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1. JanS
   Member Profile

   

   You may remember my reporting a few weeks ago that my car was stolen from a repair shop in early December. The repair shop was Barnecut's on Admiral Way. Until now I have refrained from saying who it was. The day that a police report was filed (12/20/2010), the officer who responded told me in no uncertain terms that the shop's insurance was responsible. Since then I have called the shop no less than 3 times, being told that I would be called back each time, and never getting a call back. I finally spoke with the owner today, and essentially he told me that he was NOT responsible, that he knew what my car was worth, that I couldn't get more than $500 for it. He said that it would be a different story if it was an '08 Lexus, at which point I pointed out that if it was an '08 Lexus he'd be falling all over himself to get this settled, instead of seemingly blowing me off, because my car was a '96 Saturn. (that was blowing white smoke out the back).Yes, my car was uninsured. It had been sitting, parked, until it was repaired, so I didn't need insurance. I was going to reinstate the insurance the day I picked it up from the shop. But...it was stolen from there, and he was (admittedly) negligent for not calling me to pick up the car. He honestly thought, so he says, that I had simply picked up the car, without paying, although he still had the key hanging in his shop.So..it was a couple of weeks between being stolen and being reported stolen.He simply didn't communicate with me.

   I'm not done, but I was so angry with him, that I told him I could no longer speak with him, and I hung up on him.

   I'm also asking for advice...does anyone know what the actual laws are regarding responsibility..or where I could find the information? I don't like getting the run-around here. I have too much going on in my life right now, with failing kidneys, looking forward to a transplant, a myriad of doc appts. , etc. to screw with this.I don't like being told I'm SOL. Mr. Barnecut isn't a rube business man...he knows better than this. I have been more than patient here.

   I am angry that he has taken this attitude,and let him know that I was.

   Posted 1 year ago #         

2. JoB
   Member Profile

   breathe deeply Jan.

   Call the man back and ask him exactly why he thinks it matters whether or not you had insurance.

   the car was not in your possession when it was stolen.
   That is the bottom line... whether the car is an 08 Lexus or a 96 Saturn is immaterial ...
   if it was stolen from his lot it is his responsibility.

   he doesn't get to duck responsibility for this one by assuming that you picked it up without paying him and therefore it isn't his problem.

   It is his problem and that problem may well be compounded by negligence on his part... which could make it an expensive problem.

   He didn't call you to pick up the car...
   He didn't report it missing to either you or the police...
   He didn't file a report with his insurance
   or offer compensation after you called the police to report the theft.
   and.. he is still refusing to do so.

   He is not thinking this one through carefully.

   Posted 1 year ago #         

3. GenHillOne
   Member Profile

   Show me a garage owner, any business owner, that wouldn't have contacted you IMMEDIATELY if he/she thought you, the customer, owed money for services. And that would be totally reasonable and fair. I don't buy for a second that they thought you picked up your broken down car - with a second key, without paying, or telling anyone. I can only believe that it fell through the cracks and was maybe forgotten, because I can't imagine that ignoring the possibility of it being stolen would look like a good decision. It definitely should be covered by their insurance.

   Posted 1 year ago #         

4. KBear
   Member Profile

   I understand the car wasn't insured at the time, but if you do have an insurance agent, maybe they could give you some advice on resolving this.

   Posted 1 year ago #         

5. Irukandji
   Member Profile

   

   I'm checking with the smart one in the family...

   Posted 1 year ago #         

6. brew
   Member Profile

   Did you have a signed workorder with them? If so, I am sure somewhere in it will read that they are not responsible for anything including theft. It may also be posted in the customer area of the shop.

   Posted 1 year ago #         

7. seattle66
   Member Profile

   Try contacting the WA State Department of Revenue, the regulate Bonding and Insurance for business in WA State, they may be able to provide youwith the name of their liability insurance agent/carrier : 1800-647-7706.
   If they have released them self from all liability in thier Work Order form, then in the least you could complain to the State Attorney General Office 1800-551-4636.
   Good Luck.

   Posted 1 year ago #         

8. moxilot
   Member Profile

   Though not in Washington, I found this: http://tinyurl.com/5reyj3r

   And though Jesse Jones (Get Jesse)is taking some time off for medical reasons, I believe they have someone else working their consumer cases. You should consider it: http://tinyurl.com/4rklxqu

   Posted 1 year ago #         

9. redblack
   Member Profile

   

   jan: don't call barnecut back. most likely, it won't benefit you in any way, and he's obviously not going to help you willingly.

   your car's blue book value is none of barnecut's concern, whether it's a ferrari or a datsun. like most people's cars, even the worst beater has far more intrinsic value than its physical worth.

   your insurance doesn't even enter into the equation. his does.

   instead, call a lawyer. if you look in the yellow pages, there are a slew of lawyers that will gladly dispense free legal advice for up to an hour. (i have done this before, and they're happy to help - especially if they think you might retain their services.) at the very least, they'll let you know which direction to proceed. have all of your paperwork in order, know dates and times, and be prepared to give a concise narrative of events. be sure to have the SPD case number handy.

   alternately, you can call northwest women's law center in pioneer square. they give pro bono legal advice, and are especially helpful to people with lesser means.

   http://www.nwwlc.org

   don't deal from a defensive position, and ask a lawyer about compensation for your loss of mobility - which has considerable worth beyond the car's value.

   Posted 1 year ago #         

10. Smitty
    Member Profile

    Why would the shop be liable any more than I would be had you parked it in my driveway?

    Unless you can prove they were negligent or an employee stole it I don't think you have a leg to stand on.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

11. JanS
    Member Profile

    

    smitty...apples/oranges. My fault if I left my car in your driveway. But..when I give my keys over to a repair shop, they are responsible for said vehicle while under their care.

    Negligent? My car disappeared over night, and no one contacted me? Negligent? They "assumed" that I had come in the dead of night and taken my car back?...and said nothing? Negligent? Are you serious? Next time you take your car in for repairs, wherever it is, if it disappears and no one says a peep to you...tell me exactly how that's your fault? And how would you feel if that repair shop , in essence, said to you.."oh, too bad, so sad"....

    Posted 1 year ago #         

12. GenHillOne
    Member Profile

    and Smitty, my guess is that you could care less if people felt comfortable leaving their car in your personal driveway. If I don't think my property is safe (or at least kept track of!) at your establishment, why would I bring it there and give you my business?

    Posted 1 year ago #         

13. charlabob
    Member Profile

    

    BTW, those "we are not responsible for any stupid ass thing we do" disclaimers have been overturned over and over in the courts. These kinds of people count on most folks not fighting back. I'm happy (but not surprised) that Jan isn't choosing to roll over.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

14. JoB
    Member Profile

    the disclaimer on the work order if it exists might not be so valid if jan was not given a copy of it when she left her car...

    Posted 1 year ago #         

15. elikapeka
    Member Profile

    The disclaimer, if there is one, may not be valid in this situation anyway. As Charlabob said, they are often overturned, especially when the business is negligent - and I would think the lack of notification of the missing vehicle may in fact be negligence. The time frame may have hindered the ability to find and recover the vehicle. You might try contacting him one more time, nicely, and explain you will be contacting legal counsel unless he's willing to take some responsibility. The lack of notification may in fact give you grounds for a civil suit, which would cost them more than just having their insurance cover you. Check with an attorney.

    Good luck

    Posted 1 year ago #         

16. JanS
    Member Profile

    

    I was given nothing...I simply dropped my car off the night before my appointment, and my name was added to a list.And I signed nothing.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

17. Smitty
    Member Profile

    The fact that nobody contacted you is a separate issue from your car getting stolen.

    Wish we could get a lawyer on here, but I believe it is called "bailment", or similar.

    Good lighting, keys locked in the shop, etc, then no liability.

    If you can prove they need a fence or something (especially if it has happened before) then you might have a case.

    And what "stupid ass thing" did they actually do that led to the car being stolen cb?

    (JanS - I am not dismissing your claim, just wondering if you really have a case - obviously you should call an attorney).

    Posted 1 year ago #         

18. brew
    Member Profile

    From my experience’s, Smitty is 100% correct.

    I have been to court on more than 1 occasion (4 to be exact) for this exact situation and have prevailed every time.

    It’s not the shops fault that some punk decided to steal a car.

    Btw, repair shops are not required to be bonded or carry insurance. Stupid if they don't, but not required.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

19. JanS
    Member Profile

    

    I am becoming familiar with the term "bailment". It is stated "A common situation that creates voluntary bailment is when a person leaves goods with someone for service (e.g., dry cleaning, pet grooming, car tune-up). The bailee must hold the goods safe for the bailor to reclaim within a reasonable time." That last line is telling. They must hold it safe for me to reclaim it in a reasonable amount of time. They never told me to reclaim it, period. They simply didn't bother to contact me.

    http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-bailment.htm

    Posted 1 year ago #         

20. waterworld
    Member Profile

    

    JanS: I'm so sorry this happened to you. There are a few things I wouldn't do here: I wouldn't call the guy again, I wouldn't look for a lawyer in the phone book, I wouldn't go get an hour of free advice from someone based on a yellow pages ad, and I wouldn't necessarily try to handle it myself. You can go to small claims court without a lawyer, but if you do, I would not rely on things like wisegeek.com. Every state's laws are different, sometimes in small but important ways.

    The King County Bar Association is, I think, one of the best local resources for getting free or low-cost advice. KCBA lists a number of free legal resources here:

    http://www.kcba.org/legalhelp/

    The neighborhood legal clinics are an excellent resource, and if you call the KCBA, they may also have additional free resources for folks with serious health issues.

    Also, both the University of Washington and Seattle University law schools have legal clinics. They are run by seasoned law professors who guide the students through the cases, and they do wonderful work. I don't know which one offers a consumer law clinic, but that's worth looking into.

    If you want a referral to a lawyer who isn't free but who specializes in all things automobiles, lend me your email address and I'll send you his information.

    Good luck, and I hope you get this worked out.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

21. redblack
    Member Profile

    

    yeah! what waterworld said!

    i was also thinking the state AG's office might be a handy, blunt instrument. they, too, have helped me when dealing with negligent business owners.

    smitty: you never know if you have a case - until you have a case. that's why lawyers are so handy to have around.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

22. JoB
    Member Profile

    brew...

    So.. were you negligent in the claims you defended in court?

    In this case the owner told jan that he would be periodically working on her car and never called her to tell her he was done with the car.

    He also noticed at some point that the car was no longer on his lot and didn't notify either Jan or the police.

    I suspect that qualifies as legal negligence...

    and even if it doesn't...
    the bad press he is getting over this isn't worth the price of that car.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

23. brew
    Member Profile

    JoB,

    No, I was not negligent. As a business owner, I cannot control what some scum bag may do to/on my property after business hours. Sure, we try to take every precaution by keeping vehicles inside, adding deterrents such as CCTV, signs, etc. and make sure everything is secured the best it can be. I would be negligent if I left the keys in the vehicle, left the building unsecure or anything else that would “cause or enable” a thief to steal the vehicle.

    Believe me, there is nothing that sucks more than having to call a customer and telling them their car has been stolen, broken into, and/or vandalized.

    Granted, the owner was probably negligent in the way he handled the situation after the fact. But there is nothing to indicate he was negligent in the actual theft of the vehicle. I do not agree with the way he handled the situation and he definitely didn’t handle it the way I would of, but that’s up to his own discretion.

    It is not unheard of for customers to pick their vehicles up before/after hours without notifying the shop, especially a small local shop.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

24. JoB
    Member Profile

    brew...

    "Believe me, there is nothing that sucks more than having to call a customer and telling them their car has been stolen, broken into, and/or vandalized."

    but you do believe it is your responsibility to make that call when your customer's car is in your care.

    Therein lies the real problem here...
    they didn't make that call at all.

    "It is not unheard of for customers to pick their vehicles up before/after hours without notifying the shop, especially a small local shop."

    Ok.. so let's say the owner believed that Jan had picked up her car.

    Isn't it kind of strange that the shop neglected to call to confirm that she had picked up the car and at least attempt to collect the bill?

    Small businesses are built on trust

    I have to tell you that as a customer...
    i wouldn't find that acceptable business practice...
    nor would i do business with anyone who did.

    When i hand over my keys to my local mechanic
    i want to believe that they are going to take care of my car as though it was their own
    and treat me with the respect due a paying customer

    Posted 1 year ago #         

25. hooper1961
    Member Profile

    i have had my car serviced at barnecutt's and have been very satisfied with the service.

    it appears that communication should have been improved by all parties.

    a 96 saturn blowing white smoke out the tail pipe per jans, sounds like a major repair item not worth the expense for such an old vehicle.

    hopefully the party's can reach an amicable solution.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

26. lucky chick
    Member Profile

    Who are you to judge what's worth repairing or not to someone else? And I'll venture a guess that you have no idea what white smoke coming out of a '96 Saturn means. That said, I wish people would drive NOT around in exhaust-spewing cars.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

27. JoB
    Member Profile

    if the car was still smoking
    the thieves who stole this one should have been easy to spot.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

28. hooper1961
    Member Profile

    luckychick i think you meant to say you wished people would not drive around in exhaust spewing cars, i agree and would support an environmental citation RCW so that the polluters could be cited accordingly.

    i am not judging anything - if the cost to repair an old vehicle exceeds the vehicles value most people would cede that it is not worth repairing.

    job its been to rainy to spot the exhaust

    Posted 1 year ago #         

29. lucky chick
    Member Profile

    ew, I hate typos - especially when they change my meaning 180 degrees! Edited!

    Posted 1 year ago #         

30. JoB
    Member Profile

    hooper1961
    trust me it wasn't too rainy when that car was went missing to spot the exhaust the mechanic reported was coming out of her tailpipe...
    btw.. that was after he had "diagnosed the problem" and repaired it.
    i saw what that exhaust looked like before it went into the shop to have a gasket replaced.
    if i had been the thief i would have ditched that car in the first block...
    if it was still smoking... it was a cop magnet.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

31. hooper1961
    Member Profile

    job so the car was spewing donuts (kidding). it probably is ditched on some back alley somewhere.

    at my old house we commonly found parked stolen vehicles in the alley.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

32. JanS
    Member Profile

    

    well, I wish someone would find it...I liked the umbrella in the back seat...

    Posted 1 year ago #         

33. JoB
    Member Profile

    i wish someone would find it too...

    Posted 1 year ago #         

34. Diana
    Member Profile

    It's really too bad that we have heard only one side of this story. Barnecutt's is a reputable business and perhaps they will respond. I've entrusted my vehicles to them for over twenty years as have my employees, friends, and neighbors. I'll continue to do so. JanS...sure hope you get your car back and if/when you do insure it!

    Posted 1 year ago #         

35. JanS
    Member Profile

    

    My car had not been driven in some time. It was parked in an off street parking spot. I was ging to reinstate the insurance before I went to the station to pick it up...I never got the chance to do that.What I'm particularly angry about is the fact that they never called me...not to tell me my car was ready, and when it disappeared, they didn't question it, nor call me then. They simply ignored it..simply assumed that I would go down there in the dead of night with a spare key, and take my car without paying for the repairs he had done. I don't operate that way. And then, when I found out it had been stolen, WEEKS before, filed a report, told that he wold check his cameras, I heard nothing AGAIN. I left messages, was told someone wold call me back, but they never did. Then the owner went on vacation. I finally spoke with him after he returned, and was politely told it wasn't his responsibility. Now how am I supposed to feel? The comment of his that it would be a different story if it was an '08 Lexus frosted me. It doesn't matter what kind of car it was...one doesn't make one more special because of it.And I should have been contacted the minute it was done being worked on. And definitely as soon as it disappeared from the premises.

    I realize that they have been there a long time, and I have always felt in the past that they did good work, were fair. Many people do. But..put yourself in my place. I definitely got a run around. And I'm wondering why. It isn't up to them to decide which car is worth it and which isn't...we're all equal. And for the record..he had completed what I had asked him to do in a timely fashion, and had reported to me that it was running just fine...except for the smoke that it was blowing...and he wanted to try sme stuff. I gave my OK on the phone...and never heard another peep from him. So...I had a car that, although was somewhat polluting, was running...well, he said. It should have then been my decision to pick up the car and do with it what I wanted...to decide whether it was fixable or not..not his.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

36. hooper1961
    Member Profile

    you admit the car was polluting, do you think it is appropriate to drive a car that you know is polluting?

    Posted 1 year ago #         

37. moxilot
    Member Profile

    hooper, that's not the point.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

38. JoB
    Member Profile

    Posting deleted by red faced poster

    Posted 1 year ago #         

39. Cait
    Member Profile

    

    I really hate to see Barnecuts get a bad rap for anything, they've been so great to me in the past. I really hope this gets resolved, Jan. It sounds like a nasty situation for everybody. :(

    In the meantime if you need evening and weekend transpo, you know where to find me :)

    Posted 1 year ago #         

40. JoB
    Member Profile

    Hooper 1961..
    For the record..
    The car was driven one block to the mechanic after it became a polluting vehicle.
    That is the problem that as far as she knew was still being diagnosed and fixed when she called to find it had already been missing for two weeks.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

41. dhg
    Member Profile

    

    I recommend calling Peter Maier: 623-2800.

    He's been ranked as a top attorney in Seattle magazines, he's a specialist about lemon laws, he sits on the school board and he's not the kind of attorney who has to charge you for all the fine woodwork and Persian carpets (there's none). He'll be able to steer you in the right direction.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

42. waterworld
    Member Profile

    

    Hooper: In addition to what moxilot said, I don't see how any of us could know whehter the car was "polluting." White exhaust does not necessarily mean additional "pollutants" in the emissions.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

43. brew
    Member Profile

    Typically, white smoke coming from the exhaust is just steam caused by a blown head gasket and/or a cracked head.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

44. JanS
    Member Profile

    

    fwiw...my car has always passed emissions tests stellarly...so..polluting? Technically, don't all cars pollute, if you will? Except maybe electric cars...so..instead of jumping down my throat, let's give me the benefit of the doubt instead of the repair shop, who didn't diligently keep in touch with their customer. Not one phone call...I made the calls each and every time. When my car went missing, they didn't think to maybe contact me to at least inquire if I had taken it? They just assumed? oh, please. Also...it had been sitting in my parking space with a dead battery...no chance of it being stolen then...and I drove it exactly 1/2 block down an alley to the repair shop which is just down the street from me. I love how you all jump on the "victim" here...like Barnecut's can do no wrong. Well, I was treated shabbily as a customer, and you all know very well, that you'd be a little ticked off, too.It was not their decision to make whether I drove it in that condition, or it was expendable...that should have been my decision.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

45. JanS
    Member Profile

    

    dhg...thank you

    Posted 1 year ago #         

46. miws
    Member Profile

    

    Jan if, by some chance, you get your car back, and it's not trashed, or, you are able to get a used car, please be sure that the Herr Hooper Pollution Control Agency sticker, that verifies the car has passed inspection, is prominently displayed.

    We'll be watching you.

    Mike

    Posted 1 year ago #         

47. JanS
    Member Profile

    

    thanks for the advice, Mike. I'm realizing that perfection is illusive, at least for myself.....sigh ;-) Guess some people are more perfect than others....

    Posted 1 year ago #         

48. JoB
    Member Profile

    or perhaps...

    some people only expect others to be perfect

    Posted 1 year ago #         

49. ws4ever
    Member Profile

    Jan S,
    Sorry that some respondents can't resist being crass. I hope your car is found AND/OR THAT BARNECUT'S DOES THE RIGHT THING. People here in West Seattle are just so old-fashioned and stuck on doing the right thing. :) Thanks for speaking up.

    Posted 1 year ago #         

50. JanS
    Member Profile

    

    ws4ever...it's been gone for a month now...I'd like it found, too...that would solve a world of things...

    Posted 1 year ago #         

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