CORONAVIRUS: King County might require some businesses to verify you're vaccinated

Ann Breen September 7, 2021 (11:51 am)

Please mandate vaccinations, it is safer for all.

Rhonda September 7, 2021 (1:59 pm)

None of the three vaccines do anything to stop asymptomatic spread of the Delta variant mutation. Fully-vaccinated people are still a threat to public health. That’s why we have an indoor and outdoor mask mandate, the latter of which started today. It’s also why Delta has spread like wildfire even in the 80% vaccination-rate Seattle area. At least one other variant is already here.
- uh, no September 7, 2021 (4:16 pm)
  
  “None of the three vaccines do anything to stop asymptomatic spread of the Delta variant mutation.”
  
  Well that’s just completely, ridiculously, wrong.
  
  I mean, it’s so far from correct that I don’t really know where to begin, other than just saying, uh, no, and wond how on earth you ever arrived at such a weird conclusion. So… What’s your thinking there?
  - Matt P September 7, 2021 (7:10 pm)
    
    That’s the latest talking point against the vaccines. They latched on to the initial studies of vaccine effectiveness saying that they didn’t study whether it actively stops infection at all. Now there have been several studies showing that it does in fact completely stop infection, but the damage has already been done and the misinformation won’t die.
    - Canton September 7, 2021 (9:10 pm)
      
      https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/health-58322882.amp It’s not that simple.
- Kris September 7, 2021 (8:44 pm)
  
  Based on animal studies as well as a human epidemiological study out of England, “immunization with either the Pfizer or AstraZeneca vaccine reduced the chance of onward virus transmission by 40-60%. This means that if someone became infected after being vaccinated, they were only around half as likely to pass their infection on to others compared to infected people who weren’t vaccinated.” Source: gavi.org knowledge is power
  - Canton September 7, 2021 (9:51 pm)
    
    Prof Spector said: “Many people may not need them. Many people may have had a natural booster because they’ve already had a natural Covid infection, so will effectively have had three vaccines…..Natural immunity is a very important factor.
  - Canton September 8, 2021 (12:40 am)
    
    So about 50% breakthrough cases is acceptable?
    - major_sigh September 8, 2021 (11:17 am)
      
      Are you referring to the excerpt above? It does not say 50% chance of a breakthrough case. It says of the the breakthrough cases, transmission is reduced by 40% to 60%.While I don’t recall the exact stat for breakthrough cases, I do recall it being much much lower than 50%. However, that # will go up as more variants are created by the virus circulating, primarily among the unvaxxed.
    - wsalien September 8, 2021 (11:30 am)
      
      “So about 50% breakthrough cases is acceptable?”That is NOT what that means. Breakthrough cases are rare. IF there is a breakthrough case then that person is 50% LESS likely to spread it. If you are vaccinated, you are unlikely to be infected and unlikely to spread the virus.
- Scubafrog September 8, 2021 (12:15 am)
  
  Rhonda you should be BANNED for Covid misinformation and disinformation. Just obscene. It’s so dangerous to lie about the pandemic, and for WSB to post these lies.
  - Free speech? September 9, 2021 (9:37 am)
    
    Freedom of speech is still a thing, right? Even if you find it distasteful?
    - Doug September 16, 2021 (9:26 am)
      
      A private blog isn’t the government.
- License to drive September 8, 2021 (6:40 pm)
  
  Please everyone also remember that being fully vaccinated has shown to be protective from more severe illness/death for the percentage of breakthrough cases. These vaccines aren’t 100% effective in preventing transmission/acquisition but are highly so, reduce and more consistently effective than gambling with some natural immunity if you’ve already had covid.
- CMT September 9, 2021 (12:18 pm)
  
  Please see, generally, Idaho if you have any questions as to why vaccines should be mandated. SMH. They are literally begging their residents to not get into car accidents or have heart attacks because their ICUs are filled to overcapacity with the unvaccinated COVID patients. They are now starting “crisis standards of care” which means they will have to allocate their resources to the patient more likely to live over the one that is suffering more. Idaho has a less than 50% vaccination rate.

WS Taxpayer September 7, 2021 (11:57 am)

We can be Pro-Vaccine and ANTI-PASSPORT at the same time. Government overreach at its finest and we cannot stand idly by and allow this to continue. “Papers Please” to authorize everyday interactions is not a direction anyone ultimately wants this thing to go!

Derek September 7, 2021 (12:53 pm)

Concern trolling the vaccine that saves Hundreds of thousands to Nazi German level “papers” is about as disingenuous and bad faith as it gets.
S.A. September 7, 2021 (1:31 pm)

It is so not cool to evoke Holocaust/genocide imagery to air your gripes about vaccine verification. We are asked to provide evidence of car insurance before we’re allowed to drive. We are asked to provide evidence of childhood vaccinations before we can enroll our kids in school. If you don’t want to get vaccinated, you can choose not to go to a bar or concert and the only loss to you will be a bit of entertainment and pleasure. This is not the Holocaust and you are not being ghettoized and exterminated.
- Smittytheclown September 7, 2021 (2:09 pm)
  
  I am 100% pro vaccine, but comparing vaccine proof for school to vaccine proof to buy a cheeseburger is insane. This is an entirely new level. And yes, covid is an entirely new level of virus.
  - CAM September 7, 2021 (7:34 pm)
    
    Correct, school is far more essential than a cheeseburger so setting higher barriers to get the latter shouldn’t offend anyone.
  - S.A. September 8, 2021 (8:53 am)
    
    No one is preventing you, or is going to prevent you, from “buying a cheeseburger.” If you are not vaccinated, by choice or because of age or disability, you can order a cheeseburger and pick it up through the drive-through window, or order it online and have it brought out to you in a bag, or have it brought to your home by a delivery service.
WSNoraa September 7, 2021 (2:11 pm)

You have to show your ID to get into the bar. Nobody cries “papers please” about that.
wsperson September 7, 2021 (2:28 pm)

The “papers” are free and easy for anyone to get, it’s not scary, it’s not government overreach, it’s definitely not the Holocaust, and I ultimately am all for it…just like I’m all for preventing measles, polio, rubella, whooping cough, mumps, and so on.
- Brian September 7, 2021 (5:42 pm)
  
  It was way easier for me to get a vaccine than it was to get a drivers license.
Jort September 7, 2021 (2:33 pm)

Interesting, because we tried “pro-vaccine and anti-passport” and American conservatives chose, instead, to allow their political ideology and stubbornness to facilitate the spread of a new variant of the worst viral pandemic in modern history. Now we are going to try “get the shot or else stay home where you can no longer hurt anybody and pout about it on Facebook” because, it turns out that the Cult of Individualism does not actually work in a pandemic! If you want to participate in the benefits of being part of a society, you have an obligation to be responsible for that society, and you will either get the shot or you will be righteously denied service.
- Fauntleroy Fairy September 7, 2021 (5:13 pm)
  
  The largest verifiable groups of the unvaccinated are PHD’s, healthcare workers, and BIPOC. Stop making this political; it is not.
  - CAM September 7, 2021 (7:33 pm)
    
    That doesn’t seem like an accurate statement based on actual statistics. It is upsetting that there are people in those communities (the Ph.D. and healthcare specifically) being resistant to vaccines but I don’t think there are any statistics out there saying there are higher percentages in that group than in the general population. Also, in terms of “largest #s” by sheer volume those communities don’t make up the majority of the population and the unvaccinated in those groups are the minority, therefore they would not be the “largest” group of unvaccinated individuals out there.
    - Andy September 8, 2021 (7:56 am)
      
      There is some oblique truth to it (Carnegie Mellon Study), though Fauntleroy Fairy’s wording is, indeed, inaccurate. In terms of education levels, the groups with the highest resistance/hesitancy to vaccination were the least educated and most educated. The most educated also showed a lower decrease in hesitancy over time (less likely to change their minds in favor of vaccine).The study covers the other stuff, too: race/ethnicity, political leanings, age, geography, etc. It’s only one study, so it isn’t Gospel, of course (unless it supports what you already believe).
  - Jort September 7, 2021 (9:39 pm)
    
    Multiple surveys reveal, over and over again, that the single largest consequential demographic group that refuses to get the vaccine is white republican males. There is a strong correlation, also, between the population’s vaccination percentage and their political leanings in the 2020 election. This IS political. Pretending it’s not is a refusal to acknowledge the reality of our situation and the dangerous effects that the Cult of Individualism so praised by reactionary conservatives has on our society.
  - penn stewart September 8, 2021 (9:02 am)
    
    My post is merely concise, but not inaccurate and not from just 1 study. You can research the stats if you want, but the facts remain the same; even if you or others try to spin them.
    - Ice September 8, 2021 (5:48 pm)
      
      It’s not great form to claim that your opinion is backed up by multiple studies and then not provide those studies. The burden of proof is on you.
  - alkiobserver September 8, 2021 (9:18 am)
    
    Excellent point Fauntleroy Fairy. The Left makes this equally political as the Right. Turns a blind eye to the vast swaths of the Democratic base in predominately Blue states & cities that are vaccine-averse while scornfully pointing to those GOP “anti-vaxxers” as THE PROBLEM. Seattle has not had a measurable conservative, let alone Republican presence in decades, but they are the problem? Stop. We need to look within and work to overcome vaccine hesitancy within the blue base. Follow science not political science.
    - Jort September 8, 2021 (6:59 pm)
      
      The “blue base” is not the most resistant to vaccination. It’s white republican males. Here, read, and quit telling the rest of us we’re wrong when we are not. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-the-press/nbc-news-poll-shows-demographic-breakdown-vaccinated-u-s-n1277514Percent vaccinated: Republicans who support Trump more than party: 46 percentBlacks: 76 percentDemocrats: 88 percentSo, yeah, we’re not going to pretend this is a bipartisan issue. This is a republican anti-reality cult problem.
Anne September 7, 2021 (3:12 pm)

This is not overreach at all-as someone else said -we are required to provide documents for a myriad of things -kids going to school are already required to show proof of certain vaccinations. The vaccine is free-it’s easy to get. But if you choose not to get vaccinated-it’s just that -a choice -you’ll know there are certain places you won’t be able to go-certain things you won’t be able to do-simple .- simple & your choice.
Amy September 7, 2021 (6:25 pm)

How do you feel about flying or driving? We having been handing over papers for years.
- License to drive September 7, 2021 (8:46 pm)
  
  Right, was just thinking, is it overreach to require a licenses to drive, or for anything?
  
  A vaccine ‘license’ to participate in certain places and things makes sense during a pandemic.
Mariem September 7, 2021 (8:39 pm)

It’s a public health life and death emergency! Warranted.

Jort September 7, 2021 (12:05 pm)

Good news, you’ll still be able to go to the businesses if you’re vaccinated! If you’re not, well, it’s not complicated, you’re not a special unique flower, and it’s ok that you’re wrong about it and that you will belatedly have to admit your error. You’ll get the vaccine and deal with it and move on with your life like everybody else, or else you can be socially excluded from the rest of society so that you are no longer a diseased vector, stubbornly and intentionally spreading infection and putting other innocent people at risk and jeopardizing the stability of our health care system. People (largely based on political affiliation) have basically built up COVID denialism and anti-vaxx sentiments so strongly in their minds that admitting they were wrong would essentially be the equivalent of a Christian being forced to admit the Bible doesn’t even exist, but that is a problem for those people and their self-delusions to cope with, not the rest of society. You’ve made your mistakes, you will be forced to admit them, and you will get your shot and move on with your life like a grown up.

WS Taxpayer September 7, 2021 (1:07 pm)

Jort – just so we are clear – even with the vaccine, you are still a diseased vector…
Fiz September 7, 2021 (1:55 pm)

Couldn’t have said it as well. Thanks
major_sigh September 7, 2021 (8:41 pm)

I am both provax and pro-verification and yet even I am offended by this post. Making obnoxious villifying statements won’t do anything to help people on the fence. And by the way, most people, left or right are deluded by whatever belief system they have on many issues further polarizing this nation. The last thing we want is for people to see this as punishment or marginalization or anything other than what it is–a simple public health measure. In short, you are not helping the situation here.
- Jon Wright September 7, 2021 (9:34 pm)
  
  At this point, I’m done trying to reason with “people on the fence.” Anyone who isn’t vaccinated by now is not going to get vaccinated by choice. My wife and I are vaccinated but our three kids are too young to be vaccinated. So every sociopath out there who is “on the fence” poses a mortal threat to my children. I am all about vilifying and marginalizing people like that who have demonstrated they do not care about their fellow humans.
- Jort September 7, 2021 (9:45 pm)
  
  We have tried to be “considerate” and “respectful” of the individual’s “right” to “choose” to get vaccinated for six months now, and it can be considered only a generationally colossal failure. Ostracizing and social exclusion in conjunction with vaccination mandates for participation in normal society are the tools we have left to get people to snap out of their culty anti-reality thought-bubbles and change their behaviors. I am done waiting around for Fox News viewers to have their precious, sensitive baby feelings soothed enough to maybe get a shot but only if the liberals are nice to them and Donald Trump can take credit for it. The time to act with resolve and determination to exclude these society-destroying people is now. Coercion and hand-holding didn’t work. Now the mandates will come, and they will deal with it and grow up. If they view that as “punishment” or “marginalization” they can complain about it to the 650,000 Americans who’ve died from COVID, who will listen to their complaints as much as the rest of us should.
  - major_sigh September 8, 2021 (7:41 am)
    
    John and Jort, The county is going to move forward with the mandate whether or not you spout your mouth off at anti-vaxxrrs. So I repeat, you aren’t helping any. Mandates might change their minds, as well as other measures like ins co’s taking refusing to cover their care or perhaps even raising their premiums. All of these are productive solutions to help move people off the fence. But vitriol and hate will not. Might even make them dig their heels in further. So pat yourself on the back for that.
    - S.A. September 8, 2021 (8:57 am)
      
      Why is it that the Left is always being scolded to be more pleasant and appeasing to the Right, when the Right doesn’t even bother to conceal its scorn and contempt but is not similarly told how much nicer it must be if it expects to be taken seriously?
    - major_sigh September 8, 2021 (6:29 pm)
      
      The people I know who are unvaxxed are not from the right. Not sure why you are bringing that up. But, I guess it makes you feel better.
    - shotinthefoot September 8, 2021 (11:50 am)
      
      they can dig their heels in all they want….because they won’t be able to go anywhere or do anything while still unvaccinated! And none of us need to police how we’re speaking so we don’t offend the unvaccinated. They’re on the wrong side of history, not Jort or John or anyone speaking out right now. If the unvaccinated are offended at the talk of mandates, or us “mouthing off” just imagine how offended we all are by their continued ignorance.
    - major_sigh September 8, 2021 (3:17 pm)
      
      Some of us still have people we care about that are not vaccinated that we would really like to see get vaccinated. I guess you don’t so good for you.

Benjamin September 7, 2021 (12:12 pm)

Just got an email from the Seahawks that proof of vaccination or negative test within 72 hours will be required for games. This is great!

Alki resident September 7, 2021 (12:36 pm)

Who determines who is essential? My friends are musicians. They’ve suffered the last two years financially. This is out of control. It’s nobody’s business who’s been jabbed. It’s time to move to a less stuffy state.

W Seattlebob September 7, 2021 (1:11 pm)

Really?? less stuffy?? I work in the music/entertainment business and have lost both friends and salaries over the covid virus. I’m sorry that you are so inconvenienced for your friends that you would forego having to show a card to get into an establishment. It’s in everyone’s best interest who is “jabbed” and who is not. Did you have to show proof of vaccination to goto school?? i bet you did. Stop the posturing and get off your soapbox. It is in everyones best interest to get the shot. To be able to use that same vax record to get you into a club or concert or game to ensure the safety of not only you, your neighbor and others, as well as the players, musicians, and staff?? I would do it every time. Support your friends and enjoy what having that card has to offer all of us. Move to Texass if you think its better there…..
WSREZZO September 7, 2021 (1:41 pm)

Only the business of those who get infected from you….
MB September 7, 2021 (2:03 pm)

Let’s be honest, the loss of business from 15-20% of unvaccinated folk ain’t gonna prevent your friends from gigging. The vaccination rate here in Seattle is fantastic- I’ve been to a few restaurants that asked for vaccine cards, and they seem to be packed in just fine. Honestly, I’m happy things are trending in this direction. Vaccines not only help the individual, they help society at large. If someone refuses the vaccine, and thus, refuses their obligation to the greater society, society has no more obligation to make things easy for them.
shotinthefoot September 8, 2021 (8:09 am)

yeah, maybe time to move to Idaho, where they don’t care about any of this, and their hospitals are overwhelmed with dying covid patients. But at least the bars are open and musicians are gigging. That’s the important thing. Too bad we’re so “stuffy” here and actually care about our neighbors.
- Penn Stewart September 8, 2021 (9:11 am)
  
  It appears you only “care” about neighbors who agree with you….just say’n.
  - shotinthefoot September 8, 2021 (4:44 pm)
    
    No, I am just exhausted by having to care about the unvaccinated, and the people who spread their BS in a public forum. We are in a public health crisis and I am absolutely worn out trying to convince people who don’t give a crap about their neighbors that they should. But you go on and judge, if it makes you feel better. And get vaccinated if you already haven’t. Please.
major_sigh September 8, 2021 (11:25 am)

Many jobs right now outside of music industry, even outside of services. There is a significant labor shortage in construction and other skilled and unskilled workers. So much that contractors are willing to hire unskilled and train them. I have little sympathy for people who today are still struggling with emp because of covid. It’s a small inconvenience for your friends to temporarily pivot to something else if covid measures saves lives. Also, I struggle to see how this hurts the music industry. A vax mandate might increase attendance at live music events.

Hungry September 7, 2021 (12:52 pm)

I got vaccine carded for the first time this weekend while entering a restaurant. I don’t carry my card with me so luckily they were ok with just a picture of it. It was nice and easy and I have no problem continuing to show the picture. If they come up with a state app to show proof that is ok too. I just don’t want to have to carry the physical card because it doesn’t fit in any wallet and keeps getting bent and damaged

S.A. September 7, 2021 (1:32 pm)

I bought a vaccine card holder on Etsy. Looks like the multipass from Fifth Element.
DBurns September 7, 2021 (1:38 pm)

https://myirmobile.com/ If you scout around travel sites you may guess that the actual card will become a thing of the past. Too easy to duplicate and they’re already selling copies on the internet . This is the website we used and showed all over California last week where proof is required at most indoor places; restaurants and bars for sure. It’s nothing like “showing your papers” lol We are in a Global Pandemic and the vaccine slows down the death and sickness – why someone has a problem with that is beyond me.
WSREZZO September 7, 2021 (1:40 pm)

There is a QR code you can show to businesses with your vaccination status.

Derek September 7, 2021 (12:52 pm)

Mandate the vaccines. Enough is enough. The anti-vaxxers are taking away our freedom to enjoy this world. They’re anti-freedom and pro selfish.

Benjamin September 7, 2021 (1:13 pm)

This is great news! Just got an email from the Seahawks that proof of vaccination (yay!) or negative test within 72 hours (not really helpful!) are required. I am a season ticket holder that approves!

oerthehill September 7, 2021 (1:59 pm)

Does anyone know if the vaccine card is valid if you just recently received the second shot? Or does it need to be two weeks out from getting the second shot?

Peter September 7, 2021 (2:25 pm)

Yes! This is overdue. The vaccines are easily accessible and free. It’s time for those who refuse vaccination for any reason other than legitimate medical need to be excluded from places where people gather for everyone’s protection. Refuse to get the shot? Stay home to protect everyone else.

Oerthehillz September 7, 2021 (2:48 pm)

DBurns, Thanks for the info. I tried to register but in order to go back to my birth year I would have to hit the back button for each month times 61 years! Any tips on how to work around that?

Cb September 7, 2021 (5:51 pm)

To oerthehillz, when the date of birth calendar appears, tap or click on the year. It will allow you to change the year
CAM September 7, 2021 (7:38 pm)

The website is much easier to use on a computer than a phone.

Pandemic-age Bar Goer September 7, 2021 (2:58 pm)

I got vaccine-carded for the first time at a restaurant last night. It definitely made me a bit uncomfortable and gave me NEW THING BAD vibes, but once that feeling passed I realized that this a temporary thing that is for the health and safety of everyone around me, and it is far less intrusive than asking to see an ID.

AdmiralE September 7, 2021 (4:51 pm)

It isn’t temporary, everything permanent starts “temporary”. Additionally, and as others have pointed out, the vaccinated can still pass the virus so ultimately it does nothing to protect those around you.
- wsalien September 7, 2021 (5:26 pm)
  
  “Additionally, and as others have pointed out, the vaccinated can still pass the virus so ultimately it does nothing to protect those around you.” That’s absolutely and utterly untrue. Fully vaccinated people are much LESS likely to spread covid, IF there is a breakthrough infection they are less contagious for a shorter period of time. That goes a long way towards protecting those around you.
  - Spreader September 8, 2021 (7:26 am)
    
    It can be hard to trust that vaccinated people are less likely to spread the virus when I know about 30 fully vaccinated people that have caught covid from someone vaccinated and spread covid (to other fully vaccinated people) 2 of these people even had a 3rd booster shot and one of them ended up in the ICU and barely made it out. I currently hear far more stories about vaccinated people giving someone else (also vaccinated) covid. These people are not asymptomatic and multiple of them have been seriously Ill from the virus. If the virus really has such a high efficacy rate I’m just surprised in my small circle there have been so many breakthroughs and so much spread.
    - S.A. September 8, 2021 (9:07 am)
      
      “I currently hear far more stories about vaccinated people giving someone else (also vaccinated) covid.”Yes, because the majority of adults in King County are vaccinated! That’s why the majority of stories you’re hearing are about breakthroughs. Which are still unlikely to cause hospitalization or death. I have known a couple of vaccinated people still get seriously ill, about as ill as I’ve been with a very bad flu in years before the flu vaccine. I’m very, very keen to avoid getting that ill.
- Pandemic-age bar goer September 8, 2021 (2:40 pm)
  
  Ok, let’s conduct a thought experiment and assume that, as you say, asking for vaccine status at the door isn’t temporary. Let’s assume that it will go on forever. How would this happen? The government would probably just add your vaccine status to the state-issued IDs. Your ID already has your name, DOB, address, driver license information as other personal information. Adding vaccine status doesn’t strike me as much of an invasion of privacy. This would be very hard to legally implement because someone’s vaccine status is HIPAA protected. This means that you can legally ask for proof of it but it is illegal to release it without consent (with some exceptions for medical emergencies). I personally believe that this is temporary because changing the HIPAA laws to allow for vaccine status on IDs is a lot to accomplish for a disorganized bureaucracy.
  - S.A. September 8, 2021 (7:41 pm)
    
    “Adding vaccine status doesn’t strike me as much of an invasion of privacy. This would be very hard to legally implement because someone’s vaccine status is HIPAA protected. This means that you can legally ask for proof of it but it is illegal to release it without consent.”This understanding is incorrect. HIPAA only covers medical professionals. Yes, you would have to give consent for your vaccine status to be disclosed to the DMV in order to put it on your driver’s license. But then it is in no way “illegal” for the DMV to print that information on your license once you’ve given consent. You could choose not to give consent, I suppose, just like you could choose not to sign up for one of the verification apps coming online out there. But then the problem is that you’re withholding your consent. Some states list your blood type on your driver’s license – with your consent of course. That’s private medical information. You can choose not to disclose it and then nothing will be listed. Vaccine status would be no different.(Of course I don’t see vaccines being on licenses any time soon because, although they haven’t determined a time frame for effectiveness of the COVID vaccines, if it’s like the flu shot and needs renewal every so often to account for mutations/strains and waning immunity, you’d have to have that info renewed every year, and licenses are for 10 years. DMV doesn’t want that hassle.)

Michael Waldo September 7, 2021 (3:03 pm)

Your “freedom” to not get vaccinated intrudes on my freedom not to get infected by folks you won’t get vaccinated. This pandemic would of been over in a few months if people had listened to the science and worn a mask and distanced. Now with delta surging, the responsible thing to do is get vaccinated. This is not about your freedom, this is about the common good.

StopCuttingDownTrees September 7, 2021 (4:27 pm)

If you’re fully-vaccinated you are at near-ZERO risk of contracting the A or B variants. However, your risk of spreading Delta is just as high as an unvaccinated person. Discriminating against unvaccinated people does nothing to stop Delta. It doesn’t care what nasal passages it gets spewed into the air from. That’s why we’re all wearing masks again.
- uh, no September 7, 2021 (7:56 pm)
  
  “However, your risk of spreading Delta is just as high as an unvaccinated person. “
  
  Completely wrong.
  
  Here is a very simple step-by-step explanation:
  
  If you are vaccinated you have less chance of catching the Corona virus, including the Delta Variant. That’s a fact.
  
  And if you have less chance of catching it, then there’s less chance of you spreading it. That should be obvious to anyone.
  
  It’s that simple.
  
  I have no idea where Brad et al are getting such incorrect information, but it is wrong, it is demonstrably wrong, and it’s obnoxious that these people are helping that lie spread.
  - Lamont September 8, 2021 (1:35 pm)
    
    Yeah nobody has done any transmissibility studies of breakthrough infections with Delta. What we know from Alpha is that 80% breakthrough infections do not infect anyone else.
    
    This is what we expect because asymptomatic infections (where the entire course of infection is asymptomatic) spread roughly 10x less. And despite all the headlines to the contrary, vaccines are still pretty effective against infection and extremely effective against severe symptoms and death. They should also dramatically reduce transmission.
    
    In the absence of any studies of human transmission though a lot of very scary headlines about delta have caused people to assume that the vaccinated can transmit every bit as much as the unvaccinated. This seems to me to be actually getting pushed by public health authorities as a way to scare the vaccinated into wearing masks out of caution because they know the unvaccanated won’t listen. This is probably a public health mistake on par with the early masks-dont-work message, which was born out of a concern over people hoarding PPE. Similarly we’re going to find out several months down the road that vaccinated individuals may get breakthrough infections but they really don’t spread it very well.
    
    What has happened now is that exactly the wrong message has been getting out there which is that the vaccines simply don’t work. But we’re almost certainly going to see studies published within a few months that vaccines are actually effective against transmission and that if everyone was just vaccinated the pandemic would be over.
    
    It is fairly deeply frustrating because I do support vaccinated people taking additional precautions since any effort to slow the spread of the virus helps. At the same time we can see in this thread how the messaging around delta is so very counterproductive to getting the people who could do the most to stop the pandemic (just get vaccinated) to do their part.

wscommuter September 7, 2021 (3:07 pm)

Another vote in favor of this. It gives cover to businesses who might have wanted to make this a requirement but were concerned about offending the anti-vaxer’s. At this point, like most other rational folks, I’m tired of having to re-mask and endure restrictions again because a selfish minority refuses to follow science and be good neighbors. So if that means those folks can’t go to a restaurant of their choice, or shop at Costco, or whatever, so be it. They can go shop and spend their money in the red counties that will continue to be stupid about the virus and its consequences.

Chicago September 7, 2021 (3:34 pm)

If you have already had Covid you should not be forced to also get a vaccine (or loose your job, be banned from restaurants, etc.).

Amy September 7, 2021 (6:29 pm)

Pretty sure no one is forcing you to do anything, you are choosing.

Chad September 7, 2021 (3:43 pm)

Yes! Thank you. Need to add seasonal flu vax requirement as well. Enough with the selfish and entitled breathing our air and spreading infection. I won’t be bike riding or driving my car until this is over – both are high risk and I don’t want to put my community in higher jeopardy by consuming medical resources at this time. I trust King County to tell me when it’s safe to return to my normal activities.

Jort September 7, 2021 (5:45 pm)

While I appreciate that you’re recognizing the unforgivably destructive impacts of automobiles on Americans, albeit sarcastically, it’s important to note that automobile fatalities and injuries do not grow exponentially through viral transmission, nor do they typically have the potential to overwhelm our hospital system’s capacity through that growth. Nor is the fatality rate from influenza particularly as virulent nor is the flu as easily transmissible. But if you’d like to make false equivalencies to Covid prevention and just admit that you’re lying to make a point, I suppose you can keep doing that, too.
- Chad September 8, 2021 (1:51 pm)
  
  You’re making the same mistake so many have made in becoming laser-focused on all things COVID you fail to see the bigger picture. I live in a world that includes things like cancer, accidents, depression, dependency, and many sicknesses other than COVID. So many areas in my community where we can take steps to make life better – my line of sight extends beyond COVID but I realize you don’t see as far, and that’s ok.
  - Wseattleite September 8, 2021 (4:03 pm)
    
    Chad, thank you for pointing out the bigger picture that so many seem to be unable to view.
  - Jort September 8, 2021 (6:49 pm)
    
    Depression, car collisions, cancer – these are not transmissible viruses. Covid requires a different response because it is a more serious threat. Don’t minimize it. It’s gross and demeans the 650,000 Americans who’ve died from it.
  - heartless September 8, 2021 (7:23 pm)
    
    “You’re making the same mistake so many have made in becoming laser-focused on all things COVID you fail to see the bigger picture. I live in a world that includes things like cancer, accidents, depression, dependency, and many sicknesses other than COVID.”
    
    Perhaps if someone were so “laser-focused” on Covid that they neglected sunscreen, never wore seatbelts, and ignored issues of mental health you’d have a point.
    
    But simply pointing out that there are other bad things in this world seems like a poor argument–particularly when people actively work to manage the risk these other bad things present.
    
    Don’t you want to minimize your chances of getting cancer? So you wear a hat or sunscreen. Don’t you want to minimize the chance of getting killed in a car accident? So you wear a seatbelt. Don’t you want to minimize the risk of Covid? So you get vaccinated and mask up.
    
    It’s well and good that your “line of sight” extends beyond Covid, but do you really think that others (in this case Jort) can’t care about minimizing the risk of Covid while still, I dunno, wearing a seatbelt or putting on sunscreen?

Bandana September 7, 2021 (5:41 pm)

King County is working on a COVID verification system according to the local newspaper.

WSB September 7, 2021 (6:37 pm)

That’s from the same announcement we reported here (follow the link). The headline, however, is that they’re moving toward vaccination requirements.

pagefive September 7, 2021 (6:36 pm)

COVID vaccines are designed to prevent severe illness, hospitalizations and death. And they accomplish that very effectively. Just take a look at the health department’s new dashboard https://kingcounty.gov/depts/health/covid-19/data/vaccination-outcomes.aspx. Requiring proof of vaccination to gain access to bars, concerts, football games, etc. will ensure that unvaccinated people and kids under 12 aren’t exposed to the virus in spaces with a high risk of transmission. There are several cities and countries already requiring proof of vaccine for certain activities, including our neighbors to the north (Vancouver, BC).

Lamont September 9, 2021 (11:50 am)

Vaccines also almost certainly still greatly reduce infections and transmission as well, even against delta, even with “waning”.

major_sigh September 7, 2021 (7:49 pm)

This can’t come soon enough. I do hope it includes all resturants, cafes and bars. Then I can stop coming up with awkward excuses of why I can’t hang out with my unvaxxed friend.

Enough already! September 7, 2021 (8:30 pm)

In regard to limiting access of unvaccinated people (of vaccination age), this should be heavily enforced and severe! Religious reasons are moot. If folks don’t want to be vaccinated then they should stay home. Zero access to bars, restaurants, concerts, movies. Even zero access to groceries and businesses. They can have it delivered and pay more. Insurance rates should skyrocket for unvaccinated people. Pay a penalty fee for the choice of not vaccinating. Also zero access to flights, and taxis.ICU ventilator access should go first to vaccinated people. Unvaccinated folks go to the bottom of the list. There is NO excuse for not vaccinating (outside of allergies). You all are making it way too easy to be unvaccinated.

MM September 7, 2021 (9:03 pm)

So what happens when the city/state reaches over 90% – 100% vaccinated and it’s still spreading and people are still getting ill? Keep showing your stupid card? No, now you’ll have to show a booster card and get another round of shots – on and on and on. This seems never ending. One zip code in West Seattle is already at 87% vaccinated.

bill September 7, 2021 (11:09 pm)

Hopefully at vax levels greater than 90% ICUs won’t be filled nearly to capacity. You are right, people will still be getting infected because current vaccines don’t prevent mild infections. But hospitals won’t be crushed and if you need intensive care for any reason there will be beds available. That’s the point of vaccinations and masks — to prevent the hospital system from collapsing. The vaccination status of a single zip code is irrelevant. That is too small a group of people to matter.
- Canton September 8, 2021 (10:13 pm)
  
  Just asking. If the ICU beds are becoming overcrowded, why isn’t the state setting up temporarily mobile facilities regionally? That was one of the recommendations at the start. Set up pop-up locations for just covid patients, and save the beds for other emergencies. That would be a reasonable response to any infuxes.

Oakley34 September 7, 2021 (10:32 pm)

Bout time.

Rae September 8, 2021 (9:12 am)

No matter how you feel about vaccines, this is not a great path to be on. History has taught us that. Giving this level of control over what we do with our bodies (that should be between a physician and a patient) is control that you cannot get back. You cannot be pro choice about other issues and not about this one. Excluding people from participating in society for refusing to get an injection isn’t ok. They won’t be providing an exemption so please don’t tell me that it’s “just like school“.

anonyme September 9, 2021 (8:36 am)

Pregnancy is not contagious, and comparing a pandemic to abortion rights is ludicrous. Please explain why “history” has taught us that mass vaccination or public health measures are evil and lesson-worthy? Excluding those who have no respect for others from society and pose a clear danger to others, on the other hand, is an appropriate and necessary measure that has both true historical, societal, and medical merit. I absolutely support your ‘right’ to not vaccinate, but only if you then are isolated from the rest of society. That so many people can’t grasp the difference between a civil rights matter and the control of a virulent disease is a sign of pandemic-level ignorance.
wscommuter September 9, 2021 (11:28 am)

Of course it is okay to exclude the unvaccinated. Private businesses have the right to exclude any customer they wish so long as it isn’t for a constitutionally protected reason (like race, ethnicity, sex, religion, etc.). Just like a business can exclude a customer for refusing to wear a shirt or shoes … or for behaving badly … or for any other number of legally recognized reasons that businesses are permitted to self-regulate. Your “freedom” in choosing not to be vaccinated stops at demanding to be allowed to enter someone else’s private property.
Lamont September 9, 2021 (11:52 am)

I actually can pick and choose which things I’m pro choice about.

You don’t get the choice to drive drunk, for example and we try to stop you.

Vaxed and against mandate September 8, 2021 (2:24 pm)

Welcome to New China folks! True Liberals used to be about freedom of speech, distrusting the government and personal rights; i miss the 60’s. This is a horrible virus that will continue to mutate. Those of us who chose to be vaccinated are the true trial subjects of this pharmacological experiment; no matter how long it’s been in development in a lab. Such vitriol on these pages, it is sad. I have voted for and marched for freedom for everyone not just those that believe and do as i choose. The ‘science’ has changed every week for 18 months; it will change and evolve; but politicians in Washington are diluting our personal freedoms and Seattle seems just fine with that because we are smarter than everyone else.

heartless September 8, 2021 (7:26 pm)

Sorry, what personal freedoms are you losing?
- Canton September 8, 2021 (10:18 pm)
  
  Mandates that could jeopardize the job and family you care for.
  - heartless September 10, 2021 (7:30 pm)
    
    Canton, that pre-supposes that vaccine mandates are new.
    
    But they are not.
    
    People who rail against vaccines and vaccine mandates as a loss of personal freedom simply don’t know their history. In 1777 Washington mandated inoculations for the army. In 1905, the Supreme Court ruled that vaccine mandates were constitutional. The ruling wasn’t even close.
    
    Since mandates for vaccines are as American as apple pie, and have been around as long as this country has existed, how silly it is for you people to now be crying about it being antithetical to American ideals.
    
    ps
    
    I had a laugh at your line about caring for your family. If you care for your family you are pro-vaccine, and pro-mandate. There is no gray area there; there is no room for debate.
- Fauntleroy Fairy September 9, 2021 (7:41 am)
  
  Wow. This IS still America. If you don’t understand what personal freedoms would be lost then there is no way to even begin to explain it to you.
  - heartless September 9, 2021 (9:34 am)
    
    “Wow. This IS still America.”
    
    Sorry, I thought it was New China?
    
    ” If you don’t understand what personal freedoms would be lost then there is no way to even begin to explain it to you.”
    
    That’s the kind of impeccable logic a 12-year-old would spout. “If you don’t know I’m not going to tell you!” Good one. Ya got me.
    - Fauntleroy Fairy September 9, 2021 (11:47 am)
      
      I rest my case…
Derek September 9, 2021 (11:52 am)

They let anyone say anything huh? Now mandating something that doesn’t kill 1/10 of the country is equivalent to China. Just wow. Lots of concern trolls.
- heartless September 9, 2021 (8:31 pm)
  
  Wait until they learn that George Washington mandated vaccinations…

Business owner September 8, 2021 (6:57 pm)

Does this mean business owners who aren’t vaccinated will be required to close? Or will they be the “dive” bars where the unvaccinated can freely enjoy each other’s nonjudgmental company? Almost like being able to smoke indoors:). Obviously unvaccinated folks can still walk about, do what they have always been doing (masked when necessary… not all are “heinous”, and have heeded the mask wearing)… BUT now, the business will be only for the unvaccinated, and they won’t infringe on the vaccinated… seems easy to me. Especially since the un-vaxxed are banned from all other public places. This will keep the patrons who have already had Covid, who have developed an increasingly stronger immune system and who know to stay home if sick…”away” from the people who continue to also spread the virus due to a false sense of security based on being vaccinated. Win/win. And I’m pretty sure the “unvaccinated” establishments will welcome vaccinated folks and give them kudos for venturing into such dangerous territory… because they are vaccinated and protected. OH- and to add to safety precautions, those that want to enter an “unvaccinated” establishment, will have to provide proof that they don’t have any children… to counter the “but, but, what about the kids that can’t be vaxxed yet?” Sounds like a good compromise eh?

major_sigh September 8, 2021 (7:07 pm)

I personally would like freedom from this pandemic. This mandate gives me more freedom, not less and I am excited for it. Also, the science on the dangers of covid haven’t changed other than getting worse. But yes, agree, some of the comments against non-vaxxers are uncalled for and are sad indeed.

Canton September 8, 2021 (10:38 pm)

The point is, this mandate is just another layer to divide people. Hasn’t the pandemic already done that? Notice how all the talk of racial divisions has been on the back burner. This is the current division, so what’s the next one? Can we just stop allowing the narrative of division, and focus on ourselves and the people we care for around us? The flu shots never did this.

Business owner September 8, 2021 (11:17 pm)

Just a little information on the Delta (because that is what has propelled the notion that vaccines aren’t entirely effective… aka… why the “unvaccinated” are perpetuating this virus.). I had to go to the clinic (for something unrelated to being “sick”)… I casually asked the nurse how things are going for her, in the medical world… she stated that all was fine… and yes, there has been an uptick of Covid positives, and then finished it with “you know… ‘cause the Delta”… I then nonchalantly asked her… “so you all test and know that the results are due to the Delta?” She said…”well, no, we don’t have the ability to know if it’s the Delta or not. But it would be nice to know, because that would give us better info.” After that appointment, I went to another appointment (yearly check up with my naturalpath)… I again nonchalantly asked about this Delta variant (making sure to get a natural response… because some get super defensive and thus, to me, can’t critically think and discuss)…and she additionally admitted that no Covid test (to her knowledge), has differentiated between COVID-19 and the Delta Variant. SO- when we discuss vaccines and their efficacy… I truly am curious why those (when they realize that “break-through” cases happen), that everyone blames this Delta variant… which has, in my experience, is a variant of the virus that cannot be tested… yet is still blamed for cases?

heartless September 10, 2021 (1:09 pm)

I think the confusion might be that while PCR or antigen tests won’t tell you which variant you have the state and feds do run tests that determine the prevalence of variants, Delta included. So health departments and the CDC and etc., will take samples from the population and run different tests, these being ones that determine variants, that are done at the genome level by epidemiologists who are interested in levels broader than just individuals. And that’s how, for example, we know that the vast majority of current cases are due to the Delta variant rather than Alpha Covid. Does that make sense?

That said, if you test positive for Covid these days, odds are extremely high that what you have is the Delta variant.

Derek September 9, 2021 (11:47 am)

Mandate vaccines! End the violent selfishness of anti-vaxxers!

anonyme September 10, 2021 (4:02 pm)

I’ve noticed something interesting on my daily walks. Every kid or teenager I see is masked, even when they’re alone outside on an uncrowded street, and don’t necessarily need to be. And yet, many of these kids have covidiot parents who continue to throw tantrums and hissy fits over vaccines. Go figure. Maybe we should put the kids in charge.

business owner September 11, 2021 (8:22 pm)

Insane. Calling parents of children that wear a mask, outside, on an uncrowded street a “covidiot” They are parents that instill FEAR. Yes, mask up indoors etc. Be respectful, yes. But “covidiots”? Really? This is how we want to shape the future of our children? Get outta here. Take your fear mongering elsewhere… pfft… “wearing a mask, alone, outside, on an uncrowded street” and they have parents that are “covidiots”. Sad times we live in.

heartless September 12, 2021 (6:58 am)

I think her point was that the children are acting much more maturely than the adults when it comes to commonsense precautions re the virus.

This is a point you seem to have, somehow, missed entirely–and a point that is only underlined by your knee-jerk and histrionic reply.