Cyclists (not) stopping at stop signs

[JanS]

wow, Mark, you’re on a roll…everyone else is wrong but you, it seems. Someone disagrees with you so they’re passive/aggressive….and wrong. Are there any behaviors that bicyclists are ever wrong about? Is rudeness OK with you? Courtesy is a 2 way street. Flashing someone the finger because they honked…yes, illegal…but then, so is running a red light – you ain’t special) at you is never acceptable, whether it’s a pedestrian, from a driver, or from a cyclist. There are crappy drivers out there. And then there are those of us that go out of our way to make sure that we don’t “offend” cyclists – and there are crappy cyclists, too.. Aggressive cycling, disobeying the rules of the road( I believe things are equal there…there are NOT things that cyclists are allowed to do that go against the rules), doesn’t earn points with me.. The light is red? We all wait. Green? We all go. Weaving in and out of traffic. because you can? Pfffttttt. Endangering other peopleby causing them to have to take evasive action? Wrong. We all have to use the roads together. I look out for you, you look out for me. You may be a great, cautious, courteous cyclist…not all of them are. Sharing the road goes both ways. As bisker said, take a deep breath …breathe… and have a great 4th.

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[mark47n]

Jan, you’ve completely missed my point and haven’t read what I’ve written carefully; I never said that cyclists could legally run lights (except under certain conditions), stop signs, cut off cars or that cyclists could be raging assholes. I said nothing that excused bad behavior and acknowledged that courtesy was a two-way street. I attacked, vigorously, the idea that cyclists do not have a right to being on the road, have a right to feel safe on the road and to not be assaulted. Bear in mind that assault doesn’t require physical contact, brushing me back (crowding me until I’m either off the road or into parked cars), throwing things at me or screaming that you’re going to kill me (while you’re driving your car) are all act that would qualify. Are those acts courteous? As to all cyclists not being courteous; are all drivers courteous? Hardly but I try not to lump all drivers into the category of being rude entitled jerks whether I’m on a bicycle, motorcycle, on foot or behind the wheel of one of my two cars or, in my checkered past, the driving a 200,000lb semi.

My point is simply that there is confusion about what the rights are of a cyclist. As a cyclist I have all of the rights and obligations as cars. We are a vehicle under the RCW, but we can also be pedestrians, which entitles us to run the red light at the Alaska Junction during the pedestrian cycle and use cross walks, which ever is safest for us…and we, as cyclist, get to decide that.We do NOT have the right to all of the stuff that you mentions and I ever made that claim and man of them ARE illegal and I know people that have been cited for running traffic control devices.

Yes I will fight for my rights as a cyclist and to those that have spoken up in appreciation for what I’ve said please join in. I’m feeling like a lone voice in the wilderness.

Bisker: you also have a great 4th. Don’t run down any cyclists, even if you think they deserve it ;) .

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[VBD]

The best way to stay safe is to remain visible and predictable. Running stop signs and weaving though traffic violates both. Coming to at least a slow roll at stop signs is easy on a bike, so why not just do it? It gives drivers a chance to see you, and also a chance for you to see the cars. Following the rules keeps things safe and predictable.

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[JanS]

Mark…checkered past? Do tell ;-) Yes…I think that was my point, just not articulated very well. It’s a two way street…both should be courteous…and yes, I agree with what you just said about the things that a “good” cyclist is entitled to do. I think we’ve all encountered the not so courteous driver and/or cyclist. There are plenty of them out there…..on both sides. Brush a cyclist back? I know I would never , ever do that, and in my head I ask myself who the eff would even consider doing that? And because a driver may not be courteous does not mean it can be a reason for a cyclist to be an asshole (and vice versa) But…this being the weekend that it is, I just read about a house in Graham destroyed by a young teenage neighbor who was lighting a mortar (who allows their kid to do that?), it fell over, and voila, a woman lost her house, the parents are liable. Or the joker in Thurston County who was setting off backyard fireworks, went to relite the fuse (it was in a piece of PVC))…it blew up, he’s in Harborview. And the best one, a homemade firework that blew the foot off an unsuspecting 19yo in Central Park. People in this country do not think..at times are deemed a bit insane because they think freedom allows them to do whatever, like endangering a cyclist – or doing what the cyclist in Bisker’s post did…..no middle finger salute, please…keep the hand on the handlebar, TYVM. We can hope…but sometimes we just have to shake our heads. Thank goodness for BP meds. Have a safe one :)

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[waynster]

All bicycles that want to share the road should also be licenses go through a safety course like motorcycles and have a license plate and have insurance on them…. bicyclist want this and that then pay for them just like everyone else…..

• This reply was modified 7 years, 9 months ago by waynster.

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[mark47n]

Waynester, states and cities have tried this and found it lost money. Also, as i mentioned before, most cyclists have driver’s licenses and know the rules of the road. Given that cycles aren’t know to kill, by and large, or inflict massive property damage, it has been largely left alone due to financial constraints and it’s cometely unenforceable. After all, my commuting bike weighs 28lbs, which is heavy for a bicycle, as compared with 3000, which is a conservative weight on a car. My bike goes less than 20 mph, unless im working hard as compared to the 40 mph that seems typical (and illegal) around here.

All that said, what would licensing solve, in light is statistics?

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[waynster]

sorry same thing was said about motorcycles years ago now the have a safety course wear helmets and carrie insurance plus have the endorsement on their licenses sorry its time to get bicyclist inline….

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[VBD]

What would licensing bicycles accomplish? Is the idea to filter out all the kids under 16 and those not willing to jump through the hoops? Or just price out all the cyclists who ride because they can’t afford to drive? It’s a bad idea that won’t change any of the root problems.

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[Bringerofthepain]

People who just drive cars (don’t bike, don’t bus) are NOT paying their ‘fair share’ for using the roads. Car drivers are subsidized by cyclists and bus riders. This has been shown again and again in SDOT reports.

If we propose licensing for bike lanes, let’s also propose it for pedestrians using sidewalks. You want to walk on that sidewalk? Get in the registry and pay up!

Bikes do less damage to roads and the environment than cars do, help reduce car traffic, and are a fun way to spend time with your kids/family and stay in shape.

Here’s a fun gif that is relevant to this convo.(comment edited to fix gif and typos)
http://1p40p3gwj70rhpc423s8rzjaz.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/2nd-Ave-Gif-2.gif

• This reply was modified 7 years, 9 months ago by Bringerofthepain.

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[Bringerofthepain]

Please also affirm that you will be willing to pay taxes to pay the legislators to write the laws re: licensing; hire and pay for people to write the software needed to implement and run the licensing software system; hire and pay state workers to be trained on the law(s) and also man the offices and process registrations; pay for the materials for the physical licenses; etc. And i reiterate – i expect pedestrians to receive an equal mandate.

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[AJP]

Bringerofthepain is absolutely right. Do you really want to pay extra taxes and have an extra layer of government just so you can stick it to cyclists?

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[aussiedor]

There is really no way to police bicycles in the city. It’s really up to the cyclist. I see plenty of motorists in the city that do not stop for people trying to cross the street. There are plenty of things out there that get peoples knickers all twisted. Suck it up and just learn to get along with one another.

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