Bobby Jindal, and others are finding the latest Romney messages totally unacceptable...yet there are people ( on here, even) who think that he would have made a better president the next 4 years. Pretty delusional , in my book..
Romney - his own kind turning on him
"yet there are people ( on here, even) who think that he would have made a better president the next 4 years. Pretty delusional , in my book.."
Better than the current President and his actual abysmal record ? Oh, Lord no. That would be darn near impossible (sarcasm).
Obama's approval rating is at 58% right now. I guess there are a significant amount of people who don't find his record so abysmal. Either that, or all the polls are wrong and everybody's lying. (sarcasm)
58% is good, not great. As we all know 47% is the floor and the other 11% are hoping they did the right thing. No shame in that.
Jan (and her unbiased, straight-down-the-middle) friend Gail Collins made it sound like there were handfuls still stupid enough to think Romney would have done a better job.
As the layoffs continue, Obamacare costs become reality and the lies regarding Benghazi FINALLY leak out, I would contend (gasp!) it should be the other way around. (no sarcasm).
58% is not great? And the electoral vote wasn't a landslide, I guess. Remember when GWB left office he was at 22%. I think you can lower that floor.
Let's check in two years from now when Obamacare has been fully implemented to see how the cost curve is going. As I said in another thread, after Obama and President Hillary Clinton have 5 or 6 years to tweak it, I think it will look pretty good.
If at first you don't succeed . . .
Tweak, tweak again.
When the political leasders of the republican party said before the election that it didn't matter to them who fills the seat.. any warm body will do...
it is no surprise that they didn't have much confidence in him
Here's the most important thing about the 58% approval that makes it more than just "good". It means that after 4 years of socialist, kenyan,secret muslim, birther, lazy, not too bright,gangsta, Chicago politics, etc, cr*p being flung at Obama by the right wing cranks, he's still popular. All the trashing failed. The wingers lost the argument and lost the American people. And they're not going to win anybody back with these tactics. A shift has occurred. We'll see where it goes, but I feel optimistic.
Yea.. I remember GHWB approval ratings too... 87%. Let's see how new college graduates and low skill service workers fare economically over the next four years. Add in all the Obamacare taxes yet to hit. Now, will Obamanomics create more jobs, more income.. or do we now reside in Eurofunk employment stall? France, Spain, Italy, Greece all tried to perpetuate their socialist/democratic model too... with government subsidy... look at them now! After 4 years we haven't expanded the economy enough, to cover the costs of Obamacare for 30 days... gonna borrow more?
3/7-10/91 Gallup 87
"Let's check in two years from now when Obamacare has been fully implemented to see how the cost curve is going. As I said in another thread, after Obama and President Hillary Clinton have 5 or 6 years to tweak it, I think it will look pretty good."
And, the 47% was in reference to Obama's floor. The folks not willing to vote out their meal ticket (pun intended).
"The folks not willing to vote out their meal ticket (pun intended).
the election is over.
The kind of remarks that were made about presidential candidate Obama stretched the limits of good taste..
those made about our sitting president tip well over the top.
now i know i am not having a good day today and that makes me a little cranky..
but the truth is that i am literally sick of what some people seem to believe is perfectly acceptable behavior.
I am sorry those who would have seen this election tip in another direction don't get the basic fact that it didn't happen the way they thought it would.
that old saying ..
you can fool some of the people some of the time but you can't fool all of the people all of the time applies here..
there simply wasn't enough money to sell a failed agenda to those who would pay the most for it.
isn't it time to get over it and get on with something productive?
if those of us on the democratic side who want Obamacare reformed got together with those on the Repbulcian side who want Obamacare refromed...
and convinced businesses to back us because reforming Obamacare is in their best interests..
imagine how much rpessure we could put on Capital Hill to get it done.
If the p..ing match continues...
business as usual will continue..
and the same folks who thought it was worth economically busting the citizens of the United States to elect a new President will still be at the same game.
I have already made mine.
"Yea.. I remember GHWB approval ratings too... 87%."
Right, at the beginning of Iraq War #1. Remember where they were by election day 1992? GWB was flying high right after 9/11 too. Down to 22% as they booed him out the door. The American people tend to rally around their leaders in times of war.
Is this the percentages forum? I know of this group of freeloaders, most of them pay no federal tax and so I suppose the rest just expect the government to support them. I sympathize with Ward but June, Wally and the Beav will not get off their butts and work.
GW did tell one awesome joke at a dinner one night. he burst into Cheney's room with the news that his popularity was at 22% and Cheney said, "What's your secret?"
Smitty..you are still supporting a man who said that Obama bought the blacks, women, etc with "gifts"? you are still supporting a man who lied at every turn? You are still supporting a man who won't take one ounce of the blame for losing the campaign he was in, for losing the election?
Oh, and, do tell, what is the truth according to Smitty about Benghazi? What the hell inside information do you have that no one else in all the country has? "Obamacare to blame"? no, an easy excuse for the companies to cut back..themselves to blame. And, prominent Repubs rejecting Romney, his statements (made in a phone call that he didn't think would get out about gifts bought, etc. You believe that? Why in the world do you, an intelligent man from what I can tell, still defend this out- of- touch guy? I don't get it.
Yes, the Prez won, got reelected..but we should stay divided? I don't get it.
JoB, what are you talking about? What "remark"? I can't say that people tend to vote in a way that favors their best interest? Whether it be people on food stamps and ever extended unemployment, or rich folk wanting lower taxes so they can keep more of their money...it is all them same.
Obama has presided over an economy that has created more people dependent on government than ever before....of course they are going to vote for more free stuff. Who wouldn't?
My question is, why is it wrong/poor tatse/sour grapes/racist to state that? Because you said it is?
Polls are tricky. Gallup estimated Romney ahead 50-49 on the Monday night before the election.
And 58% approval? Obama certainly didn't get 58% of the vote.
Advice to both sides: when you're shouting about how insane the other side is, and how only an imbecile could possibly support it... recall that roughly 50% of the country did support it.
But JKB, the liberals always say that half the people used to support slavery! Half the people thought the world was flat! Half the people thought women should not vote!
See how easy it is to be a liberal?
"...the liberals always say..."
You know, whenever a person starts a sentence with this type of insipid generalization it makes them sound...kind of...let's just say "reality challenged".
"And 58% approval? Obama certainly didn't get 58% of the vote."
Approval ratings and vote totals are two different things. Both have meaning.
More percentages. President Obama received 44% of his vote total from person's of color. That means 56% of his winning margin came from white people.
You guys actually believe that half of the country is lazy and wants to live off gov't handouts and "free stuff"? That's patently ridiculous.
And 35% of posts on this thread are from dobro.
uhhh...true enough as I write this, but it'll be off once I post. That's what I get for accurately knowing the location of the thread.
"You guys actually believe that half of the country is lazy and wants to live off gov't handouts and "free stuff"? That's patently ridiculous."
No, not half. But enough to change the outcome. Not sure what your white percentage of the vote has to do with anything.
"But enough to change the outcome..."
How much would you say, then?
No dobro.. this would not be true
"You guys actually believe that half of the country is lazy and wants to live off gov't handouts and "free stuff"? That's patently ridiculous.
I don't believe they "want" to.. but I think too many have too little information, too few skills, and fewer and fewer role models to show them the alternative. It's the social version of Stockholm syndrome. Even a beaten, toothless dog, unable to hunt will hang around the back porch if there is a meal coming.
From my point of view, its great that Republicans want to rely on these stories to explain their huge loss. (White House, Senate, lost seats in the House) The longer it takes for them to face up to the real reasons they lost, the more elections they will lose.
"JoB, what are you talking about? What "remark"? I can't say that people tend to vote in a way that favors their best interest? Whether it be people on food stamps and ever extended unemployment, or rich folk wanting lower taxes so they can keep more of their money...it is all them same.
Obama has presided over an economy that has created more people dependent on government than ever before....of course they are going to vote for more free stuff. Who wouldn't?"
what if it's not about the free stuff at all Smitty?
What if it's about not wanting to pick up the tab once again for the freeloading corporations and the rich have been doing on our dime?
what if it's about having enough sense to realize just how much you are getting shafted?
that's not the story they are telling on talking head tv?
do't tell me you are you still listening to the guys who thought Romney would win?
you do know they got that really wrong, don't you?
We will see... still haven't seen a Democratic proposal to stop accumulating more debt let alone reduce what we have on the pile already... I see republicans offering new ways to raise revenues... some pretty reasonable. But damn... not a thing from the Senate or White House on their offer to cut entitlement spending. Why is that?
ko00otch: what ideas have republicans proposed to increase revenue? we hear about "entitlement reform" on a daily basis, but i have heard no specifics from republicans and conservatives - and it isn't for lack of looking and listening. i think everyone wants some specific ideas about reducing the budget deficit.
The new balance of power means that Democrats who once would have acquiesced reluctantly to GOP demands for stiff benefit cuts are now balking at ideas such as chained CPI or an increase in the Medicare retirement age, as well as demanding GOP concessions to higher taxes.
"The price for that kind of thing has gone up," said a senior House Democrat who required anonymity to speak frankly on party strategy. "Negotiations depend on the situation. No one should expect to get the same kind of deal."
so here we are. you know where democrats are and where they want tax increases.
so where are the non-"entitlement" cuts? this should be a no-brainer. you guys claim that there's all kinds of wasteful pork spending that doesn't involve paying benefits for things like food and health care to poor americans. i mean, republicans claim that the federal government is too big and does too much, which implies that it has all kinds of equipment and real estate and people on the payroll. should be easy target shooting.
just stay away from food stamps, welfare, and health care, and this should be an easy exercise.
come on, gentlemen. show me the $1,000 hammers and $500 screws.
More Repubs hatin' on Romney. Why, just three weeks ago he was the greatest thing since sliced bread. I wonder if we'll be seeing him pop up on the Sunday talk shows as much as we see embittered loser Crusty McCain. My guess is no.
This is funny too. Now Mitt is whining about the media and the GOP debates. Narcissistic dude just can't figure out how such a perfect guy as himself could have lost.
I have to say that I think it's pretty craven the way Romney's ex-pals are attacking and second-guessing him now. They had plenty opportunity to do that when he was on the campaign trail and he was saying exactly the same things. So why didn't they?
Guess they're trying to be more like Democrats now, huh? I don't get that. Why would anyone settle for a knock-off when they could have the real thing?
No, imitating the Democrats won't help the Republican Party now, I'm afraid. Clarifying their "jobs" message and taking it to the people will. Dumping Karl Rove will help as well.
In retrospect, I think we can all agree that Romney could have been more careful about what he said. On the other hand, I don't find anything especially shocking, offensive, or even novel in the Talking Points story.
So . . . Democratic voters were bought off with gifts? Yeah. You could say that. I believe it's called politics. Romney had his gifts (tax cuts) and Obama had his (free health care). Big deal.
On the immigration thing, Romney's only mistake was in his use of this term "self-deportation." Clearly, someone in his crew should have been on that. But the concept itself shouldn't be shocking to anyone. The fact is that if you want illegal immigrants to leave the country you have two options: You can have deport them forcibly OR you can create conditions such that they will leave of their own accord. Or in other words, self-deport.
On the other hand, if you're message to illegal immigrants is that they can stay indefinitely, you've got it easy. You can just sit there while Mitt puts his foot in his mouth. But really, isn't doing nothing about immigration just another "gift"? A gift to Latino voters?
Anyway, if Mitt's finally learned to pick a position and stay put, then good for him. I admire him for sticking to his guns. I certainly admire him more than the Bobby Jindals of this world.
If you will permit me a crude analogy, I would say that some in the Republican Party have been acting like eunuchs . . . while Mitt Romney is acting as if he still has at least half a set.
And you know what they say . . .
In the land of the eunuchs, the man with one nut is king.
Have at, dobro. But please be circumcised.
Er . . . I mean circumspect.
no, DBP, they don't want to be Dems. He's being a fool, and showing his true colors. I think that since he ended up their candidate, they had to promote him, and now they are setting the record straight. His statements of the last week show how out of touch he is, from the "gift" statements to the whining. He is a CEO, and just expects things to go his way because he wishes them to. If those around him don't say anything, then it will be assumed that they agree with him. Sometimes you just have to take your lumps, listen to the honesty around you, and get on with life. Sour grapes on his and your part.
"...and he was saying exactly the same things. So why didn't they?"
Well, duh. He was the guy they were stuck with and they wanted to win.
"Clarifying their "jobs" message..."
They don't have a jobs message to clarify. Or any other message besides "tax cuts for the rich-we hate unions and govt workers-self deportation for "illeagles"- and if you get sick, die quickly."
"Mitt Romney is acting as if he still has at least half a set"
Romney is acting like a sore loser, a narcissistic twit that just can't figure out why we didn't all think he was great, even though he has no principles, stands for nothing but Mitt,and is the smarmiest, most unlikeable frat boy creep that has run for President (well, since GWB).
Thankfully, he's one nut that didn't get elected king.
oh, and I agree...Karl Rove needs to go flip burgers or sell insurance , and be told to go jump by anyone in politics. I agree, the people running the country need to get back to work and pass a jobs bill, learn the art of compromise. But Mitt needs a long vacation on some deserted island. The election is over. He lost. Time to move on.
If the GOP are goign to set themselves on the path to a Latino candidate in 4 years to capture the Latino vote like Obama captured the black vote they need to dump Mitt.. plain and simple.
their target audience didn't like him..
truth be told, they didn't much like him either
but they had to field somebody.
Unfortunately this strategy simply reveals how shallow their message is...
your message counts
it's too bad the talking heads haven't figured that out yet.
Listen up some of you left wing rocket scientists. Romney was trashed by many Republicans, before and after this election. You weren't part of the process, other than accusing him of killing women who had cancer and other nasty lies.
But, JoB's last post is correct (for once).
Once Romney was the nominee, most of the people in the Republican party supported him because he would be the man to unseat the Democrat in office.
It didn't happen.
Businesses are now laying off people because the ACA is coming.
Yeah, it has not been fully implemented but companies are taking steps to mitigate and control the costs.
It is my opinion that enough progressives are in power that what should not have been found constitutional, has been. Seriously, if Roberts had decided to follow the constructionist view of the Constitution, the ACA would have been dead. But he did not. He went another way.
What bothers this Republican is that the Federal and many state governments are running huge budget deficits. Now they want essentially an entitlement to be added to a huge budget that borrows 40 cents on every dollar. (If this had been Bush you would be screaming about it every day)
Obama and Reid haven't controlled the rising debt and deficits in the last four years. Do you really believe they are going to keep costs down with a new entitlement ... I mean insurance plan?
Anyway, don't get too cocky. The Democrats always implode at some point.
"Once Romney was the nominee, most of the people in the Republican party supported him because he would be the man to unseat the Democrat in office."
Exactly. They didn't support him because he had any ideas, plans, or vision. He was just "the man to unseat the Democrat". A perfect illustration of the dearth of thinking Repubs. They really thought a "I'm not Obama" campaign was good enough. The American people didn't agree, as shown by an electoral landslide and the largest consecutive majorities a Democrat has won since FDR.
"It is my opinion that enough progressives are in power that what should not have been found constitutional, has been."
Talk about whining. John Roberts is no progressive. In case you forgot, he was placed on the court and elevated to Chief Justice by GW Bush.He found it constitutional because A)it is and B) as chief justice, he didn't want to go down in history as being a cheap political hack and decided to follow the law instead of the politics.
"...a huge budget that borrows 40 cents on every dollar. (If this had been Bush you would be screaming about it every day)"
You need to stop getting your budget info from kootchman. That's a phony figure.And you probably don't remember, but millions of people in the US and around the world were very upset about GWB causing the largest deficits in history by putting two wars off-budget and on the credit card. but I suppose since you weren't paying attention to that yourself, as a lockstep Repub, you figure no one else noticed. you'd be wrong about that.
the CEOs who couldn't sell us Romney are now trying to sell us on cutting entitlements... and 0 corporate tax rates... saying that will stimulate jobs.
The truth is that cutting entitlements will free up the budget for defense which will line their pockets...
So the question becomes..
are you going to buy their story ?
or are you finally going to ask yourself why the people who are benefiting the most from our current economy are calling for austerity from everyone else?
i think it's time Americans started asking why the least among us should pay the highest price for an economic recovery that is only benefiting the few.
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