WEST SEATTLE LIGHT RAIL: What will streets around stations look like? City’s ‘draft concept plan’ out for your feedback
(Cover of draft plan being circulated for comment)
If Sound Transit keeps to its announced schedule, the route and station locations for West Seattle light rail will be finalized before year’s end. Other aspects of planning are proceeding before that momentous decision – including city work envisioning how the stations will change the areas around them. As part of that, SDOT has released “street concept plans” for formal feedback. In this phase of feedback, these plans are in the form of “director’s rules” that would serve as guidelines for “the design of future pedestrian, vehicle, and multimodal transportation infrastructure in the right-of-way, with stated goals of expanding public space, expressing community character and history, providing safer environments for people moving through the neighborhoods around the future light rail stations, and improving connections for people walking, biking, and taking transit.” You can see the entire document here. We’re excerpting the text that summarizes what they’re proposing – note that this is just a fraction of what’s in the document:
DELRIDGE STATION AREA STREET CONCEPT
The street concept design for the Delridge Station Area includes:
• A raised intersection at SW Andover St and 26th Ave SW
• Stop signs and a narrow crossing on SW Andover St at 26th Ave SW to keep people walking and biking safe crossing SW Andover St
• A walking-, rolling-, and biking-friendly street with landscaping on 26th Ave SW north of SW Yancy St by closing the block to people driving
• A turn-around for people driving on SW Andover St near the station to allow vehicles to return to Delridge Way SW and reduce vehicle volumes at 26th Ave SW
• A design that can tie into the future upgrades to the 26th Ave SW Neighborhood Greenway south of SW Yancy StThis design incorporates the following proposed station area assumption:
• Nucor truck access will no longer be from SW Andover St and will instead be from a new signal entrance off of Delridge Way SW at SW Charlestown St
• SW Charlestown St will be transit-access only from SW Andover St
• Future neighborhood greenway improvements for people walking, rolling, and biking on 26th Ave SW south of
SW Yancy St
• The design for 26th Ave SW will be refined in coordination with Sound Transit and other restoration work done around Longfellow Creek
For the Avalon station area, the document notes, “This street concept plan does not include Fauntleroy Way SW, which has an existing project design that dedicates more space for landscaping and for people walking, rolling, and biking.7 The designs identified in this plan are compatible with a future project on Fauntleroy Way SW and align with the design intent identified in the Fauntleroy Boulevard design.” That said, here are the descriptions of two for the Avalon station area:
36TH AVENUE SW/SW GENESEE STREET CONCEPT
The street concept design for the intersection of SW Genesee St and 36th Ave SW includes:
• A realignment of SW Genesee to square up the intersection with Fauntleroy Way SW
• A multi-use trail on 36th Ave SW between SW Genesee St and Fauntleroy Way SW that provides more space for people walking, rolling and biking along the neighborhood greenway
• A raised crossing across SW Genesee St at 36th Ave SW
• A plaza or landscaped space between the new alignment of SW Genesee St and Fauntleroy Way SW; could include covered seating, art, and/or a community gathering spaceSW AVALON STREET CONCEPT
The street concept design for SW Avalon Way includes:
• A widened raised two-way bike lane on the north side of SW Avalon Way for people coming from the east and the west to access the light rail station
• A bike lane on the south side of SW Avalon Way for people biking east
• Expanded plaza space on the north side for people walking and rolling, and greenery that connects into the future light rail entrance of off SW Avalon Way
• A narrower street to make it safer and more comfortable for people crossing SW Avalon Way
There are two versions of the design for SW Avalon Way. The first is a near-term design that can be completed in order to provide access to the new Avalon light rail station. The second is a long-term vision of what the street could look like with additional permanent improvements. One aspect of this long-term vision would be to explore driveway consolidation and closures where appropriate.
Finally, three proposed street-concept designs for The Junction’s station area are described in the SDOT document as follows:
SW ALASKA STREET CONCEPT
The street concept design for SW Alaska St includes expanded space for people walking and rolling, as well as space to gather and wait for the light rail, bus connections, or to connect between the station entrances and the commercial corridors along California Ave SW and Fauntleroy Ave SW. There are raised bike lanes and two transit-only lanes between California Ave SW and Fauntleroy Way SW, with general purpose traffic allowed on SW Alaksa St between 44th Ave SW and California Ave SW and west-bound only between 42nd Ave SW and California Ave SW. This five-block corridor will also have pedestrian features such as raised crosswalks and intersections, all-way stop control, pedestrian- scale lighting, benches, and wayfinding.
There are two design concepts for the block of SW Alaska St between 44th Ave SW and California Ave SW. The first concept is a low- cost design that largely retains the existing curb locations. The second concept includes a “full rebuild” design that moves curb lines and has bike facility with more separation from vehicles. These concepts would need to be aligned with bus operational changes on this block, which are currently assumed to happen in conjunction with the Ballard Light Rail Extension line opening, anticipated around 2039. Because of this, the concepts for SW Alaska St between 44th Ave SW and California Ave SW may not be implemented within the same time frame as other concepts for SW Alaska St east of California Ave SW.
42ND AVENUE STREET CONCEPT
The street design for 42nd Ave SW will open the space in front of the station into a plaza space. This will help connect into the expanded space on SW Alaska St to gather and wait for the light rail or bus connections, and creates new pedestrian-focused space to host community events such as an expansion of the West Seattle Farmers Market. This space will have places for shaded seating, abundant landscaping, and connections for food trucks or other vendors, such as electrical hookups. South of the plaza space, 42nd Ave SW will have raised bike lanes, as buses will also be using this half-block of 42nd Ave SW to exit a layover space between 42nd Ave SW and 41st Ave SW, and between SW Alaska St and SW Edmunds St.
41ST AVENUE STREET CONCEPT
41st Ave SW will be redesigned to provide more space for people walking and rolling, and space for extended landscaping and trees. It will also allow for buses to enter the layover facility. There is a planned east/west mid-block pedestrian connection that ties in the pedestrian connection through the transit layover facility to a potential future connection to the east. One aspect of this design would be to explore driveway consolidation and closures where appropriate.
The full document also includes details on what lighting, pavement, wayfinding, and other components should look like, as well as many more renderings related to the proposals described above – including cross-sections of existing and future channelization.
HERE’S HOW TO COMMENT: This draft street-concept plan was published in tandem with an environmental checklist – specifically referring to the street-concept plan, not the light-rail project itself; you can see that notice here and the related checklist here. Comments on those and/or the street-concept plan can be emailed to Ian.Macek@seattle.gov and/or Lucien.Ong@seattle.gov. Deadline is September 12.
WHAT ELSE IS NEXT: We’re awaiting the Final Environmental Impact Statement, which ST suggested would be released “late in the third quarter” (which ends September 30). A possible timeline hint – checking the public event calendar for Alki Masonic Lodge while looking for something unrelated, we noticed a placeholder for “Sound Transit” on Tuesday, October 1. (That’s been a location of previous major meetings/open houses related to the West Seattle light-rail project.)
Hopefully much better than the unsafe roads around Lynnwood’s station. We need minimal cars around these stations. And great bike infrastructure.
Good luck with no cars. Lol bwahhhh
Folks will drive to the station so both car traffic and parking on surrounding streets with be increasedright or wrong especially in poor weather folks not within walking distance will drive to the stations this crazy idea that everyone will bike is just that crazyNot everyone are able to bike, or walk, Or want to
I’m always confused by the “not everyone can walk or bike” line of thinking as it relies on the assumption everyone can drive or take a car: the most expensive and far less accessible means of transit. what about all the children, elderly, disabled that can’t drive? shockingly they do exist in large amounts. same with folks that can’t afford a car or personal chauffeur. Y’all live in Seattle and never see walkers or bikers in the rain?? Public transit will always be what serves the most underprivileged the best; and the reason you fret is because your privileged and subsidized mode of transit is become slightly less convenient than you’re used to.
No please no parking garages I beg of you! Please look at Chicago and NYC train systems, they don’t do this junk and worked forever.
The city has said it many times – no parking garages for ST stations. Those have only been built outside the city. (And ST is ending the “free parking” policy for those, too, with a nominal charge, for starters.)
And yet, Northgate, in city limits, got four Park n’ Rides and one ran completely by ST.
Google says park-n-ride at Northgate goes back to 1992, so that may be because of a precedent.
The one managed and operated for ST didn’t even start construction until 2017. I’m talking about building A. Can you tell me where the city discusses many times about this because I cannot find it? Is it ST3 and beyond only?
This is what I have been saying will happen (impacting livability in the area), but people always get crabby toward me when I say it. People drive to the area and park to ride the bus now. I don’t see why a different behavior is expected for rail (that doesn’t reach as far into W.S. as rhe current bus options).Even with the goal being to reduce cars on the roads, they need to be realistic and add even a small park and ride by one of these stops.
That subliminal palpitation you perceive in the universal life force is West Seattle’s motorheads having a simultaneous brain aneurism.
Oh bull….-but now I’m really hoping delays & maybe lawsuits will push this even farther into the future & cost into billions-so you can go have your own aneurysm.
kinda weird to hope a project costs more so you can… feel smug?
It will end up costing more and being delayed regardless – since it’s Sound Transit…
Wtf Anne?!?! As someone who is disabled and can’t drive I find your comment deeply disturbing. This project will be life changing for people who can’t or don’t want to drive. Also, wtf cheers on wasteful government spending over new and helpful infrastructure?!?!
no, not “wasteful government spending,” they want the city to waste money battling in court against NIMBYs which gives us even less to show for, just like how the city had to waste time and money in court against a handful of neighborhoods upset Alki Elementary wouldn’t have a massive parking lot (y’know, for the children and character of the neighborhood).
It was a $1.6 billion project when voted on and approved. Now it is over 2x that amount – and will still basically just take current bus riders and turn them into ST Riders – at the cost of $264,000 per rider. And you think it’s a good deal? Years ago the Seattle Times published an article showing that on average ST projects come in 86% over budget, and many years behind schedule. So this project is actually 86% over budget + another BILLION. And no ground has been broken.
@WSDude1 you saying that there’ll only be a total of 12,000 riders throughout the lifetime of this project? are you insinuating that they’ve already exhausted their $3.2 billion before breaking ground? you realize there’s a difference between the value of a dollar and the cost of materials/labor between 2016 and now?
I hope there’s an easy connection to the east side Bellevue area from WS on the light rail.
Well Bill, there are already plenty of connections to the Eastside, those rectangular boxes with wheels on them called buses. Oh, and buses don’t cost a cool billion or so a mile and don’t require gashing the landscape and gushing thousands of tons of CO2 into the atmosphere. But of course that’s far too sensible, and anyway, who who is going to make any money on that?
Its not the same.Have you seen a metro area around the world with over 3 million not having or not trying to have railed transit? None.There is a reason because the rail doesnt have traffic and a rail car is much bigger than a bus (about 2x than a bus as far as I can tell from Link trains). And guess what, every time there will be not 1, not 2 but 4 rail cars arriving, or when Line 2 opens, 6 cars arriving! 12 bus loads of people at a time. Talking about sensible. The only thing insensisble is ST not able to deliver this fast enough, not the trains themselves. Hell they should have ditched the stupid Stride bus system and built light rail along I-405! That way anybody along the loop of Lake Washington can get to anywhere along Lake Washington.
I think LA qualifies as a megatropolis and have you seen the flop light rail has been there? The spectacular lack of ridership in Sacramento? I was just in Sacramento and the light rail stations are ghost towns – might as well add tumbleweeds for the full effect. Why? Because it’s just not that easy to go – poof! – and superimpose light rail on cities that have already adapted and been configured to bus transit for decades, as well as changing people’s established patterns of getting from point A to point B, whether that’s good or bad.
Um, LA and Sacramento are on opposite sides of state. Also, Sacramento as I remember it is almost just generally a ghost town, where people stick to the suburbs and surrounding rural areas. It can’t really compare to San Jose or San Francisco
What an incoherent set of arguments. Light rail is massively popular here and moves a ton of people every day. Your predictions of tumbleweeds are laughably disconnected from the every day reality around you. Buses get stuck in traffic, clearly rail is a better option
funny that Sacramento light rail has about the same ridership as their bus system, yet you think the light rail is a flop when it uses much less resources to move the same amount of people with much less infrastructure allocated to it. But you also cherry-picked LA, a car-centric hellscape which still get hundreds of thousands of riders (but lets put them into buses on the streets which are historically NOT congested). Why not bring up San Fransisco/BART? Why not San Diego, the most used light rail system in the US in 2022? Portland? You’ve brought up Pheonix before, and over the past few years it’s light rail has rebounded much faster than their bus system (could it be that *gasp* it’s easier to run and maintain rail infrastructure instead of running buses??). Cities were not built around buses, they were built around cars and buses help maintain that status quo. For someone that advocates for the environment, you sure are cool with a lot more rubber and brake dust pollution being produced next to our rivers and lakes.
Scarlett, I don’t know why you think the LA light rail is a failure. It’s the most heavily used light rail system in the country in 2024 with around 200,000 daily riders on weekdays. Link Light rail is already a huge success in the Seattle area, with every new expansion making it even more successful. This is already a game changer for our region and West Seattle will lose big if we miss our chance to be a part of it. Stop pretending that buses are anywhere close to as efficient, comfortable, high-capacity or reliable as the Link is.
There’s not. I highly recommend reviewing the plan. and checking out https://rethinkthelink.org/fact-sheet
“When it opens, it will not go downtown, nor will it go to Ballard – it will only go as far as SODO. Riders will have to transfer from there to a bus or another train to go elsewhere. Connections beyond SODO are contingent upon the construction timelines of other light rail extensions”Yes, this is how subways systems work. Do you look at a map of the NYC system and say “you can’t get from Brooklyn to the Upper West Side! You have to TRANSFER!”Stop with this nonsense.
Hi JTM. I’m from Brooklyn and you can get from Brooklyn to the Upper West Side without transferring. In fact, you can get from Queens to the Upper West Side without transferring, thru Brooklyn, on the A train, construction projects not withstanding. Not trying to be snarky, just FYI.
LOL, my bad, I didn’t zoom in enough to see that line. I hope my overall point remains the same (that transfers don’t mean “the train only goes to X”, even though my “terrible at quickly reading the NYC subway map” point was incorrect!
Ha! No, snark away. I was trying to be snarky and screwed up looking at the map. My point remains the same, however weakened by my inability to read a NYC subway map – saying that the train shouldn’t be built because it “will not go somewhere” due to needing to transfer is a bad faith argument in the best case, and a lie made to obfuscate in the worst.
There has also been some preliminary talk of sending at least some of the West Seattle trains northbound into the downtown transit tunnel right away in 2032.
Joe, Sound Transit’s current design does not allow for this as the WS line would arrive on a separate track even though many people have proposed this change. Yes, it would avoid a lengthy transfer (going up to a mezzanine platform, walking over to the other track, and down again), but I have not seen any indication that Sound Transit is considering such change. Can you share your insights?
This fact sheet is hot garbage from a UX perspective.
It’s hot garbage from all perspective, including it being named a “Fact Sheet” when a large portion of it is opinion or conjecture.
Seth and Jim – fwiw, nowhere does it say FACT SHEET anywhere in the document. It’s a CONCEPT PLAN, which is open for public comment (WSBlog doesnt count)Seth – what’s the issue you see from a UX perspective? Are you having trouble understanding the visual concepts? Just curious. I work in the industry and I understand that not everyone can quickly see what’s being presented. Or attempting to be presented.
Don’t worry–they’re talking about the Rethink the Link fact sheet linked above, not the city’s proposals.
Would be nice if that Sodo stop gets you connecting that way, but I think you’d have to transfer a min of 2x, unless you take the bus. I think that improves with the 2nd phase when the line will continues on to downtown (hopefully??)
emailed (essentially) the following: “SW Genesee and 36th should be stubbed, i.e. the right turn onto Fauntleroy from Genesee should be removed. it’d immensely increase the safety for what will become a heavy ped/cyclist area for essentially no impact on car commutes, as the right turn is made redundant by the intersections to the north and to the south.” if you agree, it would be great if you also sent an email with a similar message :)
Is it just me or am I seeing the Alaska Junction station and plaza is effectively raising the entirety of the east and west side of 42 St SW between Alaska and Edmunds? Although the renderings show the existing properties on the west side of the street, the descriptions indicate the south end of the street will now be for bus access. How is garage access to the corner apartment building maintained? Getting around by foot or car will not be much fun during the years of construction for the station. I did not come across any information on whether these areas will be done in phases. All things to consider even if preliminary.
Ok, it looks like they’re removing the eastbound lane from Fauntleroy onto Genesee… But not identifying any alternative for the eastbound traffic?
If this is the case, loads more eastbound traffic would funnel onto Dakota, which is already too narrow for its current vehicle traffic. If this plan did proceed, Dakota would at the very least need additional signage, crosswalks, and parking restrictions.
I think you mean westward, but I agree… Making that stretch of Genesee a one-way in the opposite direction it now goes is a holy mess. I guess drivers who want to get from WB Fauntleroy to WB Genesee would have to turn right onto 37th and then left onto Genesee? (Would 37th still be two-way?) I swear I checked the document and it truly is confusing.Agree Dakota is in no way equipped for more traffic.
I’m going to suggest that greater than 50% of the side streets in West Seattle should be made one way because there is no room for two lanes of traffic. Either that or you need to make one side of the street no parking. Those streets are dangerous, we all know they are dangerous, and going one block out of your way to turn around onto a one way street is not going to disrupt anyone’s day.
My bad–I meant they’re removing the west-bound lane, and there’d be more west-bound traffic on Dakota.
WOO HOO!! So excited to see station plans really shape up, and I’m also glad to see that the feedback I provided is reflected in the document. Public comment matters, yall! :D
This warms my heart, perfect in almost every way. Not one pickle ball court, pizza place, 21+ establishment, or dog park in sight… My backyard already has too many of those. The only thing that would make it 100% perfect is an aeriel tramway station and another vegan doughnut shop.
What a disgusting mess this will be. Taking away more parking, displacing great businesses and now you want to close off driveways? Ruining West Seattle day by day.
Taking away parking increases business in the long term. Every place that parking has been removed and pedestrianization and transit access has been added, it benefits the local businesses as a whole.
Except 3rd Ave in downtown Seattle. The junction is already walkable and pedestrianized? We do run the risk of over indexing in the other direction.
So true, when people ask me what I like about living in West Seattle, I tell them all about our many beautiful parking spaces and driveways
now that’s a strong comment. well played
If they’re going to close Alaska to general traffic, they need to make improvements to the alternate routes.
SW Oregon St can already serve pretty well for people going north of SW Alaska St. SW Edmunds St is the natural alternative for people that need to go south of SW Alaska St.
However, SW Edmunds St has a massive issue with people turning left / right and severely blocking up traffic on Fauntleroy Ave SW. This will only get worse if people need to use Edmunds as an alternative to Alaska St.
This is my proposal for a fix:
Alternatively, we could just remove all parking from Fauntleroy between Edmunds and Alaska, and keep the bike lane in place. Either is fine.
As well, lanes on Fauntleroy south of Edmonds could shift East as well with east parking removed for the new dedicated left turn lane. West or East both work.
The steeper sections of SW Oregon and SW Edmunds east of 42nd will be interesting during snow and ice if general traffic is permanently diverted off of SW Alaska.
Your orange label indicates you want a dedicated left turn lane for vehicles going South on Fauntleroy and turning into the half block of Edmunds that ends at The Hurley apartments? I don’t think that short stub of a street would have multiple cars needing to turn that way very often. I think that’s less helpful than a Southbound Fauntleroy right turn pocket to Westbound Edmunds.
What a mess … causing more issues than solutions for most all. Those that need to ingress egress WS will be highly impacted as city will/has now allowed big money to overbuild areas based on false numbers of those that will use Sound Transit. Total shim sham tax payers are stuck paying for. Sound Transit and all those associated are laughing as this money eating machine loads their pockets. If this every gets built, the city and state should be involved and integrate a new roadway, bike, walking path and maybe new railway for T5. As Highrise and low Swing bridge as well as Rail bridge (100yrs old) crossing the Duwamish River will ALL be past lifespans……….
Bellevue got their Link earlier this year, Lynnwood and Shoreline got it last weekend, next year Mercer Island will get connected and the year after that, Federal Way. So many other communities in the region are getting added to the network, and we in West Seattle will get our turn someday too! This is the biggest transit expansion in the US right now and I’m excited seeing all the pieces falling into place!
Bellevue has *part* of our light rail. Still no Light Rail to downtown BUT we have the 550 bus and we can get around with less planning than most. That being said, delays and construction have had an impact on everything and I feel for West Seattle because, while it will be good in the long run for many people, it will be a mess getting there. Hopefully we get the rest of the east to west line next year…who knows.
I’m not too worried about car drivers, they’ll be safe inside their cocoons. Maybe they’ll endure a few more fender benders. Meanwhile I apologize to pedestrians, I will be biking on the sidewalks. It is just getting too dangerous to bike on Fauntleroy and Alaska and I’ll be dead before we see any improvements there for people walking and biking.
Kathy – please keep in mind, pedestrians have the right of way on a sidewalk.
2 cents: I know Kathy. She is a careful and very responsible cyclist. Save your condescending advice for drivers.
Bill. Most of us don’t know “Kathy”. Educate us on why my2cents comment was “condescending” By the way. Many find her comment “condescending” towards drivers.
Yes Bill but lots of people reading this aren’t. I had a walking boot and needed to use a cane last year and despite this had people on bikes (in spandex biking outfits) go racing past me at full speed on the sidewalk. If you want to ride on the sidewalk then you need to be walking your bike while passing pedestrians. Or you’re just creating a hazard for everyone (and no I’m not talking about young children learning to ride).
I went to the opening of Lynnwood Link on Friday night. What was impressive to me was in addition to the massive turnout for the festivities at the new stations, there were several folks using Link for practical purposes – going to the Metallica concert and Pax West. There were even people with suitcases, (going to the airport I assume). If people in Snohomish County can utilize Link, I know West Seattle sure can.
Each of those new stations also have hundreds to thousands of parking spots added. It’s not an apples to apples comparison. The road dieting is too extreme as proposed. I love the urban villages of West Seattle, but I’m not going to take a 20-30 minute bus ride to visit those businesses instead of a 10 minute car ride for errands. Most of the street scape should just stay the same. We’ve got pretty good quality of life here, right?
Which is why we should push for transit to be the priority and not cars. Look at NYC where taking the subway and bus gets you to places just as fast, and sometimes even faster, than regular driving. The reason taking a bus takes double the time cars do is because there’s not enough transit and there’s not enough dedicated bus lanes, so they’re stuck in traffic with cars. Also while you might have a pretty good quality of life being able to drive and get places quicker, what about people without cars? All those people who have no options but to take the 20-30 minute trip?
They would still take the bus. I take it sometimes, but most of the time it’s not worth it. I’m not saying get rid of light rail or buses. I’m saying we don’t need to skinny up all roads (what this post is actually about) to one lane each direction with no parking. Can we not add busses and light rail and keep the street scape the same? We seem to be going the extreme in the other direction for no reason. Adding light rail and more buses is great, but let’s not ruin what is already a great walkable neighborhood. That is easily accessible to most of West Seattle.
sign of how deep we’re in car-centric thinking that still having car access, but less in a concentrated area that is going to see a huge influx of pedestrians, etc. is “extreme”
It’s the same story at stations like Beacon Hill, Kyle, and they don’t have parking. Tons of people using light rail. No hellscape of homeless cars, waiting for a parking spot to call their own. Other neighborhoods can handle it. I have faith in West Seattle to do the same.
The junction is a lively neighborhood of businesses and restaurants. It’s not a hellscape of RVs lol. My comment is not against light rail or more frequent buses. It is against skinnying up all the lanes and planting trees (there are already trees), just to take up space and make it more inefficient for cars/buses. Leave the streetscape largely alone. The whole part about a plaza for farmers markets etc. also doesn’t make sense. West Seattle does a pretty good weekly farmers market already and it is better because it is in front of a bunch of businesses.
I put in my comment on the planning website to not half-ass this amazing opportunity to design and build a hub that will promote community, and not cars (coming from a car guy) Create pedestrian only zones with thoughtful urban planning, things like more trees, more plaza’s, automatic bollards for essential deliveries, construction, transit, ect.)
Did you actually look at the renderings? Have you been to the Junction?
Why are we wasting all this time and money? West Seattle does not need light rail – it should not be built. It fails on all three dimensions of sustainability — environment, economics, and equity. Time to fully explore the No Build Option for West Seattle link, including maximizing other transportation options already in place for our unique peninsula, already served by many express busses to DT. Light rail will only go to SODO.⁃ $4 Billion saved⁃ Many Businesses saved⁃ Many Homes saved⁃ Environment saved⁃ Many families and workers not displaced⁃ No ugly cement towersNo 4-5 years of major construction
There is no “no build option,” be cause not building light rail is not an option. The ST3 measure requires Sound Transit to build light rail to West Seattle, and it passed with overwhelming voter approval in West Seattle.
Many political figures have been elected by majority, too, Peter, but that doesn’t nullify the voters right to recall politicians, or in this case, ask a court to revisit project that will negatively impact many West Seattleites. Our system of government is designed to protect minorities from tyrannies of the majority.
Comparing additional transit options to actual tyranny that exists in countries where there are very real human rights abuses happening at the hands of the government is peak privilege.
“ Light rail will only go to SODO.”This is a straight up lie, and everytime a Re-Think or Gondola or No-Build person says it, I know they’re arguing in bad faith. Stop it.
Amazing that the viaduct wasn’t replaced on the waterfront because “it was an eyesore”. Yet we’re perfectly fine with behemoth tracks built all over the once beautiful landscape? Wait til those track grinder trucks come through in the middle of the night, that noise alone is crazy. Maybe we can get an elevated track on the waterfront, it would block the now reappraised view property that skyrocketed but at least we’d get a little closer to the billions of dollars taxpayers have spent on the waterfront.
West Seattle is getting shafted with the design. I voted for the light rail but huge swaths of north seattle get underground rail to not disturb neighborhoods and North Delridge is going to lose ALL their businesses except Nucor and the atheltic club (and that might lose it’s pool).I don’t mind above ground light rail in some situations but I feel like design of west seattle is so much we spent the money elsewhere so you get a crappier design.
Exactly. Not everything is a straight shot point to point even on a bus. I still have to transfer to make connections to go north, east and south. “Maximizing other transportation options” means what exactly to you, Boondoggle? Do you even take public transit? How does this fail in terms of equity?
Buses don’t cost a billion a mile, they don’t dislocate and upend people’s lives, they don’t suck money away from other more important needs, they don’t emit thousands of tons of CO2 into the atmospher during construction. What’s the cost versus benefit calculus that you are using to justify this – yes – boondogle, WSR?
oh, Scarlett, did you forget that the highways were built and didn’t just exist in the natural environment?
It’s not that Scarlett forgot, it’s that they don’t care. They’ve gone from one talking point to the the next over the course of the conversation. For a while it was “this is just a boon for the construction industry!” (because construction jobs are bad?), there was that foray into “I just need to educate all of my poor, ignorant neighbors”, and now they’ve rebranded as an environmentalist with just as flimsy of arguments as they had before. It has never been about facts. Change is hard.
Social Equity—Light rail does not serve the areas in our community where transit-dependent populations live and are underserved by mass transit.
this may be difficult to understand, but there are a limited number of buses and drivers. so when routes are replaced by light rail (e.g. as it’s extended North) those buses become available to either ensure/increase frequency on current routes or new routes. more public transit anywhere is a benefit to all.
There is something wrong with the first map – it shows Charlestown as a North – South street – If they can’t even get the street names in the right place should they be trusted to design anything?
It is correctly labeled David. Who knew?
swing and a miss
There is no way Edmonds and Oregon can handle additional flow from the closure of Alaska. This is a huge mess waiting to happen. Many of us told the young engineer assigned to this task.
I am excited about the extension of light rail into West Seattle, but not about the City’s plan to close SW Alaska Street to general traffic between California and Fauntleroy. Traveling east/west in Seattle is typically more convoluted than traveling north/south. That is the case here, and the proposed closure of SW Alaska Street would make it worse. SW Alaska provides a rather smooth grade between 35th and 44th, which connects to angled Glenn Way. Edmunds and Oregon have sections of steeper grades. And drivers headed east or west would add to traffic on north/south avenues in the vicinity of the Alaska Junction.
YAY! I wish it was already running.
Look great! Do whatever you need to do to make the light rail HAPPEN!
This is absolutely awful and I hope they put a stop to it. Defund Sound Transit!
Amazing!! Exciting to see all of the work to make the pedestrian experience better. Looking forward to west Seattle light rail!!
I feel physically ill looking at the first picture showing THREE stations so close to each other and know how much it is going to cost the community yet not benefiting many. The price tag is HUGE. I do not trust Light Rail organization since it seems they will do what they want. Please speak up if there is any hope to stop the project and rethink the cost of THREE stations in a 2 mile area to go 5 miles. Seems like someone is smoking dope.
Meanwhile we still have missing sidewalks in Seattle. I find that really weird.
Also, that small street is called Charlestown and it does appear to be correct. It runs behind Skylark, Ounces and Sound PT. Who knew?Major building near wet lands is not recommended. Does any one know if the environmental studies been completed?
AH, there’s info about this on Seattle Transit site and ST sites. I do not know what you’re referencing but there’s bigger developments near wetlands already happening along Harbor. Modern engineers know what they’re doing. Plus, this isn’t nearly as close to any “wetland” so I am unsure what your concern really is.
I feel the same- it’s a sickening to think about all of the environmental destruction for such little community benefit.It’s hard to trust Light Rail/ Sound Transit when we are seeing huge costly mistakes on sections that aren’t as challenging as this route. They can’t even get the elevators to run smoothly. There is an (inadequate) Draft Environmental Impact Statement that states many options are unmitigatable and it will be interesting to see what the Final EIS states. It should be released by the end of this month. We’ll have 30 days to send in as many comments as possible.
I’m happy the Delridge station plan has a large area stated “Longfellow Creek Restoration” Seems like a better use than the empty parking lot it is now.
The whole area the Link will pass through is heavily industrialized and urbanized, and much of it is completely choked out with noxious weeds. Ivy, Holly, Blackberry, and others. The mitigation for this project will include badly needed environmental restoration. Losing a few Big Leaf Maples is sad, yes, but replacing invasive weeds with native species in the remaining forest in exchange is a positive trade for local ecosystems. And yes, access to the rapidly expanding regional transit network is a massive benefit for our community… no idea how you could possibly think otherwise lol
The final EIS is coming out within a few days. This time we will have JUST 30 DAYS to comment on it. When the Draft Environmental Impact Statement was issued in March 2022 we had 90 days. Over 5000 people commented. The comments were tallied but not addressed. At Sound Transit Board and committee meetings there is never a discussion or dialogue. We are allowed to comment. Period. At Sound Transit Talk -At -You events, questions are permitted (usually just one), but they are never answered, rather pushed aside by “That’s a very good question, we will have to get back to you on that.” Follow-up questions to clarify vagueness and obfuscation? NAH! But this light rail project is going to greatly impact our community. Let’s have a real town hall! We have questions. Dow has answers – let’s talk!
OMG, really? Sound Transit has had SO. MANY. PUBLIC. INPUT. SESSIONS. I’ve been to several of them, and they were very engaging and appreciative of the input we all provided. To read people’s comments at this stage of the game that they don’t think there’s been discussion is beyond frustrating. Click on “Sound Transit” on the right hand side of this page and you’ll see public engagement sessions over the last SIX YEARS. Please just build this already!
In terms of feedback for SDOT, then, what are people’s top (specific) concerns?
1) Leave all of Alaska open to car traffic because Oregon and Edmonds can’t handle the overflow
2) Remove the right turn from Genesee onto Fauntleroy for bike and pedestrian safety
3) Leave Genesee accessible to westbound Fauntleroy traffic
4) Avalon Station being super close to the other two stations (big discussion, I know)
5) Equip overflow streets (e.g., Oregon) with better crosswalks, signage, and parking restrictions to allow for two drivable lanes
6) It would be really helpful to see a comprehensive diagram of the planned Fauntleroy improvements *and* those around the Avalon Station to understand what exactly would be changing
I agree the Alaska closure to cars creates a problem of going east-west, and the steep hills on Oregon/Edmonds will be dangerous when it’s icy so they’re not good substitutes. I also have some concerns about the 41st & 42nd street closures, because 40th is so narrow between Edmonds and Alaska that there’s currently no way to have two-way traffic with parking on both sides. But I like the pedestrian and bike plazas, so my comment will be to keep them in the design, but think about how 40th will be impacted and what possible solutions are. I do want them to drop the Alaska closure though.
So pumped to be able to start visualizing what it will be like. Yes, my direct neighborhood is going to be under construction for a great while but oh my gosh the outcome is going to be fantastic! Can’t wait to be able to hop on a train from down the hill to go up to the junction.
The Junction is already highly walkable, bikeable, busable, has parking. Charming “small city” feel, streets, trees, shops, etc. I’m afraid this project will suck all the charm out of West Seattle. Making it ugly, NOISIER, and dirtier. Is the public transport system here really broke? I can take the bus from here to Downtown easily. I have friends who ride bikes or E bikes into downtown as well.
Well, looks like I have to find a new city to live in afterall. My apartment will likely be torn down based on what I see here. Not looking forward to that.
John- they are not proposing to close Alaska. The “closed” street (open pedestrian pavilion) is on 42nd.
Sarah,The city is proposing to close Alaska to through traffic (other than buses and bicycles) between California and Fauntleroy. Traffic headed south on 42nd would be required to turn right only onto westbound Alaska. Only buses and bicycles would be allowed to enter Alaska from Fauntleroy or from California. See page 42 of the West Seattle Light Rail Station Area Street Concept Plan where it says, “There are raised bike lanes and two transit-only lanes between California Ave SW and Fauntleroy Way SW, with general purpose traffic allowed on SW Alaksa St between 44th Ave SW and California Ave SW and west-bound only between 42nd Ave SW and California Ave SW.” Page 43 shows bus-only lanes on Alaska between 41st and Fauntleroy.
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September 3, 2024 (3:22 pm)
What an incoherent set of arguments. Light rail is massively
popular here and moves a ton of people every day. Your predictions of
tumbleweeds are laughably disconnected from the every day reality around
you. Buses get stuck in traffic, clearly rail is a better option.”No, Light Rail is not “massively popular here”. It’s really unpopular, and definitely underused vs projections. It’s also a massive waste of money, considering cost per mile vs people moved. It was $1.6 billion when voted for by the citizens – and now it’s 2.5x that. By completion, if it goes through, it will be closer to $5 billion – and be years behind schedule. All to move bus riders over to be train riders, while destroying neighborhoods and businesses.
oh look, another person commenting about the popularity of light rail and in turn showing they have no first hand experience. if you cared to look up any data on ridership and cost-per-mile to move passengers to try to back up your feelings, you’d instead see that the Link is one of the most popular and successful light rail projects in the US across all metropolitan areas, and yet is one of the smallest. Link light rail has been a resounding and continuing success; I challenge you to find any evidence to the contrary: The Link was 5th in the US last quarter in weekday ridership behind CA metros and Boston
Interesting to think that these numbers are before the Lynnwood expansion opened! I’m curious to see where we will rank for this quarter. And even more curious to see where we’ll be once the Link runs across the lake next year! We’re coming for you, LA!
Have you actually been to Los Angeles and ridden light rail or bus transit, Bbron? I doubt it, because if you did you’d realize that light rail’s contribution to public transportation in LA is an insignificant blip compared to the riders who take bus transit (3x light rail) and more importantly compared to the 4 million+ potential users who continue to commute via car, daily because light rail is relatively useless, and mostly a bauble for the hordes of tourists. We’re not even counting the tens of thousands of non-commuter trips by car that LA residents make daily, sans either light rail or bus transit for that matter.
Now, lets start adding up the hideous costs, both in damage to the enviroment in the release of CO2 to the atmosphere during construction of light rail and monies that could be spent elsewhere, as in expanding bus service for those here and in cities like LA where the the financially strapped desperately rely on buses to get them to work, not in the vicinity by to their destination.
In the midst of raphsodizing about the progressive “bauble” called light rail, you still remember the poor- right?
How will all the material from the demolished Jefferson Square get taken away? And the dirt excavated from the 90 foot pit at the station? New materials need to be brought in, for three stations. And then there is the gouging out of Pigeon Point. The inconvenience we went through when the bridge was down is nothing compared to 6-8 years of acknowledged destruction, construction and upheaval.
The fact that they don’t do it all at once is how it gets done. Living in Maple Leaf for a bit when Northgate and Roosevelt was constantly interrupted in a similar manner makes me confident in this being handled in a way we get used to pretty quickly. It was annoying taking, especially on 65th st (close to my house) detours but then they became a part of life.
Are you asking out of pure curiosity, or concern-trolling? Obviously Sound Transit is familiar with demolishing and clearing their sites, considering they’ve opened 43 stations over 20+ years.
Yeah, the construction phase will be disruptive. Mass infrastructure projects usually are.
“Concern-trolling,” really? This is exactly the kind of term meant to discourage critical thinking and suppress discussion.
Maybe people are entitled to have concerns and not 100% trust a fallible system.
Apologies in advance if you feel concern-troll-concern-shamed.
No, I expect people to think critically. Honey’s comment is the opposite; they’re inventing a problem that doesn’t exist, and disingenuously asking those questions to stoke opposition. Do you actually believe they’re concerned ST doesn’t know how to handle excavations, after building 43 stations to date?
West Seattle will be the nadir of Seattle light rail. Needed: a bridge over the Duwamish, a massive, ill-advised, unstable regrade of Pigeon Point North Bluff, and disruption of existing surface streets currently containing bus lines. This extension is Pork Barrel project construction all the way. Years and possibly a decade of disruption, traffic detours, cost overruns, and delays. Oh, the delays.