Home › Forums › Open Discussion › 50 Statistics About The U.S. Economy That Are Almost Too Crazy To Believe Read
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July 10, 2010 at 2:49 am #595491
ToddinWestwoodMemberJuly 10, 2010 at 3:04 am #698679
me on 28th Ave SWParticipantaaaaaaaaAAAHHHHHHHH!!! Glad there is some free music/entertainment in West Seattle this weekend. Yikes.
July 10, 2010 at 3:07 am #698680
JoBParticipantdoesn’t it just make you fell all warm and fuzzy :(
July 10, 2010 at 3:47 am #698681
ToddinWestwoodMemberI didnt mean to be a downer. It just blew my mind, and I had to share.
July 10, 2010 at 4:04 am #698682
cjboffoliParticipantSome of those statistics can seem a bit more alarming when presented without context. I find a good antidote to a pile of depressing economic data is to spend some time on the TED website. It is easy to get stressed out by the never ending media stream of bad news and gloom. It is worth reminding ourselves that our country is also full of incredible innovators doing amazing work. http://www.ted.com/
July 10, 2010 at 6:01 am #698683
inactiveMemberCool link cjb – thanks for sharing.
And, just to jump on the downer dogpile of economic gloom & doom with a staggering fact which blew MY mind: I had a conversation last week with a Bank of America mortgage officer. So, she tells me, Bank of America has hired 3,000 people to take calls in their Eminent Default Department. That’s just one lenders strategy to deal with the people who have not YET defaulted, but are gonna’. Multiply that by how many others …….grimmer than grim.
So, yeah, I’ll go look at cjb’s site. No problem.
July 10, 2010 at 6:05 am #698684
me on 28th Ave SWParticipantI’m glad you shared too, just showing my flair for the dramatic. Those statistics (sadly) are quite reflective of what I see happening in my family and extended network of friends. Good to be aware…
July 10, 2010 at 8:20 am #698685
charlabobParticipantPerhaps another way of looking at the data referred to in the right-wing propaganda above is that it is almost too irrelevant to believe.
Perhaps the banks are going to start answering the phones from mortgatge holders who are attempting to negotiate deals, rather than just ignore them until it is too late.
July 10, 2010 at 2:22 pm #698686
inactiveMemberCharla – Good point. Such is the hope, for certain.
July 10, 2010 at 2:59 pm #698687
JoBParticipantdid you notice how they overload you with debt scare so you miss stats like this one…
More than 40% of those employed in the United States are now working in low-wage service jobs
Perhaps the lack of investment in US based manufacturing jobs and the huge tax breaks given to the uber wealthy have more impact on our national debt than social programs on US debt?
July 10, 2010 at 4:57 pm #698688
SmittyParticipantFWIW – Receipts and Outlays by year (in constant dollars):
http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=200
When the tax cuts expire at the end of this year they will go from:
10%/15%/25%/28%/33%/35%
To:
xx/15%/28%/31%/36%/39.6%
Increases of:
50%/12%/11%/9%/13%
Also, the marriage penalty returns. The penalty can force a married couple to pay more in taxes than when they were single. Starting next year, the joint-filer standard deduction will fall back to about 167% of the amount for singles meaning lots of lower and middle-income couples will face higher tax bills.
Shame on Bush for reducing the lowest bracket 50% and getting rid of the marriage penalty. Jerk.
July 10, 2010 at 11:34 pm #698689
JoBParticipantSmitty…
Ok…
it’s a budget.
like any budget.
you can’t provide more services
or wage more war
and cut income…
Bush did.
well, ok.. he wasn’t so good on the service part
unless you count the payouts to big pharma masquerading as prescription assistance to the elderly
but he more than made up for it on the war
and corporate handouts
and corporate tax exemptions
and tax relief to high income earners…
and it paid off big time to both groups
their income is at an all time high
yet they aren’t doing their part of that trickle down thing…
When large corporations don’t pay taxes
and don’t invest in American jobs it’s a double whammy on the budget…
Bush left the mostly unfunded war
and the financial mess he created
for the next president to clean up…
It could have been McCain..
and the twit from Alaska
but You got lucky
a democrat picked up the pieces
and you can bitch to your heart’s desire
July 11, 2010 at 12:18 am #698690
DPMemberSmitty,
I want to understand the point you’re making above, but it’s not clear from how you’ve presented the numbers. Can you think of a better way to put this information, or summarize it a little differently for us?
You’re saying that Bush lowered taxes for poor people, right? Can you expand on that a little, please?
Thanks.
–David
July 11, 2010 at 2:34 pm #698691
SmittyParticipantDP,
The “Bush tax cuts” lowered income taxes for ALL people – except those who didn’t pay any at all, of course (and here is the key ) PROPORTIONALLY more to the “poor”. The lowest bracket went from %15 to 10% (33%) and the highest bracket went from 39.6% to 35% (12%).
In addition – as they relate to income taxes – the removal of the “marriage penalty” helps ALL brackets but has a bigger impact at the lower levels since their overall tax burden is so much less.
Oddly enough – despite all the rhetoric – the “Bush tax cuts” actually made the income tax code MORE progressive, not regressive despite what (probably) most people think (thank the media).
July 11, 2010 at 4:32 pm #698692
JoBParticipantsmitty..
i love that word.. proportionately…
as though 5% of $30,000 ($1,500)
was somehow so much more than 4.5% of $250,000 adjusted gross.. that is after every tax deduction known to man clicks in… ($11,250)…
i suppose one could make an argument that there a so many more with those $30,000 incomes than $250,000 incomes and that it has a cumulative effect…
but the choice to invest in jobs overseas instead of here in America has cut that number substantially….
as it turns out.. the highest actual cash tax burden is currently shouldered by the supposedly upper middle class.. especially those in the $50,000 -100,000 tax range without the tax shelter of children or mortgages or ….
and those with kids and mortgages are now being hit with the alternative minimum tax:(
a fact the percentage game slight of hand slides right over….
July 11, 2010 at 10:53 pm #698693
EscondidoMemberoy vay iz meer….
Saw that on the internet earlier this morning. Also saw the following. We are all so invested in capitalism, but perhaps we’ve outgrown it. This fellow says some interesting things. I’m finding it a challenge to wrap my mind around it, but he makes a lot of good points.
http://comment.rsablogs.org.uk/2010/06/28/rsa-animate-crisis-capitalism/
July 12, 2010 at 1:25 am #698694
JoBParticipanti don’t generally cross post links here but there are some stats buried in this article that you might find relevant.
The economic model the right is trying so hard to protect isn’t good for our health…
July 13, 2010 at 3:31 am #698695
DPMemberThank you for clarifying those figures for me, Smitty. In terms of tax cuts, it looks like you’re right: percentage-wise, President Bush did help people in lower income brackets more than he helped those in higher ones. Although I was against Bush on other grounds, I have to concede this point.
At the same time, JoB makes a good point about what a few percentage points mean to a millionaire versus what they mean to a middle-class person, don’t you think? Now I know that some people (including some flat tax advocates on this blog) think that the question of how you make your money, and how much money you start off with shouldn’t enter into the tax discussion, but I can’t agree with them.
That “50 Statistics” link that ToddinWestwood posted was an interesting mixture of facts and opinions presented as facts. Most of the items seemed to be neutral or left-wing in their slant, but there were a few that were definitely from the right—like the one about a “projected” shortage of doctors resulting from the Obama health care reform. In my book, that’s not a statistic. It’s propaganda.
What I really got out of that “50 Statistics” page was the idea that America, as a country, and Americans, as individuals, are living beyond their means. And I can’t argue with that! I tell my kids not to use credit to pay for things that aren’t personal necessities—things like cell phones and cable TV—but they never listen. Similarly, I tell my government not to borrow money to pay for things that aren’t national necesseities—like war in Iraq and Afghanistan. But my government never listens either.
In a particularly ironic turn of events, my daughter, against my advice, recently enlisted in the Army Reserve and will soon be shipping out for Afghanistan.
Why has she done this?
Is it for love of her country? -No.
Is it for love of her fellow man? -No.
Is it because of the $10,000 bonus the Army is paying her? -Yup.
And what does she need this money so badly for? So badly that she’s willing to die for it?
-Why, to pay off her cell phone bill, naturally. Along with a few other bills she’s racked up over the years since high school.
Weird, huh?
I wonder what percentage of our young soldiers enlisted specifically for the purpose of paying off debt.
Now there’s an interesting statistic for you . . .
–David
July 14, 2010 at 2:24 am #698696
JoBParticipantDP..
wouldn’t it be nice if our children could learn from our mistakes?
the baby of my family will turn 40 next year…
and i am still waiting for that day:)
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