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April 12, 2008 at 10:41 am #586746
JanSParticipantdid anyone follow this in the past week? here’s a commentary on it…by a man of whom I am just in awe …
http://cavett.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/04/11/memo-to-petraeus-crocker-more-laughs-please/?th&emc=th
April 12, 2008 at 2:53 pm #622049
charlabobParticipantThank you, Jan! (Even the link is funny.)
I was working at home a lot last week and we had the hearings on in the background most of the time. P&C were marginally less annoying than NPR fundraising pitches and Cavett brought it all back — like reflux, but in a good way.
I tried to read the article aloud but couldn’t stop laughing. The katskys and Bob were worried for my health. (Alert to readers: put down your coffee and clear your nasal passages before you start.)
April 12, 2008 at 3:32 pm #622050
ErikParticipantOrwell called it ‘polysyllabic gobblygoop’.
And this line from the general…”our gains are largely imaginary: that our alleged progress is fragile and reversible”.
We wouldn’t want the 100-year war to end anytime soon now.
April 12, 2008 at 4:11 pm #622051April 12, 2008 at 5:16 pm #622052
AnonymousInactiveJoey, are you wanting us to say 100 year *occupation*, even though he didn’t use that word either? He said why not keep the troops there for a 100 years. What exactly does that mean? Even your fact check link gave it a 2 out of 4 on the false meter. 4 being absolutely false. So it’s kinda true, kinda false.
The implication is McCain is OK with keeping the troops there indefinitely, even though *our gains are largely imaginary*. Clinton and Obama want to bring them home asap. True?
April 12, 2008 at 9:00 pm #622053
JanSParticipantand, JT, for clarification..ASAP does not mean next week…it means As Soon As Possible…and, to me, I don’t see a timeline in there…(now whatever else the Dem candidates say about timelines, well, that may be another story..heh)
April 12, 2008 at 9:06 pm #622054
JoBParticipantWe won’t know when we can actually bring the troops home until someone tells us something that actually has meaning about how things are going there…
and if the hearings are any example, it’s not going to be any time soon.
April 12, 2008 at 10:17 pm #622055
AnonymousInactiveI had hoped most would understand asap meant as soon as safely possible (not sure either, who gets to define that). In comparison to McCain, who seems to be ok staying pretty much forever in some unclear capacity.
April 13, 2008 at 1:12 am #622056
JanSParticipantJT…yes..I didn’t “elucidate” very well – lol..there are some people who interpret ASAP to mean that the Dem candidates would do an immediate withdrawal, and I think any thinking person would understand that that can’t be done…but sometimes you have to point it out to those who misunderstand..
shucks…I know you know ;-)
April 13, 2008 at 1:17 am #622057
AnonymousInactiveOf course WE both knew :) Should have just said thanks for clarifying.
April 13, 2008 at 6:50 pm #622058
JanSParticipantand we knew this, too, didn’t we….
April 13, 2008 at 6:56 pm #622059
JanSParticipantoh, these things are just too easy to find >:o)
April 13, 2008 at 7:20 pm #622060
AnonymousInactiveDid see SNL last night? Their take on the hearings was priceless.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/13/snl-notices-petraeus-mock_n_96401.html
April 14, 2008 at 4:09 am #622061
WSMomParticipanthttp://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index.jhtml?videoId=165850&title=iraq-me-dave-petraeus-pt.-2
Jon Stewart’s take is hilarious!
April 14, 2008 at 8:44 pm #622062
KenParticipantJust a note the any who have never had contact with the military. (And for you yellow elephants, movies are not enough even if they do have John Wayne in them)
The politicians tell the generals to draw up a plan for withdrawal and a time line. The Generals delegate that to Colonels and Majors who already have the data and several hundred plans worked out in their logistics training. The generals either approve the plan or modify it and send it to the politicians to approve. They also supply all the officers who worked on the plan to the CIC/ politicians in case they have questions.
The plan is approved and implemented. Or sent back for changes and the process starts over until it is.
Troops come home. More troops possibly from different branches, get assigned to removing equipment that still has value (mostly Navy) and other specialist destroy or disable equipment that has only scrap value when compared to the cost of shipping it home.
And the scenario John McCain paints now for his hundred year occupation, will commence right after an underground cache of unicorns and rainbows are discovered in Iraq.
Also note: dropping bombs from 35,000 feet and then getting captured and tortured does not give you a realistic view of the horrors of war. What is did do to many in WWII, Korea and VN is make you incapable of rational thought when there are Asians in the same room with you. I knew a WWII Japanese POW pilot who got early retirement from his airline job when they could no longer keep his office an Asian free zone.
April 14, 2008 at 9:48 pm #622063
AnonymousInactiveKen – It saddens me that, based only on what you have read about McCain and his military career and one pilot that you knew, you have made the determination that McCain is a racist not worthy of “hero” status.
This makes me curious as to what, in your eyes, would make someone worthy of being considered a hero?
Are you also claiming that anyone who served in WWII, Korea or Vietnam is incapable of rational thought? That is quite an assumption. I thought that you had served in the military? Are you incapable of rational thought?
April 14, 2008 at 9:50 pm #622064
AnonymousInactiveI’m also curious what airline your friend flew for? Most pilots I know, their office is the cockpit. Was this a chief pilot?
April 14, 2008 at 10:32 pm #622065
AnonymousInactiveHow did you get racist out of someone who has emotional problems stemming from trauma? Sounds like irrational fear, not irrational hatred.
April 14, 2008 at 10:36 pm #622066
AnonymousInactiveI got “racist” from the fact that Ken claimed his buddy cannot be around any Asians. I was assuming that he acted inappropriately and this is why they wanted him to retire.
I didn’t consider that Ken’s friend was fearful of Asians. I guess that could be the case.
April 14, 2008 at 10:41 pm #622067
AnonymousInactiveSee, my first thought was the guy has to be having major panic attacks b/c that is my experience with reminders of trauma. But you could be right as well. Sounds like more info should have been given with that story.
April 14, 2008 at 10:56 pm #622068
KenParticipantHe piloted a B-17. He worked for an airline in the 60’s and 70’s but due to missing an eye and several fingers was never able to fly as a pilot after the war.
He spent 3 years as a POW. He never told me exactly where he was shot down but was released when the US took back the Philippines.
His phobia is not caused by being a pilot. Nor is being an airline pilot proof against being a nut. (I have relatives that prove that one)
His phobia probably stems from being tortured by a race and culture his small mill town never exposed him to pre war.
McCains issues are probably not that advanced or he could not have acheived what the did, but he does have issues.
“I hated the gooks. I will hate them as long as I live.”
— Sen. John McCain
April 14, 2008 at 11:17 pm #622069
AnonymousInactiveI know everyone loves to post that famous quote from McCain. However, as much as I hate to burst your bubble, do you realize that in 1992 McCain visited Hanoi and met with the Vietnam Prime Minister, Vo Van Kiet.
He obviously has since come to terms with his capture and there are pictures of him embracing former interrogator, Col. Bui Tin, Senior Col. in the Vietnamese Army.
I’m not sure when the above quote is from, however, it seems pretty obvious to me that he has gotten over any issues that stemmed from the torture he endured at the hands of the Vietnamese.
April 14, 2008 at 11:27 pm #622070
AnonymousInactiveI think those pictures prove the opposite. Some kind of identification with his captors. Weren’t there other vets and POW’s upset about that trip?
April 14, 2008 at 11:51 pm #622071
AnonymousInactiveYou can try and claim that McCain suffers from Stockholm syndrome (30 to 40 years later, not likely), but it completely disputes the idea that he hates Asians.
So you have to decide if you want to call McCain a racist who hates all Asians, or is he mentally unstable and suffering from Stockholm syndrome? You can’t accuse him of both.
April 14, 2008 at 11:52 pm #622072
JanSParticipantNR…unfortunately, John McCain said that just within recent weeks….but…that’s something for the McCain thread…this thread is supposed to be a bit lighter…I was just making fun of Petraeus :)
Now…I was in the military during the Vietnam War…and I worked for an airline for 4 years before that..wonder what that makes me, huh…am I as loony as some people think? lol
(oh, and I knew some pretty crazy pilots…and other airline personnel, too, believe me – lol)
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