Home › Forums › Open Discussion › is the ugly American our new cultural hero?
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August 9, 2012 at 10:18 pm #604325
JoBParticipantthere was a time when every American could identify the ugly American
when we traveled, we knew exactly who our foreign neighbors were talking about
the rude guy/gal who demanded everything be exactly like it was back home everywhere they went
and rudely/loudly proclaimed that the locals should do things the better way.. the way they were done wherever his/her back home was…
no-one wanted to be identified as THAT person.. not even my most right wing republican friends.
lately however, it seems that people can’t defend the kind of person we would have once taken pains to avoid quickly enough…
in fact, boorish behavior is celebrated
Can anyone explain this to me?
August 9, 2012 at 10:41 pm #766431
2 Much WhineParticipantJoB, have you traveled outside our borders recently? Maybe some Americans celebrate that behavior within our borders but outside, in a foreign land, it still exists and is embarrassing as hell. That may be part of the reason some American travelers tell people they’re from Canada. I don’t know many people that I’ve met in other parts of the world that “celebrate” American obnoxiousness.
August 9, 2012 at 11:02 pm #766432
kootchmanMemberI am going to bet… I have traveled outside this country more than most. That is not my experience. I can explain to you, that there has always been this class, or sub group of apologists with nothing to apologize for. It’s sorta like Californians that move to a rugged state of individualists .like Texas, Idaho, Wyoming.. and then try to recreate liberal, bankrupt. nanny states…. ? That kind of people? They are very self deprecating to the point of embrassement. They shouldn’t travel.
August 9, 2012 at 11:27 pm #766433
SmytheMemberFunny enough it’s the short sighted money worshippers who hate their fellow countrymen such as the poster above that the majority of people outside the US see as the problem with this nation.
And the idea of the religious wacko states being made up of “individualists” that best represent us.. I would laugh if I didn’t feel so sorry for you.
August 9, 2012 at 11:48 pm #766434
JoBParticipant2MuchWhine
“Maybe some Americans celebrate that behavior within our borders but outside, in a foreign land, it still exists and is embarrassing as hell.”
i am embarrassed when i see it here…
and i see it too often
August 9, 2012 at 11:49 pm #766435
JoBParticipantkootch..
i don’t apologize for that kind of boorish behavior
what can you say that will adequately apologize for that kind of behavior?
i simply don’t behave that way
August 9, 2012 at 11:57 pm #766436
kootchmanMemberwhat I find out when I travel abroad…. universally… is they love the American culture… none too happy with our government.. I can relate to that. Overbearing institution that is is.
August 10, 2012 at 12:05 am #766437
miwsParticipant….and then try to recreate liberal, bankrupt. nanny states….

“Woo hoo! Something else that’s the liberals’ fault!“
Mike
August 10, 2012 at 12:05 am #766438
JoBParticipantkootch..
again..you miss the point
that being our current national celebration of boorish behavior
but i will point out that Smythe countered the point you just made 2 posts prior to yours
discontent with the American Government tends to follow the American military backing up the “rights” of American multinational businesses in foreign countries…
August 10, 2012 at 2:59 pm #766439
PDieterParticipantI wish the Ugly American was our cultural, foreign policy hero. A good book, often mischaracterized by people who only read the title.
August 10, 2012 at 4:33 pm #766440
DBPMemberThat’s right, PD. Unfortunately, since the title was ironic this kind of misunderstanding was bound to happen. (Americans have always had a hard time with the concept of irony.)
In the book, the hero is physically ugly but spiritually beautiful. His beauty consists in the nobility of his struggle to help the people of a developing country (read: Vietnam) feed themselves. As Mr. Oogly sees it, if the Vietnamese people can feed themselves, they’ll be better able to fend off communism on their own and won’t need to fall back on the US military to “rescue” them.
In the book, as in Real Life, the American government ultimately decides to foresake the development strategy and go for a military solution instead, with predictable results.
Contrast the Ugly American to Graham Greene’s Quiet American, who was physically beautiful, but spiritually ugly.
***************************************************************************************
When I was in ‘Nam, I didn’t see many Americans, ugly or otherwise. I did, however, see lots of Ugly Germans, Ugly Australians, and yes, even Ugly Scandinavians.
To me, it’s reassuring to know that God spreads the ugliness around in the same measure as the beauty.

Anybody recognize this ugly gal?
(No cheating, please.)
August 10, 2012 at 4:41 pm #766441
JoBParticipantPDieter..
i agree that is a very good book..
do you agree that ugly americans are a bad cultural example?
August 10, 2012 at 4:43 pm #766442
JoBParticipantAugust 12, 2012 at 2:14 am #766443
PDieterParticipantJ, outside of the book I don’t know what threshold you’ve set for your definition. I believe I made my position clear with my response and DBP might have clarified some of my usual obtuse stance.
I’m a returned Peace Corps Vol from the Regan era so I think that might also define my foreign policy and international travel ethic.
August 12, 2012 at 3:36 am #766444
JoBParticipantPDieter..
no definition
just increasingly boorish behavior
and far too much public acceptance of it :(
August 12, 2012 at 3:52 am #766445
DBPMemberYes, Jo. Very good. Eleanor Roosevelt.
On whom I have always had a particularly huge crush. (We’re talking DBP-sized crush here.)
Â
As you know, Eleanor was not renowned for her physical beauty as an adult, but she was quite a looker in her youth, no?
Reminds me of my grandmother, Charlotte.
She was no great beauty, either.
But she took care of everybody.
And just seemed to love everyone around her.
She never learned how to swear, but when she got really angry at someone, she’d stand there shaking, unable to speak.
Called the really bad people “stinkers” and “no-good-niks.” Stuff like that.
And never understood why there had to be war and suffering, and why people couldn’t just . . . get along with each other. Like she did.
Â
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Another Ugly American, she was.
Â
God bless her soul!
August 12, 2012 at 8:02 pm #766446
JoBParticipantDBP..
there are a lot of definitions of ugly
Eleanor’s behavior was one of her biggest assets
August 12, 2012 at 9:38 pm #766447
kootchmanMemberwe’ll go with the “accepted ugly american”… yep, I have seen the boorish behavior so many times…. humping bags and bags of grain onto CH 53’s and C-130’s to make those air drops… to flood and earthquake decimated areas. Field water purification units delivered courtesy of the 10% taxpayer… or the arrival of the USS Comfort. Ah the list is long indeed.. Smythe… throw a $20 spot in the cookie jar.. the needs are great any many. What the want.. what they admire.. is the opportunity. what confuses them when they get here.. is how little advantage the native sons and daughters take advantage of their opportunity. Their work ethic and this opportunity is the reason we need more immigrants. Our gene pool is getting too diluted. We need more vigor.
August 12, 2012 at 10:19 pm #766448
JoBParticipantkootch.
need help getting your train back on the track buddy?
boorish behavior of a few does not translate into trashing all Americans
any more than the good works of a few translates into an excuse for individual bad behavior
August 13, 2012 at 8:07 pm #766449
kootchmanMembernice back track… so the answer to your question is by your admission… not. It is not a cultural norm or value.
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