accusations of racism are probably not what you want in the forum.
September 2, 2015 at 5:33 am #827443
JKBParticipantJTB, it seems that we could have a conversation about a topic on which we don’t initially agree. I wish that were the case more often.
September 2, 2015 at 5:41 am #827444
KBearParticipantJKB, I haven’t abused you. Looks like you’re the one trying to shut down the discussion now. Just like you were with your “all lives matter”.
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