Update: 2 stabbing victims found in Westwood Village area

AH Resident October 10, 2013 (7:01 pm)

We had just come out of Target. All buses stopped, 5 police cars…stay away from the are!

sophista-tiki October 10, 2013 (7:01 pm)

holy crap!~ all hell is breaking loose around here.

jrr October 10, 2013 (7:05 pm)

Someone is on the pavement in the parking lot in Westwood village. Being wheeled away by paramedics.

smokeycretin9 October 10, 2013 (7:06 pm)

I just saw on Facebook, that it was multiple stabbings. Fudge!

WSB October 10, 2013 (7:25 pm)

Smokey, we have full details. Yes, two victims.

Carolyn October 10, 2013 (7:29 pm)

And we were just getting ready to go to Target an hour ago, but decided not to go tonight. Weird. Geez, is any place safe anymore?

mehud October 10, 2013 (7:37 pm)

I was walking by the Barnes and Noble toward my car parked at Chase bank and heard yelling and saw five teens (four males and a female taking up the rear) running past McDonalds toward the QFC. Wonder if they were involved? Multiple police cars and a firetruck were on the scene. The aid car was arriving as the teens were fleeing.

Bradley October 10, 2013 (7:56 pm)

I had just pulled up to the McDonald’s parking lot as there were too many cars in the drivethru when I heard a lot of yelling and pointing from pedestrians in the area. I got out of my car to see younger male was rolling around in the fetal postiion and yelling in pain near the McDonald’s dumpsters on the asphalt, holding his gut. A nurse in blue hospital scrubs rushed over to his aid. Several police officers on foot arrived and quickly spread around the area looking for the attacker. Many teens and younger adults who know one of the victims were giving conflicting stories of what happened. McDonald’s closed their dining room before I left. It took the ambulance a long time to get there. Very chaotic scene. Too many rough-looking teenagers being allowed to congregate around WW Village these days, so this doesn’t surprise me at all.

amy October 10, 2013 (7:59 pm)

We were just down there…hubby was driving and did a u turn rather than drive through that area right when this was going down, it seems. Yikes

heather October 10, 2013 (8:37 pm)

How awful.

evergreen October 10, 2013 (9:00 pm)

Almost took my young kids to B & N tonight, and we would have probably stopped by McD’s. I really don’t feel safe in WS anymore, and am wondering if I should raise my kids somewhere else.

A October 10, 2013 (9:09 pm)

A lot of gangs in WS.

Ashley October 10, 2013 (9:10 pm)

Wow! I’ll be doing my shopping elsewhere. I haven’t felt safe there lately. There are always thugs and homeless all over the place. Harrassing me as I walk by or asking me for money.

DTK October 10, 2013 (9:14 pm)

Realtor.com

M October 10, 2013 (9:20 pm)

Drove into Westwood Village just after his happened around 6:45. There was a young teen on the ground in a fetal position who looked to be in a lot of pain. A group of youngish teenagers were crowded around him and some police officers or security personnel on foot were on the scene. It seemed that it took several very long minutes for emergency vehicles to arrive. There was also an emergency vehicle near Staples and, later, several in front of the bus stop across from Target. Very scary looking scene. Most of the group of kids looked pretty young – maybe early high school years at the oldest. Completely changed my mood from my previous anticipation of going to the Whie Center Art Walk.

Gabby October 10, 2013 (9:25 pm)

I am at Westwood Village often and will continue to shop there -Barnes & Noble is one of our favorite places in west seattle. I have not personally ever been harassed or asked for money at WV as a prior commenter has. not once. I carry mace in my hand and stay alert at all times in the parking lots there, especially after dark, as I would anywhere. No way I am letting ‘gangs’ or whatever keep me out of my neighborhood mall. SPD is often present in the parking lots too -I see patrol cars around all the time and really appreciate it.

Hope the kids make a full recovery, and I hope the perps are caught.

Gabby October 10, 2013 (9:29 pm)

The medics may have been late because a pedestrian was hit and killed by a train in SoDo at around the same time. Do we still only have M32 in west seattle? If so we really need another one.

WSB October 10, 2013 (9:40 pm)

Gabby – yes, Medic 32 is the only one based here. Here’s the 911 log showing who was dispatched where –
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http://www2.cityofseattle.net/fire/realTime911/getRecsForDatePub.asp?action=Today&incDate=&rad1=des
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Jim P. October 10, 2013 (9:32 pm)

Always seems to be a pack of loud and unruly kids/teens at or by the McDonald’s in the afternoons and evenings.

I was inside it on night when they closed down their seating area. Couple of mid-teen kids came up and when told the dining room was closed, they practically battered the doors down, screaming and yelling.

I’ve noticed more bums hanging around the shopping center too, panhandling or just taking up space on the benches.

Not encouraging.

B October 10, 2013 (9:47 pm)

This is awful. I hope the young men make a full recovery. I shop at Westwood village often and won’t change my shopping habits. These things happen in the junction, the admiral district and alki too. If I said I was not going to one area of west Seattle because I was scared I wouldn’t be leaving my house ever!

datamuse October 10, 2013 (9:50 pm)

+1 Gabby

Greg October 10, 2013 (9:54 pm)

The police have to secure the scene before any fire or medics are allowed to go in.they stage nearby until police give the ok.

Gabby October 10, 2013 (10:07 pm)

Yes it appears M32 was dispatched to Fauntleroy 25 minutes before the stabbing call, and our other nearby medics (10 and 44) were on the scene of the train collision. Seems we need another medic on the Peninsula.

Rick October 10, 2013 (10:12 pm)

“You’ll get over it” Remember that quote. You own it.

Eric1 October 10, 2013 (10:22 pm)

I hate to see this kind of thing. I don’t feel unsafe there but since it is the only shopping center around, there will be crowds of teens. It doesn’t help that Westwood Village has become a Metro “Transit Center”. You don’t hear much good news regarding transit centers.

Seattlite October 10, 2013 (10:54 pm)

Tragic. Today at approx 3pm while I was shopping in Target a bald, intimidating looking, bully-type guy walked into Target with 3 off-leash large, muscular mastiff type dogs. The clerk that was checking me out jumped onto the checkout counter scared to death of one of the dogs. This guy let the dogs roam the store off leash and into the bathrooms. The guy did this to scare people in the store. It was terribly creepy. I think Target mgmt chased him out but it seemed to take a long time. I don’t know if Target called the police or Westwood’s security.

Susan816 October 10, 2013 (11:02 pm)

I tended to the young man near the McD drive thru, noting his injuries were potentially dangerous. As an RN and former Ff/medic from CA, I understand that sometimes fire and medic units are delayed as a matter of chance, calls, etc. The police responded quickly and immediately helped me render aid. It did feel like forever until the engine crew arrived, but again, I’m not familiar with stations or staffing. Excellent job to our West Seattle public safety crew. And kudos to the other nameless citizens who volunteered their jackets, kind words, and encouragement in the face of senseless violence. To the kids who witnessed the events but “don’t know” anything when the police ask… May you be haunted by your apathy.

Amanda October 10, 2013 (11:04 pm)

The Westwood/Roxhill/Arbor Heights Community Council are having our regularly scheduled meeting on November 5th from 6:15 – 7:45 pm at the SW Library. We will be discussing Roxhill Park and things we can do to make it safer and more accessible to everyone. If you are interested in this conversation, please join us.

Steve S. October 10, 2013 (11:04 pm)

I lived in North Seattle most of my time here and the crime was just as bad. Gangs, assaults, rapes, murders, property crime. It’s a city, not a gated community.

“If I said I was not going to one area of west Seattle because I was scared I wouldn’t be leaving my house ever!” Damn right. I feel safer here than Capitol Hill or god help me, downtown. Live in a city, become streetwise, and you’ll probably be ok.

bswans11 October 10, 2013 (11:22 pm)

Oh weird, NO WAY!! THERE?? Umm, if you are surprised then you either never drive by there or are so involved in your own world, you are oblivious to the world around you. I don’t have any suggestions except maybe PARENTS quit being the garbage they are. No, I’m not talking about those parents that give an F. I’m referring to those that grew up under chitty parents and instead of taking a stand and saying “I’m not going to be the garbage parent my parent was”, they say, “Well, this is how I had it, so why should my kids get treated better”. Get your chit together, you are the problem, not your kids. They are the result of your low self esteem, no goals, “everyone else is at fault but me” crap that doesn’t understand that there is a community that DOES give a chit, IS willing to help, and DOES NOT GIVE A FUNK about your past. We want good people, good kids, good life that doesn’t fu k with the tough job we already have being parents. Join us and BE A FUGGUN DECENT PARENT! Give a chit about your own damn kid!! We didn’t make your kid, take some responsibility!! I’m not religious, but I know you are, so follow the Jesus you always chatter about. Rant done.

AlexDex October 10, 2013 (11:44 pm)

@Susan816 I for one are happy you’re here. Thank you.

Laura October 10, 2013 (11:51 pm)

Thank you Susan816 for your help as well as to the others that also helped those victims. You are one of the reasons this is still a good place to live.

Jesse October 10, 2013 (11:56 pm)

Doesn’t surprise me I’m in the same age group as the victims and have been around Westwood for years and in the past year or so it has changed for the worse it use to be safe and fun place now I fear I’ll be robbed or worse. Police need to crack down on teen gangs !

datamuse October 11, 2013 (12:26 am)

Target has their own security, Seattleite. That sounds really unnerving. :(

Alki Resident October 11, 2013 (12:38 am)

bswans11- Do you swear that much around your kids? Talk about parenting.

Native West Seattleite October 11, 2013 (1:03 am)

Target, Barnes & Noble & QFC all have their own security and there is also security for Westwood Village as a whole. But the whole Westwood area has definitely changed over the last few years. I believe there is definite gang activity in that neighborhood now and there are a LOT of transients at Westwood now as well. I honestly think the main reason for that is because it’s now the end of the line for 2 buses straight from downtown… The C Line & the 21. Westwood is not a “bad” place, but the once safe, clean neighborhood shopping center known as Westwood Village is long gone.

T October 11, 2013 (2:31 am)

Another reason to shop on amazon.com.

evergreen October 11, 2013 (4:26 am)

Alki, I think he is upset and unnerved to read about a 15 year old getting stabbed. The frightening thing about this event is that we are raising kids in a supposed “safe” neighborhood in Seattle that seems to be becoming rife with gang activity. I question my choice in raising my kids here. Am I doing a disservice to them, will they face dangerous pressures when they become teens? How safe are the high schools to which we send our kids? Are the younger ones even safe playing in their own yards? Would it be more responsible to raise them in suburbia? Sometimes it feels like suburbia here, but am I deceiving myself? As a parent, I am plagued with worries and wonder if the risks are worth expensive housing and pretty views.

ws born&bred October 11, 2013 (6:19 am)

The youth and gang violence in the neighborhood has reverted back to the way it was in the early 90s around here. Except back then there were a lot of projects here and no SPD west precinct by the Home Depot. You were lucky if SPD showed up at all if you didn’t live in the nicer Alki or Admiral neighborhoods. This is sad, but not new. When children are living lives without hope for their own future, this is what happens. The cycle of life.

WTF October 11, 2013 (6:45 am)

+2 Gabby

Wouldn’t give the PsOS the satisfaction of slithering in and pushing us out. Don’t. Just don’t.

Ted October 11, 2013 (6:51 am)

Please contact Westwood village and boycott shopping there until they improve security

I am scared to let my wife and kids shop there with the bums and other riff raff that is getting worse
http://www.westwoodvillagecenter.com/go/contactus.cfm

You have to hit them in their $

kayo October 11, 2013 (7:01 am)

Thanks for helping the boy, Susan. He was lucky a medical professional was there to help him. I was at Westwood earlier in the day and felt completely safe with my small child. I am not going to hide in my house just because of this. I am honestly more likely to avoid the Alki area because of this type of activity, especially in the evening. It is better to be vigilant and call police when you see something suspicious, but hiding only allows this type of activity to proliferate.

Jp October 11, 2013 (7:06 am)

That’s just plain stupid it’s gang violence nothing westwood security can do about it….walk around west’hood’ I bet youd see the suspect. The same shady people are around all the time I’m afraid to be at castle park because of them

m October 11, 2013 (7:33 am)

@ Susan816 – So glad you were in the vicinity at the right time. Thank you for stepping in to help.

Iggy October 11, 2013 (7:45 am)

I am also a long-time Westwood Village shopper, and I have also noticed the past year something there has changed for the worst. There are many more transients outside the stores and on the sidewalks. Early morning, before 10 am, and after dark are getting downright scary. I can see the business at Barnes and Noble after about 4 pm has really fallen off. We no longer go there to browse and have coffee in the evening. I used to walk from the SW Library to Barnes and Noble and back in the afternoons, sometimes cutting through on the path by Henderson. No more!! There have been several muggings, and it is no longer safe neighborhood for older folks walking alone. I, too, have noticed the Transit Center has been a major cause. Sad. I’m hoping the Westwood Village owners can get with the SPD and work out a solution, since I am sure Westwood Village revenues are going to be hurt.

Friend O'Dinghus October 11, 2013 (7:53 am)

I followed the link above and wrote Westwood an email. I hope many others will as well. Here is the comment I sent to them, but it holds true for anyone concerned enough to be reading the comments here. Be safe everyone, but don’t be afraid. Hope you all have a great weekend.

“Good Morning,
I am writing today to express my serious concern in regards to the violent incident last evening at your shopping center. It is regrettable, and these things are going to happen unfortunately, but as a consumer in your immediate vicinty, and as a long time Westwood shopper (15 years now and counting) I must say I am becoming increasingly upset by the things I see while visiting the shopping center. Last night’s events prompt me to write, as I feel we must all do something together as a community to stem the tide of lawlessness which is creeping it’s way into Westwood Centers vicinity. I will be working with my immediate neighbors to come up with working solutions, but a large effort must be extended by the shopping center’s management to stop this in it’s tracks, Yes, this means money. Lot’s of it. Between the continuing lack of opportunity for teens and everyone else caused by our economic malaise, and the new ‘end of the line’ proximity for the metro lines, the game has changed substantively.
If Westwood intends on maintaining it’s status as a safe, fun, and interesting destination for shopping, then you must step up your game in a big,big way; invest the money required to create a VERY safe environment round the clock and throughout the entire area. Offer internships, ride alongs with security, community outreach (particularly to teens),work with the local middle and high schools as a way to show the students that if they are willing to work then your businesses are willing to hire, much increased cooridination between all security personnel at each individual business along with SPD; immediately tackle this bull by the horns as it were. Not window dressing, but the quarter million a year minimum it is going to require to hold the line on the crime and vagrancy. If you do not, it is going to take a whole lot more money to bring it back in the event it slips further into lawlessness, as I and many others will simply drive elsewhere to shop, or increase home delivery of products. Read the story on the West Seattle blog, in particular the comments section, then take up the fight along with the rest of the community until there are once again opportunites for teens which will occupoy there time, and allow them to become invested in their own futures. Get in front of this in a big way now, and maintain it, or there will be more, and more consequences for inaction or under-reaction.
Thank you for being a nice place for us all to visit and shop. Please, please, please make the investment, pursue the changes required, acknowledge that the status quo is no longer working as the dynamic has shifted in a big, big way. Sincerest regards.”

anonyme October 11, 2013 (8:00 am)

I work in the area, and it’s gotten much worse since the transit addition. I spoke to one woman who lives in the neighborhood who will no longer walk through Roxhill with her PIT BULL – the criminal element that has taken over the park being much scarier. I’ve seen what appears to be drug dealing on the park bench adjacent to the bus stop – the new Westwood stop n’ shop. There is drug use by Sealth & Denny students all day long, and I would agree with others who have noted gang activity. That bus stop needs cameras.

T Rex October 11, 2013 (8:17 am)

Not surprised this happened, I only go to Westwood early in the morning for coffee, or to Target on the weekend mornings. Never there at night. It is becoming scary.

I have noticed since the bus changes, lots and lots of more shady people are hanging around that I see on my drive home. More people begging for money that are supposedly “homeless”. Sick of that as well.

And that story about that guy at Target with the dogs, that is just plain scary.

I think I will stay on the other side of 35th from now on, it is not crime free but I see less goof balls in my neck of the woods than I do in Westwood.

And thank you Susan for being a great person in helping possibly save that guys life. I hope it changes HIS life in a good way.

lizzie October 11, 2013 (8:30 am)

My husband and i got off the casino bus at Westwood around 7.30 pm, lots pf police and news media, a large groups of kids at bus stop , a car with blacked out windows drove by the stop very very slow, the group of kids started running after the car and shouting very very racist comments at the car. The Police there saw and heard this and made no attempt to do anything. Makes me have no faith in the SPD when stuff is happening right under their noses and they do nothing.

smokeycretin9 October 11, 2013 (8:30 am)

The idea of letting native trees and shrubs grow back in the bog area of Roxhill Park was terrible. Now thugs have a place to hide/do drugs/drink/camp. I say burn it down to grass level again. And install some lights in the park for gods sake.

datamuse October 11, 2013 (8:32 am)

In case anyone missed it, there’s a note upthread about a community meeting on Nov. 5th. I would encourage people posting on this thread to go–sounds like a good opportunity for discussion and ideas to address this issue.

CandrewB October 11, 2013 (8:34 am)

I am always curious as to where the bums are going on those rare occasions I take the C Line home from work.

mhp October 11, 2013 (8:56 am)

Many folks have spoken about boycotting Westwood village. I have always been aware of a massive police presence, especially after dark. Most of the teens who hang out there are probably harmless as the homeless are too. White fright and flight are all too common and cause more segregation rather than unification.
I am 5 feet 2 inches at best.. I am never bothered… wanna know why? I straight up look these people in the eyes, and smile say hi… that shows that you recognize them as a person, you are not scared and if for some reason they arw looking to attack they know you jave seen their face. Also, really when has a random shopper been victimized?

D. Johnson October 11, 2013 (9:04 am)

Since I have moved into this area and live across the street from the mall and next to the transit stop, it has been interesting “people watching”. With the skate park open, high school and jr high added to the neighborhood is it any wonder we have some problems here.I don’t know how many “problem folks” ride the buses to come here – some days it seems like a lot
We just have to watch out and pay attention to our surroundings. .

Mrs.C October 11, 2013 (9:07 am)

I am a long time West Seattle resident and a frequent shopper at Westwood. I agree that the criminal element appears to have increased. But, I remember the projects and all the activity that went with them. The good and the bad for over fifty years. I don’t think staying at home and hiding is the answer. We need to continue as we have always done and show the undesirables that we intend to stay. I have seen worse and then better so hopefully this too shall pass. People taking a stand is the first step to improvement. I do want to add one thing, what’s the deal with dogs in stores??? I love dogs and have been a dog owner for many years. Have not ever taken them into a store for any reason, with the exception of a pet store maybe but often times not. So the guy in Target, what the heck???

Buddsmom October 11, 2013 (9:10 am)

At CandrewB…There several encampments in the woods at the park. People coming and going out of the bushes at all times of the day,discarded clothes and such in plain sight of the bus shelter. I would rather walk the 2 miles uphill from 35/Barton rather than wait for a bus at Westwood after dark.

alki forever October 11, 2013 (9:13 am)

I’m scared. I’m staying indoors this weekend.

Friend O'Dinghus October 11, 2013 (9:29 am)

Just a few additional thoughts before I push on for the moment. Thank you Datamuse…great reminder. Hopefully members of the community will turn out in large numbers, and also representatives from the large anchor stores, Westwood Center, SPD, Metro transit police, along with resource counselors from Sealth, Denny, and SW Community center. One can hope. Cooridination and sharing of information goes a long, long way.
In regards to your question CandrewB, just my opinion here, but where have ‘bums’ always gone…think warm, dry, lucrative. The ‘end of the line’ status of Westwood Village makes it the desitation as they ride back and forth across the city…doing nothing (hopefully), or worse, causing problems. Perhaps now they have chosen Westwood Village as their staging area for distribution of illegal ‘goods’ which they use Metro to deliver down to the favorite hang out known as the Pioneer Square area, or even worse Third and Pike. I bet the 15th Ave SW and SW Roxbury area has improved substantially now (sigh).
I am neither heartless, nor naive. Many more transit cameras, prefarably with closed circuit capabilities for live observation and mobility, are for sure in order.
In addition to writing Westwood Village, I also just got off the phone with Metro Transit and asked them to be aware of the event, and also asked that the transit police review the story, and particularly the comment section here.
My next comments will be addressed to SPD, and then finally the King County District Attorney’s office regarding the ridiculously light sentencing I have noticed in other cases.
Stay strong everyone, remain vigilant and engaged when in public spaces (yeah that’s you Pad, Pod, Laptop, and Android users). Make eye contact, smile too, but do not ever, ever be afraid.

Ricky October 11, 2013 (9:35 am)

I am guessing this was an altercation between the two gangs that have had a tagging war going on the summer…
We can se the West $ide Bloods (red) battling the VL’s (Blue?) all around Westwood.
Keep your eye out and you will start to see these tags everywhere…

LH October 11, 2013 (9:37 am)

Westwood Village and the Target Store there are no worse than any place in the NW. My nephew is a top security official for the Target ‘chain’ and he works ALL locations in the NW. We have chatted in the past and the West Seattle Target store is ‘boring’ from a security official standpoint. This makes me smile! I hear a TON of stories from him on a regular basis, regarding crime/security in all of their stores – West Seattle is just an average situation. Regarding BSWANS 11, I TOTALLY AGREE! I have 3 children and I know first hand that parenting is not easy, it’s tough on everyone and it is much harder to do the right thing as a parent. Sure you could take short cuts with your children but why risk it? They are our future and they deserve solid, structured, disciplined values to help them be better people. Just my opinion!

Anonymous October 11, 2013 (9:47 am)

In regards to the comment made about the bald guy in target with the dogs, I’m wondering if it’s the same “bully-looking” bald guy with an off-leash dog (I only saw one) that walked across 35th just before the High Point library during rush hour. The car next to me (an escalade I think) had to slow down and the guy j-walking gave the scariest death glare and started walking up towards the escalade’s driver’s door, but luckily the driver was able to turn away and get away from the guy. Really freaked me out… and I wasn’t even in the car he walked up to.

anonyme October 11, 2013 (10:04 am)

The bus stop and park entry are used by Westwood thieves to go through their stolen merchandise and discard tags and packaging. I see it on a daily basis. Last week, an encampment sprang up at the entry to the park, complete with stolen trash cans, bins of belongings, tents, tarps. It’s gone now – probably just moved inward. Yesterday someone was setting off boat flares in the park. There isn’t a day goes by that there isn’t something creepy/illegal happening over there. One day I had to call police when I was followed/stalked from McDonald’s back to my workplace. The creep even came into the building after me.

I know the Roxhill Park volunteers are trying to clean and open up some areas and do some restoration. I’m all for native plants, but it’s just the wrong area for dense, untended vegetation.

D I D October 11, 2013 (10:05 am)

As someone who planted a lot of those trees and shrubs at the Roxhill Bog 15-20 years ago I am all aboard with razing the area of any plant that is not a substantial tree. Do it annually for a few years. Open up the area so there is no cover or hiding places. Many of the native shrubs that were put in will resprout/regrow from their rootstock. Having greenspaces that are producing undesired human behavior is NOT worth it. There are other places in the Delridge corridor area where this same problem occurs.

enough October 11, 2013 (10:11 am)

Take out the trash. I agree with the previous comment by Todd, pressure WW Village to clean up this area or boycott shopping there.
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The buses that park across the street block the view to the park which allows a lot of stuff to go on.
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Dont forget folks about previous incidents in this area including 2 deaths in the last 4 years or so, that I can remember, in the park area.
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Thanks for your insight Native West Seattlite. We’ll be steering clear of this area until things improve.
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Knowledge is power.

B October 11, 2013 (10:13 am)

I find it funny that when something like this happens on Alki (which it has!)that nobody is calling for a boycott.

Bob Dewey October 11, 2013 (10:36 am)

How is Spd supposed to clear out the mean or gang looking teens. They can’t just walk up to a group of teens and force them to leave when they are hanging out. People whine and scream that the police violate peoples rights or are racist all the time! Yet when something happens like this stabbing happens in the area where you go with your families all of a sudden you say security and police need to do more and target the gang looking people. The police can’t move people along because they look scary the person actually has to do a criminal activity to be told to leave.

SouthParkDude October 11, 2013 (10:44 am)

I was on scene with the multiple stabbing before the authorities – I just wanted to point out that this was clearly gang/wannabe gang related.

Bunch of kids wearing red, kids taking off articles of clothing when the cops arrived, kids saying ‘we saw nothing’ and then turning around and whispering about ‘nah I got rid of it’ and ‘yo, he went over there’ and plotting to ‘get him.’ Just wanted to clarify these were not good kids, this was not a random thing, and when you wanna be a little gang banger, these things are going to happen. I have no intention of stopping my shopping trips to Westwood because of a couple punks.

WSB October 11, 2013 (10:46 am)

Just added police update to the story.

McBride October 11, 2013 (11:02 am)

Amanda, thanks taking a lead on community representation and advocacy. I encourage folks to contribute thoughts to the next Westwood/Roxhill/Arbor Heights neighborhood council meeting at their website, http://www.wwrhah.org.
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Some years ago, Westwood Village regularly sent a rep to the Delridge Neighborhoods District Council meetings. It’s been on my list to ping them about re-engaging, I’ll be doing that today.
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This is a good neighborhood, filled with good people. From time to time it is necessary to work for change. Do the most excellent thing, folks.

OnHolden October 11, 2013 (11:08 am)

Well, at least they weren’t shooting each other. That’s my attempt at a silver lining.

Tired of painting out October 11, 2013 (11:10 am)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folk_Nation

I have been painting out tags from this group on my garage all summer and fall. I don’t even leave it up long enough for non emergency police response. West Seattle High, Madison, Lafayette area.

Kayleigh October 11, 2013 (11:23 am)

I had no idea Westwood had declined so much. I’ve been going there since I was a little kid (when Sea Galley, Pay n Save, and the Junior Bootery were there.)
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I love the bookstore and will make a point of going there more often. I hate to see the punks win.

colleen October 11, 2013 (11:29 am)

Westwood Village and the bus stop there (which is where the ‘C’ line turns around) needs a greater police presence.

kevin October 11, 2013 (11:29 am)

If your scared to go to westwood or any where. Don’t go. Then tell everybody now scared you are .Show the bad guys they won. Sounds like a perfect Seattle passive aggressive solution. Go about your business. I try to avoid the blogs comments lately became its filled with know it all or or bleeding heart types. Please people WE love here. Contrary to things we read on the blog or watch on the news there are more good guys than bad guys in OUR neighborhood. Stop complaining. Do something. Get involved. See some thing, say something. It infuriates me to read people wanting to move. This is a great community. If you want to quit on it. By all means leave. West Seattle needs more backbone. We have to many people that walk around with their head down only focused on themselves. Then have the gall to rip OUR community for how bad it is. Have a great day.

WSB October 11, 2013 (11:43 am)

Thanks, Kevin, and I appreciate your comment – if you don’t feel your viewpoint is represented by comments you see, the only way to change that is to say something, as you are doing here. We do publish as many stories about the “good guys” as we can, not just “the bad guys.” Good-guys stories in just the past day, in case anyone missed them:
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Local retailer offering costume recycling “swap”
https://westseattleblog.com/2013/10/update-costume-swap-at-city-mouse-in-the-junction-tomorrow/
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West Seattle Food Bank celebrates 30 years
https://westseattleblog.com/2013/10/happening-now-west-seattle-food-bank-celebrates-30-years/
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Firefighters teaching kids about fire safety
https://westseattleblog.com/2013/10/west-seattle-scene-firefighter-story-time-at-southwest-library/
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Local company helps match disabled workers with local businesses
https://westseattleblog.com/2013/10/inclusion-works-northwest-center-invites-employers-to-see-for-themselves/
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That’s just since yesterday morning. And if anybody wants to check on ways to volunteer or donate, we categorize those stories here, newest to oldest:
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https://westseattleblog.com/category/how-to-help
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thank you
Tracy

Honest Abe October 11, 2013 (11:31 am)

Just curious how many alias account handles the WSB has. I love all of the narrative shaping that goes on in the comments of many of their stories. It’s pretty easy to prove.

WSB October 11, 2013 (11:47 am)

Abe, I resent your allegation of fraud and will publish it just so I can note that we have ZERO aliases. I remain signed on all day and all night as WSB and sign comments at the end, Tracy or TR. My co-publisher Patrick Sand occasionally comments as Patrick. No one else speaks for our site or posts on behalf of it, nor do we EVER comment under other IDs. You can disagree with what we cover, you can disagree with our commenting rules, but we are honest to a fault in everything we do, whether WSB-related or not. Thanks. – Tracy Record, editor/co-publisher (reachable at 206-293-6302 twenty-four/seven)

WWRes October 11, 2013 (11:37 am)

To the people who react to this stabbing by saying that they will be “staying indoors” or avoiding Westwood Village altogether, as much as I understand your frustration, I wonder how much change will happen if we just hide our heads or move every time something bad happens in our neighborhood?

I’m not a fan of the panhandling going on in the parking lots and at the entrances of Westwood Village, but I don’t really know what legal recourse we have. They are on public sidewalks for the most part. I see a lot of people giving them money, so it’s really our own fault. If they weren’t making decent money, they would move on.

Please don’t blame public transit riders for these issues either. Seattle’s public transit under-serves and the system and is shameful in comparison to other cities of similar size. Trust me, people waiting for the bus in the rain don’t want to be harassed any more than you do.

I’m going to Westwood Village tonight to spend some money. I encourage you to do the same.

DBurns October 11, 2013 (11:37 am)

This is indeed a tragedy. As a business owner at Westwood Village this is very important to me. I value the feedback from the community and want people to feel safe here. I want you to know that Westwood has recently changed our Security company and increased their hours. Their presence is being felt among the merchants and we have all met and talked about keeping alert and communicating any suspicious events or illegal activity. Please don’t feel like it isn’t safe at Westwood. We are a tight community and my favorite time of year is the holiday shopping when the center is bustling and we are really serving the community with great shopping (and food ;) options. We cannot let these incidents scare us out of our own neighborhoods. The outpour of community last night during the event was heartwarming, and there were a lot of scared teenagers as well. We need to have your presence in the mall to keep us together as a community. Imagine the alternative; a suffering, empty mall would be a terrible thing to have here. I understand that people are afraid, but when you feel better, keep the idea in your head to look around, engage with people, (teenagers too) and consider it your job to keep our neighborhood safe!!
Thanks for your faith,
Donna Burns
Owner, Giannoni’s Pizzeria

elikapeka October 11, 2013 (11:40 am)

I agree that the area has declined since the establishment of the transit hub. Metro needs to acknowledge the connection and increase their security. Having a line of buses constantly blocking the view of the park from Barton gives a lot of cover to illicit activity, and clearing the overgrowth would help too.

Having said that, I have no intention of curtailing my shopping trips to Westwood. In fact, maybe I’ll try and go a little more often. I remember when Westwood was a run down mall with nothing much to draw the community in. It’s so much better than it used to be. I don’t want it to go backwards. We are all responsible for our community, so I suggest we all plan a trip to one of the stores there, and keep the pressure on the mall, transit, and Seattle police to help us keep it safe.

bswans11 October 11, 2013 (12:05 pm)

@AlkiResident sorry for the excessive swearing, it just really gets me when this kind of thing happens repeatedly and nothing changes. 15 years old? Man oh man. And no, I don’t swear around kids, but when you are typing a rant, words come out that otherwise aren’t spoken :)

datamuse October 11, 2013 (12:06 pm)

LH, one of my friends used to have that job at Target, though that was a long time ago! I had no idea store security could be that exciting.

babs October 11, 2013 (12:08 pm)

Tracy – the haters will always hate. I just want to say that you and the rest of the WSB ROCK! Keep up the good reporting, I always come to the blog first for any news relating to West Seattle.

Wet Head October 11, 2013 (12:20 pm)

WSB, your integrity is obvious. I’d say what Abe is, but that violate the terms of use.

Alan October 11, 2013 (12:29 pm)

Abe, if “It’s pretty easy to prove”, then why does your statement end without any offering of proof? I bet all of your arguments start with “It’s a known fact” or “It’s been medically proven”.

riverview park neighbor October 11, 2013 (12:43 pm)

I’ve been living in the area for 13 yrs and have never felt unsafe at Westwood Village shopping center or White Center.This and most other assault cases in West Seattle (they happen in the Admiral District and Alki neighborhoods, too, don’t forget) are usually between people who know eachother; they’re rarely random attacks. I think community “fear” of the shopping center and White Center is an over reaction.

Captain90s October 11, 2013 (12:45 pm)

This is one of the many reasons I moved out of West Seattle (and indeed, Seattle entirely). Crime and violence is on the rise at an alarming rate. Shortly before I left, I had a kid try to mug me near my home (then in Burien). He couldn’t have been more than 14 or 15, but he felt nothing wrong with pointing his airsoft gun (painted black over the tip so that I would think it was real) at me and demanding my wallet. The look on his face when I produced my 6 inch hunting knife and told him to **** off would have been amusing, if it wasn’t so damn sad.

These kids just don’t understand that their behavior is not only unacceptable, but liable to get them killed. If I’d have been carrying my pistol in the aforementioned incident, I could very well have shot him. If I hadn’t noticed that the gun was fake, I definitely would have. And while I would have felt remorse after the incident, certainly, the fact of the matter would have been that HIS actions would have been responsible.

Back to the topic here, I don’t know how to address the problem vis-a-vis Westwood. The park across the street is certainly a contributing factor, but I would hesitate to label it the biggest one, as some people here have. The problem is much deeper-rooted than just the availability of concealment.

And THANK YOU, Susan, for being a Good Samaritan. People like you restore a little bit of my faith in mankind every time I hear about you.

anonyme October 11, 2013 (12:56 pm)

I’d love to see Westwood Village developed a bit with more variety in shopping choices. Some years ago, a cinema multiplex was supposed to go in there. Don’t know what happened with that. I’ve read that Barnes & Noble may be going out of business. That would be disastrous for Westwood.

Bunnyfer October 11, 2013 (1:00 pm)

WSB – you consistently win awards and kudos for your reporting (not to mention the love and respect of this community) for a very good reason. Anyone who says differently is not only ill-informed, but an unworthy individual with whom to trade words. We know your worth. Thank you, and please continue your superlative job.

Jonathan October 11, 2013 (1:01 pm)

You guys are misunderstanding Abe, I think he’s just saying that the commenting system, since it doesn’t force registration or a login, it would be easy to be one person and shape the narrative in the comments by posting multiple times. I don’t agree that that is happening, but I don’t think he’s talking a shot at WSB.

WSB October 11, 2013 (1:21 pm)

Jonathan – Just so you know, while it’s not foolproof, the administrative side of the system does enable us to watch for that, as it is against our rules for commenters to pretend to be more than one person in a single discussion, and we do see attempts on occasion, but seldom in a context like this – usually it’s where someone has something to gain out of it, financially for example, or trying to validate a claim that might not be true. If that really was the person in question’s intent – then s/he is welcome to e-mail us what they believe to be evidence of astroturfing/ narrative shaping /etc. and we’ll investigate further (editor@westseattleblog.com anytime).
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Also a general note, speaking of comments – Our spam filter is acting up today; if you are a forum reader, you know that a wave of spam has been getting through for the past few days (and we’re deleting it manually as fast as we can), and trying to get the filter system to recognize this particular format of spam has also led to it catching some legitimate comments. I’ve found a few and un-spammed them, but I might have missed some others since it requires wading through about 1,000 at a time – TR

Kevin October 11, 2013 (1:04 pm)

I wasnt trying to throw you guys under the bus WSB. Your guys are johnny on the spot for almost everything in West Seattle/DUB SEA. I was broad stroking media as a whole. My intent was not to single your blog out. The public should continue to flood non emergent hotline with complaints of transients and hoodlums. With a complaint law enforcment can actually stop and “talk” with those certain people.

Penny Lightfoot October 11, 2013 (1:07 pm)

The United States has been declining in opportunities for the young people for a number of years. Our education system needs to be addressed and improved. Discipline need to come back in both the schools and homes and then respect will follow. What do the youth have to look forward to without a good education which at the college level is way too expensive. The poor in America are growing in leaps and bounds. Stop manufacturing overseas and bring those factories home or America will become a two economy country, the rich and the poor with no middle class. We must learn to get along with each other, accept people for who they are regardless of color, gender or sexual preference.

miws October 11, 2013 (1:14 pm)

Yes, Abe, please provide documentation for your claims.

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Meanwhile, I’m going to read War and Peace, s-l-o-w-l-y, as I await your providing said documentation….

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Mike

Uncle Joe October 11, 2013 (1:20 pm)

WSB provides this community with the kind of straight forward, integrity based, just-the-facts reporting that the mainstream media abandoned long ago. As a former journalist, I appreciate that very much. Keep up the good work.

G October 11, 2013 (1:26 pm)

Why is it that half of the comments here are trying to covince us – and most importantly themselves – that aside of a few murders here and there, and run-of-the-mill property crimes (a lot), that everything is basically okey dokey? Hey, just take the precautions that you would take if you lived in Detroit (to use a cliche) and you’ll be fine!

This is a neighborhood in severe denial.

Update October 11, 2013 (1:50 pm)

Totally agree with Elikapeka (plus others) about the transit hub blocking the park and creating barriers that make it easier for criminal activity. Since the transit hub came that area is very unsavory. I am pretty secure but I don’t feel comfortable walking there by myself. I have never felt uncomfortable inside Westwood itself and I hope people keep shopping there. We need the businesses to thrive. We should make a show of support by shopping there whether having a slice at the pizza place or going to QFC so that these thugs don’t win.

JTB October 11, 2013 (2:11 pm)

Donna Burns, Thanks for your comment which serves as a reminder there are local small business owners at Westwood Village just as much as national chains. I urge everyone to continue supporting the businesses at Westwood, complain to the agencies mentioned in this thread, and be smart when you’re out and about in the city.
And, Donna, thanks for having the kind of pizza that is dear to my heart.

gil October 11, 2013 (2:11 pm)

There are so many comments claiming that this has become a bad neighborhood because it’s become a transit hub or there are a lot of bums hanging out or gangs prowling the area. I wonder how many actually became a victim of crime in this place? Could it be that the really bad neighborhood they’re talking about resides in their minds? I’ve lived here for 17 years and I’ll not go anywhere. Last time I checked there’s still plenty of my neighbors and their kids enjoying the castle and skateboard park. Oh yes, it’s still a beautiful neighborhood around here.

Heather October 11, 2013 (2:23 pm)

I have lived just North of Westwood village for 11 years. It’s a great neighborhood with lots of families and neighbors walking. I’ve noticed an increase in panhandling at all entrances but I see this throughout the city. There has definitely been a rise in gang activity but I believe that was expected with the release of several persons who had served their prison time … at least I seem to recall reading those stats several years ago. I will continue to shop there. The economy is still rough for many – it’s middle class areas that reflect it. However, I’m all for an increased police presence at the park and around the area. There are a lot of children in this area.

West Seattle since 1979 October 11, 2013 (2:25 pm)

I don’t think they were denying there’s crime. It seemed to me like they were saying ” yes, there’s a lot more crime, but I’m not going to hide in my house. I’m going to go out, but I’ll take precautions and be alert at all times.”

danny October 11, 2013 (2:53 pm)

yes we have all seen the rash of ugliness going on in west seattle of late, plse just keep a eye on one another and each others prperty. must admit i am really tired of all the pan handlers at all the entrances , they have a way of making me feel guilty for having what i have grrrr i work hard and resent it any way i think if we all work as a COMMUNITY
we can put a stop to this crime! but remember that means maybe helping some peopl that we would usally turn away from! so pull up youpants and be ready to help not let them fall by the way side. where was the calmer heads that should have prevailed here?

Tess October 11, 2013 (2:54 pm)

Wow…the minute by minute…updates and comments as its going down…Next step for you all..invest in your local youth. I’m a mixed latina born in white center, I’m sure if I had not spent my youth as a classically trained dancer and ended up at Cornish and Pacific Northwest Ballet…I’d a hung out at mcD’s as well and had plenty of opportunity to run into a Friday night skirmish involving weapons…these kids are just mirroring us all. And wow, great coverage WSB…if you’d like a story that provides an inside look…into how some local schools and dominate culture fail todays youth of color and economically challenged, hit me up as I have a 17 yr-old male son who was raised in spain and didn’t encounter our American ways until he was in the 6th grade. Needless to say, we received a very intimate, well documented and undeniable reminder of personal biases towards youth of color in this area. All the comments were interesting and yes, G, white center, west seattle and burien are in severe denial. “So the Thugs don’t win.” Classic- the thugs would be better off if minimum wage were raised, the gop cooperated with a black president and we all just took a step back from trying to live the dream and worked on dealing with reality.

CubanRefugee October 11, 2013 (2:57 pm)

G,

The neighborhood isn’t in denial. Everyone knows that something needs to be done, but hiding your head in a hole in the ground like an ostrich isn’t the best answer.

People really need to read and understand the SPD blotter when situations like this occur: “The group of friends had gone to Westwood Village when they confronted another group of Hispanic males”

This particular incident clearly wasn’t a random “two people walking around shopping and were stabbed.” This was one group that had the intent to start something with another group.

I take my 2 year old daughter to Roxhill park almost daily. Am I going to stop that? Absolutely not.

The point a lot of people are making is that you can’t live your life ruled by fear. If you do, then maybe it’s time to buy a bunker under your house, and just live out the rest of your days in solitude.

Alan October 11, 2013 (3:08 pm)

I’m certainly not in denial of crime in the area, but I do think that the WSB has made us more aware of it. This is both a blessing and a curse. It used to be that you could see what was clearly a massive police action and never hear anything about it in the local news. Now (and I mean this sincerely), we are fortunate to have the WSB providing this information. Usually before we ask about it. For some people, this is clearly too much information.

I agree with my fellow Riverview Park neighbor. Fear is an over-reaction. It is always a good idea to be aware of your surroundings, but don’t let this change your routine; anymore than news of car accidents keep you from driving.

Drive carefully.

datamuse October 11, 2013 (3:10 pm)

I’ve never lived in Detroit, but I did grow up in D.C. when it was the homicide capital of the U.S. No comparison. Obviously murders, violence, robbery, etc are not “fine.” But neither is hiding in your house or deciding to never go near the shopping center again.

TK October 11, 2013 (3:11 pm)

I was the nurse in the blue scrubs. I seen him collapse and immediately jumped out my car. Thank you to the nurse who arrived shortly after me and was a huge help. It did seem like it took a while for the aid car to show up but who knows what else was going on at the time. I hope he and his brother recover, I feel so bad for their parents. Scary call to get. God Bless them all

Susan816 October 11, 2013 (3:17 pm)

Thank you all for the kind words regarding my small part in last night’s tragedy. And thanks (to most of you) for your thoughtful discussion regarding safety at Westwood Village and West Seattle in general. As the mother of a two year old, I frequently shop at WV and visit the new park adjacent to the property. With the exception of last night and one verbal altercation I witnessed near the 24 Hour Fitness, I haven’t had seen any negative interactions. What troubled me most about last night was, what one poster also noticed: the absolute refusal by a few young men to aid the police with identifying the assailants. “You know the local gangs around here. You can figure it out!” Are you kidding me?

This happens far too often, and we then see revenge attacks, retaliation, etc. allowing this violence to perpetuate. If I could have identified those punks, you can bet I would have. Unfortunately, all I saw were a bunch of cowards, grabbing their saggy pants and running as fast as their scared legs could take them. I’m NEVER avoiding our local shops so a few jackass teenagers can take over. Let’s have increased police presence, let’s come together to report infractions as they occur, and remember we our our brothers’ keepers. Thanks again.

Tess October 11, 2013 (3:23 pm)

Oh,and one more thing,,,MY 17 yr-old made it safe and sound from burien to Columbia city to partake in a great youth musical program…he made it safe and sound. My thoughts and prayers to those families traumatized and injured.

Auburn now October 11, 2013 (3:57 pm)

Oh where is Charles Bronson when you need him? I dont miss the west side a bit, or the nancy, pushovers that live there.

JoB October 11, 2013 (4:02 pm)

this hobbling little old lady shops at Westwood.. day and night.. by herself..without incident.

i will likely be stopping by there later this evening.

and yes, there are transients there..
but my experience with them has been that as long as you don’t hug them their unwashed smell won’t rub off on you

i can’t stop hugging, so i try to wear washable clothing while shopping there

i'mcoveredinbees October 11, 2013 (5:11 pm)

Over half of these comments are so extreme and reactionary. Get over yourselves! I can’t help but to think there is a bit of racism happening underneath your fear mongering. “Bands of unruly teenagers hanging out at McDonalds”. Good God. Yes, the stabbing is unfortunate but these things happen everywhere. And the business at Barnes and Noble has always been like that. You’re taking your own fear, some random observation that isn’t even fact based, and then making some broad assumption which just spreads fear and unrest. You’re not even concerned about the actual victims of the stabbings. I’m sorry but I am pissed. That is so selfish and entitled!!

Thank you, Donna for your update. I think we should continue to support these businesses. I like Westwood because it’s a mixed community, not in spite of it. Barnes is a gem and we have spent many winter nights there, holed up with a great book.

Ultimately, I am sorry for the victims and their families. Speedy recoveries.

West Seattle Hipster October 11, 2013 (5:56 pm)

Auburn now, Charles Bronson passed away in 2003.

.

Why, do you think the criminal element at Westwood Village needs acting lessons?

sophista-tiki October 11, 2013 (6:11 pm)

I’m still reading through all the comments. BUT I noticed lots of them about the transit stop and how metro needs to increase security. Every damn time I drive by that stop I think ” Thats the worst possible place they could have put that thing”. MOVE THE STOP, its obviously causing a hugh headache and NOW traffic is blocked where it used to flow right past the bus in addition to all the other problems its clearly causing. I think the whole thing is ass backwards.
I also have to chime in about dudes hanging out with their bad dogs at the entrance by B of A , WORST POSSIBLE PLACE to panhandle. I walk buy there almost every day with my dog. That dog goes berserk barking at us, and when Im trying to drive out of the parking lot they are a hugh distraction . There are ALWAYS metro busses sitting there blocking the veiw of oncoming traffic from the north, and all summer the sidewalk trolls have been parked out there on the other side. DONT LET THEM HANGOUT THERE its a major hazzard. All in all the increased bullsh-t thats been going on around here for the past yr is bound to put residents on edge. I still shop at WV but I come home pissed off every time because I had to run the gauntlet of aholes.

Larry Liberal October 11, 2013 (6:14 pm)

Calling them HISPANIC is Racist…

The suspects, only described as Hispanic males, fled the scene.

Cait October 11, 2013 (7:12 pm)

Coveredinbees hit the nail on the head. And I will add that if anyone in this thread was there at the time, you would not have been in danger of being stabbed. Clearly, this was a targeted attack. Get over yourselves and remember that two people were ACTUALLY stabbed. And why not be heartened by the fact that there were kind nurses there who offered to help them.

Sure, something should be done about violence – but the undertones here are telling me that it’s about something else for a lot of you.

Amy October 11, 2013 (8:41 pm)

I don’t have high regard for the Westwood Center security workers. I was in the 24 hr Fitness this morning and a very scary man was standing outside the window staring me down on the treadmill. In the eyes, wouldn’t look away. Didn’t look away for ten minutes; very threatening look. I’m a New Yorker; I don’t threaten easily.But I got off the treadmill to ask the counter person to call mall security. In the meantime, mall security walked right by him and didn’t even notice him harassing gym goers. I have never seen mall security at Westwood Village do anything.

Amy October 11, 2013 (8:43 pm)

And-green plants do not “cause” human behavior. Leave the native plantings alone; arrest or better yet find housing for homeless people sleeping in the bushes. There was a time in Seattle when poor people could afford SROs; they were all torn down to make fancy office space which is 40% empty, last I heard…Bad city planning, bad economy, not all about bad people. Arrest the ones who are doing drugs; house the rest. IMO

Buddsmom October 11, 2013 (9:08 pm)

The simple fact is violent crime in the Westwood area has risen. Period. What as a neighborhood can we do? Call SPD after the fact? I’ve been harassed during shopping trips on more than one occasion during the middle of the day. Most times a polite “no” works,but I’ve been called names I will not repeat here because I refuse to comply at their request. I worked in Belltown for 14 years and never was called such names. You can now buy hard liquor at 4 stores at Westwood, this does not help the situation. Do not get me wrong,I am not a tea drinker by any means, my point is we need to look out for each other.

SR October 11, 2013 (9:59 pm)

Sounds like a healthy discussion was started by this sad man to man violence. I don’t live very close to WW so didn’t realize some of the things I’m reading about in these comments but I’ve never personally had a sketchy interaction with anyone there while shopping. I’ll continue to shop there after this incident because I support west seattle business and because violence is happening all over seattle to random victims. You and I are always at risk to some degree as long as guns are embraced with abandon in this society and media delivers violent and polarized messages (Tracy, I’m not talking about WSB. You do a GREAT job of presenting the good guys and the nice/inspiring news in WS, thanks). Police presence is no guarantee of safety. Our youth and our society are in trouble. Fear, in my opinion, won’t help either one.

GayCynic October 11, 2013 (10:58 pm)

Le sigh.

Many here make good points and then fail to realize that more than one issue plays a factor in a neighborhood in decline.

Yes, without a doubt, heavy brush (native or otherwise) provides cover to a wide range of illicit activities including camping (often by felons and predators not welcome in emergency housing), ambush opportunities, drug dealing, prostitution.

Regrettably, that is not the the only factor (for if it were it would be an easy and obvious fix – cut it down, and things are all better).

Also in play are gang and gang wanna-be players that, while they direct their primary unpleasantry amongst themselves, place those around them at risk of violence and criminal activity.

Next on the list we must look at ourselves – are we alert? Do we call in potential violations? Have we implement safety plans not just for our homes, but for our persons?

Surely, the very best safety plan of all is to “be where the trouble isn’t.” Unfortunately, that doesn’t always work out.

Can you run away? Successfully? And do you know when it’s self-defense to deploy pepper spray or other tools to preserve your safety – and when it is some variety of assault? And when, even if you started out in legitimate self-defense your actions change into assault?

Finally, have you joined a block watch? Do you carry a cell phone in case of trouble?

We each have a part to play in reducing criminal violence in Seattle – and not all the answers that *work* will be warm and fuzzy.

Joe October 11, 2013 (11:24 pm)

I NEVER go to Westwood Village without my (licensed) concealed pistol anymore (except I now boycott the Starbucks there). Over the past 22 years I’ve witnessed two parking lot robberies, my wife stopped two men from stealing her SUV, been cornered in my car door by a crazed panhandler, was chased into the gym by two men who started arguing with me when I was the gym manager, saw 10-12 QFC employees tackle and disarm a robber in their store, seen several fights and domestic violence incidents, etc..However, with all of the above, it’s still better there now than it was 15-20 years ago and I’ll continue to shop there.

Native West Seattleite October 12, 2013 (4:07 am)

Ricky, your comment went rather unnoticed but you are absolutely correct. I haven’t noticed the tags but I know people who knew the victims and were there when this happened and they gave me the names of the victims who I looked up on Facebook and instantly saw pictures of them throwing up gang signs in red with red bandanas. I’ve been told by people close to this that it’s exactly what you suspected: an incident between the West Side Blood and VL (Varrios Locos) gangs, the same graffiti that you mentioned you’ve seen in the area. Good observation, and stay alert because these sorts of things tend to get worse before they get better (escalation & retaliation). I just want everyone else to be aware of these particular gangs.

anonyme October 12, 2013 (7:16 am)

Buddsmom brings up another good point. If you talk to the management of stores that now carry liquor, they’ll tell you that shoplifting of liquor is a huge problem. I’ve not only witnessed it, but one day saw a young man taking bottles off of the shelf at Rite-Aid and drinking out of them. The park entry is littered with bottles, most likely shoplifted. There are a whole lot of issues here that may not be unique to Westwood, but they have definitely converged on this area.

BB October 12, 2013 (8:46 am)

I live by the south parking lot of Lincoln Park. When we moved in 12 years ago the park was totally out of control. There would be up to 50 to 100 teenagers drinking in the parking lot every weekend. There were gun shots, a stabbing, fights, destruction of park shelters, broken beer bottles in the kids play ground, drag racing up Fauntleroy and destruction of neighbors property. Our neighborhood worked with the SW precinct captain and the parks department to come up with solutions. It took years but step by step it got better. I encourage everyone commenting here to get involved and meet with the SW precinct Captain…they DO care about your concerns and they will work with the community.

WSB October 12, 2013 (8:49 am)

I should have mentioned by now that the next chance to meet with local police leadership – if not the captain, the second-in-command, Lt. Pierre Davis is almost always there – will be this Tuesday, 7 pm, at the Southwest Precinct, for the monthly West Seattle Crime Prevention Council meeting. Speakers for the next three meetings are already listed on the WSCPC website: http://wscpc.blogspot.com – but each meeting also includes a significant amount of time for crime-trend briefings and Q/A with attendees and police. – TR

joel October 12, 2013 (9:53 am)

I don’t call 2 bangers getting knifed in a gang fight ‘victims’. maybe after a few knife stabs the 15 yr old goes to school and the 21 year old gets a job….IF they don’t get shot dead first.

any of these bangers got parents around?

sophista-tiki October 12, 2013 (9:54 am)

some of you are such hypocrites.

Just a few days ago I made a big stink about random creepy lurkers in parked cars hanging out infront of my house for extended periods of time. ( one block from WV) AND instead of believing me, I was immediatly dismissed as a paranoid nut.
Because how could I possible know anything, or be able to tell the difference between something nortmal and something weird going on INFRONT OF MY OWN HOUSE.
What a bunch of pollyanna high horse riders.

roundthesound October 12, 2013 (2:46 pm)

The VICTIMS were with one of their parents. Whatever you facebook detectives figured out about what color the victims were wearing I think you’re failing to see the larger problem: there is a maniac running around our neighborhood stabbing people.

Delfino October 12, 2013 (3:48 pm)

There are a number of view points expressed here. Being raised, going to school, living and working in this neighborhood for over 50 years, I think I understand. I’ve probably felt most of emotions expressed at one time or another. At first, I felt like staying out of the conversation. Every time some major incident like this happens, the same arguments have their 2 or 3 hours of interest, then most go right back to business as usual. However, because I’m closer to this situation than most, I feel the need to say something.

Over half of my time in this community has been spent as an educator at Chief Sealth High. I have worked primarily with the Chicano/Latino (Hispanic) population. I was here when we didn’t even know what a gang was, and I was intimately involved in the mid 90s when it was widely recognized as a major problem.
One commentator compared the situation today to then. IMO we are not even close to as bad. Neither are we all afraid, racist or totally ignorant.
Some one said we are a community in denial. They were somewhat correct. We have a gang problem! It has been cyclical, but never gone away.
The outward signs of the resurgence of activity have been all over and clear. Although I don’t have enough information to directly tie this incident to any specific groups or individuals, Ricky and Native West Seattleite are right on. The tagging war of the last year and two summers has been highly visible. It took nearly two years for the City, property owners and community to respond and clean most of it up. Gangs not only communicate with each other with tagging, but unfortunately gain legitimacy among their peers the longer their tags are allowed to stay up. Any tags, whether gang or otherwise needs to be painted over immediately, even as quick as in 24hrs. The formal, legal process used by the City can take up to six months! The City will provide materials if the community provides the organization, labor and follow through.

There are some very caring, talented and committed people and agencies intervening and making a difference in this work. Workers from SWYFS, YMCA, SPD, City parks, Denny and Chef Sealth Consejo and El Centro de la Raza are but a few. They are underfunded and need the help and support of the entire community.

A number of people have mentioned meetings taking place in the community. If you truly care, participate. I have proposed a “graffiti “hit squad” but had no takers. We All need to get involved!

Someone else brought up the economy, and conditions that push youth and the disenfranchised away from making this the kind of community we are proud to live in. I agree with you.

I have a message for all you business owners out there. In all my experience with gangsters, from mildly interested to wannabes and hard core, I’ve have never known any leader or heavily involved member with a good job. Given the choice between being able to help out or support a family or owning desirable possessions and gang activity, the vast majority would make the right choice. So hire them before they get into bad behaviors.
To Joel and others, my experience is that most parents of these kids are looking for help to keep their kids safe and away from gang behavior.

Finally, there are two things I wish everyone understood. First, very few youth are involved in this behavior, most are amazing, but we all have a role to play in keeping our community safe and desirable.

Sorry for the long response

Eric October 12, 2013 (4:10 pm)

Ricky and Native West Seattleite,

A friend of mine who lives in the apartment complex that is to the immediate south-east of the Westwood park told me that recently a group of people have moved in. Now he says that there is constantly a group of about 8 to 10 youths wearing all red, hanging out outside, being belligerent, and disrespectful to anyone passing by.

I think wannabe gang bangers can be more dangerous than the real deal, as the wannabes are out to “prove” themselves and create drama to feed their fictional personas.

datamuse October 12, 2013 (10:19 pm)

Delfino, I like what you say here. I’ve only lived in the area since the late 90s but I remember some exciting times (like, a SWAT team earnestly wishing to talk with my neighbors at 6 am exciting) back then. Have definitely noticed the recent uptick in tagging, but also noticed that most neighbors’ houses (mostly their fences, really) and businesses that get hit have been quick to clean it up. I happen to be on a work sabbatical this year and am hoping to be able to be more involved in the neighborhood and community as a result.
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Honestly, my biggest worry at Westwood was always getting hit by a car.

Bradley October 13, 2013 (3:03 pm)

I have lived within a block of WWV for over 5 years now. The problems at WWV are really in 4 major areas these days: 1: The new transit stop at the south side of Barton. The idiots at Metro built an island in the middle of the street that makes traffic come to a complete stop when only one bus stops to pick up or drop off passengers. We have all seen traffic being backed up west past Target during busy times of the day. More cars are cutting through the Target parking lot to bypass going further east to enter into the east entrance to avoid this concrete island/bus trap. Why there hasn’t been more public outcry over this is beyond me. 2: The complete lack of effective security at WWV. The “guards” are seldom visible and are almost always new due to their high turnover. I’ve called the security there before on more than one occasion with either no response or a pathetic one. I have called the company that manages the mall to complain and I encourage all WWV shoppers to do the same. 3: The large amount of teens demonstrating threatening behavior and the aggressive panhandlers who are allowed to congregate without challenge are turning people away from WWV or at the very least making their shopping trips shorter. We cannot ignore this fact. The SPD needs to spend more time patrolling this mall. 4: The new skateboard park across the street at Roxhill park has attracted what every skateboard park anywhere in the country attracts: drug dealers, creepy adults who are too old to be hanging out with teenagers, and troubled kids. Many of the newer gang elements who are hanging out around WWV are now hanging out at Roxhill park, drinking booze that they stole from the numerous WWV stores carrying it now, and selling drugs to the much larger number of kids in the park.

danny October 14, 2013 (9:33 am)

well said delfino!

Ricky October 14, 2013 (11:43 am)

Native West Seattleite & Eric,

Thanks for the acknowledgement about WS v VL as the gangs involved in this incident.
NOW how do we get the police to crush these two groups before someone gets hurt in the crossfire?
In my net search I found the VL traditional territory is White center…why would they by pushing into west Seattle now?

anonyme October 14, 2013 (1:36 pm)

Bradley, that pretty much sums it up.

Native West Seattlite, thanks for the gang info. It was rumored that the recent armed robbery in Arbor Heights was gang related. They all wore purple bandanas. Any idea what affiliation that might be?