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Pathetic playground

Started 3 years ago by Jeannie
Latest reply from JoB

Jeannie
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I see that that the parks department has finally installed a new swing set at Lowman Beach. But what a disappointment! The swing set sits in the middle of a big rectangle filled with wood chips, which create a rather pleasant smell of clean guinea-pig cage. But what's with the swings? The geniuses installed just two: one for tots, and one for everyone else. Didn't they have enough money to install a couple more? The stupidity confounds me.

Posted 3 years ago #
Anonymous
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Contribute some money so it gets done right in your opinion.

Posted 3 years ago #
Bonnie
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I don't know why they keep taking the 'good swings' out and putting the pathetic little swings in. Maybe because of liability? Don't know, but it's pretty stupid.

Posted 3 years ago #
WSB
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We reported on that here:
http://westseattleblog.com/blog/?p=11193
and later learned that it's been happening in other areas of the city too, with "safety" as the bottom line (note the Parks quote in that post).
Re: number of signs, as I'm sure you recall, that's all they had before - one "regular," one toddler.
We personally were disappointed because we walked there all the time and often used the old swing set - if there had been any warning it was to be replaced, we would have made sure to get in a few last trips.

Posted 3 years ago #
mom2soren
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Safety?? I don't get it. North Seattle has several large playground sets, with beautiful climbing structures, slides, and multiple swings. With more swings, more children will use the set. With more children/parents in a park, the park is safer to visit (in contrast, areas with pathetic playgrounds are not well-used & can become hangouts for hoodlums). Also, beautiful parks and play structures make the area more family friendly & a desirable place to live. This increases property values. It makes sense for the whole community to invest in better playgrounds, not just those with children.

Posted 3 years ago #
bebecat
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The Parks Dept. is very low on funds. Nearly unable to maintain the parks they have. Also , not everyone feels that large play fields are an asset to a neighborhood or nice to look at. They are necessary yes, but they are noisy and do not inflate property values unless the neighborhood is so at risk that any improvement helps. So hats off to the Seattle Parks Dept for not impacting the noise level and character of the neighborhood.

Posted 3 years ago #
Jeannie
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Bebecat: For heaven's sake, I'm talking about adding one or two more swings, not creating a soccer field/Disneyland/football stadium. The actual square that the swing set is in is quite large; there would have been room for another swing or two. Hardly disrupts the character of the neighborhood. Or don't you like the sound of little children laughing and playing on swings?

Oh, as for Scott B., sorry, I personally don't have the money to fund another swing. I do pay taxes, though. Your comment was unnecessary as well as illogical. But I will contact the parks dept. Bonnie and mom2soren, you made some excellent points.

Posted 3 years ago #
Duckitude
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Hi All: I live on the southeast corner of Lowman Beach Park and I have tried and tried and tried to keep up communication with the parks dept. through at least two of their local officials. I won't name names right now.

Essentially, Seattle Parks is pretty chaotic as far as I can tell and I have given up on them, more or less, after many tries at keeping communication open. Unless you inquire constantly, they don't communicate or attempt to survey opinion in advance. I tried to get an "official" Friends of Lowman Beach Park started, but when I did, it became apparent that it would have no real voice or vote... just a toy.

However, parks has been responsive on a couple of very important issues, on a very immediate basis. On one occassion, they showed up unannounced and unexpectedly to install a fence on the ocean wall based on the "complaint" of one visitor to the park who felt it was dangerous not to have a fence on the breakwall. They responded to my plea NOT to destroy the ambience of the park by putting a crude ranch-style wooden fence along the breakwall. Fact of the matter was a fence built that way would have ATTRACTED sitters and possibly more danger than the way it was without a fence. They stopped the construction of the fence within two hours and never tried again.

Same problem with the new swing set. As far as I can tell, it is a "make work" project that wasted valuable time, materials, and money to produce what I would call a "wash." Just as "dangerous" as the previous installation (now, you can fall on concrete while playing in the area -- wood chips as deep as they are in that pit make for a surface that is conducive to slipping and tripping). Lots of visitors at night since the park has hours that go to 11:30 p.m. -- easy to fall into the pit if you can't see that there is one there. I expect some twisted ankles and broken parts in the near future from people not noticing the step-down at night. Or the step up. Oh, and I forgot to mention how attractive wood chips are to dogs for you know, marking and such. If I had a kid, they wouldn't be playing in that area, honestly. Chips? What's next dog litter?

I have been asking parks to use their money wisely, and for safety and security, to install a solar-powered motion detector light in the northeast corner of the tennis court there that shines down on the tennis court to discourage partying in the park after 11:30 p.m. No result, whatsoever. They would rather spend money on a useless "upgrade" of the swing set than something that would actually contribute to safety and security in the neighborhood.

That's parks... I can't get used to it, but I can't change it either. It takes huge efforts to get parks on board on anything that a neighborhood really needs, because, as far as I can tell, they don't know how to give the community a voice (we seem to be just a bother to them).

If they were going to change the character of the park, which the new play area did, they should have at least gathered some opinions from the users of the park PRIOR to the work. That is too much work for them. Got money? Spend it now or forever hold your peace...

As for more swings and such... I agree with Jeannie. The work they did to produce the "safer" result was rather extensive and expensive. Less concrete and more swings or such would have been possible, and more neighborhood friendly than what they did.

Believe me, noise levels from people in the park, including children, is far less than noise levels from certain animal forms... but that is a whole other rant.

Sorry for the rant. But, you got me going on that one. Take care, Ron

Posted 3 years ago #
Jeannie
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Ron, you are my hero! And I love your rubber ducks. They always bring a smile when I walk past. You are absolutely right about the parks department. What does it say about our government when it simply ignores common sense and logic? At least you did get results re the "fence to nowhere," and I thank you for that.

Posted 3 years ago #
Anonymous
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Jeannie wrote:
"Oh, as for Scott B., sorry, I personally don't have the money to fund another swing. I do pay taxes, though. Your comment was unnecessary as well as illogical. But I will contact the parks dept."

Jeannie,

Of course my comment was unnecessary. This entire thread that you started regarding a swing set is also unnecessary. Look up the definition of necessities.

You said my comment was illogical.

You want more than the Seattle Parks and Recreation Department has provided. I suggested that you contribute funds to pay for improvements that you desire, and it seems likely to me that your contributions would be acknowledged.

I suspect the Seattle Parks and Recreation Department would quickly make fully-funded improvements in addition to their limited capabilities provided by taxpayers.

You admit that you can't fund improvements, so quit complaining about how little the taxpayers are providing for you. We all pay taxes. Most of us don't complain that we are not getting more than our fair share.

Posted 3 years ago #
Gina
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Probably someone was injured playing "bumper swings" and the parents sued, so every swing set must make sure that there can be no possible contact between the swingers. And the bigger and higher swingsets allowed for very high swinging. And someone fell off and was injured.
May not have been here in Seattle that the injuries occured, but look at all the playground equipment in the Seattle Parks and Seattle Public Schools that has been tagged dangerous and removed. Because of the risk of injury.

No bars for children to twirl on. No rings for children to swing from. No climbers made of metal, not even with chips or sand beneath them.

I think the cause of the tiny swings is liability.

Posted 3 years ago #
Jeannie
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Hmmm...I think one of the posters doth protest too much. Or works for the city government. Or lacks a sense of humor. Or all of the above. Remind me to make a donation to the City of Seattle next year - I'll skip less-worthy causes like the American Cancer Society, the Nature Conservancy, Children's Hospital, Mercy Corps, the Humane Society, Doctors Without Borders, or whatever. Sheesh.

Posted 3 years ago #
Jeannie
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P.S. Of course, I voted for the Pro Parks Levy. And I will continue to do so. That's my donation, Scott!

Posted 3 years ago #
Anonymous
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Jeannie,

Please re-read your initial article in this thread.

Posted 3 years ago #
JanS
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Duckitude, welcome. I love your duckies. Nice to see you on here.

I do not live near Lowman Beach, not my 'hood, but I understand the rant about the swings, etc. It seems that everything re: "safety first" is taken to the highest form these days. We are such a litigious society; people will sue about almost anything. Totally a shame...

Posted 3 years ago #
JanS
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Scott ...ya need some happy pills ;-)

Posted 3 years ago #
Anonymous
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JanS,

ya need some keep-your-unsolicited-advice-to-yourself pills :)

Posted 3 years ago #
JanS
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lolol..touche....

Posted 3 years ago #
mom2soren
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Ok, so why is it that parks in North Seattle do not have the same 2-swing set-up? Why is it different in West Seattle? Just wanna know.

Posted 3 years ago #
rockhills
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Time to jump on my soapbox. I hate the limitations that liability concerns have placed on our kids. I don't think we're doing our children or ourselves a service by trying to eliminate all possible risk--an impossible task anyway.

Isn't it amazing that we all somehow managed to survive the hazards of childhood? If our parents were concerned about our ability to use playground equipment safely, they supervised us. And if we pinched a finger or scraped a knee or even broke an arm, it was a shame. They patched us up, gave us a hug, and we learned to be more careful and use a little more common sense.

Posted 3 years ago #
angelescrest
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We love this park. I haven't seen the swing redo, but we love the peacefulness of this park just as it is. Yep, cruddy tennis courts worked for us, while the littlest one played on the swing or sat under that beautiful shady tree. C'mon, the views are tremendous, the tidepools rock, cool to see the kayakers, and splendid dog-watching. I have thought it perfect; I know where to go if we want a playground.

Posted 3 years ago #
glocson
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Can you help me find my puppy? I'll give you some candy, I think he's over by the bushes...

Posted 3 years ago #
angelescrest
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Glocson, I don't know what you meant by that, but that's every parent's nightmare, if I read it correctly.

Posted 3 years ago #
Crowe
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Thank you rockhills. My eight year old can hardly swing on the new"big" swing. Very lame. We used to have so much fun "flying" over the water and mountains on the old swing. The fun is gone, at least for 8 year olds and older. We still love the little park how ever and are very thankful that we live so close to such a beautiful area.

Posted 3 years ago #
Jill
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rockhills, you remind me of that episode of King of the Hill (repeated just last week!), where a new family moves into Arlen, the Dad convinces Hank to reinstate the Arlen chapter of the Straight-Arrow-something-scout-like-thingie. And new guy ends up being the equivalent of the new swing set at Lowman Beach, trying to "protect" the kids from themselves. Ugh.
(glocson, that's just so wrong, lol!)

Posted 3 years ago #
RainyDay1235
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We are downright spoiled in High Point - we have 3 huge playground installations within 3 blocks of our house. Come on over!

Posted 3 years ago #
Jeannie
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Hey, I received a lengthy response from the Parks Dept. If you would like to read it, I put it at end of this post. My own thoughts:
1. It's very kind of the family to donate the funds for the swings in memory of their infant. My deepest condolences on their loss.
2. I'm glad the Parks Dept. took environmental concerns into consideration. We definitely wouldn't want to tear the roots of the beautiful tree or have the swingset closer to the peaceful waterfront area.
3. HOWEVER, I am a bit tired of the nanny state our society has become. How did EVER survive our childhood without all those governmental rules and regulations???
Here's the email:
"Thank you for your letter regarding the Lowman Beach swings. The new swing set, including construction, was donated by a family who wanted to honor one of their twins whom they lost from complications due premature birth. We were pleased to receive this donation as it allowed us to replace the old swing set which was out of compliance with safety standards. The new swing set meets all current Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC), American Society of Testing and Materials (ASTM) public play area safety standards as well as the 2005 Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA) requirements for public play areas. The critical elements needed to meet those requirements are a 32-feet-by-32-feet clear area with a minimum one-foot-deep manufactured wood chip safety surfacing, which is certified to meet fall attenuation safety standards as well as wheelchair accessibility requirements.

We only replaced the existing two swings in the existing location because we considered that two swings are adequate for the park and would have no negative impact on existing park elements. Adding two more swings would have required us to remove a much larger lawn area. Lowman Beach is a small shoreline park, where the swing set is bounded by tree roots on one side and large underground sewer vaults on the other side. The tree roots and sewer vaults also dictated the elevations of the play area curbing and safety surfacing. The only other possible location would be closer to the shoreline, and that seems inappropriate. The existing location also has the advantage of being clearly visible from the street."

Posted 3 years ago #
mom2soren
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Actually, it seems to me like they really considered the issue & made the best decision possible for the space. They sound like real professionals, and now I feel guilty about any criticism.

Posted 3 years ago #
Jeannie
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Mom2soren, no one should feel guilty about this. I was truly impressed with their fair and well-reasoned response, but I still say we're living in a nanny society. I mean, what are we going to do about all the "unsafe" playgrounds that have - heaven forbid - LESS than the "minimum one-foot-deep manufactured wood chip safety surfacing"? Regardless, I guess we can consider this a case-closed.

Posted 3 years ago #
Anonymous
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Jeannie,

Thank you for publishing the email you received from the Seattle Parks and Recreation Department.

I do not work for the City of Seattle. I still think you could benefit from re-reading your initial post to this thread.

Posted 3 years ago #
angelescrest
Member Profile

The site is a true gift regardless of play apparati. Just imagine if there were houses there (it's beautiful real estate!). I always think we're lucky to have this little haven.

Posted 3 years ago #
flowerpetal
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Perhaps it does feel like a "nanny state." I suppose it feels that way to people who talk on cell phones while driving too. I'm glad that those of us reading this did survive our childhood and our play time at parks with swings, teeter totters and merry go rounds. There are too many children who did not; and I know some of those stories. They are not pretty, and their families will never forget.
I know the ASTM requirements very well and had hoped to get out to this park to take a look with that knowledge at hand. I'm glad the City used them; and used them correctly. If you need to know about tragic endings for children on play gournd equipment, PM me.

Posted 3 years ago #
JoB
Member Profile

ScottB..

you ought to drive over and take a look at what was done at Lowman beach park.. i did today.

most back yards have better swing sets...

if you are going to take your kids there to swing you better be pretty tall and pretty strong to lift them into those swings... the lowest looks about seat height for me and i am an average sized grown woman.

the pad for the swings is cut into a slope and i suspect one of these days they are going to have to put some kind of barrier along the top because one or more of those who use the park as an after hours party pad will trip and hurt themselves in the dark...

on the positive side, it is right in the middle of the grassy area where people used to throw balls and Frisbees for their unleashed dogs.

In fact, it may have been situated such that between the children's play area, the tennis court and the beach... a strict interpretation of park rules would prohibit even leashed dogs from entering the park...

someone will have to get out a tape measure.

Posted 3 years ago #