WSB Forum » Open Discussion

(48 posts)

Everybody poops, including dogs...

  • Started 2 years ago by Pug Daddy
  • Latest reply from LukesDogWalker

  1. Pug Daddy
    Member Profile

    Lately I've been hearing a lot about dog owners out on walks being harassed by homeowners regarding picking up after their dogs.

    This morning I got that experience firsthand walking my dogs near the corner of Marine View Drive SW and SW Ocean View Drive in the Oceanview neighborhood of West Seattle. While I see my fair share of unattended dog messes in the street, I don’t think anyone should be harassed and subjected to misdirected hostility and certainly not pet owners making an obvious effort to pick up after their dogs.

    I've been walking down that stretch of street a few times a day since I moved to the Oceanview neighborhood a few months ago. I want to mention that it's a great neighborhood full of friendly and kind people always ready to say hi and chat you up in the street and ask to pet your pooches. Great place to live!

    So you can imagine my surprise when this morning with dogging poo bag in hand ready to swoop in and clean it up when the owner of the house pulls out in his U-Haul truck into the middle of the street into the oncoming lane to order me to pick up after my dog, and I do mean order me. I assured him that I always make an effort to pick up after my dogs in an attempt to reason with him and then proceeded to pick it up. I was then subject to his angry ranting and accusations about all of the poo in his yard as if I had something to do with that and unreasonable suggestions including where I could and couldn't walk on his stretch of the street and a less than generous invitation to stay on the street I live on and away from his house...apparently he owns all of the property in front of his house up to the yellow line. As if this wasn't bad enough, twice during the confrontation he began to get out of the truck (while it was still parked in the middle of the street) at which point I demanded he stay in his vehicle. Suffice it to say I thought it was out of character for my neighborhood and completely out of control.

    So in an attempt to keep fellow dog owners apprised of their rights and the law. Below is the Seattle Municipal Code and website stating the restrictions and laws around dogs and pooping in public and private areas.

    Enjoy and be safe.

    http://clerk.ci.seattle.wa.us/~scripts/nph-brs.exe?d=CODE&s1=9.25.082.snum.&Sect5=CODE1&Sect6=HITOFF&l=20&p=1&u=/~public/code1.htm&r=1&f=G
    SMC 9.25.082 Offenses relating to safety and sanitation.

    It is unlawful for an owner to:

    A. Allow the accumulation of animal feces in any open area, run, cage or yard wherein animals are kept and to fail to remove or dispose of feces at least once every twenty-four (24) hours;

    B. Fail to remove the fecal matter deposited by his/her animal on public property or private property of another before the owner leaves the immediate area where the fecal matter was deposited;

    C. Fail to have in his/her possession the equipment necessary to remove his/her animal's fecal matter when accompanied by said animal on public property or public easement;

    D. Have possession or control of any animal sick or afflicted with any infectious or contagious disease and fail to provide treatment for such infection or disease, or suffer or permit such diseased or infected animal to run at large, or come in contact with other animals, or drink at any public or common watering trough or stream accessible to other animals.

    Owners of service dogs shall be exempted from subsections B and C of this section.

    (Ord. 119998 Section 21, 2000; Ord. 116694 Section 8, 1993; Ord. 112335 Section 1(part), 1985.)

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  2. I would have given the guy a one finger salute!! Next time, bring a video camera and film the guy and post it on YouTube

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  3. biankat
    Member Profile

    biankat

    What a horrible experience. I'm sorry you've had to be subject to this man's unwarranted ranting. Perhaps he was having a bad day? I, too, live on Ocean View and love to see the pups parade by with their humans. If I see you out with your pug(s) I'll say 'hey' :)

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  4. Same thing happened to me last year. Super mean old cranky guy chased me down the road when he thought my dog was going to poop on the landscaping in front of his condo. It was right in front of the gray condo complex kind of near Westwater on California (I think he is the manager). He started yelling at me about his landscaping costs and kept following me down the road in his car. He was also yelling at his wife to get out of the car to confront me. For the record, said doggy did not poo on his landscaping but was taking a breather. My infant daughter was scared and so was I. I cross the street now.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  5. When we lived in the Belvedire neighborhood I had a cranky old woman yell at me about my dog pooping in her front yard. He was only peeing at the time, so it would have been extremely difficult for me to pick it up. Every time I would walk past her house after that I would wave my (full) poop bag at her!

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  6. Hey, don't let the crank win! A lot of dog owners read this forum. Wouldn't Ocean View be a nice neighborhood to add to your regular rounds? (With leashes and poo bags, of course.)

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  7. Had the same experience years back walking down Genesee Hill to Alki. Old geezer on his front lawn started yelling at me to pick up after my *#@!! dog and as soon as he (the dog) finished I whipped out my poop bag and said in a very loud voice "I always do sir, would you like to come down here and inspect?" Pan to shot of Geezer re-entering his home (tail tucked between his legs).

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  8. I agree with KBear, post the address, Carson needs a walk soon and he just has that look in his eye!!!

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  9. I'll bet he thinks he owns the street parking in front of his house, too.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  10. I make an effort to make sure Carson doesn't do his business (number 1 or number 2) on the lawns where they obviously take pride and put work into them. It happens and I always clean up after him. I even make sure I walk him (on my left side) so he is always on the city property and not private property. But still, if you live in the city, and on a major artery, you have to accept it happens (dogs mess up, owners clean up that is).

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  11. anonyme
    Member Profile

    I've been yelled at as my female dog squatted for a quick pee by a fire hydrant. A pedestrian shouted "Why don't you clean up after your dog?!!" I have noticed that more people are making unfounded accusations of this nature. As I am fanatical about cleaning up after my dog, always have at least 3 bags with me, I don't appreciate being attacked for something I didn't do (or should I say, allow).

    However, I do think I understand where some of this anger is coming from. I don't think it's ethical (don't know about legal) to allow your dog to wander on to private property - as in someone else's yard - to do their business, whether you pick it up or not. To me, that is a form of trespassing; not all property lines are fenced. I can fully understand a homeowner not wanting pee spots or poo residue on their lawns. Most dog owners also disregard the restriction on extendable leashes, which makes this activity possible in the first place. Within Seattle City limits you are required to use a non-extendable leash no more than 6ft. long.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  12. The service dog exemption is interesting.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  13. luckymom30
    Member Profile

    I was a dog owner for almost 16 years and can remember one guy coming out of his house to yell at me because my dog was peeing on his yard. If it had been poop I would have used one of the bags I had to clean it up, but urine?

    I appreciate responsibile dog owners who walk past the house and clean up after their dog, I do not appreciate it when an owner does not clean up and that is when I will tell them hey, I have bags here so you can clean that mess up.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  14. I see dook in the middle of the sidewalk on my street on a fairly regular basis. I usually assume it's from a dog, but there are kids on this block too.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  15. ...and most of 'em off leash!

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  16. flowerpetal
    Member Profile

    flowerpetal

    Most people I know who have service dogs are very conscientious. A service dog will not poop while on duty. It is released from work for a few minutes to do its business. And, service dogs poop on command (if they have poop to produce!).
    People with service dogs make arrangements to get dog poop picked up if they are unable to do so themselvs and circumstances are normal. I'm sure there is that rare ocassion when people with a service dog have to give there dog a five minute poop break away from their normal routine. I imagine this happens infrequently.
    Service Dog Academy can tell us more! ;-)

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  17. yes, most service dogs are trained to go on command. going to the bathroom while "on duty" isnt appropriate and that is why we do everything in our power to empty our dogs BEFORE we go anywhere. i also teach my students to go on multiple surfaces. if you ever been stuck in an airport for lay overs with no grass around, your dog needs to be able to go on concrete whether they like it or not.

    when the vest comes off and they are "off duty", they can perform when they desire. i try to make sure though that there is no cocking of legs even off duty, it just looks tacky and i dont want my dog to get in the habit of doing it.

    its soooooo nice to have a dog that goes on command. it great if you ever have to leave for an extended period of time and your dog is refusing to go. all you have to do is say the magic word and they do it. i wonder if the dog thinks, "OMG! How did you know I had to go?!?!?"

    Happy Tails To You!
    Mary McNeight, BGS, CCS
    Service Dog Academy, Seattle WA
    Owner/Head Trainer
    http://www.servicedogacademy.com
    mary@servicedogacademy.com
    206-355-9033

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  18. flowerpetal
    Member Profile

    flowerpetal

    I used to have a retired greyhound, who I think would go potty on command; at least it seemed that way. I always surmised that this was due to his travels in a crate from one track to another. We now have a retired service dog and we never did the poop on command thing with her. So, if she had it, she probably has lost it.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  19. Carson goes on command, more or less, I thought it was pretty neat when we first got him, I had never seen that before. Great at night time and before road trips

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  20. anonyme
    Member Profile

    My greyhound goes at least 6 times per day. I'm guessing this is due to reduced storage capacity (tiny waist). She does hold it all day while crated. On command would be great!

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  21. There was a report on the WSB from someone who was assaulted at the west end of Charlestown ST about a year ago by a homeowner. Watch your back if you are in this area as well.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  22. a little suggestion...maybe the OP and other doggie owners could have a "meet-up" of sorts...get together to exercise the pups. Maybe somewhere between 5 and 10 of you...and go by this guy's house, very civilly. There's safety in numbers :)

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  23. I don’t intend to derail this discussion, but one of the things that jumped out at me were the references to age throughout this thread (“cranky old geezer” is the most blatent). Just wanted to raise a little awareness that "old" is relative...

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  24. homedk, not all older men are cranky geezers, but all cranky geezers are old men....

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  25. bebecat
    Member Profile

    I lived on Beach Drive for 10yrs. Many folks walked their dogs down the alley behind our building. Every dog seemed to like to hike it's leg on the corner of our landscaping. That corner was mushy stink and the plantings brown and dying. It is offensive to look out your window and see a dog on a leash noising around your yard looking for a place to potty. Private property is just that "private" and the problem with the lack of respect for that is where the problem lies. To read here of a planned gathering to parade in front of someones house who was only concerned for his private property makes me wonder what kind of bounderies people today have. I am offended when I look out my window where I live today and see the local Daycare providers sitting on our private bulkhead with a boatload of children that will grow up watching this lack of respect for private property.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  26. Bebecat, I don't think anyone planned anything on any Private Property. You don't own those few feet between the sidewalk and the street. As a matter of fact, you don't own the 3 feet on YOUR side of the sidewalk on most city plots as well. I am not sure I would condone a massive poop in, but nothing wrong with a little dog parade.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  27. bebecat
    Member Profile

    I will admit I thought we owned the strip between the street and sidewalk when I was growing up, as my parents lovingly care for the strip the same way they did our yard. I learned otherwise as an adult. I was also taught to not walk on or ride my bike on neighbors "strips". Drive ways "yes" strips "no". To this day I am compelled to respect other peoples property. I care for my own and respect others. As for the dog parade?... I will not ask the motivation.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  28. bebecat, really? You think by allowing my dog to walk on your parking strip I am dis-respecting the property owner? Riding my bike perhaps. Me walking on, no. My dog walking on, no. Some people are just not meant to be city dwellers for sure.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  29. flowerpetal
    Member Profile

    flowerpetal

    I agree that my dog peeing and/or pooping on a parking strip is not disrespectful if it is cleaned and it appears that the OP cleans up after his dog. But if a parade of ten dogs were to pass by and one pee'd I am guessing nine more would pee too. Its what dogs do.
    I don't get how a gathering of ten dog walkers would bring peace to the neighborhood; and would likely only escalate the bad vibes. I don't want to make someone (even a cranky geezer) feel worse. I wouldn't be unreasonable and cross the street either; but a parade of ten dogs and walkers changes nothing.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  30. Flowerpetal, you are right. But if someone were to yell at me when I am in fact doing nothing wrong, I would tend to do it more and more. But thats just me, I don't take intimidation and thgreats well. It helps that I never go anywhere without my tough as nails Wheaten!!

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  31. bebecat
    Member Profile

    No Carson I am not thinking you are being dis-respectful by using the parking strip, as I said I am an adult now and understand the legal bounderies. My friend has a raised garden bed on her parking strip. Nice spinach and such. Now a dog pottying on the garden may be legal "yes" but cool "no". I am just saying we as a people will never all view things the same way. And as for the "not meant to be city dwellers" I was born in Seattle when it was a small town. Many of the 'old geezers"?, this is our hometown, we didn't know it would grow this big. It can be a bit stressful at times.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  32. "I was born in Seattle when it was a small town"

    Wow, you must be over 100 years old! Even in 1910, there were over 200,000 people living in Seattle. Not exactly a small town even by today's standards.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  33. KBear..

    in the 50's Seattle looked and acted like a small town... in fact.. it still did when i first visited in the late 60s.. and to some of the old timers here it still is:)

    You may not have been familiar to the folks on the other side of the bay not that long ago.. but i am guessing you couldn't do much in West Seattle without all of your neighbors knowing and commenting.

    like bebecat i miss the days when kids and adults alike were expected to have some respect for others...

    you can call those property rights if you want.. but i think they had more to do with treating others and their homes the way you would want yours to be treated.

    now there seems to be a mixed message when it comes to personal rights..
    on the one hand, most people seem to think others should respect their rights no matter where they are... and... they think their rights trump all others even at someone else's home.

    it really isn't all about us some days even when we choose to take things personally.

    it sounds to me like someone had a bad day.. it may or may not have had anything to do with dogs peeing and pooping on his front lawn. his pent up frustration vented on the nearest target.. a responsible dog owner.

    If you have never ever vented your pent up frustration at someone who didn't deserve that full fury then by all means join up to torment that man... but even then you might ask yourself if that is the kind of reaction you will want to your bad day when it happens.. because sooner or later we all vent on someone who didn't really deserve it.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  34. "in the 50's Seattle looked and acted like a small town..."

    Um, no. I'm not old enough to have been here in the 50's, but I grew up in a town of less than 10,000. I KNOW what a small town is like. Just because you know your neighbors' business doesn't make it "like a small town." I suppose I would accept that West Seattle is (or once was) more like a small town than Seattle as a whole. But there isn't anyone alive today who remembers when Seattle "was a small town."

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  35. Pug Daddy
    Member Profile

    bebecat, as a person who has been a homeowner I can appreciate your position and experience with your flowerbed, I too have had my fair share of noisy dogs, owners who don't clean up after their dogs, and pets running around unattended. Sure it's annoying and I know because of these experiences that if I wanted to keep particular items in my yard protected I would do just that, fence them or provide some other barrier. Protecting our property in a reasonable manner is well within all of our rights, but a logical effort has to be made on the owners part. Planting gardens or attempting to protect items adjacent to a public space without proper protection is a tough battle to fight.

    To be clear, the point of my posting was to bring attention to inappropriate boundries/actions that are being presented to people out in public and I'm afraid are the beginnings of something more dangerous. Not only to the pet owners, but also the "attackers", and the pets. What if one of these homeowner physically pursues a dog owner and the dog is frightened and attacks? How important is a dog pooping in the parking strip when someone is hurt and a dog has to be euthanized?

    The same laws that we uphold to protect homeowners from allowing the public to abuse or damage their property are the same laws that this particular home owner doesn't see the need to abide by. So I have to ask, what else is he capable of?

    Already you can read about people trying to attack others pets with metal poles right in West Seattle, so it's not that far from reality. Besides, does that seem like a reasonable response?

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  36. Pug Daddy
    Member Profile

    Oh by the way, thanks for everyone taking the time to post their experiences and insights.

    It's nice to know that I live in a neighborhood that cares!

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  37. MousePotato
    Member Profile

    MousePotato

    I think I see a business opportunity here.... I think I'll print up a couple hundred yard signs like my pic and sell them at the Sunday market....

    Put one of these in your parking strip and you are GUARANTEED a poop free experience....

    C'mon, poop happens....

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  38. Yeah, like "No Trespassing" signs keep burglars away from vacant houses.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  39. MousePotato
    Member Profile

    MousePotato

    I’m a personal fan of the “no soliciting” signs that apparently do not refer to selling your religion….

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  40. no.. just take down your pesticide free lady-bug sign, and put in some fake pesticide / weed treatment warning signs. that might deter people more than the 'no dog pooping' sign.
    we do have a neighbor dog that often got out, leash free, and peed on one of our plants so consistently that it died.

    yes, I pick up our dog's poop.

    and like one of the other posters mentioned, if he starts to pee on a really nice plant at a well kept yard, we'll stop him before he does and hurry along till we get to a light pole or something.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  41. I used to play golf on a course with homes on it. One homeowner got so fed up with golfers going into their yard they posted warning signs about heavy deer tick infestation. It did the trick. If the pesticide sign doesn't work, cayenne pepper might. Just don't do it on my block please, Carson likes it then drinks so much water he has to pee all night long.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  42. obviously, not many people liked my facetious idea of a doggie walk meet-up. I suppose what I'd like to say is...if it's one guy walking or 5 guys walking together, if they are just walking and being respectful, and law abiding, and cleaning up after their dogs, they should be able to expect a modicum of civility from people who live in the neighborhood. Surely no one on here is suggesting that people should no longer walk their dogs.

    This guy, who may or may not have been having a bad day, stopped his vehicle in the oncoming lane, was about to get out and confront someone who was doing nothing wrong. What the hell is he gonna do if more than one person walks their dog past his house in, say, an hour. Does he finally really take it out on the last walker? Let's hope not. I have people who walk their dogs, their children, their spouses, high school kids (noisy) past my property, both on the sidewalk, and in the alley behind. It's their right. I may not like it, but I'm not going to have apoplexy about it and call them out.

    Let's stop feeling sorry for the guy who acted in a threatening manner to the OP, who was DOING NOTHING WRONG!

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  43. Pug Daddy
    Member Profile

    Sam-c, how exactly are "fake pesticide / weed treatment warning signs" going to deter leash free dogs roaming the neighborhood? That solution only has the chance to deter the people walking the dog, besides if everyone did it where would you walk your dog?

    Carson, I'm not sure if you think you're being funny or what, but in my opinion it's totally irresponsible. If you know you'd not like to have your dog get a face full of cayenne pepper what makes you think anybody else would? No dog deserves to get a cayenne pepper treatment. It's inhumane.

    Thank you JanS, that's a good point.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  44. Actually the Cayenne pepper works very good, most dogs and cats avoid it, Carson is a bit more stubborn than most. I would consider it much more humane than letting your pet walk on my lawn after I have put down herbicide, that can actually kill your pet and MANY people do that. Just check out the lush green lawns for an example. The Cayenne solution is actually considered an organic and humane way to keep your lawn and garden animal free.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  45. pug-daddy- chillax. it was in reference to the no dog pooping sign suggestion (post # 37). I don't think an off leash dogs read that sort of sign sign either.

    obviously the whole block isn't likely to do that- at least hopefully an entire block wouldn't be that passive aggressive to put up any type of signs (no pooping allowed or whatever) that would keep you from walking your dog.

    and I wouldn't actually use pesticide. the sign was a suggestion for the type of (not nice at all) person that would run out of their house and yell at you for taking your dog for a nice walk.

    ..speaking of- "where would they go?"
    reminds me of Paris, where all the sidewalks were covered in these stencils. I forget exactly what they looked like, but the gist was basically that dogs had to go in the gutter/ street...

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  46. LukesDogWalker
    Member Profile

    I walk 2 85 lb dogs all over the place. I never leave for a walk without bags. I always pick up poo. Therefore I feel qualified to stick up for the people who express justifiable anger at irresponsible dog-owners who do not pick up poo. **it happens, but nothing is more gross or rude than leaving it there to offend everyone. I realize probably all dog owners on this blog are responsible, but what can we do about the ones who arent? It ticks me off as much as the crazy guy who blocks traffic and yells at innocent people. Of course, I don't think he's handling it well at all, and he needs to cut it out before he gets arrested or hurts someone. But how should it be handled? It really is a problem. I always have extra bags to offer the "hapless" who are caught without a bag and offer one in a friendly way. But I've witnessed plenty of offenders who seem to think their precious best friend (no matter big or small) makes poo that no one will mind seeing, smelling or even stepping in. Any peaceful, positive solutions come to mind?

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  47. How about a little business like card that says something snappy and sarcastic to get the point across... or a card with the legal requirements WACs or whatever on it, to hand out to offenders if you see them letting their pooch illegally dump.

    Posted 2 years ago #         
  48. LukesDogWalker
    Member Profile

    I have thought of using sidewalk chalk to circle the offending poo pile and write a sarcastic message calling them out next time they walk by. Not sure I'm brave enough to confront personally - besides, everybody already knows it's against the law AND rude, right? What can we do when they don't care and don't fear a fine enforcement?

    Posted 2 years ago #         

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