May 11, 2017 at 5:57 am #882491
The news from our nation’s capital only gets worse and that coming from our own state legislature isn’t much better… and yet the political forums here on the West Seattle Blog which were once a lively center of discourse are largely silent. What has happened?May 11, 2017 at 8:25 am #882503
I think the first debates after the election burned everyone out, those who disagreed and those who did agree with the outcome. If you agreed with the election of Trump you were bullied to the point where you just stopped posting at all. Capt. Dave being a prime example of that. I miss his comments and his knowledge of politics and history, however he got the heck beat out of him on this blog simply because he did not agree with people.
Now I know why my grandmother always told me, “never discuss politics or religion, nothing good ever comes of it if it with someone who does not agree with you.” How right she was.
Just my opinion.May 11, 2017 at 9:26 am #882511
T rex is right, if you want actual discourse one must be willing to accept that opposing viewpoints are valid. Which is really not the case on this forum, or at this point in time not really the case in the country as a whole.May 11, 2017 at 9:27 am #882512
For me… I am continually shocked beyond belief, deeply troubled and more alarmed than I have ever been about the fragility of our democracy with the lack of adherence to laws and the Constitution by the executive branch. I work to get comments out to our elected officials, to make sure my voice is heard where they count constituent responses. I and some others I know who used to be fairly active on the Blog are active on a more national level these days. Still read the Blog though and love it!May 11, 2017 at 11:48 am #882528
T Rex and Rico.. i am guessing neither of you has been around the West Seattle Blog Forum long enough to remember when we had actual discussions..in which opinions were expected to be backed by solid reasoning and verifiable facts.
There were some fairly lively discussions back then in which people with different opinions weighed in and backed their arguments… and not all that long ago.
there still are if you look at them..though they now happen between the various factions on the left… who.. believe it or not.. don’t always agree with one another.
I once enjoyed Captain Dave’s posts… before he became so frustrated with his inability to back his statements when challenged and fell into personal rants. I am not sorry to see those gone.
May 11, 2017 at 11:52 am #882530
- This reply was modified 7 months ago by JoB.
TanDL.. i too have concentrated on activism at a national level.. but still miss the discussions we once had here… especially the nuances of thought within the “resistance” community. i learned something of value in every discussion.May 11, 2017 at 11:53 am #882531May 11, 2017 at 12:21 pm #882537
Job, I have been around this blog for over 10 years. There has never been an acceptance of alternative opinions, just small variances of the same opinionMay 11, 2017 at 12:32 pm #882539
I’d like to have conversations and/or debates about politics, but it seems that every political conversation becomes a “Left vs Right” argument. I’d prefer to discuss individual policies, but then someone will say “well, Clinton did this other thing that is just as bad” or “well, Obama did the same thing back in 200x”. Why does any of that matter? It’s history. Neither of them are the prez right now.
I’d like to see conversations that focus on the actual issue, rather than simply defending or lambasting Trump’s personality/sanity. I don’t know if any such conversations are possible though.May 11, 2017 at 7:59 pm #882572May 12, 2017 at 10:47 am #882615
Once there was a time Job so true…. then came Capt dave ….. I for one don’t miss him in theses debates he be belittled women put them down as second rate nobody’s that should be seen and not heard.. had no proof or truth behind his post when confronted about it… he hid behind rants that wsb was removing his post…. as for the trump trolls that show up from time to time they to offer nothing… I for one am burned out on trump… impeach him and his followers and vote out the republican right and some of the far democratic left its time for the country to move forward and this state too…… now for some laughs…
http://www.gocomics.com/nonsequitur/2017/5/9….May 12, 2017 at 10:56 am #882616
T RexParticipantMay 12, 2017 at 2:15 pm #882638
Yes its true Trump trolls come in here offering hate based on race sex sexual preference color and offer no dialog to any debate and if you want to defend them cool… if they offer proof of what they talk then it can be debated and don’t mind counter proof…they don’t…. theses trolls offer nothing… the sole purpose is to disrupt and anger those who come in here to talk about the issues so why discussed the issues with them… after they put their bull out they leave… so to engage to them in talk about issues it is and would be useless to try….these are the trump trolls I talk about I rest my case…May 12, 2017 at 3:28 pm #882639
National political topic discussions spiraled out of control quickly on this forum. By the second or third post we had name calling and personal insults. I’m not interested in going back there – but others certainly can.
Local politics can generate some healthy discussions, though. The mayoral race will be particularly interesting, and I’d love to have some friendly exchanges on the forums.May 12, 2017 at 3:57 pm #882648
T Rex and Rico carvee
Smile politely and run. They are attempting to lure you into the viper pit.May 12, 2017 at 7:43 pm #882664
who is attempting to lure whom. I have been called snowflake too many times because I am a libtard leftist. And, being a woman, I’m supposed to shut up and take it, because , well, you know why, because. And that was handed out often. Women were name called. Posters of both sexes were called names. If T Rex and Rico(who I have never seen on here, yet has been here for 10 years?) want to approve of that, then they willl get it back. Capt. Dave was notorious for that during this last campaign, towards the end of it. That doesn’t make a discussion, it is not intelligent, yet if someone disagrees with those postings and says something about it, they are belittled. I, for one, would like that to go away. I do not miss Dave. If we could just forget party affiliation, and not think of the “other side” as somehow stupid and dirty, and just talk, like over a beer out in public, I think we’d all get along. Honestly, I do. Forums are strange, and people are more than willing to say more than they should because of the anonymity. Some of us have met at different face to face meetups, and have found that we have more in common than we think(some have even forged forever friendships). We’re all trying to struggle through. But there is always a line crossed, or someone who has more “sensitive” feelings, or someone, as above (T Rex, I’m lookin’ at ya), who say “See? You made my point!” because someone disagreed. How do we get around that? Things are taken personally, and then it falls apart.
This country, in my OPINION, is going backwards, and falling apart. The constitution is being ignored, our Congress is party before people, our new regime in the White House is ignorant about running this country, things are not getting better, nor will this country be “great” if it continues. All these firings, all the people who were appointed heads of things that are simply against those things is infuriating to me. We, the people, are seen as stoopid, as they think we don’t get it. I despise Paul Ryan, and it’s time for dishonest M. McConnell to cash it in politically. The AHCA sucks, is wrong, and will kill people (maybe including me-but that’s another story). The State Department has no business pimping Trump businesses and books. Jefferson Sessions is a weasel, a bigot. The Prez wants people to officially declare loyalty to him and only him. Picking a fight with North Korea just because you can is not the best move(especially for Seattleites). Russia is not our friend, and, yes, I believe there was collusion. So…those are some of my feelings. This is where I say…all that is out there, so discuss. Make it civil, not personal, not degrading, no name calling. If you disagree, say why, but don’t take it personally. There is more at stake than hurt feelings on the West Seattle Blog Forum. Good grief…it’s not a reality show, it’s our community, and it’s our families, and our lives.
Also..I’d love to see a thread about the myriad of people running for mayor, too. I need an education. I don’t know many facts about the many candidates who just keepcoming, except for maybe Mike McGinn. And I don’t want to try Mr. Murray in a court of public opinion…want to leave that to the courts.
Sorry this was so long. My Friday dance card is a bit empty ;-)May 12, 2017 at 9:33 pm #882685May 13, 2017 at 9:27 am #882738
As for myself (a militant labor leftist who defies many of the popular stereotypes the centrists and right promulgate) I have an affinity for facts, not the popular tropes the rightwing ranters dragged in here by the ear only to be eviscerated under the keenly sharp knife of scrutiny and data.
I feel no have no compunction to play nice. Republicans and their lot have never played nice with labor in this country, ever, and have never realized or acknowledged the necessity of the people who keep the lights on, keep the water flowing, food in the grocery store, clean their houses, prepare food, and the countless myriad tasks that must be performed to keep them comfortable. Strangely many of these folks are Republican in the hopes that they will somehow become wealthy themselves, like it’s contagious through association.
I don’t associate and generally will not respond to Betty9348093q7453804q39 (or whatever) or any of here ilk. The open-ended rants with improperly capitalized words, insults and propaganda rather than data are not worthy of response.
Captain Dave is a hole different case. He would use twisted moebius like logic, “facts” from sources that are not credible, such as blogs that do not list their sources.
I owe no fealty to anyone. I don’t have to play nice, I don’t have to sit and listen to – or read – patently absurd arguments. It about party, it’s about what it right and neither party is close.
In closing, for myself, if you believe that health insurance is healthcare, that clean water, or any water at all, is a privilege, well funded public schools are a privilege…I could go on and on…then you are against me and many others. I do not exist to serve. While they don’t say it, the current crop of republicans believe otherwise in their tax breaks for the wealthy, removal of water rights from communities and selling them the Nestle, removal of protected status from monuments, parks, etc.
Keep this in mind. When children starve and no one has anything left to lose the wealthy are torn down. So says history.May 13, 2017 at 11:07 am #882759
Treating obvious trolls as serious participants in a reasoned debate is destined to degenerate into pointless bickering and personal insults. That happened here and largely accounts for why there is no longer any discussion on current issues.
As the long decay of capitalism continues to erode the quality of life for more and more people, it will become more important to have responsible, effective policies on a local and regional basis that can provide some degree of stability and security. I fear the Seattle City Council doesn’t have people with a sense of how to promote those policies and desperately needs voices that advocate for engaging the business community in a responsible way rather than kowtow.
Advancing necessary and appropriate social programs without including effective ways to fund them apart from hiking property taxes or regressive taxation is not going to get the job done. We need aggressive, innovative thinking and engagement if we hope avoid the slide into a dystopia.
The coming elections afford an opportunity to start that process. If people would engage enough in neighborhoods and area organizations to put forward requirements for candidates rather than opt for the best of the same old same old, it could be that quality candidates emerge. Bernie Sanders was absolutely right in saying he wouldn’t be able to get anything done without a mass movement, without people actively engaged and demanding constructive policies. That’s true on a local level as well.
This is potentially a great opportunity for Seattle to shift the stale culture of local politics. I’m sorry that I won’t be here to participate in the process since we’re moving out of state in a few weeks. I wish everyone the best.May 13, 2017 at 2:59 pm #882802
JTB, you will be missed. Seems like you weren’t on the WSB all that long, but I’ve always appreciated your intelligent, balanced, and well-reasoned comments. Best of luck to you as well.May 13, 2017 at 3:26 pm #882807
Sorry to hear that you are leaving, JTB. Best of luck to you and Mrs. JTB.
MikeMay 14, 2017 at 1:29 am #882846
JTB…we’ll still be here, so pop in every now and then. Safe travels, safe move. We’ll miss you…May 14, 2017 at 10:51 am #882853
Most conversations here devolve into arguments. I, and likely many others, are out there calling and writing legistlators and businesses, fighting for change and working to improve rights and treatment for the less fortunate. It’s of no use for me to come on here to engage in bickering. Don’t take the lack of my presence here as a sign that I’m not involved & active.May 14, 2017 at 4:48 pm #882879
And yet, Melissa, you come here with your smarmy high-handed comments. Your assumption that no one else here is engaged is total crap. Are you also also out feeding the poor, cleaning up the green belts, sitting the seals, etc?
I notice that you have plenty of time to come down into the mud long enough to instruct us poor plebes what we’re doing wrong.May 15, 2017 at 12:19 pm #882943
Melissa….why do you think that because we post on these forums, we are not active outside of these forums? How do you know that we, too, are not writing letter, etc.
You say you don’t come here to participate, but you did exactly that….and , frankly, ASSumed that this is all we do. It’s like people going on Facebook, reading a thread, then saying “Why do people even bother to post here?”..overlooking the fact that they just posted there.
and it usually gets something like “SMH”…..
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