Home › Forums › Open Discussion › Avalon Way vs. Harbor Ave. drivers
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August 5, 2008 at 1:26 am #587688
JustSarahParticipantJust wondering if anyone has an explanation for why many drivers turning left onto the eastbound bridge feel that they have the right-of-way over drivers turning right from Avalon on a solid green light? I know that Harbor Ave. does get a green left turn arrow when Avalon’s light is red, so are drivers just confused? Do they not understand the difference between a green turn arrow (turn freely) and a solid green light (YIELD to drivers going straight or turning right)? I have witnessed so many near-accidents at this intersection, and they have all been caused by a driver attempting to turn left across oncoming traffic. One morning I was on the bus and everyone got jostled pretty hard when the driver had to slam his brakes for one of these idiots. Anyone care to share their own experiences or offer an explanation? I’m truly baffled. :-)
August 5, 2008 at 1:35 am #633294
MargLMemberYes! What is up with this?! I’ve seen it happen several times. At first I thought the light was screwed up and they were getting the green arrow. Then the second time I had to slam on my brakes I thought, “Well these guys are just idiots.” I think there needs to be a sign put next to the light that says “Left Turn Yield on (greenball)” or something like that.
August 5, 2008 at 2:42 am #633295
CMPParticipantWhoa, there seems to be someone on here that hates bad drivers more than me…didn’t think that was possible! I have no explanation for the moronic Harbor Ave drivers that think they have a protected turn on to the bridge. Whenever I ride the bus at a busier time, someone always seems to cut us off when we clearly have the right of way. One time my bus driver laid on the horn to let ’em have it and I thought it was one of the funniest things ever. She went on to honk at a few other people on the bridge that were driving like idiots which made my day.
August 5, 2008 at 3:06 am #633296
BobLoblawParticipantThank gawd others have noticed. This is Bob Loblaw’s No. 1 WS pet peeve driving spot. I drive it each and every day and see this each and every day.
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I thought I was in the wrong the first dozen times this happened. So I checked the “other side” and saw that, nope, right turners are in the right on green. In fact, there are TWO yield signs over on Harbor Ave.
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I hope one of the Harbor Ave. drivers can weigh in on what gives them the impression it’s their right of way. I’m tired of getting driven over, honked at, flipped off, etc., just for trying to make a right turn.
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Now, let’s talk about the folks who decide to start lining up for 1st Avenue a half-mile down the “bus only” lane…
August 5, 2008 at 3:31 am #633297
JustSarahParticipantCMP: I’ve actually been meaning to bring this issue to WSB for months now, but kept forgetting. This afternoon’s anger toward the jerk on Spokane just reminded me to post about my other WS driving peeve :-) My other one is that people rarely signal, but that’s a Seattle-wide problem! And to BobLoblaw and MargL, I have also looked at the signal from the other side to verify that there is nothing giving the drivers the impression that they have the right-of-way; there sure isn’t! Like you said, BL, there are signs specifically stating that traffic is to yield on solid green. Argh…
August 5, 2008 at 3:35 am #633298
BobLoblawParticipantThe only thing I can think of is that perhaps it lines up for a ways on Harbor and folks, out of desparation and frustration feel like they have to cheat death to make a left. If that’s the case, the city needs to step up with a solution.
August 5, 2008 at 3:47 am #633299
GenHillOneParticipantThat whole intersection is a free-for-all and at commute time, all the worse. And let it be known that I am one of the asshats that won’t let someone merge when they try to be cute and cut down from Admiral. Everyone on Admiral and everyone on Avalon has been waiting their turn and it’s obvious what they’re doing. Now, pulling out of Java Bean or Luna Park, different story – I’m all for supporting their morning business – but…but I get childish pleasure out of holding my ground, so thank you.
August 5, 2008 at 3:51 am #633300
beachdrivegirlParticipantGenHillOne me too! i hate it when people speed down on Admiral and try to cut me off. it is just rude!
August 5, 2008 at 4:09 am #633301
LucyMemberHA! This has annoyed me for years. I too have noticed it is worse during commute times.
7:30 am and you need to get to work? Yield on green does not apply apparently.
I think all those Harbor Ave/trying to get on the bridge drivers need to contact the city about adjusting the traffic light timing rather than taking things into their own hands and treating the intersection like a mid-western four way stop. “No you go ahead. No you. No, I insist.”
NO, I am not going to wave you through. I need to get to work too. And I’d rather not have to worry about getting into a fender bender on my way in.
Sorry if that sounded mean. I don’t hate you just because you’re coming down Harbor Ave trying to get on the bridge before I’ve had enough coffee to be nice. But seriously, someone call the city?
August 5, 2008 at 6:28 am #633302
melissaParticipantThis is a case where there are almost equal numbers coming from both directions. While I, on the Avalon side, do have the right of way, I figure this is a case where it’s easy to drive nice. I let someone in each time. They, after all, need to get to work too and if the Harbor Ave folks had to wait until they had a clear spot, they’d never get off Harbor Ave. All of which is to say that I think it’s a light problem (there should be a green arrow for those turning from that direction) rather than a lousy driver problem.
August 5, 2008 at 2:24 pm #633303
BobLoblawParticipantAll for being nice as well. However, in this case, there’s a chance that somebody who has been let in enough times will assume they have the right of way, and when somebody goes straight — wham!
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Same thing with letting folks cross in cross walks when the light is red for them: Just because you’re nice doesn’t mean somebody isn’t going to see that there’s a green light and pull around you, only to hit the walker. Hence the reason lights are what they are.
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Quick: Call Mayor Greg and his crazy house of taxes to the rescue!
August 5, 2008 at 8:43 pm #633304
roundthesoundParticipantIs the light screwed up? I notice a lot of Avalon drivers stopped when making a right turn when I know both of us should have a green light. Is this people being over cautious or are you stopped on a red? After sitting on Harbor through 6 light signal cycles I’m not surprised by some of the moves people make, especially when people from Avalon show no mercy. Who would one contact about getting a signals timming changed?
Instead of changing the timming at our intersection we could have the city install a metering light on Admiral and then it wouldn’t be so dificult to merge onto the bridge from Avalon/Harbor and get all backed up in the first place.
August 5, 2008 at 9:14 pm #633305
JanSParticipantroundthesound…there is a point when the traffic coming from Harbor Ave. has a green arrow, and the Avalon traffic has a red light…once they both turn a steady green is when the freeforall begins..
August 5, 2008 at 9:26 pm #633306
roundthesoundParticipantI know exactly what we’re talking about, I drive through this intersection almost everyday and it’s when I have a solid green (not an arrow) and I know Avalon has a solid green that I see people stopped there turning right. I’ll be sitting with my left blinker on and someone will just be stopped waiting to turn right, I’ve also seen many people get honked at for sitting there too long. Why do people sit there? Just an observation from the other side of the bridge…
August 6, 2008 at 12:35 am #633307
JustSarahParticipantroundthesound: I understand what you are talking about, and I think the reason the people turning right on green sometimes stop is they’ve been conditioned to do so after nearly being hit by someone turning left from Harbor. If I see traffic waiting to turn left there and I have the green, you can bet I still slow down just in case someone decides that they either have the right of way or have enough room to squeeze in. I figure if I’m going slowly and they pull a move like that I at least have time to avoid an accident. I bet some of the “stoppers” drive that intersection on Saturdays, too, which is when I notice it gets really bad. I saw a line of cars waiting to turn left onto the bridge one Saturday night that just took over the right of way – everyone started turning, completely blocking the right of way from turning right or going straight. There was a lot of honking, and still they all kept turning left!
August 7, 2008 at 4:11 pm #633308
AlParticipantYes! This intersection is a nightmare and will only get worse in the near future (think Viaduct construction). Writing to SDOT about the signal timing is the best thing we can do, because we all know that SDOT and the City are thinking about how the Viaduct work will impact W. Seattle, right (snark)?
I sometimes stop while taking a right down Avalon because the sight line turning right is blocked by the barrier and it’s hard to see if there’s stopped traffic heading onto the bridge or not. And people, there’s a crosswalk there, it’s illegal to block a crosswalk even if there’s no one in it. Just because someone is stopped at a green coming down Avalon does not give you the right to take a left – it just means you have to WAIT and YIELD to the right turner because they have the right of way so long as their light is still green.
August 7, 2008 at 8:17 pm #633309
tsunaminwMemberThe same people use the bus lane to get past the peak before the slide over left or right into their lane thinking they just saved themselves a big wait.
And the same that cruise down in the right lane until just before the I5 onramp and try and cut over at the last minute, which is why i keep a large stash of marbles and pennies in my ashtray. I am no Jay Buhner, but I dont miss either.
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