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February 13, 2013 at 5:25 pm #784330
DBPMemberIs anyone interested in visiting some cats that Pamela (aka: hammerhead) has trapped, before they go off to the spay/neuter clinic? It’s quite an education to see these animals, I can tell you.
I asked Pamela whether she would mind if people who were curious came and had a look for themselves. She said no problem with it, and she told me that she could even arrange for one of her colleagues to give the tour instead of her . . . just in case someone wanted to learn more about feral trapping but didn’t feel comfortable meeting up with her (Pamela) just yet.
So how’s about it? Any interest out there?
February 13, 2013 at 6:08 pm #784331
SarahScootParticipantDBP, no one is saying these cats don’t deserve to live, or that they aren’t lovable… which seems to be what you’re implying with your last post. No one *wants* the cats euthanized, as far as I can tell.
February 13, 2013 at 9:12 pm #784332
DBPMemberI’m not implying anything in my last post, except that a person can become more informed about TNR by talking directly with a trapper about what trappers do and how they do it.
Notwithstanding that, I can see how someone might feel they were being set up for a brainwashing here (Oh, wook at the kewt wittle kitties!) . . . but let me assure that FCAT HQ is not a petting zoo. Trapped cats are kept in cages until they’ve recovered from surgery and can be released. Touching them is strongly discouraged.
I was impressed by the fact that, when I broached the idea of a vist with Pamela, she immediately volunteered to vacate the premises – which is on her own property, mind – in order to let a more neutral colleague give the “tour.”
If any further assurance of neutrality is required, let it be understood that any visitor could still come away with the belief that feral cats are a menace, that euthanasia is a good option, and so on. Willingness to tolerate disagreement is the price of admission to this game, and I made sure Pamela understood that up front.
February 13, 2013 at 10:18 pm #784333
HomerParticipantThank you JoB! Just keep your cats indoors/in an outdoor enclosement at all times and problem solved. Cats can live and be loved by their owners and birds can live freely as they are supposed to be and be loved by their watchers.
Too many cat owners being too lazy and have a holier than thou attitude to train their cats to stay indoors (much safer for the cat and the wildlife) or build an outdoor enclosure.
February 13, 2013 at 10:38 pm #784334
WorldCitizenParticipantAnd why is killing feral cats wrong or undesirable?
February 13, 2013 at 11:09 pm #784335
hammerheadParticipantWorldCitizen it isn’t wrong, just a waste of YOUR money and a waste of animal controls time, just like killing adoptable animals. NO different.
SaharScoot: Amalia says:Solution: euthanasia. Would save a lot of poor kitties (two of whom, stray rescues, are my “kids”) from coyotes, cars, cold, hunger, and disease. We put them out there and make excuses to ourselves so that we can believe we are doing the right thing, but the truth is, we are doing it for ourselves, not them. They don’t care if they are euthanized.
She advocates euthanizing.
So the idea of 900 feral cats thru out the year being kept in cages at any of the local shelters for 3 days taking up VALUABLE space for adoptable animal is just stupid. So why hell wouldn’t we just get them fixed and send them back.
job and gr funny a lot of feral colonies that i know of the cats are at least 14 year or older, I trapped them all. So yes while indoor cats can live longer, Ferals can live along time too.
FCAT/HH
February 13, 2013 at 11:41 pm #784336
DBPMemberIf people would just [insert fantasy here] . . .
♥ If kids would just stay in school . . .
♥ If people would just drive slower . . .
♥ If everybody would just keep their cats indoors . . .
*************************
The fact is, people just DON’T do those things, and that’s why there’s a problem.
Educating people will help, yes. But education, by itself, will not solve the problem of feral cats. I can promise you that.
That’s why I have such high regard for hammerhead and her minions . . . er, I mean . . . associates. These people understand that one conscientious deed is worth a thousand daydreams.
February 13, 2013 at 11:45 pm #784337
SarahScootParticipantHH: My point was that no one *wants* to euthanize these cats. There’s a difference between concluding that euthanasia is the only solution, and actually wanting cats euthanized. I did not get the impression that Amalia thinks that’s a desirable solution, just that it’s the cold truth in this situation. It’s very unfortunate, but since there aren’t homes for all those cats, euthanasia is the only way to immediately reduce feral cat populations.
February 13, 2013 at 11:51 pm #784338
DBPMemberSo why do feral cat populations need to be reduced “immediately” by euthanizing when you can get there gradually without euthanizing?
If it’s that urgent, then you should be euthanizing all outdoor cats, right? Because all outdoor cats kill birds.
February 14, 2013 at 12:09 am #784339
TammiWSMemberInteresting discussion. FWIW, I’ve been a kitty parent to four cats over the past 25 years. All have lived to at least 16 years old. All have been indoor/outdoor cats, none have ever been harmed by wildlife and only once did one bring in a bird – alive – and that bird got back out of the house alive.
My indoor/outdoor cat – who is 14 – doesnt kill birds or anything for that matter. In fact, she wouldnt even turn head if a bird flew right in front of her face!
Maybe we’ve just been lucky but I took the time to train them to use the cat door, keep them in at night now (where we live has a lot of wooded area) and use a catbox when needed.
Appreciate all of the perspectives on this topic.
Thanks,
February 14, 2013 at 12:38 am #784340
oddrealityParticipantPerhaps we need to euthanize the crows and the hawks and the Stellars Jays?? I see them killing other birds. The hawks catch a lot of them,I see them plucking feathers of their prey on my fence and on the poles, and the crows kill baby birds in the spring as do the Jays…though the crows have a tendency to kill jay babies so maybe it evens out. Birds kill other birds , cats kill some too. More and more people keep their cats in. I think they are way less of a problem than they used to be. There are many things in the environment that kill birds or cause them to be unable to reproduce properly. Humans are the biggest problem. Fluoride ,for instance,cannot be good for birds or their eggs.It is not good for us either.Pesticides and all the other chemicals we use.The prescription drugs that are in the water supply. Humans are the issue not so much the cats.Cats are not the ones out to destroy the entire environment,they are just dong what cats do, it is us.We are the problem.
February 14, 2013 at 12:41 am #784341
hammerheadParticipantSarahScoot.
I trapped 900 cats myself last year, over 7000 cats were fixed at the feral cat project where they get fixed for FREE(ferals) there is just no way in hell any of our animal control agencies can trap and kill that many cats. Cats can have up to 3 litters a year, already getting pregnant cats. So the logic to “immediately” reduce the number of cats is wrong. I can prevent more cats from being born before that many are trapped by any animal control agency and killed. So far 11 have been aborted.
I am doing this with a few volunteers who get up at 6 am to drive cats up to get fixed.
So you are basically telling me that the 900 cats I trapped last year, should have been taken to the shelters and killed? Even though that is not what you “want”or is desirable?
Would you take the cats I trap and take them to the shelters that they would have to go and have them killed?
FCAT/HH
February 23, 2013 at 4:09 am #784342
hammerheadParticipantWell this certainly had nothing to do with cats.
Again this was possibly done by humans.
While nothing is confirmed. I am sure some minions will be “studying” it.
FCAT
February 23, 2013 at 3:02 pm #784343
anonymeParticipantI doubt that any scientist, or anyone else in their right mind, is suggesting for a moment that cats are the ONLY reason for bird mortality. Attempts to steer the argument that way are calculated only to further polarize the argument. Obviously, there are many causes and ALL of them should be addressed – especially if they involve many millions of birds. The idea that we should either fix everything or nothing is baffling, to say the least. This anti-science stance has a disturbing edge of dark ages religious fervor attached to it.
Feline predation affects raptors as well as songbirds. Raptors rely on other birds as a natural part of the food chain; reducing that food source by millions per year is yet another part of the same equation – not a separate threat.
I’m one of the minions who happen to think that the truth is a good thing to have – whether you like it or not.
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