julie..

i can agree with that...

JoB--I think most of us will find we're not an exact match, but have some tendency either way.

At any rate, I think it's an interesting approach that might help us, as you say, step out of our assumptions and try to communicate--or get some understanding of why people might think differently than we do.

So tempting to just assume people are being foolish or selfish if they don't agree with what's obvious to us--but if we do, we lose any possibility of communication. Not to mention we're probably wrong about that. At least, sometimes....

I find it quite frustrating that people with approaches opposite to mine don't seem to understand what, to me, seem to be obvious arguments. The moral foundations theory at least gives me an inkling of how my arguments may be missing their targets.

Sigh. But I wish they'd just come to see it my way; we could make things so much better!

David,

the one thing that really bothered me about Hillary the presidential candidate is that she is a hawk... so democrat = peacknik is a big misnomer...

however, that said, peacenicks are more likely to be democrats than republicans:)

*****

if we could only step out of our assumptions and all of the rhetoric it's possible we could communicate.. at least, i would like to believe that.

Another misnomer about conservatives . . .

Supposedly, they don't like Big Government, but that really depends on what Big Government is doing. When government is doing their bidding, (nabbing illegal immigrants, spying on "potential troublemakers") conservatives like it big and meaty. But when government is not doing their bidding, they would prefer that it shrink away to nothing.

Natch! That's just human nature, right? OK, but please, conservatives, don't tell me that you're against big government when what you're really against is just big liberal government.

Now let's see if I can find something phony about liberals to balance this out.

Ok . . . here's something . . . Liberals are supposed to be "doves," right? So why is the "liberal" President Obama expanding the war in Afghanistan, not really ending the war in Iraq, and refusing to sign the international treaty banning land mines? Hm. Could it be that Obama is really a hawk in dove's clothing? Mmm . . . Could be . . .

Somebody on this forum recently pointed out, quite rightly, that the Democrats have an impressive record when it comes to starting and/or escalating wars. I really can't imagine how they ever got tagged with the "sissy" label. Was that a deliberate deception on their part? Or is that just the Republicans trying to confuse us?

Bottom line:

Many so-called conservatives claim to be against big government, but in fact aren't.

Many so-called liberals claim to be pro-peace, but in fact, aren't.

What could that possibly mean? Have Martians been using cosmic rays to jam our political system in preparation for a massive invasion? Or is some other sinister force at work here?

Tune in next time to find out . . .

–David

Note: I treat the terms liberal and conservative as being essentially synonymous with Democrat and Republican, but that's somewhat misleading, as others have pointed out. I do it only for convenience' sake. When time permits we should probably have an expanded discussion of whether these terms are being properly used.

Julie..
curiosity got the better of me.

It's probably no surprise that i walk to the beat of a different drummer.. neither matching liberal or conservative averages but certainly reflecting a more liberal viewpoint.

I don't know that i agree with some of the assumptions built into their tests.. but i did find them interesting and instructive...

morals testing done.. but i bookmarked the site for further evaluation:)

Smitty..

there is a scratch on your record.. it will never again play without repeating itself endlessly... a tune that never reaches it's end.

Perhaps you should take it off the turntable.

DP...

the dissonance between rhetoric and action in both parties is appalling...

however, this chart does reflect the infiltration of right wing rhetoric on mainstream thought and analysis...

democrats.. tax and spend?
wouldn't that be more accurately reflected as tax proportionately and spend on services?

republicans.. don't tax and don't spend?
wouldn't that be more accurately reflected as tax disproportionately and spend on trade preference?

republicans don't believe in free trade... they believe in trade regulated to benefit the most influential corporations and industries.

democrats aren't as interested in managing society as they are in ending preferential treatment for influential corporations, industries and individuals... thereby extending opportunity to all.

dawsonct..

where do you think bush sr and cheney got their political start? Some days it really bites to have lived long enough to see the same story continually replayed:(

Julie...

i so want to have the fortitude to explore that site tonight.. but i don't. Thanks for the link..

i look forward to spending some time exploring both the premise and my interaction with the quizzes.

i trust that the questions are asked in a way that will cause me to think.. either way.

Hey, are these the same guys who are involved in Climategate?

What's Climategate you ask? Ask Matt Lauer - he should be reporting on it...........NEVER.

I'm giggling because I thought only seeing the left half of the map was the point! Low and behold you were supposed to see the right half too.....

Thanks, WSMom. I found this chart interesting.

True, it's simplistic, but I've seen some attempts to be more comprehensive with these things, and they didn't work very well. If you include much more info than this, the viewer's head starts swimming.

A couple of other categories that might have improved this chart are education level and level of exposure to other cultures.

Education – I've heard—but never verified—that people tend to vote more liberal at either end of the educational spectrum. So PhDs and high-school dropouts tend to vote liberal, while people with BAs vote conservative.

Cultural Exposure – From personal experience, I would say that folks who have traveled the world and have been exposed to a variety of viewpoints and ways of life tend to be more liberal, while people who stay in their hometown their whole lives and never venture outside their own social circle tend to be conservative. I've known some self-described conservatives to be pretty bigoted people. They'll make some slur on black people or Mexicans, for instance, but when I say, "Well, how many blacks and Mexicans do you actually know?" it usually stumps 'em.

Liberals can exert similar tendencies, of course, but the group they most like to slur is . . . you guessed it: conservatives. Haw.

One place where this chart (and others like it) are bound to fail is in trying to establish mutually exclusive definitions for worldviews. Let's consider the category of rights for example. On the conservative side, rights are described as something "others must not interfere" with, while, on the liberal side rights are something "others must observe."

Plain enough, apparently. Yet, how do these differing views of rights play out in the abortion debate? Liberals see a woman's "right" to an abortion, for example, as something that others must not interfere with.

Or take gun ownership "rights." That's one right liberals certainly don't want to observe unconditionally, isn't it?

Maybe the varying interpretation of what constitutes a right isn't a failing of the chart, though. Maybe the problem lies in the unwillingness of either party to be consistent with its own logic.

—David

I find Jonathan Haidt's Moral Foundations theory an intriguing possible tool to help us find ways to communicate. I recommend taking Haidt's Moral Foundations Questionnaire here:
http://www.yourmorals.org/explore.php first, then watch Haidt's TED talk:

http://www.ted.com/talks/jonathan_haidt_on_the_moral_mind.html

If you're interested after that, you can read more on Haidt's website:

http://faculty.virginia.edu/haidtlab/mft/index.php

Seems a bit simplistic, but it contains enough truths to be useful to some people.
-
Here is map I find interesting:
http://www.zombietime.com/zomblog/?p=504
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It IS somewhat outdated, but I know some folks out there still hold on to this mind-set. I'm related to many of them.

Thanks for the revised link, WesCAddle!

I ran into the same situation as JoB, and thought the site could somehow determine my political leanings, and not give me full info for the "other side"! ;-)

(Oh, and thanks to WSMom, for the initial thread!)

Mike

That's a pretty infographic, but the information it contains is not so pretty.

Try this link: http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/leftvright_US.html

unfortunately i could only see the left half of that map

http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/visualizations/left-vs-right-us/