Fauntleroy talks traffic. City reps listen. But did they hear?

From last night’s traffic/transportation forum organized by the Fauntleroy Community Association: Residents voiced frustration at what they saw as a history of all talk/no action, leaving them bringing up the same problems year in, year out. So here’s what was talked about, in that context:

The forum was moderated by FCA president Mike Dey and organized by FCA board member Marty Westerman, who is also a member of the West Seattle Transportation Coalition. The panel was a bit different from what had been announced in advance; SDOT director Scott Kubly wasn’t there, but Chief of Staff Bill LaBorde was; Mayor Murray’s transportation adviser Andrew Glass Hastings; Southwest Precinct commander Capt. Steve Wilske; and from City Councilmember Tom Rasmussen‘s staff, Evan Clifthorne.

The chronic problems discussed included the “triangle” crossroads in Endolyne (Brace Point/45th) and surrounding streets and how there have been studies over the years, but – according to several present – nothing had been done. Glass Hastings said some momentum exists for safety improvements in the “triangle” and up the hill along Marine View. He said that the Marine View improvements MIGHT include a guard rail near the curves that have seen several crashes in just the last year.

But among the three-dozen-plus attendees, frustration was an issue even bigger than the specifics; many who spoke talked about getting in touch with SDOT over many years and feeling nothing had been done to address their concerns. Or, if the city said what was requested couldn’t be done, as FCA’s Phil Sweetland noted, the explanation always seemed to be “by the book” – why couldn’t they “think outside the box”?

Beyond the triangle, a crosswalk to Lincoln Park was suggested, crossing Fauntleroy, toward the north-central part of the park for people trying to get to the wading pool and the playground. He said that the explanation that a crosswalk was too close to the light at Othello did not take into consideration that people want to cross Fauntleroy closer to the pool and playground. Shortly after he said that, several people spoke up to talk about the lack of a crosswalk also affecting the fact the C-Line stop at Rose is only on the east side of the street. They said that it’s OK to cross east when there’s no ferry traffic, but it’s a huge pain to wade between the cars when you get off the C and need to get to the east side of Fauntleroy.

Fauntleroy Way congestion in general was a key topic, with ferry traffic, buses, and Lincoln Park at the top of the contribution list.

Three items shifted the talk to suggesting locals go beyond city officials to the state and feds.

1. Fauntleroy dock traffic – Funding was taken away for traffic-directing help. Clifthorne said that the money went away and that the city and local legislators are trying to get the money back for traffic control.

2. Keeping the lower bridge open during the commute periods. Clifthorne and Glass Hastings said this is a larger issue for getting the state and feds involved. Timing does involve tides, though, it was noted.

3. Motorcycle noise from the ferries: Capt. Wilske said that he had talked to the precinct liaison from the City Attorney’s Office and looked at the bigger-picture statutes, but bottom line, the local Seattle noise ordinance is just plain hard to enforce. Despite that, he is directing his early morning officers to keep a close eye on speeding and traffic issues with the motorcyclists to see if that might deter the problem.

Not many answers or promises, but Clifthorne did say that he would work with Councilmember Rasmussen to set up a walking tour of Fauntleroy.

25 Replies to "Fauntleroy talks traffic. City reps listen. But did they hear?"

  • rj November 7, 2014 (9:06 pm)

    The early morning motorcycle issue was handled rather well when the SPD ADRT was involved. One early morning the officers stopped and cited 5 motorcycle ferry boat commuters traveling 95 mph on the W. Seattle bridge. They also contacted the WA State Ferry liaison. The officers and ferry rep contacted the motorcycle riders during the early evening commute. The riders were told if the noise levels continued when exiting the boat at 0500 hours, instead of boarding first they would be placed on the boat last. They would not be able to accelerate when getting off the boat, causing the loud engine noises, because they would be behind the long line of cars. Officers from the ADRT monitored the ferry terminal at 0500 hours for several weeks.
    It’s too bad that when the sergeant in charge of the ADRT retired that SPD upper management decided to disband the unit. They took away 5 of the Dodge Chargers and literally parked the cars on the roof top garage at police headquarters for 3 to 4 months. Finally, Mayor McGinn found out and ordered Chief Pugel to give the Chargers back to the Traffic Section and reinstate the ADRT. Sadly, the ADRT has never been the same or as productive as they were their first 5 years. The loud muffler issue on the motorcycles can be addressed by enforcing the traffic code rather than the noise ordinance. Any motorcycle exhaust that is louder than the stock exhaust is illegal. Contact WA State Ferry and get back to doing basic traffic enforcement and hold the motorcycle riders accountable – at the back of the boat.

  • Rick November 8, 2014 (6:49 am)

    If they get loaded last they’ll retaliate by revving the neighborhood like they did last time this was tried. My kids were immature too but they eventually grew out of it.

  • fauntleroyresident November 8, 2014 (7:00 am)

    It is terrifying to drive a vehicle in the 5 a.m. hour when swarmed by motorcyclists coming off the ferry.

    Not only is the noise a nuisance in the neighborhood, but I am intimidated by the sound of all the bikes at once and the aggressive way they operate them. When driving a vehicle at that hour and you are just ahead of the ferry off-loading, you can be surrounded by dozens and dozens of motorcycles all at once–extremely nerve wracking!

    Many drive them dangerously too. Even though I don’t drive granny-slow I am passed all along Fauntleroy first in the center turn lane, then rushed in the right-hand lane at Starbucks (to get ahead before it ends just past Thriftway), and passed again on the right in the bicycle lane after crossing California. I am so worried someone is going to get hurt. It’s like bees swarming all around and it’s hard to predict their moves.

    I’ve noticed at least one who cuts east up Dawson through the neighborhood and comes down 37th to Alaska to get ahead of the pack. To pull this off the biker is going pretty darn fast.

    I, for one, am happy to see that this issue is being monitored.

  • Mufflers November 8, 2014 (7:11 am)

    Why not just ask SPD to ticket such mufflers 100% of the time? After a week of tickets they might get the message.

  • miws November 8, 2014 (7:53 am)

    One early morning the officers stopped and cited 5 motorcycle ferry boat commuters traveling 95 mph….

    .

    Anyone driving anywhere near that speed on any roadway, should be heavily punished. But, in reading rj’s comment to that point, my first thought was the incident occurred along Fauntleroy. There was an odd sense of relief to read that it was on the Bridge…

    .

    Mike

  • Marge Evans November 8, 2014 (8:09 am)

    as a pedestrian and a bicyclist I am appalled at the motorcyclists who think that it is okay to blast their music as they ride through the streets of West Seattle.

  • Lisa November 8, 2014 (8:47 am)

    My car was broadsided by another car getting off the ferry on Thursday morning as I was travelling north on Fauntleroy Way. Luckily, we were both okay. Shaken, but okay. I called and left a message with someone from the FCA to see if my case can help. I haven’t heard back yet. If I can do anything to help get traffic control back at the dock, please feel free to e mail me at lkruiz@hotmail.com.

  • Ho November 8, 2014 (8:53 am)

    I recently got caught up in the early morning motorcycle swarm. It is intimidating and unsafe. I am surprised that the riders “get away” with their behavior. I imagine that it is not considered more of a nuisance because most people are sleeping?

  • g alden November 9, 2014 (1:52 am)

    “Any motorcycle exhaust that is louder than the stock exhaust is illegal.”, is an untrue statement, and a basis of hate speech against a protect group of people for prejudicial reasons. The Federal noise control laws for these highway produced products, and “in use” conditions under CFR40205.162-2 allows higher then standard sounds. Most State and local laws are based on the Federal codes. The trend of manufacturers is to build noise controls for the total sounds these standard products make to fall far under the maximum limits. Modifications resulting in significant standard product noise risings is not only normal and legal, the products sold by the OEM manufacturer to result in this type of louder traffic soundscape configuration is offered as a legal customer feature to benefit the interest of all customers. Speech designed to align peoples illicit behavior with the legal traffic soundscape practices of highway motorcycle use is hate speech and should never be tolerated.

  • Rick November 9, 2014 (4:25 am)

    Hate speech? Seriously? Back of the boat time.

  • TGV November 9, 2014 (7:32 am)

    G Alden, hyperbole much? Good lord, people who live near the ruckus are just looking for some civility from the folks passing through. It’s already a pain to deal with the extra traffic that the ferry brings but one finger salutes like yours don’t generally create empathy or desire to seek common ground.

    We’re asking for some reasonable accommodation for the insensitivity and generally selfish behavior of interlopers. Why is that so controversial?

  • snowflake November 9, 2014 (11:34 am)

    Yes some bikes do travel quickly in the morning.

    Vanpools, carpools and even bicycles may speed when they can.

    However it is impossible to be surrounded by dozens and dozens of motorcycles at 0500, as there just are not that many motorcycles on the 420am southworth to 440am vashon to 5am fauntleroy ferry!

    Sometimes there have been as many as 14 bikes: Often fewer than a dozen.

    A ferry has probably been unloading passengers on this route for far longer than you have chosen to live or drive on the route.

    If motorcycles were not on the route you would like be passed by cars, trucks, and vanpools.

    I suggest pulling to the side or slowing down enough to make the passing of your vehicle easier. There for everyone would be happy. You would not be surrounded by Dozens and Dozens of intimidating vehicles.

    Yes some vehicles are loud. Some are excessively loud. But that is everywhere, not just your own nimby neighborhood.

  • j November 9, 2014 (2:08 pm)

    Chapter 11.57 – MOTORCYCLE REGULATIONS

    11.57.280 Exhaust system.

    No person shall modify the exhaust system of a motorcycle in a manner which will amplify or increase the noise emitted by the engine of such vehicle above that emitted by the muffler originally installed on the vehicle, and it shall be unlawful for any person to operate a motorcycle not equipped as required by Sections 11.84.060 and 11.84.080 or which has been amplified as prohibited by this section so that the vehicle’s exhaust noise exceeds ninety-five (95) decibels as measured by the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) test procedure J1169, (May, 1998). (RCW 46.37.390(3))

  • Rick November 9, 2014 (2:40 pm)

    Don’t confuse me with facts. Or laws.

  • g alden November 10, 2014 (9:21 am)

    Two wrongs do not make a right. Hate Speech against a protected group of people is serious and outside the law. The hate speech in this article is an attempt to detract from the true people responsible for this issue. Take a long look at yourself in the mirror to find the culprit giving back the one finger salute. We the People have spoken, and you in the mirror are part of this group. It is incorrectly applied jurisprudence, surrounding effective enforcement efforts of your local noise control statutes that is the root problem.. If you dislike the result of a decision to demand the noise maker defendant remain innocent until proven guilty, then institutionally change who must provide the burden of proof that their modified motorcycle was operated with raised standard volumes to overturn a call to court. The very people complaining about the noise nuisance are the ones who have created the environment to allow the issue to exist.

    No voluntarily complied to Chapter 11.57 Exhaust system regulation, or 95 dB(A) based sound measurement law have teeth, until We The People act. Is it not a reasonable accommodation for you people to change?

  • j November 10, 2014 (1:20 pm)

    g alden, Nice try on your Federal Law defense, you might want to read it again and then look in the mirror.
    *
    Subpart D–Motorcycles
    Sec. 205.162-2 Tampering.
    Tampering With Noise Control System Prohibited, further:
    d) The provisions of this section are not intended to preclude any State or local jurisdiction from adopting and enforcing its own
    prohibitions against the removal or rendering inoperative of noise control systems on vehicles subject to this part.

  • au November 10, 2014 (4:31 pm)

    snowflake, I think you are unaware of something called a speed limit that we all, when applying and receiving a drivers license, have agreed to follow.
    g alden- while it is true that hate speech against a protected group is to be take seriously, operating a motorcycle does not constitute a protected group.
    that plus the fact no one has said nor written anything hateful, unless of course demanding that people drive the speed limit is hateful to you. if that is the case i suggest you voluntarily give up your license.

  • Thomas M. November 10, 2014 (8:36 pm)

    I used to have to sit through traffic calendar to get to priority civil down in LA area. They got sick and tired of the speeding and the noise down there and EVERY ticket requires that am accused driver actually show up at the courthouse stand in a HUGE line and then wait for the courtroom assignment. Illegal vehicle exhausts (including fart cans and modified motorcycles), illegal lighting, bald tires, etc… all get fix-it tickets that require the offender show a paid invoice to correct the deficiency. There is no fine, but most of a day goes down the pot, and there are “court costs”. Local yokels it ain’t a bad idea just because they do it in LA.

  • fauntleroy fairy November 11, 2014 (1:02 am)

    A lot of back and forth about noise.

    I hear loud cars, airplanes, helicopters, and yes, motorcycles on my street and I chose to buy here in spite of the fact that I might get some unwanted noise at any given time of the day or night. Some of you remind me of people that move near an airport and then complain that the jets are too loud. Pretty sure that ferry dock has been there longer than most of you and the route off of it follows an arterial – not a quiet country road.

    It’s called CITY living. I’m sure you could find that quiet country road somewhere else though if it really means that much to you.

  • g alden November 11, 2014 (5:57 am)

    “Three items shifted the talk to suggesting locals go beyond city officials to the state and feds……..3. Motorcycle noise from the ferries:”
    Above are the article references that denoted hate speech. Number 3 used the word “Motorcycle” with a description of noise. The use of the word “motorcycle” in the article, was not qualified. Standard highway motorcycles are noise controlled regulated products offered into US commerce. The operators of these highway products in US traffic soundscapes are protected by the US Constitution, the Bill of Rights, the EPA, and the Noise Control Act of 1972 and other laws protecting ones right to the public way. These people are protected as a group when operating on a public way, whether you like it or not. The ability on how to legally modify the constituent exhaust system components on these highway regulated products is afforded to every “in use” person in public operation of these products in CFR40Part205.162-2. CFR 40 and NCA afford these products to emit exhaust noise emission levels in significantly higher amounts then light trucks and cars. By comparison definitions, a standard motorcycle may be found to have more sound, or noise then other standard highway products regulated for noise in the traffic soundscape. The vehicle ferry is a traffic soundscape is it not. The generic use of the word “Motorcycle” in automatic reference to noise, excessive noise, uncontrolled noise, for prejudicial reasons against these protected people, is the definition of HATE SPEECH. Looking into questionable noise sources by denoting the term “motorcycle” with a preconceived opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience to harm another for reasons to result in some action against these people is hate speech. Hate speech is a crime. A website that holds this hate speech is a HATE SITE.

    The article may of simply been poorly written, and no offense intended to protected people. The story about the police response confirms that these specifically targeted people in the traffic soundscape are locally protected, but not to other obvious traffic code violations around the ferry operation like speeding, which is not specific to powered two wheel vehicles.

    If it is correct to use the word “motorcycle” in relation to automatic noise sources, then it would be equally correct to state a standardly configuredToyota Prius operated over the posted speed limit is a known source of nuisance noise, and the people who operate such cars are traffic noise scofflaws. Should transportation forums target Prius noise and create laws to remove such vehicle types?

    • WSB November 11, 2014 (5:40 pm)

      Mr. Alden, you’re done. Being accused of “hate speech” is deeply offensive and completely inaccurate in this regard. People who choose to own/operate a certain type of machinery do not comprise a protected class in any way, shape, or form. Our website, in fact, has more stringent standards on ACTUAL hate speech than almost any news publication out there – particularly in regard to traits with which people are born (race, gender, sexual orientation, size, etc.), some of which continues to be allowed by other news sites (particularly sizeist hate speech). But I digress.
      .
      On this topic: If you are local and wish to engage the Fauntleroy Community Association on their concerns about motorcycle (or any other kind of) noise, I hope you noted our mention that tonight is their monthly board meeting, open to all (still an hour and 20 minutes away) – this is an issue they have been raising for years. (Same goes for anyone else who disagrees with their pursuit of enforcement.) Thanks – Tracy (editor/co-publisher)

  • r November 11, 2014 (2:13 pm)

    So, loud illegal pipes on motorcycles driving through a city neighborhood violating noise and traffic codes is OK because “it’s called city living”? Does that apply to loud drunken parties by your neighbors at midnight or barking dogs at 2 AM interrupting sleep? After all, it’s called city living. The occasional airplane or helicopter noise is a poor analogy. How many loud helicopters come roaring through your neighborhood at 5 AM like the daily motorcycles do when leaving the ferry boat, especially during the summer months? Selfish liberals doing whatever they want with zero consideration for other people. It’s all about the me mentality.

  • fauntleroy fairy November 11, 2014 (3:35 pm)

    You’re so right, we should never be disturbed or inconvenienced or bothered in any way by any other people or any thing at any time – ever. Never, ever, ever…….

  • j November 11, 2014 (7:14 pm)

    “we should never be disturbed or inconvenienced or bothered in any way by any other people or any thing at any time – ever. Never, ever, ever”
    *
    Where does anyone posting here make reference to NEVER wanting to be disturbed or inconvenienced?
    *
    Most of the motorcycle commuters obey the laws, it’s the handful that don’t who are causing the noise issue. Monday thru Friday for about three hours each morning is not an occasional inconvenience.
    *
    The idea that – if you don’t like it then move – is unbelievable. All the family’s living along Fauntleroy Way, Marine View Dr, Brace Point who are negatively impacted by the loud motorcycle exhausts should leave so a handful of law breakers can do whatever they want is nonsense.

  • fauntleroy fairy November 12, 2014 (7:37 pm)

    ….and especially no sirens. Ever.

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