FOLLOWUP: Crash-plagued West Seattle Bridge curve not due for work any time soon

Andros March 26, 2025 (12:08 pm)

I’m pretty sure is the road surface transitions and high-centered cars. I’ve never had any issues with that corner.

For a progressive city March 26, 2025 (12:09 pm)

It’s embarrassing how many people make an excuse for drivers being terrible drivers. Do all of you realize these people are capable of lethally hurting you or someone you care about?There were 4 reported crashes the other day. Are those all spots that cause accidents too?

CJ March 26, 2025 (12:12 pm)

How about starting a crash count on the WSB for the “Not So Welcome to WS” spot?

bike commuter March 26, 2025 (12:25 pm)

The issue seems to be the bump coming out of that uphill corner. If your accelerating up the hill and you go through the bump your car lightens up and you loose traction on the wet pavement. It being a corner with forces wanting to rotate the vehicle, you loose traction you spin out. they need to address the two bumps in the road in that area. Speed is an issue as well, exacerbating the underlying issue.

North Admiral Cyclists March 26, 2025 (3:55 pm)

I know the bump you are talking about. I’ve had my car “lighten up”. However, I’ve found if I drive the speed limit, I never have a problem. I was going too fast when I felt the bump. I’m all for speed cameras, as is suggested below, to provide the incentive to slow down. As a victim of a crash while stopped waiting for the light at Fauntleroy and 35th at the top of the hill, I don’t have much sympathy for the speeders.
- Josh March 27, 2025 (7:03 am)
  
  This guy gets it. Why would you be increasing your speed just prior to a reduction in speed limit, another turn and a stoplight?
AJ March 26, 2025 (6:21 pm)

Simply follow the law. There’s a posted 35 mph sign. Being a law abiding driver is all you have to do.

CarDriver March 26, 2025 (12:31 pm)

WSB. Has SDOT even acknowledged there is a pavement issue there? Have they acknowledged the FACT that half the curve was repaved during the closure but the other half wasn’t? I do have a family member who works for SDOT and has responded in the past to these crashes. The transition from the repaved grippy to billiard ball smooth is sudden and has clearly caused mayhem and will continue to do so until SDOT actually does what they’re supposed to do and that is provide safe roads.

WSB March 26, 2025 (1:35 pm)

If you follow the link to our February story, you’ll see how they elaborated then.
- CarDriver March 26, 2025 (2:10 pm)
  
  WSB. Reread. The “high friction surface treatment” they’re studying is exactly what they applied to HALF the curve during the closure. Guess the proper questions to be asked is a) why only half and b) since the accidents don’t occur on that surface but the other half of the curve which for reasons unknown they didn’t apply the new surface what is their rational for not doing so. SDOT’s word salad/redirections/obfuscations would make the most seasoned politician blush!
  - bill March 26, 2025 (8:34 pm)
    
    Cardriver: These are deliberates, not accidents. Drivers are choosing to drive too fast. And proving my prediction back when the surface treatment was announced: It just encourages people to take the curve too fast. Here’s another prediction: Improving traction on the rest of the curve will move crashes up to the signal on 35th.
    - Boop March 27, 2025 (12:10 pm)
      
      Bill and others, is there some factual information on speeding versus not speeding?While I wouldn’t be so naive as to think no one is speeding on this corner, it is equally remiss to assume everyone is. Attempting analysis or remedy to any problem without relevant, accurate data is pointless. Everyone assuming that every accident is due to speed is not going to solve the problem. If this factual information has been presented and I’ve missed it, you have my apologies.
Hammer in Hand March 26, 2025 (2:12 pm)

Has the general public accepted that there is a speed problem with most people that drive that stretch? Let’s put a camera right over that spot have it record speed of vehicles and trace their movement. There is no invasion on privacies because you movement is recorded every where. Gas stations, grocery stores etc Just say it with meSlow Down!!!
Oakley34 March 26, 2025 (4:48 pm)

Slow down…pretty simple

wetone March 26, 2025 (12:41 pm)

Evidently SDOT is to busy with their higher priority and less dangerous area projects like Highland Park hill redesign, Alki Point 4yr long redesign modifications and Alki Parking (multiple) redesigns (boat launch area) just to name a few…. All projects that were or are fine before SDOT got involved with. Yet the section of roadway that has more accidents/wrecks in the city of Seattle area in the 2 1/2 years since bridge re-opened is not a priority…….. would like to know if any party has gone after the city for liability’s yet ;)

Jake March 26, 2025 (2:37 pm)

HPW is very dangerous and also has lots of crashes. Two things can be true at once.
- Look Both Ways March 26, 2025 (3:29 pm)
  
  Wrong. HPW does not have “lots of crashes”. The data shows a comparably small # of incidents for HPW traffic volume vs. other areas. And largely intersection issues. SDOT is negligent for not addressing the repeat issues of the same bridge curve spot at issue here.
  - Bbron March 26, 2025 (8:33 pm)
    
    There has been over 100 car collisions on HPW since 2020, not including the intersection. how is that a small number compared to elsewhere? here’s an actual source.
    - Look Both Ways March 26, 2025 (11:34 pm)
      
      Your source map shows only 3 minor incidents last year on HPW hill…not 100. A small handful of others occur at the top / bottom intersections (similar to intersections across the city). Our comments regard the hill, which is what SDOT is unnecessarily focused on changing. Instead they should address more severe, repetitive issues like the bridge road surfacing.
    - Bbron March 27, 2025 (1:05 am)
      
      @Look Ugh, why do y’all insist on not interacting with this map at all– Click. The. Dots. it is not 1-to-1. that middle dot on HPW represents 160-ish incidents. also, you can download the table data and go that way. like, if you went to go look at the curve, it also has a single dot; probably would’ve tipped you off, but you saw your bias confirmed and spent more time writing out a reply based on a false understanding.
    - Jake March 27, 2025 (9:57 am)
      
      @Look Both Ways, the collision a couple months back with the guy being hit on a scooter was near deadly, how is that “minor” and they said since 2020, also not all crashes are on that data, for example this one wasn’t, along with many others: https://westseattleblog.com/2024/09/rescue-response-at-highland-park-way-west-marginal/ but hey, don’t let me stop you from skewing stats for an agenda.
    - Bbron March 27, 2025 (9:58 am)
      
      @Look click the dots. that’ll show the 100+ collision incidents.
    - Look Both Ways March 27, 2025 (11:01 am)
      
      @BBron, the dots show individual incidents. Only 3 are on HPW hill — Aug 2022, April 2024 and Jan 2025. Other dots for nearby areas, but not the hill. The point still being…SDOT’s focus should be elsewhere.
    - Kyle March 27, 2025 (11:16 am)
      
      The 3 dots are the location coordinates where collision data can be recorded. Since January 2020 there have been 48 collisions at those 3 dots on Highland Park Way. 2020 is kind of a ridiculous start time though because it includes time before the traffic light was installed at the top of the hill (A great safety improvement) and the ENTIRE time the west seattle bridge was closed. But hey if you want to use that timeline it’s still only 48/~6,000 collisions in West Seattle alone, so 00.8%. Didn’t have the time but guarantee Avalon, Admiral, and Olson Pl SW will have more. Oh, and the West Seattle Bridge will have more than all including the 2 year closure.
    - Kyle March 27, 2025 (11:22 am)
      
      @Jake you are doing the exact same thing. You just cherry-picked anecdotal evidence to prove your point and ignored the larger data set.
    - Look Both Ways March 27, 2025 (11:23 am)
      
      @Jake, not skewing stats, just citing them. Your anecdotal link refers to an incident at the intersection of HPW and Marginal…not the hill. Even if hill incidents are actually 3x vs. what’s reported (doubtful), they’re still far fewer vs. bridge / other areas where SDOT should focus. That’s the point.
    - Jake March 27, 2025 (11:59 am)
      
      Guess what, that counts, the start of the accident was… on the hill. Not “anecdotal” when the point was to show that accidents are not covered. And no need to do strawmen with other roads that could also use diets. HPW and Avalon, Bridge, etc. being problematic can all be true. No need to compare. My original statement is correct, there are LOTS of HPW crashes. But keep moving the goal posts.
    - Bbron March 27, 2025 (1:22 pm)
      
      @Look, @Jake, @Kyle I have been wrong on the 100+ collisions on HPW; I didn’t hit the “Filter By” after creating a selection, and my initial skim incorrectly confirmed to me that they were all after my chosen 2020 date. You’re right, tho, that 2020 was an arbitrary 5 year lookback, so instead I’ll collect data starting from October 2022 which is after WSB reopened. I’ve downloaded the data to compare between HPW and the WSB (between the curve and the 35th Ave intersection). There have been 13 vs 21 incidents respectively; however, on HPW there has been 5 injury causing collisions (1 serious) vs. 4 on WSB, and on HPW 8 of the incidents have been cars colliding with other vehicles vs. WSB where there have been 9. An interesting aspect between those 2 sets of collisions is that the majority of them that happened on WSB occurred during wet conditions while for HPW the majority of collisions has been during dry conditions. A hypothesis I would draw from this is that on WSB drivers aren’t adapting to the weather conditions while on HPW drivers are intentionally hazardous in ideal driving conditions. For all the comparisons between these 2 locations (my own included), it looks as if they’re pretty similar in terms of “danger,” but 1 location is demonstrably more harmful especially when considering the amount of traffic that each road handles (HPW having significantly less traffic volume than WSB in this timespan). It’s true that this is out of around 2k totally incidents across West Seattle for the same time, but in terms of injury causing incidents, there are around 600 meaning both locations have about 1% of the injury incidents. After some review of this data, I agree even more with SDOTs focus to calm HPW with a lane reduction. (Note for @Look: click on the dots then look at the bottom left and right corners of the modal that pops up. You’ll see the incident count at that dot, and can cycle thru them with the arrows.)
    - Kyle March 27, 2025 (4:57 pm)
      
      Glad you are actually using data now, but not updating your dataset to start when the West Seattle bridge reopened is a huge miss for your analysis. Half of that time there were no accidents there because there were no vehicles. I don’t think I’ll ever convince you otherwise but there are ways to increase safety without reducing lane capacity, like a midline barrier which the West Seattle Bridge has.
    - Bbron March 27, 2025 (1:40 pm)
      
      @Kyle regarding Avalon, Admiral, and Olson Pl SW those are longer stretches of roads with more intersections, but you’re right that they have about the same or more injuries in the same time span. Admiral and Olson Pl SW should also get lane reductions like HPW. Hopefully SDOT will fast follow after a successful reduction of HPW.
    - Kyle March 28, 2025 (7:12 am)
      
      Avalon already is one lane, so would this even make a difference?
    - Bbron March 27, 2025 (5:32 pm)
      
      @Kyle “but not updating your dataset to start when the West Seattle bridge reopened” I did, see: “so instead I’ll collect data starting from October 2022 which is after WSB reopened”. WSB reopened September 2022. I’ve always referenced data before making statements. This time I misinterpreted it. I didn’t base anything off of feelings like this quote: “[it’]s not true [HPW… has lots of crashes] compared to other arterials in West Seattle based off SDOT collision data” which as shown doesn’t hold up to the data. How would a lane barrier prevent that the majority of those injury collisions were rear endings? The WSB area gets just as many crashes even with a barrier.
    - Kyle March 28, 2025 (7:18 am)
      
      Sorry, didn’t see that you had updated the start date. If you look at collision numbers in the teens over a 2.5 year span and think halving the road capacity is a good idea I don’t think we will ever agree.
    - Bbron March 28, 2025 (11:23 am)
      
      @Kyle in your opinion how many people should be injured by reckless driving before something happens? how far in the past do fatalities have to be before they aren’t considered a factor when rechannelizing a road?
    - Kyle March 29, 2025 (7:51 am)
      
      Bbron, I get your stance. You don’t drive and must have a job where you don’t need to leave West Seattle and would be minimally impacted if every road was restricted to one lane. Maybe you’re lucky enough that the only bus route on the hill, the 131 takes you where you need to go. Or maybe you don’t even ride that route and just want to make it miserable for everyone else. I think there are likely many other factors besides the number of road lanes that contributed to those collisions. Please stop trying to make me out to be a monster who doesn’t care if anyone dies in a car. Of course I do. I also live in the real world and if crashes are that low and mostly rear ends, like you say, I still don’t see why you can’t lower the speeds with speed humps or some other solutions that doesn’t create bottlenecks to lower speeds. I’d also argue there are more important uses of SDOT’s money if crash volumes are that low. The bike lane and path can be improved while leaving the lane capacity alone. Pretending vital lane throughput off of West Seattle for jobs, doctors appts, living life, and affording a mortgage to live here seems narrow sighted of you. Maybe you are lucky where that doesn’t affect you, but it would for many others.
    - Bbron March 31, 2025 (1:09 pm)
      
      I don’t drive, correct. That’s the only correct assumption. Evergreen is the weird assuming drivers need to do about those with viewpoints that could potentially inconvenience their car travel to not only dismiss them, but to justify and rationalize their own car ownership and how it leads to some “better” lifestyle we can’t imagine. I bus, bike, and walk. I commute to DT daily for work. Surprisingly, I do have a vested interest in this hill: it’s the only missing link in my bike ride to get to South Park, a place I love to go to volunteer and commerce. The lack of a bike path is a huge burden (a burden caused by the normalized, deviant behavior of drivers). I’m not making you out to be a monster; however, I’d reread your utilitarian viewpoint that some people must be injured or killed for the convenience of cars. The only thing I’ll accuse you of is being unimaginative; that there could exist a world without vehicular harm. Cars are not inextricably linked to human living, and it brings me sadness to know some people truly believe that to be the case.
- Kyle March 26, 2025 (5:05 pm)
  
  This is not true compared to other arterials in West Seattle based off SDOT collision data.The West Seattle bridge by far has the most crashes.
  - CAM March 26, 2025 (5:37 pm)
    
    I have no idea how many crashes either of these routes have relative to the # of people that drive them daily. But what I can tell you is saying that one has “the most” crashes doesn’t mean nowhere else has a disproportionately large number of crashes.

KT March 26, 2025 (12:58 pm)

First they had a “plan to add safety enhancements” and now they are “continuing to explore safety improvements”. So nothing in other words.

Brandon March 26, 2025 (1:41 pm)

They need to raise taxes again first.

Paul March 26, 2025 (1:42 pm)

SDOT continues to amaze me at how much the cannot actually do, and then the “improvements” cause worse traffic.

Tony March 27, 2025 (6:45 am)

False. Traffic isn’t caused by road design, it’s caused by too many people driving.

Jon Wright March 26, 2025 (1:43 pm)

Maybe if people just did what the “Slippery When Wet – 30 MPH” sign said they wouldn’t be hurtling off the road.

Marcus March 26, 2025 (1:54 pm)

Yeah, drove it Monday with damp pavement, at speed limit and with really good tires. That bump of pavement discontinuity was surprising and I clinched on the steering wheel. SDOT NEEDS TO DIAMOND WHEEL THAT AREA—-NO EXCUSES!!!!!!!!!!!

bill March 26, 2025 (8:28 pm)

The speed limit provides a margin of safety for dry pavement. Driving safely for the conditions is the driver’s responsibility.

spunout March 26, 2025 (1:56 pm)

This spun out truck was spotted there Monday morning, one day after the Jeep in the above pic. I feel like I’ve seen 20+ cars spun out there in the past couple of years.

Lola March 26, 2025 (3:38 pm)

Spunout, this truck was there for a good 4 or 5 days as I saw it on my way home from work on 3.21.25 . It was finally gone on 3.24.25. I thought maybe it was stolen and they just had not gotten around to towing it

Melissa March 26, 2025 (2:39 pm)

Good gracious. It’s a speed issue. If a driver goes the posted speed limit through that curve, it’s really not a problem. However, if a driver ignores it, the elements and road (curved, hill) may well cause them to spin out or lose traction. Slow down, people. Please. And stop blaming the city.

Jeff F. March 26, 2025 (2:46 pm)

Where’s Rob Saka on this issue? You’d think someone so concerned for safe left turns in West Seattle would be out championing a $2 million fix to this problem.

DRW March 26, 2025 (3:05 pm)

He takes the Delridge exit.
KBear March 26, 2025 (3:49 pm)

Careful, Jeff! We don’t want the median barrier to get the Curby treatment!

John March 26, 2025 (2:50 pm)

Too many of these speculations avoid the supreme cause of these accidents – SPEED.

High-school-physics analysis of concrete panels (billiard ball smooth!) and the up-force of a “bump” would fail to roll a vehicle at a safe, for the conditions, speed.

Hundreds of thousands of vehicles of every sort manage to successfully navigate this turn through all types of weather.
The trick?

Slowing Down.

By the way, has anything changed at the other WSF west bound at the 99 entrance accident area?
We expected a slew of accidents there unless demanded changes were made.

Look Both Ways March 26, 2025 (3:39 pm)

Your comment presumes that the incidents are only the result of speed. That’s false. I’ve seen cars flipped from just leaving a parking space. Multiple people speed here without issue. Multiple others drove the speed limit or under, and still suffered incidents. The road is the problem, and SDOT needs to address it.
- CAM March 26, 2025 (5:41 pm)
  
  Ha! Summary: so many people speed here that when only some of the speeders crash it means it has nothing to do with speed. So therefore, everyone should speed! It is completely safe and doesn’t cause crashes!
- Bbron March 26, 2025 (8:43 pm)
  
  okay, so the road is a constant, you’ve seen speed varies but doesn’t determine crash or not. only difference is the car and the driver, so sounds like it’s primarily the driver’s skill issue operating their vehicle of choice. how are thousands of people able to navigate the corner in all conditions without issue, and when there is a crash it’s just 1 at a time? doesn’t add up that the road surface is the issue.
my two cents March 26, 2025 (5:45 pm)

Well John, if we want to talk about college level as opposed to the high school physics you referenced; not taking into account resistance rate, /angle of camber + vertical, center of gravity, etc. Also what a driver feels or senses may not always be completely indicative of the actions being taken (electronic driving technology) or the action the vehicle is receiving. There is. not a one size fits all reason.

a danger for all March 26, 2025 (3:55 pm)

There’s nothing SDOT can do to prevent people from speeding. But there is something they can do to prevent accidents in this area: fix the road. While I’m very careful to drive the speed limit in this area, I can’t control what other drivers are doing.

Repercussions from an accident can happen in the moment (from sideswipes, sudden stops, etc) or in the time it takes to rectify the situation, such as fender benders due to rubbernecking, etc.

It is a consistently dangerous area to *everyone* at any speed due to the constant occurence of accidents since the bridge re-opened. And it’s insane that SDOT won’t do anything about it.

k March 26, 2025 (4:03 pm)

Wow, SDOT. Now I will have to keep driving this stretch of road and not crashing like every other time I guess.

Wendell March 26, 2025 (4:18 pm)

IIRC The pavement surface(s) on the eastbound side of that section of the road change as well, but we don’t see all the spin outs. Probably because there’s more of a chance of folks driving at the speed limit, moving off from the lights at 35th and Fauntleroy.

Marcus March 26, 2025 (4:21 pm)

I agree people are driving too fast and speed is probably the biggest contributing factor. However with that said there is a problem there. If Saka really cares about his district he needs to respond. Again diamond wheel the stretch like WDOT did on I-5.

Stewpid March 26, 2025 (4:45 pm)

The people who are denying that “speeders exist” are the speeders themselves.

I’m almost 64 & haven’t been in an accident in 35 years. I drive the speed limit +/- 5mph depending on driving conditions, day vs. night, etc. Unlike some, I do not drive 40mph on California … for those that do, YOU ARE THE PROBLEM.

We’ve all seen them, the drivers who HAVE TO BE IN FRONT. They’ll speed past you … on the bridge or 35th … just to get ahead (sooo important to get ahead!!!), only to remain 1 or 2 cars in front at the next red light or slow down … stupid.

CarDriver March 27, 2025 (6:16 am)

When you’re driving 5 over you are breaking the law and therefor you are the problem. Your justification for pointing fingers is?? And, by the way if you’re driving slowly and impeding cars behind you that is also a traffic infraction under the law.
k March 27, 2025 (11:34 am)

So all the confirmed reports of people who were going the speed limit still skidding or spinning out here are, what, doing it in solidarity with speeders? Trying to start a new Tik Tok Craze? Just haven’t wrecked their car for a while and have the FOMO? The road is an issue, even if it not 100% of the issue in 100% of crashes.

jw March 26, 2025 (4:57 pm)

Let SDOT put in stops signs with camera’s just before that curve. That will slow them speeders down. Give tickets to those disobey the stop sign.

Kyle March 26, 2025 (6:33 pm)

Clearly it is speed and design related. Too many people are taking the curve too fast for what it was designed for. This is no different than hundreds of other freeway ramps etc. To make it safer increase the pavement traction etc. so that it is safe at those traveled speeds. Or redesign the road ahead of it so that it is impossible to travel those speeds when reaching the curve. As long as the lane throughput stays the same SDOT can pick whatever is cheapest IMO.

Dave March 26, 2025 (7:13 pm)

I think we’re seeing professional malpractice at SDOT – they are ignoring a problem that they’ve been told about repeatedly. They will get sued, they will lose, and we the taxpayers will foot the bill.

Bbron March 26, 2025 (8:46 pm)

Y’all sue folks give me a chuckle. If it’s so open shut, why hasn’t anyone done it yet? Probably that pesky RCW that make driver’s responsible for driving their car safely.

Jason Red March 26, 2025 (7:28 pm)

We passed a $1.55B transportation levy focusing on bridge safety and they won’t fix this?

The problem is worse for rear wheel drive vehicles the oversteer.

NotFastOrFurious March 26, 2025 (8:20 pm)

I have gone over that area many times, I drive slow and…my car is fine? When you read about all the crashes that happen there from fast drivers, I don’t feel the need to test it out for myself.

Dog Whisperer March 26, 2025 (9:48 pm)

It works fine when used as directed.

Drew March 26, 2025 (11:51 pm)

I’ve driven that road for 35 years without incident, and I’m not any kind of amazing driver. Just don’t go crazy fast. Honestly, self-driving cars can’t get here soon enough.

Art March 27, 2025 (6:59 am)

After nearly being hit by many too fast drivers on this little crest, I avoid this whole section by exiting and entering the bridge off Avalon.

Thomas March 27, 2025 (7:04 am)

How many of these accidents involved top heavy SUVs?

Peter March 27, 2025 (8:25 am)

The main problem is overwhelming majority of drivers in Seattle completely ignore speed limits. The secondary problem is the prevalence of high center of gravity SUVs with bouncy suspension. When driving the speed limit in a sedan there is no problem with this curve or the road surface. It comes down to individual drivers, how they choose to drive, and what they choose to drive. It’s weird that drivers are blaming the city for their own bad choices. Take some responsibility for yourself.

ShermanO March 27, 2025 (11:20 am)

Over and over people say it’s just speed, and they repeat that they have never had a problem. But notice that all these vehicles off the road are trucks. I hardly notice it in my VW Golf, but truck based vehicles with a solid rear axle, like my 4Runner, behave very differently. The combination of the curve, the two bumps unloading both rear tires at the same time, and the surface change has a very different effect from the independent suspended cars that most people are driving. Yes, slower is better, but it’s a dangerous condition because it is so unexpected from any other curve I have ever encountered. It is the surprise of it that is the problem. This should not be treated as divine vengeance because you think people drive too fast. People are going to get hurt.

Anonymous March 27, 2025 (2:06 pm)

It’s obvious the tires are too big for the vehicle, not the right size. Add speed to the equation and guess what? You’re going to rollover! Not rocket science.

CarDriver March 27, 2025 (3:37 pm)

How are you judging the size of the tires? How do you know they’re “too big”? What was their speed? Were you following them?? Please share your evidence. Or are you simply keyboard speculating.

Anonymous March 28, 2025 (7:10 am)

I drove by the rollover this past weekend. Tires are way too big. The driver should’ve been cited.

Anonymous March 28, 2025 (10:41 am)

Putting tires that are too large for a vehicle can increase the risk of rollover. Larger tires can raise the vehicle’s center of gravity, making it more prone to tipping over during sharp turns, abrupt maneuvers, or sudden changes in direction. Additionally, oversized tires can affect the vehicle’s handling, stability, and suspension, further increasing the likelihood of a rollover, especially in high-speed or off-road situations. It’s important to ensure that tires are within the manufacturer’s recommended size range to maintain optimal safety and handling.