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November 12, 2008 at 2:12 pm #646374
Kayleigh2MemberI felt kind of sorry for Palin (because she wasn’t smart and aware enough to know that she wasn’t remotely qualified) until she started stirring up the gun-waving, fear-filled bigots. If something happens to Obama (God help us), she and McCain are partly to blame. For that, I’ll never forgive McCain, whom I used to admire. He showed his true colors…ugly colors.
November 12, 2008 at 4:09 pm #646375
GenHillOneParticipantJust two quick thoughts on media –
1) I truly believe that the Palin feeding frenzy would have been different if she had been chosen, or even heard of, before August 29; the rush for ANY information coupled with the mismanagement of her interviews (no press, then bad press) wasn’t to her/McCain’s benefit
2) bless Chris, and Joe for agreeing with him, but I don’t think of either of them as journalists; I enjoy the shows, they send me looking for more information, and I’m glad they have integrity, but they are now personalities – still media – but hosts; I don’t expect anyone hosting a tv show to be completely impartial, on any network, whether it’s Hannity, Olbermann, Winfrey, or Degeneres
November 12, 2008 at 5:49 pm #646376
HeavyMetalConservativeMemberKayleigh, I hope, pray, that everyone stays safe. I do not feel as you that McCain and Palin would be culpable if such a stupid and utterly horrible thing transpired.
When stupid people started denigrating and slandering Mr. Obama, Mr. McCain shut them down. If the tables were changed and something happened to McCain, I would blame the person and not the opposing candidates. That is my view.
I want our new President and any President to be safe. If anyone wants harm to come to them, then they are deranged and do not belong in society.
With that said I am glad you voiced your opinion. It is important to me and others to hear your thoughts. Thank You for sharing.
I really do not want to even talk about it anymore. It is so heinous. So wrong.
Can we find common ground together?
November 12, 2008 at 5:50 pm #646377
HeavyMetalConservativeMemberGH1 – I can agree with you. The actual journalists (not hosts) that I know generally lean democratic but there are some leaning the other way too.
I like the differences. It makes for some great debates.
Thanks for the thoughts. Stay dry.
November 12, 2008 at 6:42 pm #646378
JoBParticipantHeavyMetalConservative…
Are we now to judge the bias of a news entity by it’s commentators? if so.. those left leaning stations came to the party late… mostly after they figured out Obama could indeed win the election.
but then, so did corporate America.. opening their pocketbooks in an unprecedented way in the last couple of months of the election.
if anything left of the far right is considered left.. then yes.. it’s all left.
but if left is left and right is right.. there has to be something in the middle.. and our major news media are just that.
i purposefully chose Amy Goodman and Laura Flanders to ask you to watch as examples of left broadcasting because although they are left they are also consummate journalists… and they are very careful to draw the line between news and their commentary.
If they are inflammatory… it is in the reaction to the news they bring to the table.. news most of America hasn’t even heard… not even from those left leaning broadcast stations…
not because they call names and shout loudly at the opposition.
If you believe in an us and them.. then it is comforting to get behind someone who points out that you are the real us.. and that is THEM… even when the message that person speaks is one of hate.
You say that John McCain spoke out against the kind of hate that was building… but he didn’t speak out early.. he waited until the media noticed what was happening and reported it repeatedly.. you know the news reporting labeled as “feeding on Sarah”.
Do you think he and his staff didn’t know before that what was being yelled from the audience at Sarah Palin rallies while she stood in front and winked at the audience using catchwords like “real Americans” and “palls around with terrorists”?
they knew. They just waited to see if it was going to be effective.
I know there is this move to paint John McCain as clueless to much of what Sarah did.. his staff insulated him because it would anger him. I have to tell you.. this is not the John McCain I know from Arizona politics and if it is true the poor man is well into his descent into senility. I, for one, will be surprised if that’s what we see in the coming months and years. I don’t believe John McCain is done.
I believe he is enough of a player to want to be in on the action even if the action comes from a democratic president. John has always been very good at seeing which way the wind blew.
He never had much juice in the Republican party to start with.. it’s what made him accept Sarah… so i don’t expect his leadership to change his party… but i can always hope that survival is important enough to them to sense what has happened in America.
After all.. they did once and in my lifetime. They didn’t turn left.. but they sure did veer left of right for a while.
HMC…There is no question that Sarah Palin incited hate in republican voters you now disown. the FBI reports of intended violence against Obama and his family correspond with her inflammatory speeches.
it’s ironic that while she kept repeating that Obama palled around with terrorists.. she was feeding the hatred of the American terrorists of our time.
America has been bitten by the hope bug. It’s not just that Obama speaks well… it’s not just that he is black and that speaks to something larger than him. After all.. he is a mulatto.. something both races despised in the not so distant past.
He is inspiring idealism.. the way things could be if our greed and anger just got out of the way…
he has told us it won’t be easy but that things can get better in ways that matter to us. He had re-engaged the ideals of this nation that Republicans have been giving lip service…
Now there’s another irony for you… it took a man who speaks like a preacher and believes like a preacher to stir this nation because the republicans had done such a great job of laying the groundwork by speaking in christian ideals but not delivering them.
Believe it or not.. that’s terrifying as h.ll to this democrat. It could really go either way.
but like the rest of America.. i am bitten by hope.
Killing both Kennedys and Martin Luther King was not enough to put out the torch of idealism they kindled… because once kindled it takes a lot to put idealism down.
The republican party has played too long on hate and fear. They energized their base by implying that if elected the black hoards would take over the nation… a certainty eventually demographically anyway. They played on fear that if those who have little now ever got any… the democrats.. socialists.. would take it all from them. They played on fear that an Obama presidency would be a Muslim presidency.. tarring his christian church.. and by association.. all black churches.. with the black power movement.. and black Muslim religion and political extremism. They played on the fear that if Obama was elected his terrorist palls would run wild destroying everything in their path in the name of change. They played on the fear of dishonor.. that if Obama was elected and the troops brought home from Iraq that it would dishonor the nation… never mind that a dishonorable war waged in the name of outright lies has already dishonored our nation. they played on the fear that if torture is stopped… we will face another 911.
but it’s all fear and fear leaves you giving up your liberty and hiding in the dark.
Obama opened a door…. Given a choice between hiding in fear and walking into the open with hope.. hope wins every time.
What we do with that idealism and hope is our common ground.
November 12, 2008 at 7:02 pm #646379
Kayleigh2MemberAbsolutely we can find common ground, HMC. JoB said it well. We all want a strong, safe, free America. Let’s agree on keeping jobs in America and not sending them abroad, on fixing our health care system so that the burden is not borne by businesses or individuals, keeping abortion legal but RARE, using American ingenuity to find alternative energy sources to protect the planet and create new jobs….
I hope that even those on the right give Obama a chance, because if he fails to fix our country (which is in serious trouble right now, by almost any measure), we all fail.
November 12, 2008 at 7:36 pm #646380
beachdrivegirlParticipantIt nearly sounds like you are asking all Republicans to step away from their values and become Democrats. IMO, that is not findinga common a common ground. I think a step in the right direction would be for each political party to be more accepting and open minded to the other. The lack of respect that is shown on occasion to each party is just really classless and useless.
November 12, 2008 at 8:24 pm #646381
andreaParticipantnearly sounds? we must be reading different things then. hope and idealism for the future is a common ground that any person, reagrdless of political affiliation, can identify with and yearn for. we should be less concerned with people’s party affiliations and more concerned with the words coming out of their mouths and the efforts they put forth to taking action on what they say. that goes for all of us. there has been far too much derisiveness being spewed from every angle, and the only person who can countermand that is Obama himself with his time in office. my idealism and hope is squarely on him to make it out on top with the country right there with him.
November 12, 2008 at 9:03 pm #646382
beachdrivegirlParticipantHer positions on healthcare, abortion, and energy that she was taking were all very democratic. IMO, it was not being “open minded” or meeting on a platform in the middle. I agree we need to all come together but forcing ones ideas @ another is not goign to be the way that will happen.
November 12, 2008 at 9:31 pm #646383
Kayleigh2MemberNot sure who “her” is, BDG, but if you were refering to me, I’m long past my early 20s when I was “open minded” and forming my belief system. I’m an adult now (an educated and opinionated one, but an adult nonetheless.)
It’s my job to stand up for what I believe in, while doing my best to find common ground and respect others’ viewpoints.
Global warming and health care should not be politicized, IMO. We should all support public health and protect the environment that we all share.
November 12, 2008 at 9:54 pm #646384
ZenguyParticipantWe need to make healthcare a right and not a priviledge in this country, it would cost us less in the long run. I have never understood why ANYONE would not be for taking care of our planet.
November 12, 2008 at 11:34 pm #646385
beachdrivegirlParticipantYes, Kaleigh2, I was referring to your post.
You state in your post that we can find a common ground.
Then you state that to meet on this common ground we must all agree on abortion, the environment, healthcare etc. The stances you were taking on those platforms yourself seemed very Democratic. IMO, by forcing another party to meet you on your side of the ticket it is not being very open to finding a common ground.
I am not saying that I disagree on your stance for those items; however, I am saying that we must be accepting of anothers opinion/viewpoint etc. And we absolutely should not force our ideas onto another.
Regardless of anyone age, I believe that people should continue to be open minded, and not be set in their beliefs. The world is changing and evolving to continue to be a world leader we have to be willing to adapt. And I am not just a “girl” in my early 20’s.
November 12, 2008 at 11:56 pm #646386
Kayleigh2MemberJust so you know, I consider when someone urges me to be “open-minded” to be a manipulative ploy.
You seem to assume that I value open-mindedness. I don’t, particularly. I value strength of conviction and the courage to stand up for what I believe in. Or maybe you think I haven’t already considered many points of view before I came to my own (I often have.)
I am happy to support efforts to reduce the number of abortions, but absolutely won’t stand for that right being taken away.
November 13, 2008 at 12:24 am #646387
JoBParticipantThere is common ground on all of those issues…
i admit it’s work to find it when people are more interested in proving a point than finding it…
but it is still possible.
we have done it before in this nation and we can certainly do it again.
November 13, 2008 at 12:30 am #646388
beachdrivegirlParticipantWell, I am not trying to be manipulative but feel free to believe that if it makes you feel better. :)
What I am questioning is the ability to meet on a common ground when you aren’t willing to budge on your beliefs or be open minded? I believe that to be effective and meet on a common ground we all need to be leaders in our beliefs. And to be a leader we need to not only have conviction and strength of our beliefs, but also have communication skills and cooperation skills to work with others on finding this “common ground”. Furthermore, a true leader is one who will be open minded to others ideas. If a leader is not open to others ideas or working together then we will never reach this “common good”. I am not saying that I don’t value conviction and the courage to stand up for what I believe. What I am saying is that conviction and the courage to stand up for our beliefs isn’t going to be the strong points while helping us find this “common ground”.
November 13, 2008 at 12:42 am #646389
Kayleigh2MemberFunny, when I stand up for what I believe in and act on it, sometimes people follow…and the common good is served.
But probably not in your world, where we don’t need convictions or courage…just an “open” mind.
November 13, 2008 at 12:55 am #646390
beachdrivegirlParticipantI guess I just dont think highly enough of myself to believe that “I” and “I” alone knows what the common good is not only for myself but also for our country, and the entire world.
And being a leader myself, I tend not to hang around with followers so I wouldnt know what that was like…
November 13, 2008 at 1:01 am #646391
AnonymousInactiveKayleigh, it seems, is speaking of the “common good” of her own (or her Parties) beliefs.
BDG is speaking more along the lines of reaching across the aisle.
To someone on the outside, it looks like this is an argument where 2 different things are being discussed. IMO
November 13, 2008 at 1:32 am #646392
JoBParticipantHeavyMetalConservative
i thought you would want to see how those left wing news organizations are tearing up Sarah…
it seems they’re not…
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/12/palin/index.html#cnnSTCVideo
one of the latest.. but certainly not the only one since Matt Lauher (sp?) is doing a series on her on one of the main 3…
you should see how cute her 7 year old is in high high heels… and missing front teeth.
November 13, 2008 at 1:35 am #646393
JoBParticipantIs any subject ever brought up by any democrat off limits now?
to speak of them wouldn’t be reaching across the table…
even to someone who voted for Obama
Now that’s a scenario i just don’t understand at all..
Why did would you vote for a democrat if you weren’t interested in implementing a democratic platform?
November 13, 2008 at 4:42 am #646394
beachdrivegirlParticipantFirst off, JoB, next time you would like to address me please just do it rather than just talk in generalities. I am not dumb and know when someone is asking me a question, it is just much easier to find when someone starts off their post with BDG or Beachdrivegirl. (I have no preference please do whatever is easiest for you. I do understand that you tire easily.)
Secondly, I find it very odd that you question my support for Obama. Considering all facts, that I was the only one between the two of us that supported Obama from day one of his campaign. Furthermore, I was the only one between the two of us that caucused for Obama and realized when supporting Hillary was a lost cause.
Now onto your fun questions!!:) For me, an Independent Obama, supporter, I don’t think it is off limits for any Democrat to bring up any item. I do get concerned when any individual who only can identify with one party starts bringing up ultimatums. I get even further concerned when someone doesn’t have an open mind. Kayleigh and yourself were not reaching across the table. Specifically, Kayleigh’s post was asking Republicans to compromise their values, beliefs, and the platforms of their party. That is not reaching for the common good of our country. It insulting and rude. I voted for Obama, not because I agree with the platforms of the Democratic Party, but because he was the candidate I most identified with. Furthermore, as I have mentioned previously, we must do away with the two party systems. It is tearing the country apart.
November 13, 2008 at 4:55 am #646395
GenHillOneParticipantNovember 13, 2008 at 5:02 am #646396
ZenguyParticipantYes, is it really necessary to make snarky comments like “I know you tire easily”?
November 13, 2008 at 5:42 am #646397
AnonymousInactiveWell, I thought post #45 was incredibly “snarky”. Was THAT necessary? Who are we to say?
I respect BDG’s opinion. She, to me, exemplifies true unity. As far as I can see, she has the right idea about what Obama promoted himself as standing for.
BDG – You’re a diamond in the rough!:)
November 13, 2008 at 5:45 am #646398
ZenguyParticipantPlease explain how it was snarky? Even if it is, does one bad turn deserve a second? How many threads are we trying to close this month?
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