Fauntleroy Southbound School Speed Camera – Video Showing it's VERY hard to see

Home Forums Open Discussion Fauntleroy Southbound School Speed Camera – Video Showing it's VERY hard to see

This topic contains 44 replies, has 0 voices, and was last updated by  nerolabs 3 years ago.

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  • #606311

    nerolabs
    Member

    Hey all —

    I’m in the $189 ticket club now as well. I was going southbound on 1/14/2013 at 8:06am and got photographed going thirty two miles per hour, while the light was flashing. I decided to go out for myself and see how clear the signs were, and how much time you had to react to the posted signs. I’m come to the conclusion that it is VERY hard to react quick enough not to get a ticket. Check out the video proof on the link below:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgOOsqGGjdg

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    #783265

    dhg
    Participant

    I feel your pain and agree 100%. There are too many distractions, such as drivers pulling into the lane who’ve timed it just right where they won’t hit you so long as you don’t brake.

    I also think the $189 ticket is highway robbery.

    #783266

    dhg
    Participant

    I feel your pain and agree 100%. There are too many distractions, such as drivers pulling into the lane who’ve timed it just right where they won’t hit you so long as you don’t brake.

    I also think the $189 ticket is highway robbery.

    #783267

    DBP
    Member

    Weird. The original post containing a video link just disappeared while I was looking at this thread. Was it a rules violation?

    Anyway, I have a question for the OP if he’s still around:

    Sir, you imply that the ticket camera photographs cars just at the moment they’re passing the flashing-light sign. Are you sure that’s correct?

    Reason I ask is because that has a bearing on the amount of slow-down time drivers have.

    An easy fix for this would be to put a second (much smaller) set of flashing lights at the first warning sign. Or . . . they could just point the camera at a spot that’s another two seconds of travel time past the second sign.

    Either way, it would give drivers more time to slow down.

    #783268

    nerolabs
    Member

    Video link is still in the original post… but here it is again just in case:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgOOsqGGjdg

    The picture that was on my “ticket” (which isn’t a speeding ticket, its classified as a “parking” aka REVENUE ticket for the City of Seattle), shows me about 10 feet in front of the 20 MPH sign.

    I checked the distance from the sign tonight, it’s about 180 feet from absolute FIRST visibility.

    The formula for MPH into feet per second is (mph) * 1.466666. At 30 miles per hour (the normal posted speed limit, you are going 44 feet per second. This gives you roughly FOUR SECONDS to see the sign, process that you are in danger of going too fast, apply the breaks, and slow by 10 miles per hour.

    That is if you SEE the sign in the first place, which is AFTER the turn (not on a straight away), shaving at least a couple seconds off that reaction time.

    You BET I’m taking my video to court and showing the distances and reaction times. West Seattle is getting ripped off, this isn’t about school safety, this is about REVENUE and GREED.

    By the way, I could easily get out of this ticket:

    http://bancams.com/get-the-facts/

    However, I care to make a point and get better visibility about this so that others aren’t bullied into a BS “violation”. I’ve contested the ticket and will report how it goes in court.

    Two seconds reaction time is ridiculous and DANGEROUS.

    #783269

    dhg
    Participant

    I know an attorney who will fight these things for you. It may be no cheaper than the ticket but the more these things are fought, the less attractive they are to the city as revenue generators.

    John Kannin, kanninlaw.com, 574-0202

    #783270

    Thanks in advance for reporting how it goes in court. I hope you get out of the fine. I am all for making school zones more safe, however, it appears the city needs to approach this Fauntleroy location a little better. Currently, it’s a gotcha type of set up.

    #783271

    Huindekmi
    Participant

    Step One is to stop treating the speed limit as “Absolute Minimum Required Speed” and treat it instead as it was intended: “Maximum Allowable Speed”.

    Step Two is to ease off the gas when you see the first School Zone ahead sign. Let’s see… it’s a weekday and, though I don’t know the actual hours that school is in session, 8AM to 4PM sure seems plausible. Maybe I should back off a bit.

    Now, if you see the blinking lights, you are traveling slower and can easily reach the designated maximum speed through the school zone. From what I’ve been reading, if you go past the sign at 24-25 mph, you won’t be getting a ticket. Slowing from 28 to 24 is not difficult at all. And you’ll have added, at most, 5-10 seconds to your journey.

    #783272

    brew
    Participant

    There is no doubt that this, and the other camera on 35th, is purely about revenue generation. If it was about safety, they would follow the lead of other jurisdictions and add a narrow “school zone” sign to the center of the roadway.

    #783273

    nerolabs
    Member

    There are no blinking lights on the first school zone sign, and it doesn’t exactly scream out at you. In fact it looks like a parking rules sign, more than a school zone sign. The second ACTUAL flashing light is hidden around a corner until way too late.

    If they really were interested in protecting the children there would be a couple of lights strung out over the street with blinking lights at least a quarter mile up the road in either direction warning motorists that it was a school speed zone in session.

    #783274

    Kevin
    Participant

    One great way to fight this – and this is NOT my idea, is to ALWAYS drive about 15 MPH through ANY school zone at ANY time.

    After all, the signs do say – “or if children are present.”

    #783275

    singularname
    Participant

    No sympathy. You’d be required to go from 30 to a dead stop if there were a ped in the crosswalk, which is signed visibly prior to seeing the flashing light.

    #783276

    dobro
    Participant

    Likewise, no sympathy. Slow down, get off your damn phone, pay attention to your driving and obey the traffic laws.Don’t endanger your own life and others (especially children in a school zone) by speeding or not paying attention to traffic signs. And when you do mess up, quit whining and pay your fine. Try to do better next time. (Rant over).

    #783277

    nerolabs
    Member

    I just checked, when coming around that corner, the reaction time to the sidewalk is pretty much nil as well. And if you advocate that it’s okay to have 2 seconds to SLAM on your brakes (with traffic likely behind you) as a safety measure for pedestrians OR a school zone, you are nuts.

    I’m not whining, it’s clear as day this new program is 1) dangerous, 2) highway robbery, 3) not filling it’s designated intent (which supposedly is keeping people safe, however, if it’s revenue as the intent, it’s working wonderfully), 4) not in line with many of the other school zones I’ve seen which are effective which have plenty of warning WAY WAY WAY prior to the actual school zone being in sight.

    I have no sympathy with your apparent inability to see the facts for what they are, or your inability to see that speaking up is part of your civic duty if you feel there is something wrong. I don’t mean that disrespectfully, however, I think your comments to me were.

    #783278

    dobro
    Participant

    “…advocate that it’s okay to have 2 seconds to SLAM on your brakes (with traffic likely behind you) as a safety measure for pedestrians OR a school zone, you are nuts.”

    If you are driving at or below the speed limit and paying attention you can slow down without endangering anyone. As to whether I’m nuts, well, that’s another question altogether.

    #783279

    nerolabs
    Member

    dobro —

    :)

    However, I think the video I took shows that there are mere seconds to slow down, if you look, I even did an equation with the video as proof of the decision and slow time. It’s not safe. It’s dangerous. And it needs to be fixed.

    #783280

    singularname
    Participant

    Wow. You got caught speeding. Your argument is ridiculous in view of the fact you’re required by law to yield to any ped at any crosswalk, signed or unsigned, regardless of the posted limit. All the kiddie physics formulas in the world don’t change your “guilt.” I prefer that my “civic duty” stand on behalf of peds not getting slammed into because people don’t know how to drive. I’ve been very consistent in that. In fact, I’m kinda feelin’ the call to let the city know the program seems to be working. And to be clear, don’t need your sympathy–last time I had a moving violation I paid it promptly in full and learned to be more conscientious.

    #783281

    Welcome to WSB nerolabs :) Hope you have thick skin.

    #783282

    Bofus
    Member

    It would be interesting to see the same video when the lights are flashing and your vehicle is at speed to confirm the timing. Your vehicle is at the first sign at 33 seconds speeding up to 30 MPH. It appears that the light pole may become visible at the 39 second mark but definitely visible by the 40 mark. Your vehicle then reaches the camera pole at 45 seconds. So, based on this video, one has at least five seconds between the first sign (if one is travelling at 30 MPH) and the point the flashers become visible and then another five seconds until the camera pole is reached. Arguing that one can not slow down from 30 MPH to 20 MPH in ten seconds is going to be difficult at best.

    #783283

    Huindekmi
    Participant

    Watching the video, the first school zone ahead sign is VERY visible. Are flashing lights required on ALL traffic signs in order for drivers to heed them? I sure hope not. Pay attention and slow down.

    You stated in the video that you live in the neighborhood. You know there’s a school coming up. You know that its a weekday and school might be in session. With all that AND two very visible school zone signs, there is no reason to get a ticket. Slow down!

    You stated that you got a ticket for going 32mph in the school zone. The non-school zone speed limit on that road is 30mph. That means one of two things:

    1) You were traveling MUCH faster than the normal speed limit when you saw the flashing lights and started slowing down to only 32mph at the sign.

    or

    2) You were completely oblivious to both of the school zone signs and didn’t slow down at all for the school zone.

    In either case, you most definitely deserve the ticket. Take responsibility for your actions. Stop making silly excuses. Pay the ticket. Pay attention and SLOW DOWN!

    You keep talking about having to slow down from 30mph to 20mph and waiting until the very last moment to start that process. As I pointed out before, the speed limit is the MAXIMUM speed allowed, not the minimum required. There’s nothing that says you must maintain 30mph or more until you see the flashing lights. Try taking your foot off the gas when you see the first (clearly visible) school zone sign. Now you already have a more reasonable starting point. You also won’t get a ticket if you’re traveling 25mph or less. It’s not hard to slow from 30mph to 20mph in 10 seconds. It’s even easier to slow from 28mph to 24mph in 4 seconds.

    If you think it’s too hard to reduce speed for the school zone or to let someone cross the road in the crosswalk, there’s a very easy solution. SLOW DOWN!

    #783284

    nerolabs
    Member

    Huindekmi:

    After reading a lot of people’s advice, yesterday I started driving 15 miles per hour or under through the school zone, at all times, day or night, just to be SAFE.

    So if you see a guy SLOWING WAY DOWN, that’s me! I don’t want to get assraped with another $189 ticket, nor do I want to hurt any children, nor do I want to pose any sort of danger for having to break too fast.

    Thanks everyone for your advice, and I think the solution is perfectly acceptable.

    #783285

    LOL on the A.R. thing.

    #783286

    Huindekmi
    Participant

    There are a few different ways to react to this sort of situation:

    A) Act like a jerk: continue driving faster than the posted speed limits while disregarding the safety of your fellow citizens.

    B) Act like a baby: throw a hissyfit over something you did wrong, then overreact and try to punish everyone else for your own mistake.

    C) Act like an adult: take responsibility for your actions, pay the well-deserved fine, then learn from the experience and start driving in a reasonable manner within the confines of the law.

    Personally, I’d choose C.

    #783287

    cwit
    Member

    Also, don’t shoot video and drive at the same time. ;)

    Kidding aside – if anything, other than just revenue generation, the $189 fine is making a few more people aware of the school zones through the publicity that it’s producing.

    #783288

    DBP
    Member

    Huindekmi, is it your belief that citizens are not entitled to their day in court?

    Let’s say you’re the judge in this case. Would you address the appellant (nerolabs) with terms like “baby,” “jerk,” and “hissyfit”?

    What do you suppose would happen with this case if you did that?

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