Election 2014: First results for King County Proposition 1

joel April 22, 2014 (8:22 pm)

hoping that trend continues….

Gilbert Henson April 22, 2014 (8:25 pm)

In retrospect, those of us commuting by bus should have had a bus strike and driven everywhere for a week to show people how much Seattle needs Metro. From talking to people in West Seattle, I have an idea that many here cast a “no” vote — despite the fact that most of the commenters on any blog post about proposed development bemoan the fact that traffic is worsening. It’s one thing not to care about the disadvantaged who need to commute by bus — people are selfish — but to ignore the environmental and economic impacts, not to mention the traffic issues, is truly a vote against self-interest.

Hopefully there is an Earth Day miracle and things turn around.

Drives alone April 22, 2014 (8:26 pm)

Get control of those wages before asking voters for higher taxes.

WesCAddle April 22, 2014 (8:30 pm)

Seattle needs real mass transit. Busses are laughable, and we are one of the last large cities in America that has not developed a real mass transit system (subway, full scale light rail, monorail, etc.) This prop would only add more “buss islands” jutting out into the road stopping traffic.

Ashey Biz April 22, 2014 (8:32 pm)

Awesome. That’s another $60 I can spend on local West Seattle businesses

D.D.S. April 22, 2014 (8:40 pm)

Gilbert,
Selfish, Disadvantaged? NO- REASONABLE!

Mary April 22, 2014 (8:40 pm)

I did not vote no because I don’t understand how much Seattle needs Metro. I voted no because this regressive tax is not an acceptable solution.

JRR April 22, 2014 (8:40 pm)

C’mon, leaders, time to lead instead of turning to a misinformed electorate. So frustrating.

Gilbert Henson April 22, 2014 (8:42 pm)

Drives alone: Wages were frozen. Massive cuts have been made to Metro. The pettiness and misinformation that surrounds this issue is upsetting.

Gilbert Henson April 22, 2014 (8:47 pm)

DDS- enjoy the traffic and fight for parking downtown. There is no way to justify a “no” vote here as unselfish. The shocking thing is the extent to which people will vote against their best self-interest.

Mary- Yes, this was regressive. But given that even a regressive tax wasn’t enough of a sucker-punch to the poor to get anti-government conservatives to vote for this, I am really scared at how a progressive tax would be received. Also, this was the only option that the Council had given that Olympia/Eyman got rid of the progressive tab charge, and that the Council is limited in the types of taxes they can establish.

Mike April 22, 2014 (8:48 pm)

I didn’t even open my ballot. I’ve always voted to increase funding for mass transit, road fixes, schools, etc. Needless to say, the past 18 years I’ve been voting, government has failed to use funds appropriately. I’m done.

Gilbert Henson April 22, 2014 (8:48 pm)

Ashley Biz – no — you’ll still have to pay $20 for your car tabs. Also, expect those businesses to get less traffic from buses and pedestrians.

Ray April 22, 2014 (8:52 pm)

This was a poorly designed vote when even Metro admits they are inefficient and do not have solid solutions.

It is time that Metro be more self-supporting. Like the ferries, it will never be self-sufficient, but fares have got to rise (or support be cut) so that it is better sufficient.

ScubaFrog April 22, 2014 (8:57 pm)

Woohoo! We, The People won this one, Seattle. We’re still paying for the Kingdome for heaven’s sake. We have got to become more monetarily conservative – from the local level, to the national level. Metro’s mismanaged, and needs to reform itself before we inject more funds into it. Americans are fiscal troglodytes (we’re 17 trillion dollars in debt for heaven’s sake).
–
The vitriol and name-calling from the pro-Prop 1 people was getting old. So was the “I can’t wait to see the “No” voters whine when they lose, tee hee!”.

Ray April 22, 2014 (8:58 pm)

The other point I would like to make is:
I am unsure how dates for special elections are set, but I cannot help question how this election was set coincidentally on Earth Day.
I guess we can all be glad that it also was so close to Federal Tax date as a reminder of how much the government already takes.

ScubaFrog April 22, 2014 (9:00 pm)

Gilbert your fear-mongering and lies need to stop. The campaign’s over – you lost. Thanks.

joel April 22, 2014 (9:02 pm)

I voted NO. I am saving my money to pay for the upcoming property tax hike to pay for Murray’s parks plan. being that will be a vote of increased property taxes those always pass as if you don’t own a home then why not vote yes….it costs you nothing…..it’s like walking downtown and being asked for money by countless homeless people….do you give your money to all of them who ask or save your money so you have something for the armed robbery?

beef April 22, 2014 (9:10 pm)

enjoy getting off the island as these 3,000 new units come online in west seattle.

I. Ponder April 22, 2014 (9:16 pm)

Seattleites demand gridlock. Seattleites love to whine.

Really? April 22, 2014 (9:20 pm)

@Gilbert: regarding your words, “Wages were frozen” and “misinformation” do you care to share with the rest of us exactly how long wages were frozen? I can if you’re feeling too shy.

joel April 22, 2014 (9:22 pm)

Ray…..watch your mail for a summer election for the increase in taxes for the parks. that election will be when 1/3 of the city is on summer vacation…nice timing? if these government agencies are so broke why don’t we have one election in the fall when everything is voted on at once?

Joe Szilagyi April 22, 2014 (9:27 pm)

This ain’t over.

Marty April 22, 2014 (9:30 pm)

So can I assume that everyone who voted ‘no’ on this has forfeited their complaining rights about Seattle traffic from here on out or is that just wishful thinking?

chris April 22, 2014 (9:42 pm)

@ Gilbert the people have spoken so try another approach instead of taxing the cars how about raising fare for the people who use the bus lines. Raise parking space rate for the cars. The manner of the way the prop 1 written was obviously wrong.

Civik April 22, 2014 (9:51 pm)

I just happen to think the creep toward a 10% sales tax is dumb. The land owners and builders who are creating the extra density should be the ones to pay for it, not the entirety of the county.

Supporters pick an off-season election hoping for low turnout on something unpopular. Then try to gin up support from their side to overwhelm the no votes that would hammer them in a regular election cycle with a higher expected turnout.

Ray April 22, 2014 (9:51 pm)

Forfeit the right to complain?

NO! Never.

Our city infrastructure is such that traffic will always suck. We have I-5 and the I-90 interchange. We have limited to non-existent entrances/exits from the freeways. We have so many merges that a blind person could have developed a better infrastructure.

The reality is that access to downtown Seattle where a lot of the core business are will ALWAYS be miserable and none of these programs will change that. The cores of Redmond and Bellevue have things a little easier but face similar challenges.

More payments to keep the SAME service improves nothing. None of Metro’s proposals are in any way a SOLUTION. They are just maintaining the status quo, which is broken due to politics, economics and geography.

If something is losing money, you work to fix it. If you can show improvements, there is an earned right to ask for more $ based on some good faith earned for dutiful management. If it is not improving (and status quo is not an improvement) cuts need to be made.

Metro is not self-sufficient. It never will be, that is a given. But right now it is a money pit – raising costs, lower quality of service. The users of Metro need to pay more for the service they consume.

For those arguing that drivers benefit from the busses, we do. No one is denying that. But we are already more than subsidizing “our fair share”. Let the users pay more.

And for the record – yes I ride Metro (the 120) about 50% of the time.

John April 22, 2014 (9:57 pm)

I am a progressive voter who happily voted no on this measure. I support public transit for all but Metro needs major reforms rather than asking voters for tax increases every few years. Hopefully our elected officials see this as an opportunity to make some tough decisions about Metro’s operations including asking bus riders to fund a greater percentage of operations.

JoB April 22, 2014 (10:00 pm)

Ah yes..
traffic sucks
it will always suck
no solution will be perfect
so we will shoot it down
we won’t pay for less than perfect
.
but we will whine whine whine as we sit in our cars waiting for our turn at the West Seattle Bridge
because it is our right to whine
.
one bad choice after another

RS April 22, 2014 (10:00 pm)

Alright, no voters, feel like walking? It’ll be faster than driving…and no whining on the blog about traffic! It’ll be your fault…

miws April 22, 2014 (10:01 pm)

Marty, I’m with you. I was just about to post a very similar comment to the “No” gloaters.

.

And, joel, Renters would be paying for it, through the Property Taxes figured into their rent, and with the added Sales Tax.

.

Mike

Chris W April 22, 2014 (10:03 pm)

I voted Yes. It was a fear-based decision. My wife and I don’t wish to own a car, but we may eventually have to. Even so, I don’t have South Lake Union parking fees in my monthly budget just now, but even when I do, I’d rather spend it elsewhere.

Target April 22, 2014 (10:05 pm)

I voted “no” because putting funding Metro on car tabs has been a recurring theme that has not ended recently, no matter the promises. Metro needs to re-think how it does business. Also, the rest of the city needs to realize that many people, including those who ride Metro, have cars, and agencies such as DPD cannot continue to think that this city is a mass transit dominated city.
Several years ago, no house in the city was more than 4-6 blocks away from a bus. Now, massive cuts have reduced that to a pale shadow of what we had. “Rapid Ride” took away sensible routing and replaced it with buses that didn’t go where people wanted and were either too crowed or mostly empty, as well as building new stops that blocked traffic. While I realize that money had to be spend, it was not spent in a way that providing positive enhancing results, but rather resulting in short and long term negative disruptions. And adding bus lanes that caused traffic backups was not helpful at all.
Enough. Metro, King county, and the City of Seattle: enough is enough.
Figure out a better way. Funding a reducing and badly run bus service on sales tax (regressive) and car tabs (regressive) is not a solution.
Think better.

pam April 22, 2014 (10:11 pm)

I am disappointed that we keep messing with transit as though it’s some kind of optional service. The 21/22 both serve my neighborhood, without them, my nearest bus is at the Morgan Junction. I’m a healthy person, I can deal with the walk, but it’s a hardship for those that can’t, that’s for sure. and I certainly don’t love it in the colder, darker, wetter months.

Driving and paying for parking shouldn’t be the best option. Can we get a Park and Ride at 35th and Avalon as a consolation prize? No?

joel April 22, 2014 (10:15 pm)

ahhhh Mike….unless Murray’s plan has changed the parks tax increase is strictly a property tax increase and is not sales tax based. that was in the Mayor’s press release.

Peter April 22, 2014 (10:16 pm)

Idiots. Just idiots.

Ex-Westwood Resident April 22, 2014 (10:18 pm)

Not to sound flippant here, but if you voted “yes” and would like to give Metro the $60.00 per year and the money from the added sales tax you can still do it.
Some of us are living pay check to pay check like I am after taking a $14,000+ pay cut a few years ago. Although I have recovered some, the rising cost of gas, food, taxes and healthcare insurance (thanks “Obamacare”) have actually negated the money I have managed to recover from the payout. The $120.00 per year for our 10+ year old cars, plus the added sales tax would REALLY hurt.
I used to be able to take the bus to work, which I did, but now, because of my schedule and where I work, I cant.
A fare raise seems like a good idea, but unfairly penalizes the poor and senior citizens, those that least afford it. That being said, Metro could issue low fare passes to them and raise the fare $.50 per zone and let those that use it, pay for it. But before doing that they do need to reign in spending and waste (I don’t want to hear they already have, there is ALWAYS money wasted, esp., in a Gov’t agency!!!).

Mr Matt April 22, 2014 (10:24 pm)

-Every-Single-City I have lived in over the years has has their mass transit operators threaten and ransom routes and transport for more funds on a cyclical basis. Every.single.city. “Glad” to see Seattle is no different in the 8 years I’ve been here. I have no qualms funding mass transit but this funding package they put together was COMPLETELY backwards and regressive. And the throw-back “oh, here’s 20 bucks, poor people.” was insulting and useless.

I’m also incredibly amused they’re already back down with “Well, okay, there won’t be as much cuts after all…” I wouldn’t be surprised if the cuts are even less now that the hostage-taking of your bus routes aren’t needed for the election. :|

Lorne April 22, 2014 (10:31 pm)

As inflation keeps adding prices on goods and services in King County so does our the tax revenues. Adding to our sales tax rate would compound the inflation rate. I’m for an income tax in this state and if we keep fishing for regressive sources of taxes how will we ever get that approved? Bus service is important for many reasons- come up with a better tax system. As far as car tabs go, stop making me buy new license plates every couple of years which gives fees to license dealers and just charge me more on gas.

boy April 22, 2014 (10:40 pm)

Let the tax revolt begin Is that miled enough?

DTK April 22, 2014 (10:41 pm)

Can we turn Alaska back into a four lane road now?

C April 22, 2014 (10:50 pm)

I didn’t vote. I voted for every single monorail proposal. I paid increased tabs on my cars willingly. Lots of promises and money spent. My trust is gone. Give me a real option and assurance I will happily pay.

Aaron April 22, 2014 (11:06 pm)

I voted no for many reasons. #1 is this region’s addiction to severely regressive taxes. #2 buses aren’t transit in my opinion. Any vehicle sitting in traffic is not a long term solution. #3 yet another poorly written transportation tax that lumps EVERYTHING with a license plate together. Utility trailer? Extra $60. Motorcycle? Extra $60. Scooter? Extra $60. Please-if you wanna tax cars, just tax cars- not small vehicles that don’t really contribute to the traffic problems in this city. I am glad to see this one fail.

Ted April 22, 2014 (11:09 pm)

Im not much of a math guy, but I dont think I should trust you with even more of my money when you put out a chart that shows almost half (100 of 214, in a rough count) of your bus routes are in the “lowest performing 25%”. Regardless of the politics, nothing ever seems to add up with the transit around here.

GTH April 22, 2014 (11:20 pm)

Yeah, I hope we see more traffic and no plan at all. Seattle is a city of do-nothing morons stymied by endless initiatives and referenda. Gutless politicians who punt everything to a ballot to pander to the public. OK, this gets voted down and we all get exactly NOTHING. Now more transit cuts? I have lived all across the country, but I am staying here to remind this city it needs fixing. This citizen vote on so many issues is pure unadulterated nonsense — ballots every few months, some pamphlets almost a hundred pages — I bet only 30% of eligible voters voted, anyway. Not that any even understand what they are doing. Pathetic. This isn’t democracy, it’s pure moronic brokenness.

Samwise Gamgee April 22, 2014 (11:26 pm)

The extra few minutes I may have to spend driving because of more drivers on the road is tuppence compared to the $180 in registration fees Prop 1 would have cost me.

How anyone in West Seattle could have supported Prop. 1 surprises me as Metro has treated West Seattle like forgotten step-children. Fewer and fewer bus routes, and a rapid ride that isn’t.

Samwise Gamgee April 22, 2014 (11:31 pm)

I agree DTK… let’s start demanding our roads back. Buses fuels pay NO road tax yet they get the best cuts of the pie. Time to start electing people who will support those who pay for the roads.

Samwise Gamgee April 22, 2014 (11:36 pm)

Chris W.: You should thank those of us who voted NO since we saved you $60 in car tab fees for the car you may be purchasing.

Tim April 22, 2014 (11:41 pm)

A few years ago I could catch a bus 2 blocks from my house. Now I have to walk 8 blocks for a bus that takes longer to get to my destination. Who’s idea was it to acquire this new “RAPID RIDE” marquee crap? What did all that and the new buses cost? Money down the drain folks, and Metro has money to burn. We HAD a fantastic bus service, but now in the name of “progress”, it truly, truly sucks. Some connected contractors cashed in on the “upgrade”, but we have NOTHING to show for it. AND, we’re gonna pay 3 times as much for it!! I’m depressed. Give me the old system back, pleeeze.

cj April 22, 2014 (11:45 pm)

I think a lot of people are misunderstanding this. The money has already been taken from Metro but the cuts that will effectively disrupt many lives that depend on it for transportation are on hold hoping this will pass. We are not prepared to handle thousands of extra cars on our roads daily because they have no choice but to travel that way. Metro will be broken to a shadow if it self if the funding taken by the state is not somehow replaced. I don’t think this is going to be just a few extra minutes of driving but honestly what I do not understand how people can just leave other human beings out to dry when metro is all they have.

Samwise Gamgee April 22, 2014 (11:55 pm)

GTH: many of us do understand. We just disagree with you and your ilk who don’t wish to pay for the services you use. Don’t let what you perceive as our need for fixing keep you here. We will be fine without you.

Chris April 23, 2014 (12:04 am)

What I hope is that this puts more pressure on legislators in Olympia to do their jobs and pass a transportation package instead of pushing it off in hopes that others will make the hard choices for them. It’s just cowardly.

wsguy April 23, 2014 (12:08 am)

A $1 per ride increase and perhaps making more people actually pay their fares will get transit the money they are looking for paid for by the people using the service. When will they learn to leave car tabs alone?

ScubaFrog April 23, 2014 (12:10 am)

The “yes” crowd and their insults again. “Idiots!”, “Morons!” etc. Good heavens. Their campaign was based on fear-mongering, insults and lies. They wonder why they lost…
–
Well said Samwise, and of course I agree with what you and DTK are saying in regards to our roads.

wsguy April 23, 2014 (1:20 am)

Since there is a direct causal relationship between higher density and the need for more transit services maybe the taxes should be focused there. A $5-10 per month fee per apartment / condo unit would probably generate the required funding. Metro should be able to park twice as many empty C Line buses at Westwood Village while full buses pass up riders at downstream bus stops.

JanS April 23, 2014 (1:49 am)

property taxes that apartment owners pay is already written into our rent…and the rents go up and up, unlike your mortgage. I saw a comment tonight from a woman who said she voted no because she drives (alone), and doesn’t feel like she should have to pay for someone else’s transportation. What a moronic statement. We all pay, whether property taxes, fares, sales taxes. Until Metro, as all of you claim, “fixes” things internally, in the meantime, the riders who will not have transportation to work, to doc appts, to grocery shopping bedamned? I love the selfishness of our community.

And gloating is unbecoming. And those gloating on here, the no voters, don’t even have all their information right, don’t have good answers/suggestions how transpo can be fixed….in other words, you all just whine. It seems to be a way of life here.

marty April 23, 2014 (5:11 am)

Instead of car tab and sales tab tax, metro should move to virtually all-electronic fares, kind of along the same lines as the 520 tolling. You can still pay non-electronically if you wish, but the price is jacked way up.

This would allow a sliding scale of fares according to income. It could still be done via car tabs, with vehicle value serving as proxy for income.

Then a minimum wage single mom who does not use the bus, does not have to subsidize the software engineer who has a jag and land rover in the driveway of his Issaquah McMansion, yet commutes to downtown by bus to avoid traffic and parking.

wsguy April 23, 2014 (5:29 am)

JanS – high density is however the driver for increasing demand for this particular service. As the root cause it makes sense to target the density in some way(s) to pay for the required sustained transit levels to support it. It certainly makes more sense than a sales tax, property tax or car tab tax which has been voted down numerous times. Seattle and King County’s hostage taking strategy of refusing to fund parks, schools, a library system or transit system among others may have finally run its course.

Darren Olson April 23, 2014 (6:10 am)

My comment is I’m am very happy to see this measure go down in flames. All bus riders should be paying more in fares and that is exactly where the increase should have come from. Not me as someone who is already supporting enough social programs in the taxes that are taken from me already. Here is even a better idea…don’t allow anyone to ride the bus who does not pay the fare. I am sick and tired of the “you owe me” mentality and how lazy we as a society and a country we have become. No one owes YOU anything.

New Driver April 23, 2014 (6:14 am)

Well my bus route will be cut and the only bus alternative is too overcrowded to be reliable. I’ll be driving to work over the bridge with all the other SOV drivers soon enough. That’ll be fun.

Dantzler April 23, 2014 (6:32 am)

I voted no. As a bus rider/cyclist commuter I would rather Metro fiscally reform and raise fares rather than raise car tabs & sales tax. Frankly I’m surprised people rejected the proposition but maybe the crushing weight of inflation and taxes is shifting mindsets. My fare of 2.50 from North Seattle to South Lake Union costs pays about 1/3 of Metro cost for the trip. I would happily pay more. Quantifying the benefit to primarily driver commuters is tricky but jacking tabs on utility trailers, scooters, motorcycles, etc. is misguided.

Chris W April 23, 2014 (6:53 am)

@Samwise Ha ha. Yes, thanks for the $60 I won’t have to spend when I’m forced to buy a car. I’ll use it to buy PTSD meds (the real reason I don’t drive when I can avoid it. That, and environmental concerns of course!).

Adam April 23, 2014 (6:57 am)

Why must the burden of buss lines fall on the people who are already paying car payment, gas, insurance, registration, smog check? People who ride the bus should step up a bit. To the person who said “They love the selfishness of this community”. Go to Ca. and see the difference. People here pay higher taxes than most places. To the person who said we are not prepared for all the cars on the road. If you have a car and don’t drive. Sell it and use that money on the metro rate hikes. Seems like a no brainer unless you are a complete complainer.

KeithR April 23, 2014 (6:59 am)

Abolish the sales tax completely. Implement a progressive income tax. Fully-fund Metro and, like roads, let people use it for free. Eliminate tolls on necessary infrastructure like the Narrows Bridge and the 520 Floating Bridge.

And for the love of the gods, stop complaining about how bad traffic in Seattle is. It isn’t. Try driving from Oxnard to Santa Ana during rush hour in LA and you can see bad traffic. Honestly, when it comes to traffic, a lot of you all sound like 49ers fans.

Glenn April 23, 2014 (7:32 am)

I voted yes because I ride metro and so do my neighbors. We’ll move on. Just more slowly.

miws April 23, 2014 (7:33 am)

ahhhh….joel, did you miss this part of my comment?

.

Renters would be paying for it, through the Property Taxes figured into their rent….

.

Mike

orca card ripoff April 23, 2014 (7:36 am)

I lost 180 bucks off my Orca card and was unable to get it back. I figure my car tabs are covered for the next two years.
Yes, voted no because of that.

Gary April 23, 2014 (7:49 am)

Instead of only looking at cutting service why not look at increasing fares so those that use the service pay a little bit more of the cost.

935 April 23, 2014 (7:57 am)

This is almost laughable.
Full disclosure, I am a no voter. BUT there are so many yes voters complaining about the idiocy of the no voters, and I agree, some voters may be poorly informed. I voted no because I am tired of the city and state (and Fed) using me and my small business as an ATM machine.
I can hear the mucky mucks at Metro saying – “if we don’t ask, they won’t say yes”
Again, I reiterated my rant against the DBT, this boondoggle would/could solve all transportation woes, if it were stopped, filled and deleted from memory. Use the money to fund transportation. All of you “progressive minded” voters out there who elected the decision makers, lean on them HARD to make sure the funds (federal highway/state DOT-etc) can be rerouted and fund the services you wish.
For the people who would like anything but transit off our lovely peninsula please be aware that light rail is not a viable option – no road bed and monorail? Laughable – in line with a DBT construction in seismically active fill soil, right next to the Puget Sound.

Ebisu April 23, 2014 (7:58 am)

@ Adam: clearly you haven’t been to CA recently: they are funding and building a world-class transportation system that this city could only dream of. Why don’t you just admit it: you don’t want to fund metro because you don’t use it. Using your same selfish logic, perhaps I should stop voting yes on school levies because I don’t have children. When does this Eymanesque nightmare end?

Oh, and to all the “it’s regressive” yahoos: you know what is truly regressive? Cutting public transportation for those who are not fortunate enough to own a car, or those who are physically unable to drive, or the elderly, or…

P.s. Enjoy sitting in traffic.

dapuffin April 23, 2014 (8:07 am)

So I’ll likely lose my job because of lack of access to the bus. No, I can’t bike it or walk it. And, hmm…. I don’t have kids, but I think some of the taxes I pay go towards schools and other things that are good for the community – even if I don’t have children. Yes, Metro is mismanaged, but screwing your bus-dependent neighbors because you’re upset with Metro is just beyond my comprehension.

And trust me, you don’t want me out driving on the road – even if I could afford a car.

Marty2 April 23, 2014 (8:09 am)

What is more concerning to me is 38% of registered voters actually returned their ballot. If the percentage remains where it is now, then approximately 21% of the voters actually determined the outcome and 62% didn’t participate.

allison April 23, 2014 (8:11 am)

I vied yes, I take the bus because it is more relatively easy, better for the greater good,convenient and less expensive than driving and parking downtown. I own a car and was willing to pay more. When my buses are cut and inconvenient, and more expensive, i will make a rational decision and start driving downtown. My one car won’t matter but, i represent probably the majority of Metros riders, and all of or cars will matter and make traffic much much worse. Also everyone complaining about rapid ride being a failure needs to look at ridership numbers and see that it is higher (by far) than all the routes it replaced.

Rick April 23, 2014 (8:18 am)

If changes were instituted from the TOP down in this system there might not be much of a discussion here.

Adam April 23, 2014 (8:20 am)

Ebisu, Do the car owners not deserve a little break? Come on man. Maybe a different tax. Maybe a pot and booze tax. I think that is funny you would compare not funding schools to transit. That is stupid as hell. Lets do that. lets stop funding schools and see how quick you are to complain when the future of America is even more behind in education. Also, I have been to Ca. lately. I lived there for 7 years. This community is selfless in comparison. Stay judgy Judgy Mcjudgerson! I will enjoy the traffic and the fact that i can make ends meet because I don’t have another hand in my pocket.

DTK April 23, 2014 (8:20 am)

Sometimes the best way to help an addict kick is to stop buying them dope.

datamuse April 23, 2014 (8:27 am)

Go to Ca. and see the difference.
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My brother lives in San Francisco. Every time I visit him I can take transit everywhere I want to go.
.
Imagine that.

Adam April 23, 2014 (8:28 am)

Also, I ride the buss at times but, guess what. I pay for the ride.

West Seattle since 1979 April 23, 2014 (8:41 am)

Gary, FYI they are increasing fares. How many times do people have to reiterate these things.

Samwise Gamgee April 23, 2014 (8:47 am)

ChrisW: So you want people living in Spokane, Yakima Wenatchee and the Okanagon to pay for your bus rides here in Seattle? I am sure that will go over well with them. No one is forcing you to buy a car. Your car purchase will be your choice. All choice begets other choice. Pretty soon you find your choice has brought you to a box, in which it looks like you’ve been forced to live. Don’t blame those of us who chose to vote NO for your choice, please.

West Seattle since 1979 April 23, 2014 (8:49 am)

Frustrating that such a low percentage of voters sent in their ballots. Even if the results would have been the same, at least we’d know it was the will of the majority of eligible voters, not just the majority of 38% of voters.

Steve April 23, 2014 (8:49 am)

Not happy that this was voted down. Very disappointed.

sardine April 23, 2014 (8:52 am)

I think that Dow Constantine has it backwards with the “not rejecting metro, rejecting this proposal to fund metro” tweet. The no vote was very much about Metro, which is a highly arrogant and completely mismanaged organization. Most people support transit and want (much) more of it, the problem is with Metro.

joel April 23, 2014 (8:52 am)

ahhh Mike again…..yes read that and was just correcting that Murray’s plan does not include sales tax for the parks……when costs to landlords go up and they pass it along to tenants…..that would be business 101. you either increase your revenue or you decrease your expenses or a combination of both. perhaps Metro should operate like your landlord does and they’d balance their budget.

Ebisu April 23, 2014 (8:55 am)

@adam. Yeah, I figured that logic might escape you. It’s either we or me, pal, and you’re a me.

Oh, and you were aware that the proposition funded more than bus service?

Think.

AJL April 23, 2014 (9:03 am)

This fall will be great fun on the roads. Fantastic!

West Seattle Bus Commuter April 23, 2014 (9:05 am)

I voted yes and want to respond to the specific complaint from many here that fair hikes are needed with a quote from Seattle Transit Blog (excellent, informed discussion on transit):

“A 25 cent fare increase yields about $6.6m annually. With a $60m annual budget gap, that implies a fare increase of $2.25, to $4.50 off-peak/$4.75 one-zone/$5.25 two-zone, if there were no decrease in ridership. Setting aside entirely the social impact on riders, at those prices Metro will have trouble competing with driving on subsidized highways with subsidized gasoline to subsidized parking spaces, and so it won’t actually plug the revenue gap. By suppressing ridership, it is likely to increase Metro’s cost per rider.”

If you’re ideologically against transit or paying any taxes for public goods, just say so rather than citing some self-serving, inaccurate rationale.

WSB April 23, 2014 (9:10 am)

WSBC – We did report the “$2 fare hike would be needed to cover the gap” previously, including toward the start of this April 11th story. https://westseattleblog.com/2014/04/video-with-voting-under-way-metro-talks-money-with-west-seattle-chamber-of-commerce

wakeflood April 23, 2014 (9:10 am)

Lots of cut off noses laying in the streets of Seattle today…

JAT April 23, 2014 (9:11 am)

Transit is the economic engine that makes a city work, and cities are the economic engines that make states work.

Yet somehow the disdain of non-city dwellers for the fact that cities are net tax revenue exporters but do require expenditures for some things that don’t directly benefit the exurbs and rural areas of the state has gotten us in this fix.

This insistence that government entities run themselves like businesses and that Transit has to be lean and efficient is misguided.

Transit may well be expensive and the cost of a ride may in fact be subsidized, it’s still far cheaper than the aggregate of all of us sitting stuck in traffic.

wakeflood April 23, 2014 (9:21 am)

Ebisu, the tax scolds and “efficiency experts” who are posting here are me-zombies. They want to infect everyone with the same mindset and poor (if any) critical thinking. Reality is but a quaint notion for others to deal with.

Kayleighsong April 23, 2014 (9:23 am)

Thanks for making my life harder as a non-car- owner. I really appreciate it. I love watching full buses go by, standing in the cold/dark/rain waiting for fewer buses, and then being crammed like pickles in a jar on a smelly, overcrowded bus.
.
Have fun waiting for your magical no-cost-to-you fantasyland transit solution while you wait longer in traffic, breathing worse air pollution and smugly telling yourself that you stood up to big bad Metro.

wsguy April 23, 2014 (9:27 am)

Some facts:

Since 2000 – Inflation up 36%, Metro Revenue up 56%, Metro Operating Costs up 80%, Passenger trips up 20%.

Metro has received 2 Sales Tax increases, a car tab fee and a property tax increase.

Metro’s sales tax revenue last year was $440 million which was a record. Projected Sales tax revenue this year is $471 which is also a record.

Snohomish and Pierce County increasing transit service with increasing sales tax revenue and not new taxes to support it.

Some reasons I voted no.

Peter April 23, 2014 (9:38 am)

Reading the comments, I am shocked at how utterly ignorant the no voters are of how taxes work, how transit works, how traffic works, and how cities work. It’s crystal clear that the no votes were based on ignorance and selfishness at best, malice and hatred of bus riders at worst. I thought people on King Co were smarter than this. Nope. 55% gullible idiots.

SirRiles April 23, 2014 (9:47 am)

Disappointing that people can’t take less than a 1/4 day’s worth of work out of their budget to pay for something essential to the rider and driver. Now I won’t be able to get to my work effectively as I could and neither can you because of the spike in traffic the rejection of this proposition is going to create.
If you’re honestly complaining about the cost. Why are you driving in the first place, sound like you ain’t even got the cash for that.

SirRiles April 23, 2014 (9:49 am)

@wsguy
How much did you pay for diesel in 2000, dude..?

joel April 23, 2014 (9:55 am)

THIS………

Some facts:
Since 2000 – Inflation up 36%, Metro Revenue up 56%, Metro
Operating Costs up 80%, Passenger trips up 20%.
Metro has received 2 Sales Tax increases, a car tab fee and a property tax increase.
Metro’s sales tax revenue last year was $440 million which was a record. Projected Sales tax revenue this year is $471 which is also a record.
Snohomish and Pierce County increasing transit service with increasing sales tax revenue and not new taxes to support it.
Some reasons I voted no.

Nay April 23, 2014 (9:57 am)

For those of you talking about wages–metro drivers have one of the most challenging jobs. I am very close with a driver who tells the most appalling stories of how he is treated by riders on a daily basis. They have almost no time for breaks between loops, and have one of the most stressful jobs dealing with the general public.

It’s disappointing that this didn’t pass and that our county didn’t recognize the importance of metro.

Brian M. April 23, 2014 (10:02 am)

The beauty of an election is that allows the people to make a decision. Whether you agree or not with the decision, it is wonderful that we live in such a place that allows its citizens to make these kinds of choices. I respect the outcome, and I hope it spurs other alternatives that are deemed fairer to the electorate at large.

Adam April 23, 2014 (10:15 am)

Ok. I guess because I don’t want to pay more car tax. I am a me zombie. Well, Have fun being a Walking Dead beat. See what I did there.

zark April 23, 2014 (10:19 am)

You’re not “progressive” if you voted no – your a conservative so just own it already. You literally just voted “not-tax!” and punished people most in need – that’s anti-progressive by definition. You’re just vanilla conservative republicans who don’t care about people who make less money than you.
Regressive tax and consumption based tax are not the same thing, that’s a misleading and simpleminded assessment of how taxes work.

“Other taxes like sales tax are often called regressive taxes in order to make them compare poorly with income tax in terms of their “fairness”. The rationale is that individuals or families at the low end of the income spectrum spend a higher proportion of their income than those at the high end. Combined with the fact that sales tax is tied to consumption rather than income, this leads misinformed voters to the conclusion that low-income individuals and families pay a greater proportion of their incomes in sales taxes, therefore sales tax is regressive. You’re supposed to read “regressive” as “unfair”.”

Way to drink the conservative kool-aid.

I can’t imagine the crazy logic that would lead any business owner to vote no on this. Unless you own a taxi service I guess.

wscommuter April 23, 2014 (10:29 am)

Samwise … re your comment about folks in E. WA “paying” for our transportation. Just a quick fact or two for you. Do you know that for every dollar in state gas tax collected in E. WA counties, they receive back $1.19 in spending? However, here in King, Pierce, Snoho and Kitsap counties, for every $1 we pay in gas tax, we receive .84 cents in spending. This isn’t surprising – we are the most populous counties and we need to subsidize our less populated counties. Welfare for the red part of the state, I suppose, but I’m cool with that. We’re all in this together. But it would be helpful if you and others got off this silliness that Seattle/King County receives some benefit from the rest of the state – we don’t. We provide the benefits to Yakima and Wenatchee and Spokane, etc. Just facts.

Good for the folks who voted “no” – your absolute right to do so. But I shake my head at the ignorance I read in so many of the comments above. There are certainly good/legitimate reasons to have voted “no”. I respect those. But many here seem to be more about being ill-informed or selfish. That I don’t understand at all. My two cents.

TM April 23, 2014 (10:35 am)

Here’s the elephant in the room:

It’s more and more obvious, as you see inappropriate density and development projects packing unprepared neighborhoods (like, oh, West Seattle and Ballard) that the DEVELOPERS are running the show in this city.

Projects being OK’d with no parking provisions or care of impact to small neighborhoods;
density that’s way out of line.

TAX THE DEVELOPERS FOR TRANSIT.

Let them pay for moving people in and out of the neighborhoods they are packing for the privilege of building in this city.

Ebisu April 23, 2014 (10:52 am)

@samwise – more fun facts: you do realize that the proposition, if passed, would only have applied within the King County transportation district? Did you even read the pamphlet before you voted, or are you just stuck in a mindless loop of tired talking points?

MindDrive April 23, 2014 (11:12 am)

Everyone who voted no is about to get a harsh lesson in the phrase “penny wise and pound foolish”.

wakeflood April 23, 2014 (11:26 am)

I wish. You’re giving them credit for applying a rational causal relationship to their actions. They’re incapable. They’ll just point the finger of fallout blame at some other tax injustice or boogeyman they drum up.

alkiobserver April 23, 2014 (11:40 am)

I find it illogical that no voters for this poorly crafted measure are bearing the blame for Metro’s woes. This whole line of thought outlined in numerous comments above that if you voted no you are either selfish or ignorant is crazy considering the process of how this even became a special election item in the first place. I haven’t lost sight of that. Just because more (of the few) voters that participated in this process are against this particular means of funding doesn’t mean they are against Metro or that there are not other solutions they would support. How about pointing the vitriol where it should be aimed–at the legislature that failed to fix this long ago?

Diane April 23, 2014 (11:46 am)

agree TM; “TAX THE DEVELOPERS FOR TRANSIT.
Let them pay for moving people in and out of the neighborhoods they are packing for the privilege of building in this city.”

wakeflood April 23, 2014 (11:49 am)

That’s been mentioned ad nauseum observer but since NOBODY thinks that ANYTHING will get through the Republican committee (DINO Rodney) then we’re left with doing SOMETHING versus NOTHING.

Did you NOTICE that several of the usual tax scold R’s on the County Council voted for this plan and campaigned for it – on the EASTSIDE, no less? What does that tell you? It tells you that even THEY thought this was our best shot to move forward.

If you want to try to convince me that ANYONE who voted NO spent time/energy contacting their reps in the state to make something happen, prove it. Cuz I don’t believe it for a second.

The vitriol is aimed right where it belongs. On BOTH – those who said no and those idiots in the state Senate. If you said no to this, exactly what will you say yes to? Some funding bill you made up in your mind? Get real.

junctionite April 23, 2014 (11:58 am)

Repackage this to include a meaningful fare increase, at least $1 each way during peak M-F. This is the primary reason I didn’t vote for this. I don’t buy that the majority riding the bus at this time are poor, but perhaps look for a way to subsidize those that truly are low income. The rest can pay more for the service. Dump the sales tax increase, our sales taxes are already ridiculously high.

maplesyrup April 23, 2014 (11:58 am)

wscommuter and Samwise:

Maybe this picture would help explain where the tax money goes.

http://www.thestranger.com/binary/ea57/CityLead-CLICK.jpg

wakeflood April 23, 2014 (12:00 pm)

And observer, lead me through the logic tree of yours that says that now that we’ve said no to taxing ourselves why the state legislature will suddenly decide that it’s a great idea to pass taxation on their own?

Go ahead, I’m ready to hear how this argument works.

buddsmom April 23, 2014 (12:00 pm)

BRAVO Dapuffin! I knew I could count on you! I am in the same sinking boat you are….unable to walk for over a mile each way to get to work or to buy groceries. Cab? Forget it! $30+ one way to get to town. Brilliant job METRO, isolate those of us who use you daily and depend on you as our only means of transportation!

Sarah April 23, 2014 (12:13 pm)

Why do people assume that most bus riders have cars or that they can afford a fare hike? I am car-less and rely on metro for work, groceries, everything. If the fare rises above the $6/day I already pay to get back and forth to work, I will no longer be able afford to get to work.

James April 23, 2014 (12:17 pm)

For the people with the inflation ‘facts’:

THIS………

Some facts:
Since 2000 – Inflation up 36%, Metro Revenue up 56%, Metro
Operating Costs up 80%, Passenger trips up 20%.

If you look at gas inflation over that period – http://gasinflation.org/ – you will see that in January 2000 the national average for a gallon of gas was $1.29. The national average today is $3.53. This is a 273% increase in the price of gas over that time. Using only overall inflation (which includes food and other items in a regular basket of goods) is a distortion. Fuel is a major cost of Metro specifically and transit in general. The implication is that because Metro’s costs have increased faster than inflation, this is proof of mismanagement.

wakeflood April 23, 2014 (12:18 pm)

Excellent, junctionite, you’ve got a perfect plan that suits…you??

Any idea what revenue projections your idea would actually raise? Of course you do. And I assume you’ve stood in the chambers of the County Council and proposed this with your supporters? Gathered signatures? Rallied transit groups to it?

Phew, for a second there, I thought you were shooting from the hip, but no you’ve got it dialed in!

Will there be a special election for your Prop?

Sweet Jeebus…

wetone April 23, 2014 (12:22 pm)

No ignorance or ill informed involved with this vote wscommuter. People are just tired of the bad spending habits and poor choices of our city government and bad metro management. Passing this vote would of been like saying our city and metro are doing a great job and continue on. If this city didn’t have such big cost overruns on many of its projects they could of easily funded metro along with fixing our infrastructure a little, but between tunnel, waterfront rebuild/design and more billions are being wasted that do little for most the people of this city in their everyday lives, oh I almost forgot the new bike paths at a $525mil cost that will surely double also and were is that funding coming from. People are just answering back to ignorant spending and thought processes of the city government. Hopefully this will be a long coming turning point and people will continue to start holding the city more accountable in the future. Will be interesting to see how they try screwing us now since they didn’t get their way.

zark April 23, 2014 (12:37 pm)

“Everyone who voted no is about to get a harsh lesson in the phrase “penny wise and pound foolish”.”

Perfectly stated MindDrive.

Myopic
unable or unwilling to act prudently; shortsighted.
lacking tolerance or understanding; narrow-minded.

wakeflood April 23, 2014 (12:39 pm)

I love it when people use generalizations with no specific solutions that other can shoot holes through.

OK wetone, you think everything’s hosed up and you have answers, enlighten us. With some details?

What’s your plan for good, cheap, efficient government? I mean, besides saying no to everything you don’t personally like. We got that part.

West Seattle since 1979 April 23, 2014 (12:45 pm)

Junctionite, the reason our sales taxes are so high is because we have no state income tax to fund things. I don’t think the small increase was onerous. I agree with your other point though–as a bus rider I would be glad to pay an extra $1 if I knew there would also be a low-income fare for those who need it.

ScubaFrog April 23, 2014 (1:00 pm)

Gosh the ‘yes’ voters’ whining is incessant. They were gloating, calling people ‘idiots’, sure of their victory. I haven’t seen any gloating by the ‘no’ voters. The amount of complaining by the ‘yes’ voters is remarkable… They kind of remind me of the republicans who’ve been steadily whining for 6 years. The Prop 1 campaign itself reminded me, on a small scale, of the fear-mongering, insults and lies committed by the GOP and ole’ gw bush in his 2004 bid.

WSB April 23, 2014 (1:00 pm)

First post-Prop 1 proposal has emerged: Property-tax increase to raise money just to apply to Metro service within Seattle city limits. https://westseattleblog.com/?p=271330

zark April 23, 2014 (1:14 pm)

If you aren’t willing to pay your fair share, aren’t you just a deadbeat and a tax dodger?
If not, why not?
Isn’t it all of our responsibility to pay taxes to support the infrastructure that allows us to work and make money? If you aren’t willing to pay for roads (40% of this funding was to go to roads) shouldn’t you stay off of them entirely?

“Because we’re one of the only states in the country without an income tax, of course we have a high reliance on sales taxes, so this is hardly an intellectually interesting sliver of news,” Carlyle, D-Seattle, the chairman of the state House Finance Committee, wrote in an email. “The more substantive question is whether we are on the path toward being a low tax, low service, low quality of life state because of our reluctance to invest adequate resources in public education, transportation, universities, parks, Puget Sound cleanup and more. We’re among the most educated, engaged, progressive and courageous 21st Century states, yet our tax policy is frozen in a 20th Century patchwork of inefficiency.”

“We’re going to have more drivers on congested roads that aren’t in good repair.” – Philips KC Council Chair

“Faced with the choice between slightly higher taxes and draconian cuts to service, the voters have chosen the cuts. The impact will be most severe on the transit-dependent, but commuters of all modes, businesses in dense areas, clean air and water, and public health are all losers.” – Duke seattletrasitblog.com

“If you’re upset about traffic, crappy roads, or sparse Metro service in the coming months, blame @seattletimes & @Mayor_Ed_Murray. Period.”
“Final thought: You can’t be against a higher minimum wage & also vote against how people get to work for an affordable rate. You can’t.” – Olsen Seattlish

get ride of c line April 23, 2014 (1:21 pm)

Maybe if they didn’t send 3c line buses in a row they could save another route. The rapid ride buses are a joke. They serve the areas with more money. It is ridiculous that this route is ineffective. The high point area needs more buses than the price neighborhoods. But of course nothing changes take from the poor and give to the entitled people.

zark April 23, 2014 (1:22 pm)

“I haven’t seen any gloating by the ‘no’ voters.”
-ScubaFrog
“Woohoo! We, The People won this one, Seattle.”
-ScubaFrog

We’re all people, even the ones who voted yes.
I’d call that a smug comment.

Gloat – contemplate or dwell on one’s own success or another’s misfortune with smugness or malignant pleasure.

ScubaFrog April 23, 2014 (1:38 pm)

Zark you’re being emotionally-reactive. Moreover I don’t think you’re using intellect, logic, rationale, history, facts or the truth to analyze why you lost this one. The name-calling, fear-mongering and lies cost you Prop 1. It was a bad ‘bill’.
–
Let’s think about reforming Metro, and making it more efficient. No one’s going to vote to chase good money after bad insofar as Metro’s concerned. Until now I’ve voted to fund Metro, each time they’ve asked for more. But like the Monorail, and the Kingdome (for which we’re still paying) – it takes conscientious, educated, informed and intelligent voters to put the proverbial foot down on this one. And we did.
–
I have absolutely no malignant pleasure at the anger and sadness of the ‘yes’ voters’ loss, Zark. Maybe raising bus fares to $3 is what needs to happen. If the riders and ‘yes’ voters want to pay more, write a check to Metro.
–
I won’t vote to pay more in my properties’ taxes, to fund Metro. Dow and his gang are targeting a specific group to pay for the entire transit system, and that’s not fair. It will never work.
–
And zark – calling all ‘no’ voters “republicans”, and “vanilla conservatives” is laughable. And low. I’m a moderate Independent – I’ve voted for conservative, and progressive measures. You’re clearly an extremist partisan, and indicative of what’s wrong with American politics today. Extremists on the left, and right, have destroyed this nation fiscally, and in many other regards. 17 trillion in debt, Zark. Thanks.

Pokey April 23, 2014 (1:52 pm)

@zark and wakefield,

let us know when you’re finished holding your breath and turning blue! Get back to us when you can think and talk rationally. Maybe you should try to figure out why this failed instead of mindlessly blaming people you don’t even know. Seattle and King County almost ALWAYS passes these things, the fact that 55% of us thought better of it this time, should have you thinking about what should have been done, not who did it to you!

I’m guessing that with the low voter turnout, you could start by getting all your bus buddies to vote the next time. If this was such a great proposal it would have passed. It wasn’t and it didn’t. Get a grip!

Andrew April 23, 2014 (1:52 pm)

My husband and I both voted no. I am pro mass transit but metro has always been run poorly. They need to make reasonable cuts before asking for more of tax payer’s money. Whether you ride the bus or not think about this: How many of the busses in the county do you see that are nearly empty most of the time? Instead of cutting routes Metro could use smaller busses in the slow hours of the day. Or run less often during slow times. Do we really need those huge busses with the accordion center at 11pm? Do we really need overlapping bus routes like the #3,#4? The people who say that taking the bus is more environmentally friendly need to put things in perspective. How is having a bus with only one or two people on it more environmentally friendly than some one driving a compact car that gets 30 to 40MPG? It’s not! This city is growing rapidly and we need to come up with better options than an out-dated, mis-managed, fuel-guzzling bus system, maybe a full-fledged subway system like D.C.(a city with less population than Seattle), or a monorail.

Bradley April 23, 2014 (1:55 pm)

Good news! The last thing Washington State, King County, and Seattle needs are more regressive taxes like this. It’s ridiculous to make a billionaire in Hunt’s Point to pay the same $60 for his new $100,000 Tesla S sedan as the struggling single mother in White Center for her 25 year-old Toyota Corolla.

junctionite April 23, 2014 (2:30 pm)

I stand by my opinion that a meaningful fare increase should be at least part of the solution here. If the measure had also included this I probably would have voted for it, even with some kind of car tab fee and sales tax increase. I would also not support a property tax increase that was not accompanied by some fare increase.

Danny April 23, 2014 (2:48 pm)

” yet our tax policy is frozen in a 20th Century patchwork of inefficiency.”

Grabbing more taxes without have a foreward thinking plan for actually IMPROVING public transportation is the definition of patchwork.

As many have stated, my problem is that I know these funds will not be used to improve anything. Metro has proven time and time again they can’t handle this. They would’ve absolutely threatened cuts and asked for more money just a couple years later.

I’m a huge fan of public transportation. As someone who spends 2-3 hrs a day in traffic because of a crappy job transfer, I would love to not have to drive my car. The problem is they way they mismanage funds and refuse to put together a cohesive plan for the future of public transportation. If I saw a plan that brought together metro and soundtransit and outlined real plans for an I5 corridor commuter train (something that has viable stops and goes faster than 25mph) while not removing car traffic lanes, I’d be on board. $60 a year more? I’d pay $120 more a year, if the plan was viable.

There was no scenario where I saw the $60 a year resulting in any kind of improvement.

alkiobserver April 23, 2014 (3:00 pm)

I don’t know exactly what proposal to save Metro I would support right now, I just know this one was not it. After this vote, I would say the legislature has a fair idea of where a portion of the voters stand as far as pursuing this kind of taxation as a solution so, yeah I agree with wakeflood that I don’t think they will be eager to bark up that tree.

Ebisu April 23, 2014 (3:09 pm)

@scubafrog – yes, and you sold out an important and essential part of your community for sixty lousy bucks. How conscientious, intelligent, informed and educated you are. A veritable community chest of compassion and fairness! You must be just beaming with pride!

Moderate independent? Hmmm… I’m thinking something more along the lines of Myopic Eymanite (ME).

KNich April 23, 2014 (3:09 pm)

Sure, a bus strike would be fine. Let’s just drive everywhere and show Metro what’s what.

Except for those of us who DON’T OWN CARS.

I can show you exactly how this “no” vote is selfish… Those of you who voted against it because it’s “regressive” obviously have luxuries like a private vehicle; you can CHOOSE to drive or take Metro.

I cannot. I don’t own a car. I am TRYING to live on a VERY limited income ($735 a month. Read that again. $735 a MONTH.) I’m disabled. Yeah, go on and tell me how I’m just lazy and need to just get a job…

Except that my partner DOES have a job. He makes about as much money as I do. We can’t afford luxuries.

Thanks. Thanks a lot. You “no” voters ARE the regressive ones.

zark April 23, 2014 (3:54 pm)

@scuba and pokey
Sounds like you guys have the name-calling cornered.
You called me “low”, devoid of “logic, facts, history and the truth” called me “emotionally reactive” and an “extremist” – among other allusions to tantrums and not having a grip. Pot calling kettle black? yeah, yeah it is.

You really do need to stop the hypocritical comments though:
“I have absolutely no malignant pleasure at the anger and sadness of the ‘yes’ voters’ loss”

“Woohoo! We, The People won this one, Seattle. We’re still paying for the Kingdome for heaven’s sake.”

So… really? what does “WooHoo!” mean exactly in scubafrog land? It’s typically used to express glee.

I submit that if you are voting for no tax just for the sake of no tax and you call yourself a moderate or progressive, you’re just confused about your position. Defend yourself if you like, but just insulting me makes you look like you agree.
If you’re a fiscal conservative then you are – just own it already. It’s not honest of you to claim to be a moderate or to be a progressive voter when you don’t vote progressively and are by definition conservative – seems pretty straight forward to me.
Maybe you USED to be a moderate but you aren’t anymore based on what you’ve said here.

From what you’ve said you don’t want to pay for the infrastructure that supports you because you think you are entitled not to. You didn’t respond to anything I posted other than to sling insults at me personally – opposing taxes just for the sake of the rally cry “NO NEW TAXES” is a vanilla conservative republican position – sorry you don’t want it to be, but it is. ‘Shrink gov’t until you can drown it in the tub’ right? So if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck… it’s a cat? Nope, it’s just another duck.

Maybe you somehow think not voting this funding in will punish Metro and force them to be more fiscally responsible? Do you really think that? I hope not, that would be insane and you’re clearly not insane. The issue here is not whether taxes are spent wisely, they aren’t, they never have been and never will be.

The fact is we need more money for Metro – period.
If they don’t get it the people who can’t take the hit will be expected to take the hit.
It matters not why they need the money, we need buses.
I’m not sure, but I bet I’m right on this – $60 isn’t gonna break you. I don’t know a scuba diver for whom $60 would be a crushing blow.
No buses will break people who need them
So you saved $60, and will now pay $120+ in property taxes, and punished those who need your help – and you won? We all lost on this one.

Personally I think uneducated voters have done more damage than partisan politics. But you are entitled to you conservative opinions on that matter as well. You clearly see ‘conservative’ as an insult, it’s not, it’s a fairly decently defined label for people who promote political agendas similar to yours. I’m sorry you don’t want to be one, and I obviously angered you by pointing out that you are, so you slung insults instead. Next time just be a progressive and vote progressively and you won’t have that problem.

How can you call someone else an extremest partisan and then use phrases like “Dow and his gang” – those are YOUR elected officials not a gang of democrats out to get you – the “us vs them” divisiveness is exactly what you A) accused me of and B) claimed is destroying effective politics in this country.

Pokey – Thanks for calling me mindless by the way. Mindlessly blaming whom? the people who gleefully cheered at the failure and stated they voted No? – that would be the people who voted No – and the people whom I think have been extremely short sighted and have made a horrible decision.
Am I not entitled to an opinion, or are just you entitled? You’re post was mean spirited, insulting and lacked any useful information whatsoever. You should have saved the time and posted nothing, or maybe just a giant picture of you flipping off your friends and neighbors – same thing.

My position is that you are ignorant, have made a horrible mistake, and the impact of this mistake will hit hardest on our neighbors most in need, and that just sucks. Ignorant just means you didn’t know, were uniformed or misinformed – be defensive and take it as an insult if you wish.

It’s this kind of uninformed and frankly nasty comment that has defined your position here:
“Maybe raising bus fares to $3 is what needs to happen. If the riders and ‘yes’ voters want to pay more, write a check to Metro.”
That’s just snotty and meant to insult not inform.

The people who most need the bus can’t afford that hike, and they are teachers, nurses, students – the people YOU should be fighting for. They may save your life or teach your kids one day – perhaps you chose a career that is compensated fairly, but do you honestly think that we pay teachers and nurses what they deserve?

Scubafrog I believe you actually know how a city infrastructure functions, and why we need things like public transportation. So why are you against funding repairing roads? Just, it makes no sense. Wouldn’t you be pretty upset if we all voted down cleaning up the sound – should we just say scuba divers should pay for it, they use it more? That’s not how the world works.
I don’t use the sound really, but I would pay the taxes because we ALL benefit from it directly or indirectly. YOU benefit from the existence of public transportation whether you you want to admit it or not.

Fact is Washington state has a comparatively low individual tax burden, and we get a lot for it. We’re ranked 4th in the nation on ROI for taxes spent.

You’re notion that Metro can somehow be retooled is just silly – seriously it is. Read about city planning and infrastructure development, it’s fascinating and you’ll learn a lot about why screaming “NO TAX” with little understanding of how the budget is constructed is damaging to everyone’s agenda – even a fiscally conservative agenda.

You can’t just stuff you head in the sand and expect things to change for the better. You also can’t build a thriving city on the backs of the lowest economic strata.
You also can’t sling insults, accuse others of slinging insults, and not be a hypocrite.

Lastly, stop with the republican talking point about the $17T deficit – it’s BS, you know it, I know it, it makes you sound like a Fox News anchor. And if you think we should cut social security for the deficit, just keep it to yourself.

wsguy April 23, 2014 (4:05 pm)

ROM for Metro diesel costs

2000 approx $14.8 million
2013 approx $34.8 million

2013 Sales Tax Revenue over expected amount $30+ million
2014 expected to be higher

So yes voters cannot read these comments and understand how a rational person might have a different opinion and perspective and respect that?

2 sales tax increases a car tab tax and a property tax increase in the last dozen years. People saying yes to 80% of funding requests is a pretty damn good record of stepping up.

935 April 23, 2014 (4:08 pm)

For the love of everything holy…can we please stop using the word “fair”?? one of the most disgusting 4 letter words.
Who, pray tell, decides what’s “fair”? Is it fair for me to pay for something I do not use? If so, I would like all the “fair” minded people to start a bank account for me. I promise to use the funds only for altruistic motives…

Lawrence April 23, 2014 (5:12 pm)

2 years ago (2012) the state voted yes to legalizing marijuana. Other than the need to decriminalize it, a major factor in it’s legalization was the fact of being able to tax it. In fact I believe one of the estimates was around $200 million in additional tax dollars. Couldn’t these deficits be resolved if the bureaucrats get off their butts and get this done? 1/4 of the population of Washington State lives in the Seattle/Tacoma metro area, so it could be understood that 1/4 of the tax revenue if not more would be allocated to this region. A potential $50+ million dollars extra a year to tax what they already said they would, or continue to raise property and auto tax to pay for basic city infrastructure. I don’t understand the state governments way of thinking.

Diane April 23, 2014 (5:42 pm)

Thank you Bradley; exactly “Good news! The last thing Washington State, King County, and Seattle needs are more regressive taxes like this. It’s ridiculous to make a billionaire in Hunt’s Point to pay the same $60 for his new $100,000 Tesla S sedan as the struggling single mother in White Center for her 25 year-old Toyota Corolla.”

Francisco April 23, 2014 (6:45 pm)

I think its really cruel to paint those that voted no, as inhumane jackals who are incapable of feeling empathy for others. I think the yes people wanted to make this a referendum on the elderly and other segments of the population that are dependent on Metro, when really it seems to be a referendum on how Metro does business and operates in general. Frequently holding the public hostage by constantly throwing out reductions in service, and asking for sales tax hikes and parading out every elderly, infirm person in the region as the poster child for who will suffer, is simply not acceptable.

I too hate traffic on the WSEA bridge, and in the region in general but I think there are some creative ways to fix it. I personally would love to see some sort of incentive made or a shift to leverage technology more to let workers telecommute if possible. Sure it’s not an option for every profession I get it, but think about what flex hours or telecommuting would do for traffic and reliance on public transit as a daily requirement.

Jeff April 23, 2014 (7:21 pm)

We shouldn’t be punished for the lack of planning the city has historically shown. Mass transit has been around and been successful in numerous cites for 5-6 decades. In knowing this they went with a bus tunnel in 1990?? Finally get light rail in 2009??? If Prop 1 passed they would piss it away on an obsolete band aid solution anyway.

No Free Rides April 23, 2014 (8:18 pm)

I’m glad this got defeated. I will vote no to Metro until they get their books in order.

flimflam April 23, 2014 (8:26 pm)

jeff, don’t forget rapid ride…same bus stop locations…more curb bulbs! shiny EEElectronic boards to tell you how late your bus may be! renaming routes that formerly had such boring names as the 15, etc.

I. Ponder April 23, 2014 (11:44 pm)

West Seattle is awash in management efficiency experts. Reminds me of all the constitution scholars who told me they didn’t like Obamacare because it was unconstitutional. Enjoy your traffic gridlock and no whining about it please.

New Driver April 24, 2014 (7:27 am)

Where was GIR4WS in this debate? Since they’re so concerned about West Seattle, certainly they have a position and could have rallied more support around this issue, if they actually care about WS, that is.

On a side note, it appears that developers have taken note of GIR4WS actions against alley vacations and non-union low-wage jobs. A developer downtown has, in response, curbed plans for at least 1 development: http://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/blog/2014/04/hedreens-mega-hotel-in-downtown-seattle-not-quite.html?page=all

Kristen April 24, 2014 (7:44 am)

Hi all! I started a Facebook group called Seattle Hitchhikers Unite as a way for folks to connect if they are able to give rides and/or need a ride. Many of the alternative options (Uber, Lyft and Car2Go) either are above folks’ price point or do not extend into all West Seattle neighborhoods. RideShare Online is there but I’ve found it to not be so useful. It is not a place to vent and/or discuss transit options or the failure of Prop 1. It’s meant to be a way to try to help folks who will have more trouble getting to/from work, etc once transit makes cuts.

The general guidelines for the page: Get a ride. Give a ride. Don’t be a murderer.

datamuse April 24, 2014 (5:04 pm)

We shouldn’t be punished for the lack of planning the city has historically shown.
.
The city has advanced many transit plans over the years. They pretty much all got voted down. I’m beginning to think Seattle voters really just don’t like transit.
.
Mass transit has been around and been successful in numerous cites for 5-6 decades.
.
Considerably longer. The New York City subway has been running for over 100 years.

Angela Bender April 24, 2014 (5:31 pm)

The whole vote is garbage, it wasn’t a contest. The state spent 2 million dollars to have it out of regular voting season (A WASTE!) and a lot of people didn’t even know what was happening.
Just an FYI to home owners, whom do you think will be paying higher rent when our landlords get the tax hike… yes the renters. I being one myself was totally going to accept that. I am also a vehicle owner and wouldn’t really have minded the extra twenty dollars a year. I spend more than that in coffee I make at home in a month. Its not a he gets off scott free kinda deal. Some people depend on the busses to get into work. The 66 for example covers people at seattle cancer care and anybody that needs to get there from northgate which is were my other half needs to go in the morning. I work in Everett and now because of this I not only have my regular commute, I have to drive into down town to drop him off. I know plenty of people working for the UW that are facing the same issue. Open your eyes people this was just a sham and the two million dollars they spent on this vote could have kept the busses running for that much longer. Also what the heck are we doing paying our bus drivers over 60k a year???????? seriously? That is rediculous. Nowhere else in the country do they get paid that much. Its a crock! especially since half of them dont know what in the heck they are doing. This city is only getting worse. The public trans isn’t for poor people, it’s for people whom work since its not cheap to even ride the fluffing thing. UGHHHH!!!! The whole situation is frustrating.

James April 25, 2014 (9:10 am)

Angela Bender,

I am late to the party on my comment/response.

I think why bus drivers are paid more in Seattle is the higher cost of living in Seattle. US News & World Report has Seattle second in the country (after Olympia – strangely) in average pay per driver at $50,130. The same site references the median salary for bus drivers across the nation at $36,600.

http://money.usnews.com/careers/best-jobs/bus-driver/salary

Now, when I compare cost of living in Seattle to a city close to the US average for cost of living (Richmond, VA) I get the following result:

A salary of $50,000 in Seattle, Washington could decrease to $34,478 in Richmond, Virginia

This is from the website Sperlings best places, that allows a cost of living comparison.

http://www.bestplaces.net/cost-of-living/seattle-wa/richmond-va/50000

What the Richmond bus driver is being paid in an average cost of living town compares pretty well to the median for all bus drivers in the USA, which also compares well to the average bus driver salary in Seattle.

You are comparing absolute dollars to purchasing power. The other top paying cities for bus drivers are ones you might expect – New York, San Francisco, & Bridgeport, Conn. As you might expect, this correlates with the cost of living in those areas.

Jaques May 6, 2014 (11:08 am)

It is bad enough that I have to get new licence plates every 7 years. Other states don’t do that. Want to keep the same plate number that you have memorized, well there is a fee that too. They are nickel and diming the poor and middle class to death with their fees and taxes. This tax only hurts the working poor who can not afford to live in Seattle and would like to keep thier car.