Full Tilt Ice Cream

[Anonymous]

I have been there.

And, you’re right, I didn’t feel unsafe.

I agree that it is tame in comparison to several cities in America.

I find it bothersome, however, that simply because people have a bad perception of White Center, it is immediately assumed it is due to skin color.

Did anyone stop and think that maybe, even though it can be considered mild when compared to Chicago, it IS the high crime rate that troubles people? Why make it about race at all?

There are people that were born and raised here in West Seattle and do not know the realities of other major cities. To a lot of people, it just simply is the highest crime area in their neighborhood. So, if they have a choice, they will avoid it.

That’s completely unfair to throw around the word “racist” when there are obviously other factors involved here.

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[inactive]

Running with Elgrego’s concluding thought –

here is a link to the White Center Community Development Association’s website page where there is an online Discount Book for White Center businesses.

http://www.wccda.org/content/resources/discount-card.php

The businesses which I can immediately avow for are as follows, however, there are 180 some odd business in White Center:

The Salvadorian Bakery on Roxbury 1 block west of Delridge. They have one of the best fresh chicken soups I’ve ever had. And, they have thee best flan, which other restaurants buy. And, of course, they have pupusas, which are like a tamale, but with a twist. Curious? Gonna’ have to go find out for yourself what I’m talking about, I guess :).

White Center Upholstery – Fern is one of the most competent, ethical small business owners I have ever seen. Plus, she has superior, master craftspeople working with her in that shop. They can do anything in there which has to do with upholstery or glass/mirror and they will do it to perfection and for a competitive price. Plus, everyone I have met in her shop is good people.

Tacqueria Guaymas on Roxbury kitty-corner from the Schucks Auto. Slightly different menu from the California Ave. shop on the Junction.

Murphy’s Paw –

on 17th one block south of Roxbury – pup heaven – the dog will get a biscuit and you can get something for the dog. It’s a win/win situation for the dog.

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[elgrego]

I think the race card is the elephant in the room, which ties in to the passive-aggressive nature of the Seattle Racism ™. Nobody wants to talk about it because nobody wants to admit they’re even a teensy bit racist.

I think it keeps coming specifically because a lot of people don’t want to talk about it. It might not even have to do with a hateful form of racism – it could be a very mild form in that you (not you specifically, you as in y’all) might just not feel comfortable when people aren’t speaking English or when you see cars that were obviously bought second-hand.

In fact… I wonder if the issue with WC has to do with classicism as much or moreso than race.

I, for one, feel more uncomfortable in Redmond and Bellevue than I do in WC or the International District or Beacon Hill. Hell, even Alki kind of makes me uncomfortable.

Oh, and the Salvadorean bakery IS great!

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[credmond]

Here’s a link to the city’s crime-by-neighborhood statistics page http://web1.seattle.gov/seastats/doStatistics.aspx. What it shows is that the U-District is in the category of “highest” crime and Alaska Junction and White Center are in the category of “moderate” crime, with low and high being the other two categories. Everyone’s perception about crime, even in West Seattle, is severely skewed based on actual data.

–

Don’t forget Center Sign Shop – banners, posters, t-shirts, laser etched stuff, 1 color, 5 color, you name it and they, too, are efficient, locally owned, price competitive and more than any of that – they care. White Center’s actually an incredibly cool place to hang around. Lots to see and hear and eat/drink. And, no, I never feel unsafe. Heck, there’s a sheriff substation about 30 yards from Full Tilt. There’s also foot patrol officers walking the Junction on Fri/Sat nights after midnight, too. Did y’all know that?

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[TheHouse]

This thread was specifically about the ice cream joint. If you want to debate if White Center is a dump (there isn’t much of an argument) or if you want to debate racism (nobody made any racist comments….even the nightclub comment wasn’t racist), feel free to start another thread and I’ll be glad to jump in.

As for the owner that responded above. Very nice post. My only comment to all of you is if you can’t tell the difference between the crowd at a UW football game and the crowd that hangs out in Downtown White Center on Saturday nights, then you have clouded judgement. There are lots of law abiding citizens out for a good time, but there are just as many thugs/gang bangers.

And yes, I have been to DT WC and at almost any given time of the day you can find addicts or hookers roaming it.

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[JanS]

gee, Mr. House…have you been to 2nd and Pike lately? And have you seen those “addicts and hookers” doing their thing in WC? Are you absolutely, positively, without a doubt sure that they are addicts and hookers? or are they what you perceive to be addicts and hookers? You’re making an assumption, which I suppose is OK, but maybe it’s just people who haven’t lived the lily white WASP life that you have…so don’t make assumptions. Maybe you could just ask them next time if they’re an addict or a hooker..leave the assumptions out….lol…

I would not go to the UDistrict on a bet alone in the evening…no problem during the day, though. It has nothing to do with the college , of course..it has to do with the crime…but then, I’m a woman, and wouldn’t go to many downtown places alone at night either…just my preference.

You throw out statements like “White Center is a dump (there isn’t much of an argument)” Wow, is all I can say….wasn’t too long ago when your neighborhood was considered the same. But I do remember from another thread that you said that you were “condescending”…at least you’re proving it…

now, about that ice cream…anyone had any flavors besides yummy sounding mango chili, blackberry choco-chip, and the wonderful sounding vegan coffee, etc, etc.etc. Let’s get back on track – lol…I will be there tomorrow afternoon…anyone wanna join me?

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[JanS]

oh…and a business that sadly isn’t there anymore…at 102nd and Ambaum…Primeval Ink…got my first and only tattoo there…Andi did wonderful work…wish she was still there…her shop is in Monroe…and gas prices these days prevent me from going there.

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[FullTilt]

A few things…we aren’t open tomorrow, so have that scoop on Tuesday. Our regular hours are Tues – Sun noon to 8pm, and late on Fri and Sat, until 10pm and later if we can still stand. We are working on getting bands to play Friday nights.

Fern from White Center Upholstery is opening a restaurant/art gallery sometime soon in the space behind her shop. She has a ton of great ideas and it should be a real highlight of the neighborhood!

Alki Tattoo is a great shop, with a view of the beach. 2622 Alki Ave. Justin and I both have work from there.

White Center Pho (16th south of Roxbury, east side of street)and Banh 88 (Delridge, just north of Rozella)are both amazing-lick the plate good. And White Center Deli, right next to us, is super yummy. Kim, the owner, is kind and will answer any “what’s that?” questions.

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[JanS]

lol..thanks…we all need a day off, huh…see you on Tuesday :) And I’m planning on going to the deli, too…it sounds yummy..

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[celeste17]

HI all, I am sure its posted here somewhere but what is the address of Full Tilt? I went looking for it today but couldn’t see it. I like Ice Cream and had a hankering for it today but sadly didn’t see the place. I couldn’t slow down to much as I had someone on my tail. All I can say about the discussion that is going on about the area is that it takes one step at a time and one person to make a change. If you see a piece of garbage on the ground and you pick it up and throw it away you have made a change in the area. If there area has undesired appeal to the area then it takes one person or one business to make a change. From what I saw today there is a changing happening one business at a time. Once upon a time the junction area was looking down in the dumps and new businesses came into the area and started to make improvements. White Center is pulling itself up from the ground one business at a time and we all need to support that area to make a change. Remember it takes time and it takes a willingness to make change.

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[JanS]

amen, Celeste…absolutely agree :)

9629 16th Ave SW

(between 98th St & S Delridge Way)

Seattle, WA 98106

I’ll be there Tuesday afternoon – lol

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[JanS]

Celeste…if you see the big sign for White Center Deli, you’re there :)

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[Kayleigh]

Look, I grew up in WSEA, and I can tell you that since LONG before I was born, that area was a dump. It wasn’t about the color of people that hung out there. It was about the crime, the seedy businesses, the dive bars, etc.

I don’t care if there’s more crime in Detroit. I don’t want to live where there’s significant crime, period. (And I heartily disagree Seattle is the most racist area, and so does everybody I know who’s traveled or lived in the South.)

Maybe having your house broken into or your car stolen or to feeling scared at night getting off the bus doesn’t bother some of you, but it bothers me. Do you have any idea what it’s like to be 85 pounds, 16 years old, female, and hassled by freaks hangout outside a “club” or a porn store? (Maybe New Res would understand this) That’s what *I* remember about White Center and areas like it when I was growing up.

There was no Cafe Rosella and no Salvadorean Bakery when I was a kid. I’m glad those businesses and Full Tilt too are moving in.

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[celeste17]

Thank You Jan. I didn’t go far enough. I turned at Roxbury to go to Safeway. Mom likes their chocolate doughnut holes. And Kayleigh yes back in the 70’s and early 80’s you didn’t want to be in White Center aka (Rat City). But things are changing now. Sure there are still problem area’s same as anywhere you go but with community involvement and with police presents this will change. Just look at Tacoma there is an area down there that was always in the news for gangs and shootings and murders but the community fought back. They started to leave lights on, they started community patrols, they would keep an eye open on all the activity and eventually were able to make a difference. Hopefully with the community banding together White Center will become a safe and pretty area to hang out after dark. I know the community has been working on things for a while and change is a slow process but if we all band together we can make this change. Well I need to go to work I am late. Take Care

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[hopey]

Since no one has opened a new thread, I’m posting my comments on this one…

Let me tell you a story about when I first moved from Chicago to Seattle. When I lived in Chicago, I became accustomed to shopping at mexican grocery stores from time to time, because my ex-husband had spent significant time living in Mexico as a child. (He also introduced me to the joy that is paletas, and taught me how to order them in Spanish, to the immense amusement of the paleta cart guys! But I digress…) When I moved to Seattle, the acquaintances I knew here all lived on the north side — Cap Hill, UDist, Green Lake, etc. I asked them: “Where are the Mexican grocery stores? Anybody know where I can go to buy really fresh tortillas?” Nobody knew. Not a single one. According to them, there wasn’t a Hispanic district or anything like that.

Imagine my surprise when my fiance and I decided to move to West Seattle, on the southernmost part of the peninsula. We started exploring White Center and Burien mostly out of convenience. And holy crap! THIS is where all the Mexican grocery stores are! You practically can’t spit without hitting one!

This was quite eye-opening to me. Why didn’t they know that White Center/Burien has a large Hispanic population? Was it the quality of my (white, middle-aged, female, mostly single) acquaintances? Was it because of provincialism — anything that’s not north of Lake Union isn’t worth knowing about? (In Chicago, locals may not know every neighborhood intimately, but for the most part people can tell you the “flavor” of the major neighborhoods — i.e., Pilsen is where the Puerto Rican Day parade is held, so if you’re looking for PR goods in Chicago, try there.) Or is Seattle truly passive-aggressive racist as folks here are suggesting? I don’t really have an answer for that, but I will simply remark that none of those “friends” will visit me in my new digs.

Edited to add: to address the “White Center has always had crime” idea… Again, coming from Chicago, it’s not challenging for me to think that a neighborhood which was high-crime in my youth could — and naturally WOULD — improve as time goes on. People change, neighborhoods change, sometimes for good and sometimes not. Maybe this goes back to Chicagoans having a baseline knowledge of the city’s neighborhoods. If you are not aware of the neighborhoods, then how could you possibly be aware that this one’s improving, that one seems to be taking a dive, etc?

Be aware of your city. Know the lay of the land, without being judgmental about it. White Center/Burien is where the Hispanics live right now. Okay, cool, nothing wrong with that! Maybe ten years from now they’ll have shifted over to Beacon Hill. Maybe ten years from now West Seattle will be known as the new gay district. Who knows — but the lack of awareness here does suggest at best simple provincialism and ignorance, and at worst an unacknowledged racism.

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[hopey]

P.S. westseattledood, thanks for the tips! All of those places are convenient stops for me. I’ve driven past Murphy’s Paw but it hadn’t yet made it into my mental rolodex of “places to look for dog toys.” And I have some furniture refurbishing planned for the near future, so I’ll be checking out the upholstery place as well. Thank you!

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[Kayleigh]

What a bunch of crap—that because we don’t classify areas as “where the brown people live” means we’re racist?

When I go thru White Center now, I register that it’s multicultural, not solely Hispanic. I do know of a good Mexican grocery because I love that kind of food. I don’t know of any good Japanese groceries because I don’t like Japanese food. If someone asked, I would suggest the International District for Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese, etc.

I’m aware that it’s improving in White Center because 1. I drive through it and can see newer, cleaner-looking businesses 2. I go to the Salvadorean Bakery, which I love and 3. I read and pay attention. It’s not that hard. I have a brain and I use it.

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[hopey]

Kayleigh, I did not make an absolutist statement. If you want to make it into one that is your choice, but it is not what I said.

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[Kayleigh]

“Who knows — but the lack of awareness here does suggest at best simple provincialism and ignorance, and at worst an unacknowledged racism. “

Your words, your choice. Please explain how this is not absolutist, and I’d love to hear more about how not seeing White Center as Hispanic is racist.

Maybe Seattle is less ethnically divided than other cities, or perhaps some of us simply don’t see the divisions. Or maybe we don’t care. I have no idea if there is a “Greek” area or an “Italian” area of Seattle. I know the places I like or don’t and the places I feel safe or I don’t. That’s how I label them in my head, not by the ethnicity or color of the people that live/work in them.

But in your rush to negatively judge a place to which you are a newcomer, speaks of poor manners at best and judgmentalism and ignorance at worst.

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[hopey]

The word “suggest” is not absolutist. I also offered a spectrum of possible reasons for the lack of awareness. I fail to see how that is demonstrating an absolute value judgment.

Absolutist would have been “You all are a bunch of racists and you won’t admit it!” or “This definitely shows how racist every Seattleite is.”

Frankly, prior to this discussion I leaned towards the “provincial” end of the spectrum to explain this behavior, but I included the possibility of unacknowledged racism because others included it, and I think there may be some merit in their observations.

By choosing the word “suggest” and offering a spectrum of possibility, I was attempting to keep the dialog open. You are the one who decided my deliberately open word choice meant “you’re all racist.” It is this kind of illogical leap which keeps me — and, I suspect many others — out of most discussions in these forums.

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[Kayleigh]

What’s an illogical leap is your assertion that because your friends don’t know where a Mexican grocery is, that they are provincial and perhaps racist. You appear to still not be considering any other point of view.

Provincialism is no sin, nor are food preferences. Racism, however, speaks to people’s character.

You floated it out there, though you weren’t the only one. Don’t expect to make vague insinuations as to the character of an entire city without being called on it or having people step up to defend themselves.

Especially those of us who’ve spent our careers working for social justice—to have newcomers post this kind of insulting theorizing is offensive.

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[hopey]

I’m impressed with how inaccurately you read my posting. I offered one, personal experience. I said that the quality of those acquaintances might be suspect. I also stated factually that those same acquaintances will not visit me in West Seattle. I left the reader to draw their own conclusion there.

Perhaps instead of jumping in and attacking me for making “vague insinuations as to the character of an entire city”, you could have rebutted my personal experience with your own, alternative, different, more positive personal experience. I would have welcomed hearing about those experiences — and still would, if anyone else has alternatives to share.

However, all I can go by is my own personal experiences. And frankly I am not surprised that others reading these forum discussions are not willing to speak up to share their experiences when there is such a great risk of being attacked by those who feel that any negative experiences must be rabidly defended and immediately quashed.

Out of deference to you and your career of “working for social justice”, I will stick to factual communications from now on. I will refrain from offering opinions and observations, since your opinions and experiences as a veteran West Seattleite are so clearly more superior than mine as a newcomer.

This conversation could have gone differently. I am disappointed that knee-jerk hometown boosterism rules over open, honest, and respectful dialog.

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[JanS]

ok, folks…this was supposed to be about icecream…and I’ll refer to another thread :sadness and disappointment”….just a thought…

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[Erik]

I’m home today…and they’re closed :-(~

sadness, disappointment

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[Anonymous]

No it wasn’t. House started the thread talking about the type of shops on the same block. And what’s so wrong with heated debate? It brings forth interesting viewpoints.

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[Author]

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