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September 19, 2008 at 1:16 am #639502
JoBParticipantJenny..
it may well be true that the fannie mae and freddie mac meltdown will blow over..
but with the addition of the Ins bailout.. which i truly hope will be the only one…
every American doubled their portion of the national debt this week.. and that might just take a while to work our collective way out of…
yup, the big bad mean GAO said that you can’t take on a company’s liabilities without adding them to your own books.
i suspect you may be fine no matter what happens to our economy in the next few months..
but i can guarantee you that that most Americans are not going to financially recover from the hit their personal portfolios have taken from the excess of greed in the last few years.. nor are those who have already lost their homes because the financial institutions thought it would be better to cut their losses than renegotiate their loans.
After all, the mortgage companies could count on the largess of the American taxpayer.. and the corporate heads had golden parachutes worth millions…. while individuals got stuck holding their worthless stock.
You can only blow smoke up an orifice so long before people realize all they are getting is hot air.
If hot air is being blown into a balloon it can create a breathtaking sight…
but it doesn’t do so much for humans.
September 19, 2008 at 3:59 am #639503
angelescrestParticipantAnother perspective:
In the 70’s, when I went to college, paying for it was NOT an issue…my parents paid what they would, I took out a loan for the rest, paid it off when I graduated: I never thought about it, nor did I worry about finding a job, a place to live, etc.
Is it the same for my children? Oh, come on. We’re in major panic. As my ex was recently laid off of his job as an editor at a major newspaper after 25 yrs., we can only hope that our sudden lack of income and need of financial aid will get the kids through college…’cause loans? We’re all well aware of the college loan debacle.
Those w/out kids won’t feel this–and I haven’t seen it discussed on the board here–but it’s a huge issue (that some of the Ivys have addressed by offering free tuition to families that earn less than whatever).
And, try to find a job now…
September 19, 2008 at 5:37 am #639504
charlabobParticipant“It’s reminiscent of the Great Depression: FDR’s actions dragged the Depression on for TEN FRIGGING YEARS – but he was only doubling down on Republican Herbert Hoover’s earlier clueless reactions to what started out as merely a sharp recession.”
Jenny, could you possibly cite some source for this outrage? Once again, I’m left thinking, she’s got to be kidding!
September 19, 2008 at 2:18 pm #639505
rs261MemberFDR’s new deal has been debated by economists as speeding the recovery as well as lengthening it. I dont think there is a definitive answer on if it helped or hindered the recovery time period.
I see the economy from a financial trading standpoint as well as the farmers market standpoint. I just realize that just because corn prices reached a peak price of 8 dollars a bushel in July, those prices are more readily noticeable now. However…now that the prices are 5 dollars a bushel, I have a feeling that those prices will be reflected in the december farmers market. Granted September last year they were around 4.50 a bushel… and peaked around 5.50 in june 07.
I think most people hear prices on the news, and hear about the riots…and keep that in their mind until they next hear prices which doesnt happen often when they return to normal levels. I see the market price, as well as the final product price, and realize it takes time for the price move (up or down) to get to me. And I for one at least know what to expect 3 months down the road, and can plan accordingly.
Wheat prices have also dropped back to “normal” levels at around 7 dollars a bushel…vs the $14 they were in Feb and march of this year…which again…do you hear about the tortilla riots now?
September 19, 2008 at 3:38 pm #639506
DunnoParticipantAfter traveling around the country and reading this blog I’ve come to this conclusion.
Everything wrong in this world is King Bush’s fault. Companies in the US are made for one thing, screw the little guy.
Best way to get elected, promise something like change, that could change these things above, that will likely change.
Thats it in a nutshell!
September 19, 2008 at 5:10 pm #639507
JoBParticipantrs261..
if you are looking at commodity prices.. things look like they are improving… and they may be.
if you are looking at what has happened to your food bill in the last year or so.. or the last decade… not so much.
the thing i like about the farmer’s market mentality is that commodity futures are measured in farmshares.. and buying one guarantees that food will be grown on the land using sustainable practices and … as long as anything grows, you will benefit.
even better.. i can invest in the small community gardens, do good and still get great food.
I know that the commodity markets are a necessary part of our world economy and i am not anti-market… and i do realize that the existence of favorable futures prices does stimulate production…
but the amount of influence trading future shares in essential commodities has on both production and price does bother me.
Not enough to call you a dirty rotten capitalist though ;~>
the world market is infinitely complex and there are no simple answers.
But it is time that Americans woke up to the realization that they are engaged in a world market and that the practices which make American firms more competitive in that world market may not be practices that are beneficial to the citizens of this nation.
We need a public conversation about how we can best serve the needs of American businesses through legislation and still serve the needs of infrastructure and public services for our citizens.
If nothing else, the latest financial collapse should make the need for that conversation apparent.. that is if we can get beyond panic and sticking fingers in dikes.
September 19, 2008 at 8:49 pm #639508
JennyMember> charlabob: “It’s reminiscent of the Great Depression: FDR’s actions dragged the Depression on for TEN FRIGGING YEARS – but he was only doubling down on Republican Herbert Hoover’s earlier clueless reactions to what started out as merely a sharp recession.”
> Jenny, could you possibly cite some source for this outrage? Once again, I’m left thinking, she’s got to be kidding!
Here’s a start:
http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=3357
Powell’s book, “FDR’s Folly”, is a good, readable introduction to FDR criticism. The article above doesn’t mention (but the book itself does examine) how the New Deal was an extension of ideas that were very popular at the time – there’s even a quote from the head of the US Chamber of Commerce from around 1929 IIRC, about how fascism (i.e. tight gov’t control over the marketplace on the Italian model) is the wave of the future for the US economy.
I see the Great Depression as a big, painful learning experience for modern economics, so I give them a bit of benefit of the doubt, even though most of FDR’s major initiatives look tragically foolish & obviously counterproductive in hindsight.
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