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July 16, 2008 at 7:13 pm #630951
roundthesoundParticipantMy faded Hillary poster is still hanging in the front window of my house. Some people say I’m in denial. Maybe I am. I really thought she would be able to clinch the nomination and was of course disappointed when she didn’t. She was the first presidential candidate I have ever actually been excited about. Once again I find myself voting in an election where I’m just voting for the candidate that will screw stuff up less. It’s like a default vote. I think a lot of Hilary supporters felt wronged by the democratic party for whatever reasons, come election day I’m sure they will cast their votes for Obama because let’s face it, McCain would be a step backward; however, you won’t see them shouting it from the rooftops. You won’t see my Hillary poster replaced by an Obama one either. I miss you Hillary.
July 16, 2008 at 8:49 pm #630952
beachdrivegirlParticipantI mean this in all seriousness, but how did you feel wronged by the Democratic party?
July 16, 2008 at 10:50 pm #630953
roundthesoundParticipantI didn’t say I personally felt wronged by the Democratic Party. From what I’ve discussed with other Hillary supporters is this; you have a candidate that was pushed by all the party leaders to drop out of the race even though she was willing to fight to the very end for what she believed in. The candidate that had the popular vote according to most polls and won the key states, i.e. CA, NY, & FL. Not to mention all the rule changes made by the party this year.
I work at the polls every election and a week before the caucus I didn’t realize that the Dem party wasn’t counting any votes from the actual election, only those from the caucus, where you also had to sign a party allegiance (very much a turn off for us non-partisans). I don’t believe the Dems did a very good job notifying people of the caucus locations in this state or the changes since out of the 24 people that showed up to vote on election day 18 of them were Democrats. The $2000+ the county spent on just my polling place was a complete waste and I really hate saying that about voting.
Hillary is out of the race so there is really nothing left to discuss. I will leave it at this; I am voting for Obama by default, I am saddened that I will not be able to put a checkmark next to Hillary’s name come November.
:(
July 16, 2008 at 11:18 pm #630954
JoBParticipantThe first 4 hits if you put.. Obama campaign new Yorker cartoon … in google search engine..
There has always been a huge difference between the reactions of Obama’s campaign staff and his public reaction day(s) later..
and his has almost always been far more measured and forgiving…
you won’t find the racism charge in the official statement from his campaign..
but it was used by prominent members of his campaign staff in more than one interview…
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2008/07/14/obama-cartoon.html
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/07/14/tasteless_and_offensive_new_yo.html
July 16, 2008 at 11:33 pm #630955
beachdrivegirlParticipantAll of those link reference the same quote which is:
“The New Yorker may think, as one of their staff explained to us, that their cover is a satirical lampoon of the caricature Senator Obama’s right-wing critics have tried to create,” Obama campaign spokesman Bill Burton told The Associated Press. “But most readers will see it as tasteless and offensive. And we agree.”
I still don’t hear his camp calling it racism.
July 17, 2008 at 1:21 am #630956
JoBParticipantyes, that is the text of the official statement.
it is possible that a reporter said that the Obama campaign found the article racist… i have erased the Grit program that discussed it.. and i don’t watch FOX news. But that is not what i remember.
The discussion on this on GRIT TV as very interesting. i can highly recommend the eprogram.
July 17, 2008 at 4:36 am #630957
beachdrivegirlParticipantThat might make more since with a REPORTER stating it was racist and the REPORTERS making a bigger deal about it. The Daily Show did bring up last night or (maybe two nights ago) how the REPORTERS were *trying* to get a rise out of people over the
*racism * because they weren’t getting enough…but then again they have been the most racist since the beginning. Sure does make a difference when we all pay attention to what was said and what the reporters say.
Wow what a difference it makes when you listen to what is said rather than what you or the reporters *wish* to hear!!
July 17, 2008 at 5:25 am #630958
longtimelurkerMemberThank you JoB for your honest response, I appreciate it. It seems we just disagree on what Hillary’s weaknesses might have been but that is OK we don’t need to see this issue the same way.(FWIW MY candidate finished about 97th!) In any event as you say I’m willing to suffer a great deal to keep McSame out of the WH.
July 17, 2008 at 3:29 pm #630959
JoBParticipantlongtimelurker…
to be honest.. i wanted kucinich (whose name i can’t figure out if i can spell this morning)… but i knew that was a dream. He’s too honest to get elected.. and probably too honest to be effective as well.
i agree totally that we need to keep McCain out of the White House…
and who knows, maybe Obama will turn out to be more than i expect. I always have hope.
July 17, 2008 at 3:31 pm #630960
JoBParticipantbeachdrivegirl..
i said it was possible.. but not what i remembered.
You would have to watch the program i watched to know whether my memory of that program was correct or not.
no matter.. you illustrated my point beautifully…
the candidate.. and apparently the campaign.. for whom any criticism is unacceptable:)
now… unless there is further honest inquiry.. i really am done with this conversation.
July 17, 2008 at 3:38 pm #630961
ZenguyParticipantClinton only won the popular vote of you discount the caucus votes, which are votes none the less. This should not have even been close, she had the name and the blessing of the party, but ran a bad campaign, which we cannot afford again.
July 17, 2008 at 3:47 pm #630962
JoBParticipantZenguy…
she was outcampaigned for sure. but a bad campaign? depends upon who you ask.
Quibble if you like about whether or not she won the popular vote.. but she sure won a lot of votes right up until the end… in spite of being outspent and continually lampooned by the media.
This was a hard fought and very close primary…
now it’s time to focus on how we get those who voted for her to vote for him.
July 17, 2008 at 4:10 pm #630963
WSMomParticipantI think JoB’s original post said something Hillary’s supporters considering not voting, or (horrors) voting for John McCain, need to hear…NOT voting for Barack Obama is a bad idea. Clinton has now devoted her energy toward Obama winning in November. It is in Clinton’s and our best interests to vote for Obama even if we think Hillary was the best candidate. I hope we democrats and independents will not shoot ourselves in the foot this November and end of with four more years of disappointing Republican antics.
July 17, 2008 at 4:15 pm #630964
JoBParticipantWSmom…
it’s hard to believe that is where this conversation started.. but yes.. that is the point exactly. thank you for coming back to it.
if electing Obama president is important enough to do whatever it takes…
then we all need to be willing to think outside the box to draw those who are embittered or just plain disillusioned back in…
July 17, 2008 at 4:38 pm #630965
charlabobParticipantIt does make a difference — my first presidential election was 1968, when I voted AGAINST Hubert Humphrey. He was, in no way, my ideal. I probably even blamed him for Kennedy’s and King’s and Malcolm’s deaths, at some level. So I taught him. Didn’t I?
Except that every time I think about the American(sic) kids and Vietnamese kids who died so I could maintain my stiff-necked pride, I get a little sick. Every time I think of what Nixon did to make the world safe for hypocrisy, I get even sicker.
The only point to be proved by your vote is that person A is *light years* ahead of person B in terms of presidential potential.
Let me see if I can be blunt: McCain is a lying weasel. He will say anything to get elected — if that’s someone’s notion of maverick, we’ve got a whole congress full of mavericks. Keating 5 was only the beginning for him…it should also be the end.
Learn from my ancient geezerette history: don’t repeat it. :-)
July 17, 2008 at 5:25 pm #630966
JoBParticipantJuly 18, 2008 at 12:24 am #630967
walfredoMemberroundthesound- cheer up Obama is a great candidate and will make a great president! We appreciate your support, and I think with an open mind you will come to really like him.
I do think that some of your statements on Hillary being treated unfair are a bit silly. Very few, almost none of the media suggested she drop out. They actually made the horse race seem close, much, much, much longer then it was. The MSM calling the WVU, Kentucky primaries would be like a football announcer calling a late 4th quarter field goal attempt by a team trailing by two touchdowns, like it was the most important play ever, and had changed the whole game.
But, its not important anymore. She ran a good campaign (much better towards the end), and she got a lot of votes. It just seems to me the exact opposite of what you were complaining about, is what actually happened.
July 18, 2008 at 12:37 am #630968
JoBParticipantwalfredo…
at what point do you let your anti-Hillary bias go?
had you posted the same post without the middle paragraph it would have come much closer to winning the hearts and minds of Hillary supporters…
i really don’t know what part of the fact that Hillary supporters think they weren’t treated very well by Obama supporters.. here and elsewhere.. you don’t get…
you won.. but we are still entitled to our story.
I understand you don’t see it. You weren’t treated that way.. but you don’t have to agree with how we see our story.. you just need to let us tell it.
my guess is that you aren’t going to make any of us feel any better about casting our vote for obama until you are willing to let us speak…
let it go…
and let’s get on with the national election.
July 18, 2008 at 3:37 pm #630969
walfredoMemberJoB-
I have been pleasently suprised by Hillary herself the last 6 weeks or so. I think the debt may have something to do with it, but she has been pretty impressive with her support so far. A lot of the qualities her supporters talked about, are starting to come to the surface.
The point I was trying to make, in regards to how something that happened so recently, and on a national media stage could be viewed so differently by people. It literally is exactly the opposite of what I percieve to have happened. (The media called for Hillary to quit, long before the race was over, hurting her campaign. Versus- the media far overstated Hillary’s position and chances after the election was mathmatically sealed, and continued to pump oxygen into her campaign after every victory, far overstating its significance to the overall election).
I just find it really interesting, because literally those are the exact opposite, and its two people talking about something that played out in front of 2 billion witnesses on worldwide televsion.
July 18, 2008 at 10:56 pm #630970
JoBParticipantWalfredo…
Walfredo.. of course we have a difference of opinion… you thought her campaign was no longer viable after ohio ;->
July 18, 2008 at 11:17 pm #630971
walfredoMemberI would agree with that. Her staff said they expected to tie in pledge delegates after Ohio/Texas 4 weeks prior to those elections. When she still trailed by triple digits, it was over.
I find it interesting how each group can see things pretty much the exact opposite, but both groups blame the media for the result! There is some crazy stuff going on there.
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