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October 24, 2011 at 6:51 pm #737986
kootchmanMemberYea..and the dude at 1600 PA Ave is sooo qualified? At least HC knows what it takes to meet a payroll, set aside enough cash to pay bills, how to hire and make productive the most unskilled amongst us, how to grow a business and make it profitable… but most importantly… he can see reality. He doesn’t make the mistake of making wishes facts. Bet he also knows you can;t spend more than you make for over a century..and be a viable entity..
October 24, 2011 at 7:34 pm #737987
dobroParticipantuhhh…if you exist for “over a century” then you are, by definition, a viable entity…I don’t think many of us here will be that “viable”…
October 24, 2011 at 7:38 pm #737988
JanSParticipantkman..hogwash. Herman CAin doesn’t have a clue about running this country. He doesn’t know whats in the constitution, he doesn’t know how the constitution is changed. He was OK with choice on abortion 5 days before he said he would outlaw abortion and sign a constitutional amendment to say that if given to him. Presidents don’t sign constitution amendments. At three am, when the red phone rings at the White House, do I really want his fingers on the button? No way ! So..I see you are all for the “big business” way of running the country. Joy !
October 24, 2011 at 8:08 pm #737989
cadburyParticipantKman, convenient that you left out the sentence before your quote from the Nation article you site.
“Barack Obama veered sharply down that same course, trumpeting his executive order “to remove outdated regulations that stifle job creation and make our economy less competitive.””
Um…isn’t that exactly what the repubs (and yourself) have been sqwaking about wanting to do?
Here is Obama caving again to republicans demands and you still find a way to criticize him for that?
October 24, 2011 at 8:25 pm #737990
kootchmanMemberHe hasn’t caved to anything. He is tacking, trimming sails, jibbing, to get re-elected. Uh huh… well if we are so viable dobro..what’s the beef? I don’t care about abortion, for or against… not really enough to get worked up about.. it’s been a see saw issue for decades and the debate is old and tiring. I will take Cain over Obama… any day. If Obama HAD a clue about running this country..and the American people agreed… they would not have dumped his ass in prompt fashion during the mid-terms… Jan? He sucks at the job. The polls show it. 39 per cent approval rate? Feckless panderer.
October 24, 2011 at 8:26 pm #737991
sarellyMemberA police group that has decided to stand in solidarity with the Occupy Wall Street protestors:
And, a Marine veteran speaks out in New York:
October 24, 2011 at 10:40 pm #737992
kootchmanMemberYep… good ole USA… free free free… don’t ya love it?
October 25, 2011 at 1:09 am #737993
dobroParticipant“well if we are so viable dobro..what’s the beef?”
“The beef” is that my statement challenged your lame and incorrect assertion- “Bet he also knows you can;t spend more than you make for over a century..and be a viable entity..”
which you promptly ignore and reply to with more BS assertions. That’s why I don’t bother to engage in your pi**ing matches much anymore and can’t, for the life of me, understand why anyone does.
BTW, do you care to acknowledge that your statement (the one I replied to and addressed) was a fact-free ignorant opinion?
October 25, 2011 at 1:16 am #737994
JanSParticipantKman..they are ALL..repubs and dems alike… “tacking, trimming sails, jibbing, to get re-elected”…it’s called politics. And there’s the problem…they all are just going through the motions of running things, while they just want to get re-elected, just want keep the “power”…and in the meantime this country is sinking on so many levels. Eric Cantor cares about you? Mitch McConnell cares about you? John Boehner cares about you? Same for Paul Ryan. Do not flatter yourself. They just want those running to win, at all costs, so they can say they are the party of power. But..they aren’t doing a damned thing to help the economic problems of this country.
October 25, 2011 at 1:22 am #737995
JoBParticipantOctober 25, 2011 at 3:18 am #737996
JanSParticipantOctober 25, 2011 at 3:23 am #737997
JanSParticipantOctober 25, 2011 at 1:12 pm #737998
redblackParticipantkootch: don’t change the subject.
i didn’t say anything about a republican-engineered conspiracy. and, yes, i know that clinton was a republican-lite who weakened banking regulations. later, republicans came along and kicked them down all together.
(but i do enjoy the fact that you keep ignoring that congress was run by republicans from 1994 to 2006, and they’re the ones who deregulated the banks and wall street.)
wall street responds positively to opportunity, correct? the dow was approaching 14,000 during the height of housing bubble, correct?
what was wall street buying so voraciously that was keeping an otherwise weak economy buoyed? why was their confidence so high? (because we know that they wet their pants and sell everything at the first sign of trouble.)
you can’t pretend that the government forced wall street to buy bundled mortgages as financial instruments. they wanted to buy them. and they demanded that the government change the laws so that they could bundle them and buy them.
but you’re trying to tell me that the government said, “here ya’ go. take all of these worthless bums’ mortgages. we know they aren’t worth the paper they’re printed on, but you have to buy them.” wall street didn’t give a shit whether mortgage-backed securities were toxic or not. they were paying 5 – 7% interest, guaranteed by a bank. they were ignoring the warnings that they were going to crash the economy, but still the champagne rained from the sky. they couldn’t lose – and their bets were covered if they did.
what you’re ignoring is that very few of the actual mortgages were toxic. the fact that they were bundled with perfectly good mortgages made them worthless as financial instruments.
but go right ahead and keep blaming the government for interfering with the free market’s invisible hand, which is always wise and steady, and which should be dictating economic policy.
am i right?
October 25, 2011 at 3:27 pm #737999
TDeParticipantSigh… I’d post the Community Reinvestment Act language AGAIN, like I did in a previous thread, so you could see that banks were not required to make risky loans via the CRA, but you would just poo pah it AGAIN and insist that politicians forced our hapless little financial institutions into making risky loans, even though they really didn’t want to make all that money.
October 25, 2011 at 4:33 pm #738000
YardvarkMemberAwesome to see a police group gaining steam in support of the Occupy movement:
It’s been ridiculous to see some people trying to pit the police against demonstrators and vice versa. We’re obviously all opposed to blatant corruption, shameless greed, and thoughtless ignorance in our economy and our government.
I’d love to see mutual, peaceful cooperation continue to grow not just between police and demonstrators but also among those of all political backgrounds and opinions.
October 25, 2011 at 4:39 pm #738001
kootchmanMemberTDe I could post the AGAIN the lawsuit filed by Janet Reno under the flag of the CRA..to make more risky loans available… but you would just poo pah it. But more to the point… here we go again…more bail outs for the banks… taking those rising student loan defaults off the hands of the banks and putting em’ under the federal banner. I hope he gets the votes he is chumming for.. are you all ready for a few hundred billion more loan modifications and forgiveness programs? Maybe he just can’t get past the abstraction of a trillion dollars, it is incomprehensible. Sigh.. TDe let’s see how you mount a defense to this one? $50,000 debt loads to kids with no jobs, no credit history…. not to worry though.. right? We will get it out of the 1%. Or Fisker Motors? Maybe a magical top hat?
October 25, 2011 at 5:21 pm #738002
cadburyParticipantLet’s play guess the president
“…That’s why I’ve challenged the industry leaders all across the country to get after it for this goal, to stay focused, to make sure that we achieve a more secure America, by achieving the goal of 5.5 million new minority home owners. I call it America’s home ownership challenge.
And let me talk about some of the progress which we have made to date, as an example for others to follow. First of all, government sponsored corporations that help create our mortgage system — I introduced two of the leaders here today — they call those people Fannie May and Freddie Mac, as well as the federal home loan banks, will increase their commitment to minority markets by more than $440 billion. (Applause.) I want to thank Leland and Franklin for that commitment. It’s a commitment that conforms to their charters, as well, and also conforms to their hearts.”
You’re right. George W Bush 2002
Oh and don’t forget, at the very height of the sub-prime mess (2004-2006) only 25% of all subprime loans were CRA-eliglble…
October 25, 2011 at 5:55 pm #738003
TDeParticipantGot no fight with you on Student Loan Debt. I used to work in the student loan industry and saw first hand what it could do to students. I once had to counsel a married law student at one of the nation’s most prestigious law schools, who was graduating with way over $100K in student loan debt. He had 3 kids, another on the way and was on the verge of panic because he had no job offers above $35K a year. I had to tell him that under the very best of circumstances, which would require a bunch more paperwork, his student loan payments would be at least $1000 a month. He didn’t know how he was going feed his family and told me he felt like he’d been duped because he bought into the notion that a great college education would guarantee you a great job.
I quit shortly thereafter.
I also worked for a bank that refused to make risky loans and they took a lot of ribbing and scorn from other banks that were making money hand over fist during those glory days of free lending, but they stuck to their guns. So don’t tell me that our financial institutions were “forced” to make sub-prime loans. They weren’t!
October 25, 2011 at 5:59 pm #738004
DBPMemberI’d love to see mutual, peaceful cooperation continue to grow not just between police and demonstrators but also among those of all political backgrounds and opinions.
Well said, Yard. I see this “Occupy” movement as being mostly about Americans taking government back into their own hands.
Step 1 is to get corporations OUT of government and to curtail their political “rights.”
Ordinary conservatives should be able to get behind that, right? If a so-called conservative said to me: “No, I think corporations should be equal with humans in the political arena,” –I would have to say: “Well then, you’re not a true conservative.”
I don’t know what you ARE exactly.
A corporate shill maybe. A toady.
But not a conservative.
October 25, 2011 at 6:11 pm #738005
DBPMemberSo don’t tell me that our financial institutions were “forced” to make sub-prime loans. They weren’t!
Correct, TDE, but neither was that law student you mentioned “forced” to take out $100,000 in loans. He was an adult when he borrowed that money, and he had a responsibility to research the job market and calculate his odds of being able to pay it back.
He took a gamble (rather naively) that he’d be making a lot of money right out of school, but he bet long and lost. Oh well. I feel somewhat sorry for the guy’s kids, but not for him. You know, he probably shouldn’t have even had the kids until he had some money saved and/or a more solid career under his belt. But that’s people for ya. I’ve made my share of bonehead moves, too.
Anyway, I’m for corporate accountability AND personal accountability. How can we hold our corporations and politicians to a high standard when we don’t hold ourselves to the same standard?
October 25, 2011 at 6:26 pm #738006
YardvarkMemberMembers of the US armed forces are now starting to actively organize and speak out in support of the Occupy movement as well:
October 25, 2011 at 6:41 pm #738007
TDeParticipantYou’re right DP… or that other guy… :) Adults do have a responsibility to research the cost of debt before jumping in. Unfortunately, there are millions of college graduates who didn’t do that. How many high school graduates this upcoming year will do that before jumping into college? Hopefully more, now that the recession has changed a lot of financial thinking.
This poor guy jumped right into college loans as a freshman, got married early during his undergraduate years, started having kids (as programmed by his religion), went right on through graduate school living on debt and part-time jobs while studying. He only got the awful wake-up call at graduation.
“How can we hold our corporations and politicians to a high standard when we don’t hold ourselves to the same standard?” Good Question!
October 25, 2011 at 7:12 pm #738008
YardvarkMemberGood call. It’s usually your fault if you bite off more than you can chew. Presumably, this guy isn’t a fraud, though. He isn’t corrupt. He didn’t accept bribes. He didn’t deceive anyone but himself.
Our politicians, on the other hand, constantly accept large bribes (or campaign contributions) from wealthy individuals and businesses to deregulate their practices and maybe send some subsidies their way.
As a nice thank you, some of our most powerful corporations, in turn, have bent and broken the law to deceive both their investors and the general public. Their most recent deceptions have greatly contributed to (if not solely caused) a global economic collapse.
So the guy who wanted to get a good education and start a family comes out smelling just as evil as Enron or Goldman? He sounds like an otherwise ideal citizen who simply bit off more than he could chew. In fact, if we hold him to the same standards as our politicians and corporations, he actually comes off looking like absolutely purity and sunshine.
In reality, I think we currently hold ourselves and our neighbors to a much higher standard than corporations or politicians. That obviously needs to change. It’s high time to raise the bar on the latter.
October 26, 2011 at 4:04 am #738009
redblackParticipantTDe let’s see how you mount a defense to this one? $50,000 debt loads to kids with no jobs, no credit history…. not to worry though.. right? We will get it out of the 1%.
what in god’s name are you blathering about now?
if students had sufficient assets, they wouldn’t need loans with exorbitant interest rates now, would they?
and pay it back they do. in spades. a lot of them have to take multiple deferments to pay that money back. and the juice keeps running. and the jobs keep leaving.
yeah, i do know what i’m talking about. my wife paid back two college loans at 9% interest while i supported our household.
and not one thin dime of those loans was paid back with taxpayer money.
man, wall street is laughing their asses off at us as we keep paying our bills while they jack up the cost of everything. and it’s even better for them when we default or otherwise wreck our credit scores. pile on the interest!
this country is sick, and it was made sick by money.
it’s time we got well again.
October 26, 2011 at 4:20 am #738010
DunnoParticipantPolice union, Marines, whatever. Day late, dollar short. Whole movement has lost the media and its steam…next time.
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