- This topic is empty.
-
AuthorPosts
-
December 23, 2011 at 6:20 pm #739159
waynsterParticipantKootch we just seen were the republican controled congress’s true colors were this past week….They don’t give a dam about the middle class its all big business just like it has been…Boehner called out on the carpet by his own party in the senate and the Wall Street journal….. The wrecking ball has swung congress is in deep tea mud along with the gop candidates who refused to take a stand in favor of the middle class….One could say crunched like the wallnuts being cracked for bananna bread come November…..
December 25, 2011 at 8:19 am #739160
kootchmanMemberYou got taken to the friggin cleaners! You don;t even know it. democrats rely on constituents like you. The middle class got slammed with a 10 basis points charge on new homes, re-fnanances etc… for the next 10 years, 20 years if it extend for the full year. Ya got hit with a national home sale tax to pay for the $31.40 weekly benefit.. your Democratic Senate slid that in for ya. Adds about $6,000 to the cost or the average Seattle home. THAT was the love ya got from the Senate… ya gotta make up the shortfall in the SS fund…and since the economy is still in the crapper..they will take it out of the right pocket. Pony up sucker! You are in the dark dude… way in the dark. MSNBC come up with some new talking points? That figures out to be a good deal for you… the average SS payroll deduction vacation comes to $818 per year… and the average Seattle mortgage payments go up $ 6,000 ? That’s middle class friendly? Hell then, lets double up on tuition, fuel taxes, shoot no deductions at all…. nothing… no payroll deductions at all… we’ll just raise fees on everything we do… OH m’gosh… that’s a national sales tax or VAT… sorta de facto and backdoor but that what it amounts to… JpB …. it IS going through after all! A little sheep s wool on the wolf, but.. I guess ya can’t call it a flat tax eh? Sure adds a lot of downward pressure on housing price recovery.
Here’s what they did… Ya got taken… what we saw last week is how gullible and stupid we are…
Democrat legislation in the Senate and Republican proposals in the House would raise as much as $38 billion over 10 years to offset the tax cut by increasing the rates that the two government-controlled mortgage companies charge lenders to guarantee principal and interest on home loans.
Read more on Newsmax.com:
December 25, 2011 at 5:56 pm #739161
JoBParticipantkootch..
you don’t need to read someone else’s analysis of the bill..
the actual text is online
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c112:1:./temp/~c1126ISOp1::
You fail to mention two things in your rant..
the first is that the “pain” you mention in this bill was inflicted upon us by the Republicans who wouldn’t sign without it
and the second is the Keystone Pipeline provision … also insisted upon by your Republican brethren …
which pretty much guarantees that lease unless the president can prove that it is not in the national interests…
the keystone provisions in this bill are the larger issue for me…
but, you obviously think the points increase on federally guaranteed mortgages is a bad thing…
so.. please explain to me how putting the party who pushed it into power is a good thing?
December 26, 2011 at 7:51 am #739162
kootchmanMemberYea … well JoB the labor unions line up behind Keystone. We know you would take us to the brink of fiscal ruin to keep your credentials. Ya think we aren’t going to buy the oil? If Keytone isn’t built we are going to buy Saudi, Nigerian, Venezuelan oil… you won’t do a damn thing to lessen demand, unless demand slackens more due to a sicker economy…pipelines ARE infrastructure… If you are an eco warrior…look at the condition of the Niger Delta… that is an unregulated, extraction zone… murder. massive pollution on a scale that is breathtaking, government represession …unlike Keystone… All you do is increase our deficit balance of trade, send US dollars to hostile countries and of course the very obvious..kill union jobs. Way to think that one out. They are screwing the middle class….the problem is republicans rely on an educated voter…and they are fewer and fewer in number… we kicked the can and will have to go through all this bullshit all over again. All you have to hear…from your Messiah is.. “they are screwing the middle class” while he is in the midst of unzipping the iinstrument of screwing …. more middle income tax… more debt, new revenue streams… suckah !!! You have been had… again. If you were any thing near socially responsible… review what increased oil production will do to the Nigerian Delta and its people…
December 26, 2011 at 8:50 am #739163
JanSParticipantDecember 26, 2011 at 7:07 pm #739164
JoBParticipantkootchman
“We know you would take us to the brink of fiscal ruin to keep your credentials.”
????
I asked an intelligent question and you clearly failed to answer it.
December 26, 2011 at 10:53 pm #739165
kootchmanMemberwhat intelligent question? This one” “so.. please explain to me how putting the party who pushed it into power is a good thing?” makes no grammatical sense.. to me anyway.. can ya rephrase it?
December 27, 2011 at 5:25 am #739166
JoBParticipantkootchman..
LOL … So now grammer matters to you?
Here’s the thing kootch..
you can’t blame the democrats for crappy policies your tea party republicans insist on cramming into bills…
if you think those are good policies..
then applaud them.
if you think they are bad policies,
then why on god’s green earth would you support the idiots who shove this crap down America’s throat?
December 27, 2011 at 3:51 pm #739167
JoBParticipantkootch..
keystone is just more crap being shoved down America’s throat by those tea party “angels” of yours..
it’s real purpose.. to divert Canadian oil currently being piped to the midwest to port cities where it can be exported without every paying a penny of US tax…
i can see why you love it…
but it isn’t so good for the rest of us..
December 27, 2011 at 7:11 pm #739168
kootchmanMemberUh…balance of trade? American jobs? energy security that doesn’t have us dispatching the Atlantic fleet everytime there is a MidEast dislocation? Oil is traded on the Chicago Mercantile..as a commodity… meaning there are substitutive sources that will fill the demand… It’s not just the Tea Party that loves it… so does the labor movement…jobs jobs jobs…. or would you prefer welfare and perpetual unemployment checks? Have ya seen the taxes Keystone will pay? JUST property taxes.? “The study further concluded that once the pipeline is operational, the states along the pipeline route are expected to receive an additional $5.2 billion in property taxes during the estimated operating life of the pipeline” That is schools, infrastructure, etc… ya think they are going to transit across all those state lines for free? Plus they are in the main… Republican states!!!! That’s how we roll… private enterprise… someone has to pick up the check. The real America wants it….
December 27, 2011 at 7:25 pm #739169
JoBParticipantkootchman..
the estimates for those “American” jobs were over-inflated to begin with…
and they are for the most part exceedingly temporary..
and for what..
a huge environmental risk
that America picks up the tab for..
that energy security you speak of..
will go down the day the pipeline is functional
there is only so much oil and the current Canadian pipelines are far from flowing at capacity now
what America will get is a reduction in the amount of oil being delivered from Canada to America
with the resulting rise in prices for American consumers…
and no tax
except of curse for “republican” states…
Yup.. i see exactly how you roll
December 27, 2011 at 11:43 pm #739170
kootchmanMemberAll jobs are “temporary” but it will take 7 years to build it. Then add the extension pipeline from Bakkan fields … that’s 20,000 direct job related only to the actual pipelines. Ask ND about direct jobs and economic stimulus. At a 2 per cent unemployment rate it’s doing great. They have less than 160 wells and added 98,000 jobs ..Alaska’s “temporary” work on their pipeline still accounts for most of Alaska’s economic activity..pipelines sections replaced, new pumps, and the money has been flowing for how many year now? 30? . See private economic stimulus REALLY has a multiplier effect…where government jobs do not. Unless you are Nancy Pelosi. Ya think the hundreds of millions of $$$ fof jobs, services, lodging, food service, transportation, etc etc… and the BILLIONS in state taxes won’t mean … new school constructions? Highway improvements? There are how many thousands of Gulf oil rigs offshore now? Ya wanna drill some more deepwater wells? Did ya kinda forget the Bakkan fields are going to be added to the pipleline… gas prices are made in the international market… again you seem to not understand commodity prices…demand and supply are international. We will use the oil as much as anyone eles does…you make no sense..none. Do you have any concept of how much JUST the ND fields have… 300 Billion barrels!! That is the latest estimate from the UND Geological Survey… which is 10 times as much as the 2008 survey….
Quote from 2008 USGS which was underestated
But, according to the USGS, “the estimate of technically recoverable oil in the Bakken is larger than all other current USGS oil assessments of the lower 48 states and is the largest “continuous” oil accumulation ever assessed by the USGS.
Did ya read that JoB? American will always pay the market price for oil… if the world grain market is 4.50 a bushel for wheat… that’s what we will pay. Either from the USA, Ukraine, Australia, ..plus transportation costs. IF you look at a map .. the Keystone is shortest distance from fields to refinery. Of course you can let the Chinese fund the pipeline… and have the terminal in BC in the Puget Sound…eh? Perfect!! SIngle hull chinese tankers, navigating in Canadian waters would pretty much leave any environmental controls to Canada and China… Canada will sell the oil, no question about that. Of course if American want lower gas prices..we could cut the federal highway and fuels tax!!!! Now that would make a huge difference. Ya think Keystone is going to build an 12 billion dollar pipeline with no oil to pump through it? Only Obama does stupid shit like that…Solyndra, GM, Fiskar, etc… this is private capital at risk, not the taxpayers. You do come up with some wacko ideas about supply and demand…
Wouldn’t you rather have a 300 billion gallon strategic reserve right here in North America? Keystone will more than quadruple Canadian oil exports… add Bakkan…Gulf Coast drilling slackens…cause it is ar more expensive and risky. You’d rather we tapped Gulf wells at 8000 foot depths, in hurricane waters? Good thinking… NOT We are an energy dependent economy..the curse of developed nations..ya wanna just shut it all down and take a government check? That’s liberals on a roll.
December 28, 2011 at 12:07 am #739171
kootchmanMemberThe republicans took a very very stupid bill and got something out of it… yea it was a great achievement… they took an Obama tax increase on the middle class and managed to carve out jobs and private investment. Was it not you who blamed all those evil corporation for sitting on their cash and not investing …? Well they are investing… BIG time… not on whirly stick windmills and over capacity, overpriced solar panels that lose money and cost taxpayers dearly. Republican get private investment capital to get busy…. Democrats spend tax money, borrow to do it, and swell deficits…and increase the middle class tax burdens and try to blame 1% for the problem…. 1% certainly can’t cover the deficit… but is sure sounds so… “progressive” It is somewhat “fair” though.. the misery is spread on everyone. Oh, my gosh ANOTHER Senate Democrat isn’t running in 2012… and go figure … in a red state that the Keystone pipeline is going through…wadda ya know? What’s that? Six Democratic senators are not running for re-election? It is a zippity doo dah piece of news!!! Goodbye Ben Nelson…! ooops seven aren’t.
December 28, 2011 at 2:45 am #739172
JoBParticipantkootch…
try to control your glee..
you just got caught with your pants down
blaming democrats for the misery republicans put in the unemployment extension bill
and you think you did good?
maybe someone else will buy that dance
but i won’t.
btw.. maybe you should take a better look at the environmental consequences of those pipelines in Alaska that you think are the cat’s meow.
i was there in the 70s Kootch…
and those of us who worked on that pipeline knew what damage those little pipelines were doing even then.
that’s nothing compared to what they can do in America’s bread basket.
December 28, 2011 at 4:19 am #739173
kootchmanMemberOhhh I did work on that pipeline ma’am…what misery is in the extension bill? The republican are trying to save your SS Trust Fund…which The Messiah is trying to run into even higher deficit..the man can’t help himself..if it ain’t on the credit card of the future generation of taxpayers.and ya can’t kick the can into the next election cycle… he doesn’t how to spend it. Hey it’s the Senate..but not to worry I think those days of Senate gridlock are soon to be over. I can feel it in my bones.. a Senate that can pass a budge on time? No Rule 22 invocation for filibuster, … here’s a simple one for ya JoB ask the citizens of Alaska… “should we shut down Aleyeska pipeline? Ohhh… wait they did get to vote on it… and they passed it. Ask the state budget director..a state in perpetual surplus, ask the local schools which are all new, state of the art.. JoB a pipeline is so much safer… pressure variance, pumps shut down. The technology while good in 80′ … is even better today. Weld the pipe and let the good times flow….. wages, jobs, taxes, energy security, infrastructure…. and not one single taxpayer dime.
December 28, 2011 at 5:02 am #739174
kootchmanMemberYo JoB…. today’s NY Times headlines…. ya think? Ya think we are in a position to not go to war pronto if this happens? Bet the US 6th fleet is loading munitions as we “speak”…
WASHINGTON — A senior Iranian official on Tuesday delivered a sharp threat in response to economic sanctions being readied by the United States, saying his country would retaliate against any crackdown by blocking all oil shipments through the Strait of Hormuz, a vital artery for transporting about one-fifth of the world’s oil supply.
Keystone… secure, domestic, jobs,
December 28, 2011 at 7:04 am #739175
JanSParticipantyou act like the Repubs are G-d, that they do nothing but good…give me a break…they would tank this country in a second…if it put more money in their friends, the corporations. I don’t buy the bullcrap you come up with sometimes. No, I had nothing to do with the pipeline, so I guess you can pick me apart…well, have at it !
December 29, 2011 at 12:11 am #739176
JanSParticipantback to the original purpose of this thread..Rick Perry at it again :D
http://blog.seattlepi.com/seattlepolitics/2011/12/28/does-rick-perry-plan-to-annex-canada/
and that brings up a point…the Keystone pipeline is from Canada..so it’s not “our” pipeline, nor is it our oil…
December 31, 2011 at 1:34 pm #739177
kootchmanMemberThe investment in the pipeline is a Canadian consortium. Imagine that? Attracting foreign capital to build USA infrastructure…create US jobs. Who cares who “owns” the pipeline? The Keystone pipeline also includes Bakkan. Well Jan, I mean what the hell does the governor of ND know? Keystone is a private network of pipes to deliver oil…the jobs will be ours.
“As North Dakota continues to expand its oil production, we must also expand the distribution system,” Gov. Jack Dalrymple said. “It’s important that we have a system that can handle our growing Williston Basin production, and the Keystone pipeline can help do just that
As it now stands, the nearest refinery is in Billings.. where ConocoPhilips is currently refining tar sand oils..and has been for years
…
http://business.mt.gov/MontanaAdvantage/economic.asp
“Montana produces 68 thousand barrels per day of crude oil, making Montana the 10th largest producer, including Federal Offshore areas. The combined crude oil distillation capacity of the state’s four petroleum refineries totals 181 thousand barrels per calendar day. Several crude oil pipelines connect the producing areas in Montana and Canada with refineries that are concentrated near the Billings area.”
It’s too small, the pipeline is too small to absorb the Williston basin production.and it is over 40 years old,,crossing the Yellowstone River.. the only refineries with the capacity are in Texas… so, watch Obama carefully, he does not have the national interests at heart. Jobs and economic development are roundly endorsed and every state has accepted the final draft plan for Keystone, including the ND extension….
December 31, 2011 at 9:55 pm #739178
TDeParticipantLittle sidenote: Guess what the #1 U.S. export was in 2011? I’m guessing that we’ve got the potential to have all the energy secuity we need… except that U.S. companies prefer to sell our resources offshore for higher profits so that we must continue to import fuel from other countries and suffer higher fuel prices as a result. The craziness of this is beyond comprehension.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2017130298_export31.html
January 2, 2012 at 5:06 am #739179
JanSParticipantwow…and people think that Obama is trying to drag us into a war with Iran? Look what this guy would do…idiot!
http://news.yahoo.com/santorum-says-bomb-iran-nuclear-sites-160712330.html
January 2, 2012 at 6:17 am #739180
kootchmanMemberOur economy is so damaged and in such deep recession, we have the refinery capacity to crack the crude and sell into other markets. TDe we sell about 20,000 per day of crude oil… mostly to Canadian refineries with proximity to a US distribution point, We are NOT crude oil exporters. We ship in a bout 10,000,000 barrels a day. Iran is a net fuel importer… they lack the refining capacity. We are buying foreign oil, refining it, and selling it on the world market. We are nowhere near energy independent and when this administration is thrown out and the recovery is underway.. you will see the results. We do not sell surplus crude oil… coal we do. Just goes to show you how horribly this economy is being managed by this government.
January 2, 2012 at 6:46 pm #739181
redblackParticipantWe are buying foreign oil, refining it, and selling it on the world market. We are nowhere near energy independent and when this administration is thrown out and the recovery is underway.. you will see the results.
this is long-standing policy and it’s dictated by the free market. obama has nothing to do with it.
even if the keystone poison-emitter is built, that canadian oil will flow to the gulf, be refined, then sold on the spot market – just like all of the other oil we produce in north america. where in the open market we import oil from is merely a matter of proximity and availability, and it’s not subject to trade agreements or any other policies.
what obama does have the capacity to change is our energy policy regarding consumption and our foreign policy regarding the protection of oil shipping lanes.
and one would hope that russia, EU, japan, and china won’t allow the united states to take it upon ourselves to ensure that the strait of hormuz remains open with the threat of military action. the rest of the first world uses that oil, too, and they have a vested interest in making sure that american consumers aren’t crushed by energy prices.
we need broad-based diplomacy here, not more bombs and islamophobia. we’ve had quite enough of that; but santorum, et al, would eagerly take us to unilateral war under the (false) premise of protecting those shipping lanes.
if obama goes there, i think he is going to have a serious revolt on his hands here at home – not just a bunch of chest-thumping republicans bemoaning taxes and regulation. to align his foreign policies with those of the republican war-mongers will be political suicide.
strangely, this is one (probably the only one) area where progressives and ron paul are aligned. and i say ron paul – not libertarians – because i think most libertarians have no problem with using the united states military to create global private-sector economic dictatorships that aren’t subject to government regulation.
January 2, 2012 at 7:22 pm #739182
sydneyMemberSadly, I think ninety-five percent of the people in this country are too easily frightened into supporting war when they are told the one-sided view of intelligence the Mighty Wurlitzer pumps out.
January 3, 2012 at 7:57 am #739183
kootchmanMemberUh huh… and who’s pumping the bellows on this one? Seems both sides of the aisles are on board. Back in the time machine again…. GHW Bush.. got turd piles of money from the Saudis for the first Gulf War.. we actually to our utter shame, made a “profit”. Republicans have their base covered.. strong national defense and all that crap. The Democrats have their base covered, the entitlement states gets to borrow more to cover some of their debt from a new creditor. Now if we were energy independent, Ms. sydney… we would, should, tell them all… embargoes are acts of war.. and we don’t want this bullshit on our national agenda. Y;know… I actually have more faith in the raghead mullahs than I do our own government to bring some sanity to the dust up. Remember Obama selling off the SPOR
-
AuthorPosts
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.