LIGHT RAIL: Sound Transit talks about stations with West Seattle Transportation Coalition, asks for your feedback

By Tracy Record
West Seattle Blog editor

Though the Sound Transit Board won’t decide on the final West Seattle light-rail routing (“alignment”) before the middle of next year, the agency is proceeding with station design based on the “preferred alignment” that got preliminary board approval.

And as ST reps reiterated to the West Seattle Transportation Coalition last Thursday night, this is prime time to tell them what you think about how the design of West Seattle’s stations is shaping up. Your primary way to do that is to answer this survey – also pitched at ST’s recent meeting in The Junction (WSB coverage here and here) – if you haven’t already. That meeting did not include a briefing, just a chance to circulate and look at maps and sketches, so even if you attended, the materials from the WSTC meeting might provide a somewhat closer look.

Here’s the full slide deck from Thursday’s meeting. It includes three views of each planned station (Delridge, Avalon – still potentially on the table for omission, but design continues – and Junction). Below are the three major design views on which presenters focused:

First, the Delridge station (elevated) – some key points mentioned by ST’s Sloan Dawson included that the platform will be about 55′ above a reconfigured Charlestown Street. They’re working on pickup/dropoff/pedestrian zones to minimize having people crossing “a busy arterial.” The station itself eventually won’t front on Delridge – the street was shown as running alongside transit-oriented development projects that could be up to 85′ high (three stories higher than the platform). They don’t believe 26th/Andover will warrant a new signal but a new intersection at 23rd/Delridge will.

Next, the Avalon station (underground in what ST calls a “routine cut”):

This station will “straddle 35th SW,” underground, so entrances will be roughly where Taco Time and Pecos Pit (WSB sponsor) are now. Dawson also pointed out a plan to “reroute” part of SW Genesee in the area, as well as “a lot of new bike infrastructure” planned. He said they’re not currently envisioning any changes to the existing intersection signalization.

And next, the westernmost West Seattle station, in The Junction (tunneled):

Its entrances are envisioned on 40th and 42nd SW, and the platform would be 65′ below street level. There is new bicycle infrastructure here too, with protected bike lanes envisioned “all along the Alaska corridor.” Transit-oriented development in the area could go up to 75′.

Again, the full slide deck (here it is again) also has station-by-station looks at two other views – development near the station, and how you’ll get to the station (where buses and other vehicles will drop people off, for example).

In Q&A, ST reps were asked what happens if the board vote next year results in a different “alignment” than the ones these stations are on. The feedback provided now could be applied to other station locations, they said, but for the record, these are the only station locations getting some early design work now.

WHAT’S NEXT? The station-planning survey is open through December 20th.

WSTC’S NEXT MEETING: The group usually meets every other fourth Thursday, so that means the next meeting will be January 25, 2024 – watch westseattletc.org for info.

ADDED WEDNESDAY: Here’s video of the WSTC meeting, which the group just uploaded:

78 Replies to "LIGHT RAIL: Sound Transit talks about stations with West Seattle Transportation Coalition, asks for your feedback"

  • DC December 4, 2023 (1:31 pm)

    Does zoning for Delridge really allow higher buildings than in the center of The Junction? Really wish they could make those taller. 

    • WS Guy December 4, 2023 (7:34 pm)

      Junction allows 95’.

  • WS Res December 4, 2023 (1:49 pm)

    I’m so ready for this project to start. I just hope West Seattle Animal Hospital and West Seattle Liquor and Wine can relocate successfully as we really appreciate the folks at both businesses. 

  • GF December 4, 2023 (2:32 pm)

    I have not seen information yet on how the Rapid Ride H Line will be rerouted once this lightrail is in place. I have heard that the Rapid Ride H line will loop thru North Admiral to being us North Admiral district people to the station. Is this true? If so I would like to see how that factors into to be able to comment better on the design of the drop off and pickup areas. thanks for any info if you have it.

  • Scarlett December 4, 2023 (3:23 pm)

    Light rail is essentially  a religion so forget about reaching any of its adherents with reason and commonsense.   It’s a lucrative piece of work for contractors in the building trades that has been sold as a piece of needed infrastructure.   

    • Yeah December 4, 2023 (6:32 pm)

      The gondola is essentially a religion so forget about reaching any of its adherents with reason and commonsense.  It’s a NIMBY proposal to stop Sound Transit’s plans that has been billed as a viable alternative to light rail.

    • Johnny Stulic December 4, 2023 (6:52 pm)

      Projection is massive in the nothing-should-ever-be-built-in-Seattle circles. Those of us who expect Seattle to finally get its stuff together and build a mass public transport worthy of a world class city are being accused of “religion”, while they offer their alternative dogmas: gondolas, buses on choked up streets, bicycles as mass transit in 6 months-per-year rain, or better yet – simply nothing because we “don’t need it” and because some people might earn some money in the process.

      • Scarlett December 4, 2023 (10:47 pm)

        Has nothing to do with world-class cities, or gondola’s, or opposition to public transportation, or NIMBYism – it’s just a bad idea.  It’s a massively expensive piece of infrastructure that will do zero to alleviate traffic congestion or increase access to public transportation (as in other cities where it has been tried)  In fact, it is likely that bus transit will face cutbacks.  When the thing is birthed, it will be a concrete monument to folly and testament to how a seductive idea (who doesn’t like trains?) can overwhelm the rational brain. But I’ll said this all before and it all gets wearisome.   

        • Wseattleite December 4, 2023 (11:47 pm)

          Scarlett is correct to say that ideology has gotten in the way of any logical common sense when it comes to light rail in West Seattle. If aliens were to show up today and observe the fervent worship of the dream of riding on rails at all costs, they would have to conclude that a strange religion was in play. 

        • Yeah December 5, 2023 (6:48 am)

          You can’t preach the gospel of Gondola in every other light rail thread and then come into this one saying it’s not about gondolas and call the light rail an “expensive piece of infrastructure that will do zero to alleviate traffic congestion” lol.  Every other neighborhood that has gotten light rail has seen massive increases in use of public transportation.  The numbers don’t lie.  I just can’t believe we’re still talking about this, to be honest.  This thing should have been built ages ago, but everyone has to slow down the process wanting to be “heard”, meanwhile the costs of labor and materials keep rising while we’re waiting for everyone to be “heard.”  And then those same people slowing the process down have the gall to complain that it’s getting more expensive.  Unbelievable.

        • Aaron G December 5, 2023 (8:56 am)

          The cost of the road infrastructure far exceeds anything spent on light rail so far or projected. And getting in a car and getting stuck in traffic when you have the option of a train that bypasses it makes far less sense. Never mind the pollution from cars and all the parking needed for them.

      • anon December 5, 2023 (2:02 pm)

        Lets go!

  • Jim December 4, 2023 (3:47 pm)

    It’s time to put this to a vote again people don’t want it with how long it’s taken and how far over budget it’s gone. The voters were sold a bill of goods We want you increased bus service not the destruction of West Seattle for something that will benefit very few people

    • CarDriver December 4, 2023 (5:14 pm)

      Jim. The original monorail team worried about ridership had made contact and was in early discussion with Metro on ENDING all WS to downtown bus service. Instead, Metro would only provide a shuttle service(seperate fare,no transfer) to the monorail stations. Be very watchful on what ST has in mind.

      • Mickymse December 5, 2023 (3:06 pm)

        That’s not exactly correct… Yes, the plan is to end bus service running to Downtown. Why exactly would we continue to pay for buses when we’re building elevated transit running the same exact route? So, THEN, the hope is Metro uses recovered bus hours to provide better service inside of West Seattle or better connections from stations elsewhere to the destinations we are all trying to get to. As for the “seperate fare, no transfer” I think that was because ORCA wasn’t all set up at the time so you couldn’t transfer between ANY Sound Transit and Metro options. It wasn’t some nefarious plan tied to the monorail–or now light rail. With a more integrated transit system now and many people with cross-system passes, there will be no problem transferring between light rail and buses just as you can currently do with the existing line. For example, take the Route 50 bus to SoDo and then transfer to light rail to Husky Stadium for a game!

        • Martin December 6, 2023 (8:47 pm)

          For Northgate this approach made a lot of sense: buses go to Northgate so that they don’t get stuck in traffic going downtown and instead riders take light rail downtown. But West Seattle is a lot closer to downtown, just a few miles along a highway which just got a major upgrade. So why not just stay on the bus instead of transferring twice onto light rail: once in West Seattle and once in SODO and each time potentially waiting 10 minutes?!? For the $4 billion I’m sure we could get more buses to improve service across West Seattle, some may be even running straight to downtown.

    • Jon Wright December 4, 2023 (9:38 pm)

      “Keep voting until it’s the result I like.”

      • Jim December 5, 2023 (4:46 pm)

        Just because something was voted once doesn’t mean that it has to be forever. If that were the case most people in this country wouldn’t have the right to vote. Think about that

  • pnw December 4, 2023 (4:13 pm)

    I just love how they are bulldozing brand new homes on Delridge and Andover. Seems excessive…take out the old bartells office. Also, why not take out Bank of America and it’s too large of a parking rather than an office building? 

    • John December 4, 2023 (7:49 pm)

      They use excavators not bulldozers….just saying.

      • Jim December 5, 2023 (4:46 pm)

        Honestly really doesn’t make that much of a difference The house which was perfectly good has been destroyed either way

    • YT December 5, 2023 (12:45 pm)

      Which brand new homes at Delridge and Andover will get bulldozed?  I live close by, and the I honestly can’t think of any new homes there, or any homes at all in the path shown in the plans above.  It doesn’t appear that it will affect the homes on the east side of Delridge, and west of Delridge is businesses and parking lots.

      • Bronson December 6, 2023 (8:21 am)

        The path will destroy quite a bit of homes on the northern tip of Pigeon Point, east of Delridge, including homes on 19th, 20th, 21st, 22nd, and 23rd. 

  • Seth December 4, 2023 (4:20 pm)

    Love the light rail bout to come to west Seattle. I wish they’d just buy nucor and use that land for high density development. Don’t make sense to have to accommodate for large trucks where you want pedestrian traffic to be high. It’s also a great spot for marketplace or other high traffic business.  

  • ws resident December 4, 2023 (4:54 pm)

    I don’t understand why they are not buying out the Bank of America property/parking lot and utilizing that space instead of demolishing all of Jefferson Square businesses and apartments.

    • Socialcontract December 4, 2023 (5:50 pm)

      That is technically still one of the options. It would require demolishing (at least) City Watch Apartments and the neighboring mixed use condominium building. You can look up all of the numbers of affected in the draft EIS.

    • WS Guy December 4, 2023 (7:36 pm)

      It’s a land grab. Just like when monorail seized that property across from Jeff Square and then sold it off to developers.

    • John December 4, 2023 (7:53 pm)

      It’s simply to small of an area.  The general and sub-contractors will require a large staging area for materials, equipment, supplies, construction trailers, etc.

  • West Marge December 4, 2023 (5:41 pm)

    That’s easy. Don’t do it. https://rethinkthelink.org/This is a waste of money and an will eliminate busses into Seattle. 

    • Up to 1,400 residences and businesses may be displaced.
    • Irreparable damage will be done to the Pigeon Point ecosystem, threatening wildlife, including a federally protected heron rookery, and removing acres of tree canopy.
    • The project also threatens Tribal Treaty protections.
    • Construction will take at least 6 years, longer if the tunnel option is chosen.
    • During construction, some streets will be closed. Access to the West Seattle Bridge will be limited. Existing transit services will have to be rerouted.
    • Construction will have a negative impact on local businesses. Some will go out of business or be forced to relocate to survive. We saw a preview of this economic nightmare during the pandemic.
    • After the project is finished, it will take 5 – 10 years for the neighborhood to rebuild, depending on economic conditions at the time.
    • my two cents December 5, 2023 (2:47 am)

      The gondola version of Tim Eyman 

    • Bob December 5, 2023 (11:54 am)

      Can you begin to elaborate even a little bit on why it would take 5-10 years to “recover”? Sounds like you’re just spreading fear to get people alarmed, Marge. That’s not good! Are you a fear monger??

      • West Marge December 5, 2023 (5:16 pm)

        Oh, Bob… It will take that long to rebuild the number of homes and businesses that will be lost to this project. It will take even longer for the environmental impacts of tearing down a federally protected heron rookery to see recovery. if at all. And Longfellow creek, which is already quite fragile, may not be able to support the wildlife that currently depends on the area. Yes, I’m fear mongering, and I think that’s quite good, considering the impact this cash cow of a project will cause. We should all be fearful of the PR surrounding this project.

      • West Marge December 5, 2023 (5:36 pm)

        Here’s a little more for you, Bob.https://seattletransitblog.com/2023/10/03/environmental-impact-of-transit-projects-such-as-the-west-seattle-link-extension/I think this will help to explain my concern and “fear mongering”

        • Bob December 7, 2023 (11:24 am)

          Uh, a blog link describing the name of a route doesn’t support your argument, no. 

          Again, really curious to see any semblance of actual data regarding the ten year timeline beyond “trust me, bro”

  • Dan Lee December 4, 2023 (6:25 pm)

    I’m so glad that this project is underway. I wish we weren’t so bogged down by letting detractors and trolls throw in wrenches at every turn, but that’s the American process I suppose. Do-no-harm to anyone or anything, even if that means delays or status quo that do far more harm than anything ST3 could do.

    We want it, we voted for it, not let people get to work!

    • WS Res December 5, 2023 (9:03 am)

      Thanks for noting that this is “the American process” and not a Seattle-specific thing as people like to allege. I just listened to The Big Dig podcast which is a great look at how difficult it has gotten to do infrastructure projects for a whole variety of reasons, some good, some bad, and all of them complex. It’s very relevant to thinking about the Seattle light rail (which I agree, can’t come fast enough at this point!)

  • Jl December 4, 2023 (6:51 pm)

    I agree with Scarlett, Jim and West Marge.  We don’t want light rail,  the expense, the years of construction mess, the displacement and destruction of multiple buildings and PEOPLE!  Please don’t ruin West Seattle with your light rail plans.

    • Felix Grounds December 4, 2023 (9:43 pm)

      Please stop using terms and phrases like “we” and “the voters” and “the residents of West Seattle”.You DO NOT speak for anyone but yourself.I am a voter and West Seattle teaident and tax payer.I voted for light rail because Seattle will continue to grow and densify, and it will only get more expensive to wait and build it later. It should have been built decades ago.Increased density is coming to West Seattle, and all your histrionics will not stop it, and it will be crucial to have viable dedicated nass transit to other parts of the city.

    • Johnny Stulic December 4, 2023 (9:59 pm)

      This may come as a shock to you, but here’s the thing: no one cares what “you” want. In 2016, a majority of Seattle voters decided they wanted it. The end.

      • Wseattleite December 4, 2023 (11:50 pm)

        Oh Johnny, no one voted for what is happening now. You should stop propagating the misinformation that they did. 

    • Jeff December 5, 2023 (11:09 am)

      No WE do want Lightrail, we voted on it!!!!

  • Flights December 4, 2023 (7:36 pm)

    It’ll take awhile but will be nice to use to get to the airport vs a taxi, Uber or spending money on airport parking. Can’t wait for light rail in WS! 

    • Marie December 4, 2023 (9:07 pm)

      It won’t take you directly to the airport. Ever. You will have to get off the train in SODO and transfer to another train. This will involve carrying your luggage across streets, possibly over train tracks  (ST hasn’t figured that part out yet), or via an elevator that may or may not work,  to  an elevated walkway over the street/tracks. You’ll need to pack light. And leave early. Maybe Metro KC can start a free shuttle from the Burien Transit Hub  to the airport, like they do with the WS Water taxi. The RapidRide H goes to the Hub. Either way, you will have to transfer and carry all your luggage with you when you transfer to get to the airport. 

      • Eddie December 5, 2023 (5:13 am)

        Marie is correct about this incarnation of Light Rail to West Seattle not going to the airport, but I gotta ask “Why Not?”  Continue the planned line past the Alaska Junction and connect (key word there) the neighborhoods south into the system with a handful of stations and give the line more of a purpose than just serving the central West Seattle area. What would be wrong with two light rail pathways to the airport? Just do it.

      • Jeff December 5, 2023 (11:10 am)

        Connecting trains is fine and common in transit and it is not going to make you go over any tracks! this is just scaremongering

        • Martin December 6, 2023 (8:52 pm)

          Have you looked at the plans, Jeff? As the West Seattle trains will arrive on one platform and the airport line on the other you will have to go up an escalator or elevator go over a bridge and take another elevator/escalator down.     

      • heartless December 5, 2023 (11:40 am)

        Marie: most people familiar with real cities understand the concept of transferring and, despite your most amusing efforts, won’t be daunted by the concept.  As for having to carry luggage–well, yes.  I think that’s even where the word comes from (lug)!  Heaven forbid we ever have to CARRY things, the absolute HORROR!

        • WS Res December 5, 2023 (3:31 pm)

          I have “lugged” my luggage via rail from Gatwick Airport to Bromley-By-Bow Tube station in London, like an ANIMAL! And on light rail in Atlanta, Toronto, New York, Denver, Chicago, Paris, San Francisco, D.C. Montreal, and probably others that I’ve forgotten. Sometimes even while having to transfer lines!  And lived to tell the tale.

        • Marie December 5, 2023 (5:13 pm)

          I know that. I also know many people who voted for light rail because they thought they would have a one-seat ride to the airport. A couple of months ago, I told a friend of mine that she will have to transfer. She got indignant and said, “Well, that’s news to me!” I think she thought I was lying to her. For those who do not mind transfers, you already have a connection to light rail to the airport from West Seattle. It’s the 50 bus – it stops at SODO and there you can transfer to the train.  You can do that today. You don’t have to wait 10 years for the experience. The bus system connects WS people right now to light rail up and down the spine. The thing is that not many people do it. Most WS folks drive, get rides from friends, or take Uber or Lyft to the airport because they want the convenience of a one-seat ride. Light rail will not change that. 

        • West Marge December 5, 2023 (5:43 pm)

          That’s a very able bodied point of view. Must be nice. Your screen name certainly fits

          • heartless December 6, 2023 (9:02 am)

            Marie: fair point.

            West Marge: I am able-bodied, and it is nice.  But it’s unfair of you to try to diminish my point with a disctraction like that.  The truth is that overall more people will be able to take the light rail (even with luggage, a roller or a backpack) than are able to drive.

            So if your interest is accessibility, just know that light rail will be more available to more people than car ownership and driving is. 

      • Flights December 6, 2023 (7:03 am)

        Not a problem, I easily carry my luggage through airports for connecting flights and don’t mind a transfer. Still will save me $$ and keep me from relying on someone to pick me up and drop me off or parking my car at airport parking. 

        • Martin December 6, 2023 (8:57 pm)

          The 560 bus takes you straight from Westwood Village to the airport and drops you off closer to the terminal than light rail does – same price but you avoid the wait and change of platforms at the SODO station. 

  • SpencerGT December 5, 2023 (1:05 am)

    I think it’s funny that people are against this.

    • CarDriver December 5, 2023 (5:55 am)

      Nobody is against improved transportation options. We’re against spending our money on “improvements” that turn out to simply drain our wallets with nothing to show for it.

      • KM December 6, 2023 (9:09 am)

        Me, describing owning and maintaining a car.

    • Joe Z December 5, 2023 (7:28 am)

      16% are against and 84% are in support. 

  • James December 5, 2023 (3:35 am)

    We voted for lightrail and we want it! I think the Avalon station is excessive and prefer a tunnel but it’s time to get to work!

  • anonyme December 5, 2023 (4:41 am)

    So glad I’ll be dead before this even begins – much like the viability of this project.

  • Megan December 5, 2023 (7:51 am)

    I’m so excited for this! I wish that ST did more public outreach talking about the advantages of transit overall. I feel like people get the wrong idea about light rail (and transit in general) when the only things they ever see are how this project was delayed or that project needs more money. Guys, public transit is amazing. We bought a house in WS during the bridge-pocolypse and rely exclusively on transit to get around Seattle. Yeah, sometimes we have to walk a few blocks to get to a bus stop, and we pay attention to bus schedules. But going to events downtown without having to find parking?? Spending my morning commute reading??? So worth it. 

  • TrainsFTW December 5, 2023 (8:04 am)

    I’m so confused about people not understanding or rather, being upset that you will have to transfer trains to get places. Have you been to other cities that light rail systems requiring transfers…NYC, Atlanta, San Francisco, LA…a sieve of an argument to make against something that will open up transit opportunities for many, reduce some of the car burden (or at least hope to) and allow for smoother movement of large masses of people. Mind you, I won’t stick around to find out because the timeline is ridiculous but instead I’ll move to where they prioritized it so I can start to use it in the next couple years 

    • Another One December 6, 2023 (10:20 am)

      It seems to me they haven’t used similar public transportation, or been to places where you can get around without a car. All the arguments they make (you have to transfer, go up an escalator, etc) are all just the normal way rail-based transportation works in other places. Even when the tunnel downtown was a bus tunnel, you still had to get off and transfer buses and go up and down escalators. It’s like someone who’s never been to the beach, complaining about going to the beach, because in order to cool off, you have to get wet. 

  • Ev December 5, 2023 (9:30 am)

    I think Light rail is ugly and destroys nice neighborhoods. I can see having a station in Delridge that goes DT & to the airport. But no where else

    • Jeff December 5, 2023 (2:10 pm)

      What? It has overwhelmingly transformed Roosevelt. And Othello and Columbia City have seen SURGES of economical improvement since lightrail too. 

      • Scarlett December 6, 2023 (9:05 am)

        So light rail really wasn’t about public transportation after all?  Considering the massive development around those hubs, the increase in ridership has been minscule. Light rail  is a wet dream for the construction industry and has zero to do with improving getting people from point A to point B.  It’s stunning that people can’t see through this.  

    • CAM December 6, 2023 (7:53 am)

      Please do enlighten me. If light rail is so ugly and ruins good neighborhoods, why do you want it in Delridge then?

  • WSDAD December 5, 2023 (9:52 am)

    My wife and I lived in Boston for many years, and everyone rode the train. It was great getting from one spot to the other without driving. We need light rail all over Seattle. It opens up the city to everyone and also brings a lot of business to the area. I like the idea of the Delridge and Junction stations. I would not waste the money on that Avalon station. I also think they should demo that BofA lot too. 

  • Genesee5Points December 5, 2023 (10:38 am)

    Parisians seem to be into the idea: https://www.cnn.com/travel/paris-new-metro-network/index.html 

  • PDiddy December 5, 2023 (12:52 pm)

    No light rail. Improve bus service and not destroy neighborhoods. I prefer dedicate no car bus lanes over anything ST. The delridge idea will destroy this neighborhood.

  • Paul December 5, 2023 (4:15 pm)

    WSTC is misnamed in the title and article.  It’s a coalition, not a commission. 

    • WSB December 6, 2023 (2:57 am)

      I should know better after covering them for so many years. Getting rusty now that they meet every other month and I missed last time. Thanks, fixing.

  • Ryan December 6, 2023 (9:05 am)

    Looking at the potential designs for TOD in the provided slide deck makes me super happy and excited for light rail. It can’t come soon enough! 

  • Scarlett December 6, 2023 (9:16 am)

    After reading the comments from light rail proponents, the unrealistic assumptions and magical scenarios of an economic boom and being whisked around the city on rail,  again I reiterate:  Light rail is a religion.  It is pointless to construct an argument.  But don’t take it too harshly, other cities have been sold the same fantasy, from Sacramento to Los Angeles to Phoenix, though I hoped that vaunted PNW level-headed pragmatism would kick in.  But, as our friend SE Dick might say – and so it goes. 

  • KA December 13, 2023 (12:29 am)

    Nobody in the world builds a 4 mile long light rail line. It is useless, expensive, and impractical. You know it only goes to Sodo, right? What good is that? Not exactly a nice place to hang out waiting for a transfer.

    • James December 13, 2023 (9:27 am)

      Neither are my bus stops but I have to take them. Lightrail is traffic-free and can be extended in future years. Cars are destructive and prone to accidents. Busses too. Trains are way less so in comparison. 

    • James December 13, 2023 (9:41 am)

      It will eventually go to Ballard. And Sodo is fine where the stop is. I transfer there many many times this year and it is easy peasy. Also……many many many places build 4 mile segments of major metro lightrail lines. (what we’re doing). With the bridge lifespan only another 10-20 years, I’d rather have an option out of the “West Seattle Island” that is non-pollutant, and doesn’t fatally injure people (at the rate cars and even busses can do). 

    • Stickerbush December 13, 2023 (9:56 am)

      This would be good time for Sound Transit to pause and rethink future expansion plans to incorporate the significant changes that have occurred since 2020.  Specifically I’m thinking about the reduction in the number of people that commute back and forth to an office. Ridership is down for mass transit all over the US.

Sorry, comment time is over.