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Who is buying America's elections?

Started 6 months ago by JoB
Latest reply from redblack

JoB
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http://newpoliticsreport.org/site/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/JAS-NewPolitics2010-Online-Imaged.pdf

Posted 6 months ago #
redblack
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thanks, jo. this is something i suspected was happening, but the stupid liberal media doesn't cover it.

kootch will come along in a minute to discredit it, though, because it was written by some liberal university staff.

a caution to those with dial-up or slower DSL: this is a 40-page, 8.7 MB .pdf file.

Posted 6 months ago #
kootchman
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you do me a disservice... but yes, NYU is not the bastion of conservative thought. For Heavens sake redblack Justice Brennans' biography is (one of them) is called ""liberal Champion"

So what's new? You want and think unfettered, without restriction, union influence peddling is fine and dandy.. moral even. Others think it is an abomination and perversion of equal protections. So, we bring our best fight dogs to the fray. As my sweetheart homey would croon... "money changes everything"... as does the lack thereof. It's the game. Every other part of government is up for sale... why not the judiciary?

But yes, the democratic core did outspend conservatives.. lawyers and lobbyists... I agree with ya on this one.

Posted 6 months ago #
HMC Rich
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Twenty plus years now of Conservative Talk Radio, plus the internet has come to fruition I suspect. For years the radio hosts promoting conservative views have been griping about judicial activism from the bench.

And the Evangelical crowd once motivated will spend money on causes they believe in.

The right took the lead in the last election on spending. I bet it will even out in the coming years as the left rises to answer.

Posted 6 months ago #
redblack
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wtf?!

union membership is down to 7% of the nation's work force. we're a bunch of blue collar slobs fighting to keep our heads above water.

what kind of money or power do we wield that frightens you so much?

Posted 6 months ago #
kootchman
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We will see. Liberals had a pretty good run at it... 50 plus years. That is, if the left can keep their instituions intact. So far, the dismemberment is pretty advanced. Unions, and parallel left wing groups (ACORN) are being taken apart bit by bit. I think the big "mo" has gone the other way. The rabble are just the foot soldiers. C'mon, do really think Rove, Norquist, hear a higher moral voice? No more than Obama, Gregoire, Trumka. Both sides carry the water buckets for someone else.

Posted 6 months ago #
kootchman
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ya got the death grip on government... yes effectively unions are a non-issue in the private sector. But they are the government work force.. the ones that rule by government fiat. Haven't you noticed the growing popularity of targeting government work force unions? Force them to downsize ny denying revenue to the government. When you assault an entrenched fortification .. 10 to 1 odds in favor of the entrenched. Unions know they can't build the private sector base. They are roundly rejected time after time... they throw a blue collar bone out there once in a while... the last jewel left is white collar government workers. Repeal Davis Bacon and the blue collar labor movement is done.

Posted 6 months ago #
redblack
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man, you guys miss the point entirely.

our government is here for everyone. left, right, rich, poor, brown, white black...

it's not here merely to facilitate market forces making more money for the wealthy.

when we talk about jobs, we're talking about people's livelihoods and their ability to sustain themselves, not just some means of making profits for someone with an acceptable level of ambition.

but i'll bet you'd love it if electricians made $11 per hour. then you could save thousands on a whole-house rewiring job.

remember: you get what you pay for, and that goes double for workers' wages.

Posted 6 months ago #
kootchman
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No they aren't. They are here for the highest bidder, those most likely to put them in office for some goodies that someone else will pay for. . I have had absolutely shitty work done by union labor... testified in civil court many times. Also have had great examples of labor work. Being in the union is irrelevant to wether you are an honest businessmen or apply best practices skills. You are, I am, we are, making livelihoods because people of ambition have use and need of our services...and can make them profits. That is the point entirely.

Posted 6 months ago #
JoB
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kootch...

only conservatives believe that the government is there for the highest bidder...

that mistaken belief is why Occupy Wall Street continues to gain momentum in spite of the lack of a "clear message" .

Posted 6 months ago #
redblack
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Being in the union is irrelevant to wether you are an honest businessmen or apply best practices skills.

and being a businessman is irrelevant to how qualified you are to lead.

what's your point?

besides, if you're in a union you're not a businessman.

duh.

Posted 6 months ago #
kootchman
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Let's try and connect the dots. read the sentence carefully redblack.. slowly if you must. Dishonest businessmen who send union labor, will screw you to the floor. If your "craft" requires a skill set, and in the absence of close supervision, one chooses to take short cuts.. tuck the wires the wrong way, not chisel deep enough into the concrete etc.. what advantage is their to union labor? None. Being in business is a winnowing process to be sure. IF you think you are qualified AND have capital to risk.. you are free to try and prove it. The market will judge. I have seen a lot come and a lot go.

Posted 6 months ago #
kootchman
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Sure JoB... it is a veritable tidal surge. I don't suggest they have a clear message, or think they should. Watch Greece. A federal government that exerts state control over every segment of enterprise, and a population entrenched in the notion of entitlements. So gutless is the government, so wedded to the entitlement state, that when being rescued, it won't even grab the life line being offered. Too afraid to take the neccessery steps towards some austerity. That's the movement that is the more telling. All that sugar cake... somebody has to pay. Trouble is they taxed themselves into "fairness" and who would invest a dime there? They no longer have a private sector left to jump start a recovery. Too deep in debt for their economy to address the deficit. A "fair" and bankrupt country.

Posted 6 months ago #
redblack
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kootch:

point of clarification:

when you said, "being in the union," i thought you were talking about the labor side of the contract. laborers and craftsmen are in the union. employers are rarely union members themselves.

i think you meant to say, "whether or not you sign a contract for union labor is irrelevant to wether[sic] you are an honest businessmen[sic] or apply best practices skills[sic]."

Posted 6 months ago #
JoB
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kootch..

read slowly and connect the dots?

so you jump from occupy wall street to greece
and then to the assumption that the austerity measures there are necessary to it's economic health

dude.. connect the dots
build an argument one step at a time.

your union argument would have benefited from the same attention.

you seem to forget that it is workers who run those wires and workers who check to see that the work is done well.

when workers are overworked and underpaid.. when they are spending more time worrying about the welfare of their families than about the job... the work suffers and the bottom line suffers.

the prosperity America once enjoyed.. the prosperity that educated us both and gave us the chance to move from less to more... was based on the combined efforts of workers and capital... what we used to call teamwork.. back when you worked your entire life for a company.. not just collecting a paycheck but gaining experience that increased your company's effectiveness until you retired with the pension that was part of your deferred wages.

then wall street bean counters took over and decided that capital was more valuable than actual product and look where that has led us... to the brink of economic collapse.

and you can't figure out that labor is essential to product? get a grip.

I know the educational system you were educated in and even at it's worst, it produced better thinkers than that.

so... read the link
it doesn't say what you think it does.

Posted 6 months ago #
miws
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JoB #15 FTW

Mike

Posted 6 months ago #
JoB
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miws..
is FTW a good thing
i will take my answer offline if the explanation is less than polite...

Posted 6 months ago #
JanS
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JoB..FTW...for the win :)

Posted 6 months ago #
JoB
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ahhhh!
no wonder my grandkids fondly think of me as dense ;->

Posted 6 months ago #
kootchman
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The main point... Greece taxed itself beyond its capability to repay its debt. It was so government sector dominated, it no longer has an effective capitalist economy to raise the kinds of wealth needed to meet is entitlements and solve its debt. 27 per cent of the work force is government employed.. creating no wealth, adding value to nothing. And my fellow citizens see it, should know we are heading in the same direction... but cry full steam ahead.

I didn't say I believe the government "should be up for sale".. I said it IS up for sale. C'mon even the most casual observer sees at least that much. And the returns are breathtaking....

indeed redblack... that is a more accurate penning.

Posted 6 months ago #
JoB
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kootchman

your assumption that a capitalist economy will raise wealth only applies if that economy creates jobs that sustain the government's ability to raise revenue.

when that doesn't happen
you get the current crisis in America

Yes, we should look to Greece.. but not for the reasons you state.

There is plenty of wealth in Greece...
but most of it remains untaxed wealth either through tax code manipulation or illegal avoidance.

Greece has a HUGE revenue problem...

Untaxed wealth doesn't necessarily create jobs. It certainly didn't in Greece.

citizens can no longer afford to turn a blind eye to government by corporations for the benefit of corporations.

This is still technically a democracy...
If we take back our process we still have a chance to regain balance

Posted 6 months ago #
kootchman
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Sure.. and Italy just raised the retirement age to 65 for women, are cutting back on pensions, taking away politicians benefits, pay cuts for government workers, ... Spain to follow... all the rants and raves on how progressive the the Euro model is...and half the countries are in deep shit. Greece has a MASSIVE deficit and spent in 2010 10% more then it generated in revenues. That's what happens when you spend and spend and spend... you lose your options. They are down to selling state assets. That's where liberal, "progressive" tax policy get ya, Broke

Posted 6 months ago #
JoB
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kootchman...

this morning.. one year away from next year's elections.. Karl Roves big spending political PACs and special interest groups have begun attack ads on democratic candidates...

it's going to be a very long very expensive year.

You are a businessman.
Do you think they are expecting some pretty big returns from that investment?

How is it that you concentrate on government expenditures that benefit citizens but ignore the great corporate feed trough that is the result of this kind of election spending?

You aren't for less spending Kootch.
You are for less spending that benefits citizens.

there is a difference.

Posted 6 months ago #
kootchman
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Oh you wrap that blanket on someone who needs it and believes it. Government spends to buy votes, to entrench an intolerable political class. They call everything a "benefit" to citizens. 17 Trilllion by 2012... that's the deficit. All that spending to "benefit" the citizens? We can't afford all those benefits. You can't tax it away. Not even the most reality deprived socialist doesn't understand that. If there WAS wealth in Greece.. then the banks would not have to be recapitalized now would they? And more telling, the couldn't be recapitalized,,, the piggy bank was empty. Now tell me how you figure Greece has wealth? It's gone.. it fled years ago. It was a hostile confiscatory, government.

Posted 6 months ago #
WorldCitizen
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FYI:

"Greece has a predominately service economy, which (including tourism) accounts for over 73% of GDP. Almost 9% of the world’s merchant fleet is Greek-owned, making the Greek fleet the largest in the world. Other important sectors include food processing, tobacco, textiles, chemicals (including refineries), pharmaceuticals, cement, glass, telecommunication and transport equipment. Agricultural output has steadily decreased in importance over the last decade, accounting now for only about 5% of total GDP. The EU is Greece’s major trading partner, with more than half of all Greek two-way trade being intra-EU. Greece runs a perennial merchandise trade deficit, and 2009 imports totaled $64 billion against exports of $21 billion. Tourism and shipping receipts together with EU transfers make up for much of this deficit."

Source: U.S. Dept. of State

Posted 6 months ago #
JoB
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World citizen

and we are headed now the same dead end service economy that has failed Greece :(

Posted 6 months ago #
kootchman
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Yep. And those Greek ships? Foreign flagged, and built in Asia. Socialist rule.

Posted 6 months ago #
JoB
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kootch...

i hate to break this to you dude
but life is not one big who done you wrong song

Posted 6 months ago #
DBP
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To follow up on JoB's (#23) post . . .

Enforcing the tax code won't magically cure what ails Greece, but it will definitely help.

Here's a decent article from a conservative source (Wall Street Journal) that describes the phenomenon and impact of tax cheating in Greece.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704182004575055473233674214.html

And just below is a handy-dandy graph from the article that compares the "shadow economies" of various countries. In this cluster, Greece is at the top, with a quarter of its economy hidden from the eye of the tax collector.

Just who are the tax cheaters in Greece anyway? Not surprisingly, it runs the gamut of social classes, but here are just a few individual cases as described in the article:

In a government survey last year of 150 doctors in Kolonaki, an upmarket Athens neighborhood, half of the doctors said they were paid less than €30,000 a year. Thirty said they made less than €10,000.

"It is not possible for a taxpayer to declare an income of €15,000 while at the same time maintaining a big house, a big car, a recreational boat and sending his kids to private school," Mr. Papaconstantinou said Tuesday.

Repeated requests for comment on the survey of Athens doctors were unanswered by the Athens doctors association.

Dimitris Mavrogiannis, who owns an auto-paint shop in the New Kosmos district of Athens, says he usually issues receipts, especially as a lot of his work is for insurance companies, who insist on them. But he says he makes exceptions.

"In the majority of cases, I do issue receipts," says Mr. Mavrogiannis, 58. "But sometimes people ask for a discount on the VAT tax and I say, 'OK.' "

"I work for a large Greek construction company … but of course, I have also done my own jobs on the side off the books," says Alexandros Foukis, 27, a building contractor. "What the government needs to do is provide incentives to people to issue a receipt."

Sound familiar, anybody?

Naw . . . What was I thinking!? I'm sure none of my Bloggy friends would ever hire (or work for) someone "off the books" . . .

Would you?

Posted 6 months ago #
kootchman
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why buy em'? Here is blue state voter registration. Makes ya feel real confident ....

http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=GqMVxeZhflI&feature=player_embedded

Posted 1 month ago #
JanS
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why buy what? I'm lost here, I think...you saying why buy votes? on a 4 month old thread?

Posted 1 month ago #
kootchman
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That's the title of the thread... why buy em' when you don't have voter registrations with any degree of security... you can just go pick up handful of forms and register anyone..... asking for legitimate ID is voter suppression in "blue speak"....

Posted 1 month ago #
WorldCitizen
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Voter fraud is not a real issue.

Posted 1 month ago #
JanS
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Kootch...ID is required to register...other than that...well, I suppose anyone could use a fake ID..not just "blue"..it goes both ways...get over yourself..

Posted 1 month ago #
WorldCitizen
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Please read these if you have any desire to challenge my assertion:

http://www.truthaboutfraud.org/pdf/TruthAboutVoterFraud.pdf

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2010/10/fake_the_vote.2.html

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2011/12/02/381172/reince-priebus-voter-fraud/?mobile=nc

http://www.tampabay.com/news/in-florida-voter-fraud-is-rarer-than-shark-attacks/1219292

http://www.brennancenter.org/content/resource/policy_brief_on_the_truth_about_voter_fraud/

http://dirtyhippies.org/2012/03/05/voter-fraud-frighteners-citing-the-wrong-statistics-fixing-the-wrong-problems/

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/10/opinion/the-myth-of-voter-fraud.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/five-myths-about-voter-fraud/2011/10/04/gIQAkjoYTL_story.html

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122550597058490345.html

I could go on...

Posted 1 month ago #
kootchman
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Not on that clip was ID required. Amd should you be paying attention, it's a political vendetta.. JaN did you notice ANY red states being sued by DOJ for rquiring a valid voter ID? Even though there are some blue states with picture ID requirements. The Brennan Justice Center? Now there is a fair and balanced view. Please... The video has more import.. because it actually happens. Did ya watch the guy walk out with qr voter registrations and the clerk say no idea required? Who would have ever imagined it would be easier to vote than to get sudafed? The ID is free... and shucks... all you have to do is go get one. That is too high a hurdle for active civic responsibility? You miss the important part.. there is no enforcement.. it's hard to generate fraud stats when you have no mechanism to detect fraud. That makes as much sense as saying the FBI stops keeping any crime statistics so we no longer have bank robberies. You carry ATM cards, drivers licenses, welfare and food stamp ID... a voter ID is too high a hurdle? Why am I not surprised liberal sources say there is no problem?You could go on I suppose. but we lnow the Democrats do not want voter ID verification...

Posted 1 month ago #
JanS
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I think people get sick and tired of your slanted view...it's only blue states, it's only the evil libs, it's the way you liberals want it ( no one working, everyone feeding at the teat of the government), and on and on...like I said, get over yourself...it's on both sides, and intelligent people know that.

Posted 1 month ago #
JanS
Member Profile

I'm a Democrat..and voter ID? sure...you register with a form of ID, and you get a voter registration card..that's my ID...you don't need to see my Drivers license in addition, or a special card to prove that I am who I am. Besides, I live in WA State,,,I vote by mail, so unless you want to come avisitin' when I open my little packet, well..

statements like "but we lnow (sic) the Democrats do not want voter ID verification..." are simply baiting, generalizations. Seems to me that for one who wants government out of everything, you still want government in some things, huh, as long as it's your agenda...

Posted 1 month ago #
WorldCitizen
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Once again...voter fraud is a NON ISSUE!!!!

Talking about it doesn't make it one. Showing videos by a cut-rate edit king doesn't make it one. In fact NOTHING you can find online makes it an issue because it isn't one.

Posted 1 month ago #
kootchman
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It's not a non issue. People are going to jail for it. Federal prison in fact. voter registration is no more an inconvenience than showing ID for a six pack. IF you look at the map, those states with lax voter ID are .. blue. That's fact. Jan. So, you ;rove my point... Washington being a blue state has lax voting regulations. Thank-you.

Four Democratic party officials, including the St. Joseph County chairman Butch Morgan, have been charged with conspiracy, forgery, and official misconduct in the 2008 presidential primary

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/295595/election-fraud-tainted-2008-presidential-race-indiana-hans-von-spakovsky

The state chairman of Indiana's Democratic Party resigned Monday as a probe of election fraud in the 2008 Democratic presidential primary widened.

State law requires a presidential candidate to gather 500 valid signatures in each county to qualify for the ballot. Barack Obama may not have met it. Investigators think 150 of the 534 signatures the Obama campaign turned in for St. Joseph County may have been forged. Former Democratic Rep. Artur Davis, who is black, said vote fraud is rampant in African-American districts like his in Alabama.

Read more: http://old.post-gazette.com/pg/11352/1197406-373-0.stm#ixzz1rZvqWrEA

Although the organization prides itself for its registration efforts, it also has a long history of scandal. In the state of Missouri in 1986, 12 ACORN members were convicted of voter fraud

more?

On February 10, 2005, Nonaresa Montgomery, a paid worker who ran Operation Big Vote during the run-up to the 2001 mayoral primary, was found guilty of vote fraud. Montgomery hired about 30 workers to do fraudulent voter-registration canvassing. Instead of knocking on doors, the volunteers sat at a St. Louis fast food restaurant and wrote out names and information from an outdated voter list. About 1,500 fraudulent voter registration cards were turned in.

more?

In 2007, in Kansas City, Missouri, four ACORN employees were indicted for fraud. In April of this year eight ACORN employees in St. Louis city and county pleaded guilty to federal election fraud for submitting bogus voter registration

more?

The Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN) was fined the maximum of $5,000 in Las Vegas today for its role in a massive voter fraud conspiracy.
Judge Donald Mosley said if an individual, as opposed to a corporation, had been before him, he would have handed down a 10-year prison sentence. "And I wouldn't have thought twice about it," he said, according to the Las Vegas Review-Journal.
Mosley criticized ACORN for making a "mockery" of America's electoral process. "This isn't a banana republic," he said.
In April ACORN pleaded guilty to felony-level unlawful compensation for registration of voters. With the full knowledge of upper management,

more?

Judicial Watch recently uncovered massive voter fraud by ACORN in Colorado and ACORN settled a racketeering lawsuit in Ohio out of court last year and agreed to leave the state. In the settlement with the Buckeye Institute's 1851 Center for Constitutional Law, ACORN agreed to "cease all Ohio activity" and surrender all its state business licenses.

How much voter fraud will you tolerate WorldCitizen? How about NONE?

There is plenty online... but shucks.. court records, guilty pleas... I guess they mean nothing. It is an issue.. and a Republican one too... their hands are not totally clean... It's s non issue in your book... other states have a higher degree of sanctity for the worth and value of the vote. They are legislating accordingly

Posted 1 month ago #
DBP
Member Profile

WorldCitizen said:

Once again...voter fraud is a NON ISSUE!!!! Talking about it doesn't make it one. Showing videos by a cut-rate edit king doesn't make it one. In fact NOTHING you can find online makes it an issue because it isn't one.

WorldCitizen, do you dispute kootchman's examples? Granted, it would've been nice if he'd cited them, but still . . .

Anyway, now I'm wondering . . . how many instances of organized voter fraud would it take for this to become an issue in your eyes?

kootchman implies that even one instance is enough to get riled up about. I don't agree with that, but neither do I agree that this is "non-issue." Surely there is some point at which we have to look at the problem and say, "Yes, this is something we need to take preventive action on."

Posted 1 month ago #
kootchman
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Why cite them? In her own words....

"In fact NOTHING you can find online makes it an issue because it isn't one."

How can you argue with that.?

Posted 1 month ago #
dobro
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Here's something I posted in another thread...

No, it's not. In the past decade (that's decade-10 yrs) 311 cases of voter fraud have been prosecuted. 81 convictions. Hundreds of millions of voters. 81 convictions.

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/political-animal/2011_12/the_evidence_bolstering_voterf034087.php

In the 2008 election alone over 130 million people voted. You can do the math. Voter fraud is not a problem. It's all about vote restriction. Think back, remember when several US attorneys were fired by the Bush justice dept. Recall why they were fired? Because they refused to file phony voter fraud cases under pressure from Bushco. Republicans with integrity, willing to sacrifice their jobs rather than buckle to political pressure to misuse the law. Hard to believe?

It really happened.

And please stop confusing the issue of voter fraud with election fraud. They're not the same thing. Registering false names and manipulating petitions is election fraud. Going to the poll and voting with a false identity is voter fraud. Showing ID when you come to a polling place addresses one of these things and not the other. According to statistics cited, one of these things is not a problem.

Posted 1 month ago #
JanS
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DBP...and what preventive action should we take, if it's an issue? Your opinion...

Posted 1 month ago #
WorldCitizen
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OK, so let's just say that the couple of cases that are in the news count as something, as they should. What level of a problem is this? As stated above by dobro, the overall numbers just don't add up enough to make this worth implementing a system that every neutral party admits would amount to massive voter disenfranchisement. This fraud, as well as the various other cases over the years, are held up in the limelight by those who know that it is in fact a way to decrease the role the poor and elderly play in elections...groups that vote overwhelmingly for left-leaning candidates.

One can say "voter registration is no more an inconvenience than showing ID for a six pack" and you'd be right. The problem isn't showing the ID, it's getting the ID. Just because your world view is limited to what you see as no big deal, doesn't mean it's not a massive struggle for countless others. But this doesn't really get at your question, does it?

I'll stick by my answer and say the instances are not enough to warrant our national attention. I will amend it to say that I agree with you that the acceptable number instances of voter fraud are zero. If you'd like to get at a way to increase the value and sanctity of every vote possible, then I would suggest doing it in a way that is much less burdensome on the individual. Again, I don't find it a burden and obviously neither do you, but that doesn't make it so for the rest of America.

I'll also go on record as saying I don't have a good answer for you as to how to change the system. I must insist, though, that any attempt to place the right to vote with the ability of an individual to get an ID is at best misguided and at worst nothing more than a thinly veiled attempt to disenfranchise voters across the nation. That goes directly against your claim to care about the sanctity of the voting process.

I won't sit back and let those who would use such overall insignificant events like this to limit the rights and voices of those most in need, just to gain selfish political advantage.

Oh, and as far as post #42 goes, well probably just not the best language for me to use in a text only format. The intent behind it was to say that none of the examples online add up to enough to make it an issue. That doesn't make the fraud legitimate, it makes it insignificant.

Posted 1 month ago #
DBP
Member Profile

OK, well, now you guys have swayed me back the other way. I think dobro's points (and statistics given) are persuasive.

My current thinking:

¶ Election/petition fraud still equals somewhat of a problem (maybe).

¶ Voter fraud, however, does not seem to be a problem. At least, not with these current numbers.

*************************************************************************************

Re: Election/petition fraud

kootchman suggested that in Indiana, the last Pres. primary outcome would have turned out differently if not for some Democratic officials in some counties who cheated and filed ballot petitions with bogus names.

I'm not so sure even of that. I think that if those dishonest, lazy-ass officials (alleged) hadn't cheated, other honest officials would've gone out and gotten the Obama signatures legitimately.

Anyway, I actually feel smarter now as a result of reading a political thread on WSB. Gotta tell you, folks . . . that doesn't happen very often.

Thanks everyone!!

**************************************************************************************

P.S. to Jan. Now that I've changed my mind and don't think preventive measures need to be taken, I don't have to answer your question. Right?

P.P.S. Weird to think that some people still don't have a picture ID. How do they get anything done?

Posted 1 month ago #
jamminj
Member Profile

If the argument is that there is voter fraud that decides our elections, then that explains the 2010 congressional elections.

thanks for pointing out the fraud kootch.

Posted 1 month ago #
JanS
Member Profile

lol..DBP..you never, ever have to answer my questions....it's OK...after all..other people simply change the subject - so I'm used to it :)

Posted 1 month ago #
jamminj
Member Profile

"Weird to think that some people still don't have a picture ID. How do they get anything done?"

when you make poverty level, not much you can do that needs an ID.

Posted 1 month ago #
redblack
Member Profile

DP: charlie white was the indiana secretary of state who just got convicted for voter fraud. i guess he's one of dobro's 81 felons.

that's why fox news is targeting south bend dems. it's nothing more than a tit-for-tat revenge story.

however, it is important to note that the south bend dems are being accused of election fraud, not voter fraud.

Posted 1 month ago #

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