West Seattle safety: Signal ‘warranted’ for Avalon/Yancy/30th

The narrow-Y intersection of Avalon, Yancy, and 30th, south of the Luna Park business district (map), has long been a frustration, and danger, to pedestrians, bicyclists, drivers, and bus riders. But there’s a glimmer of hope. A resident who’s been talking with the city about getting a signal there, Liz Johnson, sent first word that the city agrees the intersection needs help. Liz shared this from city traffic engineer Valerie Lee:

SDOT recently completed a signal warrant study for the intersection of SW Avalon Way, 30th Avenue SW and SW Yancy Street. The study results showed this intersection met the MUTCD* manual signal warrant 1.

SDOT will put this location on our warranted signals location list. Every year, more signals are warranted than we have funding to build. Towards the end of each year, all warranted locations compete for the following years’ new signal fund.

At the end of 2011, SDOT will consider the traffic volume, pedestrian volume, and collision history as well as the cost of the signal to determine which of the warranted locations will receive a new signal in 2012.

*The MUTCD is the Manual on Uniform Traffic Control Devices, a federal document that defines the national standard for municipalities to follow when installing any traffic control devices.

We checked with SDOT about the length of the waitlist; Marybeth Turner from the communications team tells WSB, “Our Traffic Management Division reports that we now have 15 traffic signals on the list. We are usually able to install 2 to 4 new signals each year, depending on the funding available.” This is the same intersection that got pedestrian flags almost three years ago. (P.S. For comments, the city has this e-mail address: traffic.signals@seattle.gov)

28 Replies to "West Seattle safety: Signal 'warranted' for Avalon/Yancy/30th"

  • WS native February 21, 2011 (10:46 am)

    I do think this intersection needs some help, but I wonder if the intersection at the top of Genessee hill next to the golf course has been looked at as well. A lot of the people who use 30th ave are avoiding the back up of cars waiting to get on to Avalon at the top of Genessee. I think this intersection is the root of the problem.

  • coffee February 21, 2011 (11:10 am)

    I was thinking the exact same thing, I would think Genessee would be a better choice, but then……

    • WSB February 21, 2011 (11:16 am)

      We had no involvement with this – Liz’s note came out of the blue – but having to drive most of West Seattle most days, on the way to emergency calls or photos or any number of things … Have you been on Yancy during Allstar prime time? Our business mailbox is at Stor-More (WSB sponsor) so we are there often. That street looks like an LA freeway (both the speeding and clogged versions) some days. And trying to turn left onto Avalon, heading northwest off Yancy, with the 30th traffic just outside your peripheral vision, is always … fun. The bus stop at Yancy also is a future RapidRide site, as discussed in some of our recent Luna Park/street parking/transit lane coverage. These may be some of the factors that played into it – plus, Transitional Resources, which provides housing for people with mental-health challenges, is right across the street and expanding (that’s the construction project just north of the former Tillikum Village office). Just a little more context … TR
      .
      (And of course, with that steep steep slope, waiting on Genesee to turn onto Avalon is no picnic either!)

  • jeff February 21, 2011 (12:01 pm)

    as much as i know that area is in need of dire improvement safety wise, another area to look at for them would be at the top of highland parkway at holden. either a four-way stop or somesort of ped overpass. as someody who walks down, and occasionaly up, that hill trying to cross is a hair-rasing expierence.

  • sybil February 21, 2011 (12:46 pm)

    Oh how I wish Avalon and Genesee would get one, too! Glad to hear something is in the works for that strip, however. I hope it improves that whole stretch.

  • jwws February 21, 2011 (1:00 pm)

    WS native,

    Just a point of clarification Genesee hill is nowhere near the golf course (it’s always been above Alki Point as long as I’ve lived here – perhaps there has been a seismic shift I’m not aware of..) but Genesee SW does continue to the golf course and beyond ;-)

  • Jenn February 21, 2011 (1:02 pm)

    I applaud the resident who contacted SDOT about this and WSB for following up. In my experience SDOT projects that get funded are those with the most community support. I encourage people who live there start a petition (online?) to back up the inquiry. Maybe try to get a letter of support from All Star. I’m a member there and know that this intersection can be a problem.

    Everyone else, I encourage you to support improving the intersection in question, since the process is already started.

    If you have a different spot that you’d like to report, report it yourself, and get support from your neighbors. Mentioning it in here and not doing anything about it doesn’t do any good.

  • bridge to somewhere February 21, 2011 (1:57 pm)

    While we’re talking about where signals are warranted, is there anyone else who agrees there should be a left-hand turn signal from 35th onto Barton?

  • Still in Culture Shock February 21, 2011 (3:41 pm)

    I use this intersection often. And I am always happy there is no traffic signal there. The number of stoplights from east-west in W. Seattle is already over the top so this is one of the few intersections that seems to still be “free”. Sometimes it is a challenge to turn, but I never have to wait as long as I do at the stoplights. I guess I am the lone voice in hoping this doesn’t change. I haven’t seen any accidents there, so unless that is a problem, I don’t see a need for another traffic light.

  • Al February 21, 2011 (3:50 pm)

    GOOD! I have also complained about this intersection. It needs a signal – the traffic started becoming a problem soon after Allstar opened. This will make it easier for peds/cyclists to cross as well.

  • xyz February 21, 2011 (3:57 pm)

    bridge to somewhere, I agree with you, they need left turn pockets on Barton at 35th and also on Henderson at Delridge.

  • JAT February 21, 2011 (4:24 pm)

    One reason why Yancy warrants a light above some of the other intersections cited is that it’s a cycle route and yet (particularly after pedalling up) it can be really hard to get a break in Avalon traffic to make the left turn to continue up hill. I know a lot of readers / commenters don’t have any sympathy for the unique problems cyclsits face in traffic, and I won’t try to convince you here of the value of traffic signals and facilities which are accommodating to both motorists and cyclists.

    There is some, but I won’t try to convince you…

  • WS native February 21, 2011 (4:26 pm)

    I knew someone would point out that “genessee hill” is usually used to refer to the other huge hill on genessee but really? They are both genessee and they are both big hills so… I guess it’s all semantics. ;-)

    • WSB February 21, 2011 (4:29 pm)

      Like Admiral hill, to some degree … I think “north of the bridge” and yet many probably think “headed down from the business district to Alki” …

  • Mark February 21, 2011 (5:21 pm)

    I bike to work a couple times a week and use this intersection both directions. You have to watch 5 separate roads for traffic. My experience is that cars are pretty good, but ANYTHING to slow or stop the Metro bus drivers will likely save a life at some point.

  • Brooke February 21, 2011 (6:05 pm)

    I am overjoyed at this request! I live on Yancy, and with the cars that turn off Avalon down Yancy, usually at higher speeds, the bikers biking up the hill at night, and the All Star fitness people parking, it’s quite scary. I actually hope the city changes the road more to make one of the shoulders a bike lane during certain times of the day.

  • JN February 21, 2011 (7:06 pm)

    This is kind of a hairy area to bike down, as well, what with cars poking out into traffic and seeming like they won’t stop.

  • Westside45 February 21, 2011 (8:14 pm)

    We need fewer traffic lights, not more. If you can’t pick your opening and accelerate into traffic, you should not be driving. If you don’t feel confident or haven’t got a car which will accelerate quickly and smoothly into traffic, you should not be driving. In the 70’s there were five traffic lights on 35th between Avalon and Roxbury. There are now over 20; few of which are synchronized.

  • Alki resident February 21, 2011 (9:33 pm)

    A left turn signal to get to Metropolitan Market in the Admiral.Sometimes lucky if ONE car makes it through on green.

  • Mary February 21, 2011 (11:04 pm)

    As a pedestrian who crosses Avalon at Yancy on my way to and from work I say YAY!!! to the possibility of adding a light (or even just a marked crosswalk) there. While many drivers stop when they see a flag (or a pedestrian) far too many others don’t. I was, in fact, nearly hit by a speeding car a month ago when the driver decided there should be two uphill lanes so he could race around the car that *had* slowed for me.

  • austin February 22, 2011 (7:41 am)

    My experience is parallel to Mary’s. I cross avalon at this intersection nearly daily and it’s terrible from a pedestrian’s standpoint. You’re lucky if the cars simply don’t stop for you, I’m surprised days that people don’t jam on the accelerator when they see me in the crosswalk in front of them. I’ve taken to palming a rock every time I have to cross there but a signal seems like a better solution.

  • WSRes February 22, 2011 (8:35 am)

    This intersection is a tough one, I will admit. I’ve regularly encountered it from all sides, both on a bike and in a car. The downside to a light is that lights on 5 way intersections are a huge pain in the butt and are very SLOW. I’d think that the current right of way is probably more efficient than a new 5 way stop light for most people at most times.

  • MK February 22, 2011 (9:51 am)

    Finally! I live right here and this intersection is a nightmare for everyone, drives, bikers and peds. The crossing flags were a joke (I think there’s only one left at this point, anyway) and I’ve had some pretty close encounters with both cars and bikers.

    Now somebody do something about the godawful half-built ruin at 30th and Yancy!

  • Karin February 22, 2011 (12:43 pm)

    I agree that this intersection needs a signal. There’s a lot of pedestrian and bike traffic down Andover from the overpass over the WS freeway, and a signal would help them cross Avalon safely. I’ve also had too many close calls crossing Avalon! Luna Park is a great neighborhood for walking and cycling, and a signal would just make it safer.

    P.S. I drive in the neighborhood, too, and wouldn’t mind having to stop at a light.

  • Mike Dady February 22, 2011 (1:41 pm)

    I would like to see an SDOT signal warrant study of Avalon Way at Genesee. Genesee is equally, if not more dangerous, and has a larger population/pedestrian density and is the main means of those residing in North Delridge and Puget Ridge of reaching the WS Junction. It is unfortunate that SDOT did not advise the Delridge Neighborhoods District Council and the North Delridge Neighborhood Council of the SDOT signal warrant study so that we could have chimed in on the other traffic issues in the immediate area that have been a concern of NDNC neighbors/members for some years now. There could be a comprehensive approach and solution.

  • Tucker February 22, 2011 (7:19 pm)

    I don’t think the argument holds that some sections of the city seem to have an overabundance of traffic signals so no signals should be put in anywhere else. I would agree that the lights on 35th don’t seem to offer the best flow of traffic and perhaps a couple need to be reconsidered.

    However, having lived on Avalon and been forced to try to navigate the Avalon/Yancy/30th/Andover cluster many, many times, I can’t think of a location more deserving of a signal. This is exactly the place a signal is designed for. I’m all for it. I do hope they consider the traffic from the Bridge/Spokane Street intersection in timing and flow, though.

  • Michael Taylor-Judd March 1, 2011 (4:13 pm)

    @Mike, I thought Genessee and Avalon had been inquired about before, and there is concern about forcibly backing cars up on the steep hill waiting for a light change?

    I know I wouldn’t drive it any more if they put in a light there.

  • Mike Dady March 9, 2011 (6:40 pm)

    @ Michael T-J, I don’t recall any study or inquiry. Certainly could have been. I know there have been neighborhood conversations and emails about it. As for vehicle’s backing up on the hill, it is my observation that they already are and without a means of flow-control via a signal it is actually more likely that a vehicle will have a problem on the hill and at the intersection. I don’t know the exact degree of slope of Genesee, but I would estimate that it is in the same range as many of the downtown streets and certainly no more than signaled sections of the counterbalance/QA Ave going to the top of QA. Perhaps the length of Genesee gives one the perception that it is steeper than the downtown hills? There is another idea that I have that would work with the proposed signal at Yancg but it is to wordy to spell out here. I am going to contact the SDOT traffic engineer to discuss.

Sorry, comment time is over.